Is it just me or have SF vanished?

dundalkfc10 · 25-06-2020 02:07PM

Bishop of hope wrote: »

The washings of the bag like, how, would SF supporters feel about MM as Taoiseach?
Would the SF membership pass a deal with FF and the Greens, would FF membership or the Greens for that matter?
Is it just about getting SF in without a thought of a programme for government?
Lads, just because this current deal is rejected, if it is, doesn't mean wahey it's FF SF and whoever!

We know, keeps FG out though. Pints the weekend

dundalkfc10 · 25-06-2020 02:08PM

McMurphy wrote: »

Why assume Michaeál would be Taoiseach?

So now the shinners do want to govern afterall? Careful now Bishop, few lads on here going to be arguing with you on this.

They are clutching at straws at this stage, great reading on all threads.

Bishop of hope · 25-06-2020 02:15PM

McMurphy wrote: »

Why assume Michaeál would be Taoiseach?

So now the shinners do want to govern afterall? Careful now Bishop, few lads on here going to be arguing with you on this.

Just questions Mc, I don't know how it will turn out, it will all be irrelevant if the current deal goes ahead anyway.
What process does SF go through if there's a deal offered, who has a say in its acceptance, is it the members voting or is it like an Ard-Fheis where its put to them and they all vote yes as, the result is pre established?

dundalkfc10 · 25-06-2020 02:16PM

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Just questions Mc, I don't know how it will turn out, it will all be irrelevant if the current deal goes ahead anyway.
What process does SF go through if there's a deal offered, who has a say in its acceptance, is it the members voting or is it like an Ard-Fheis where its put to them and they all vote yes as, the result is pre established?

According to some clowns on here, The IRA army council in Belfast will decide

Finty Lemon · 25-06-2020 02:17PM

Like those who bombed Dublin and my county town?

Those succesful operations were entirely justified.

Bishop of hope · 25-06-2020 02:18PM

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

They are clutching at straws at this stage, great reading on all threads.

I haven't seen anything bar them saying nobody will talk to us that makes me think there's a chance in hell of them agreeing to be in govt.
My opinion is, they will not agree no matter who approaches them anyway.

dundalkfc10 · 25-06-2020 02:33PM

Bishop of hope wrote: »

I haven't seen anything bar them saying nobody will talk to us that makes me think there's a chance in hell of them agreeing to be in govt.
My opinion is, they will not agree no matter who approaches them anyway.

Tiocfaidh ár lá

Jinglejangle69 · 25-06-2020 02:34PM

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Because FG and FF and Greens wouldnt talk to them.

FF and the Greens have opened the door for talks to happen (if Greens say no)

Cant explain it any easier

Numbers were still there.

Even RBB rinsed Mary Lou.

dundalkfc10 · 25-06-2020 02:47PM

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Numbers were still there.

Even RBB rinsed Mary Lou.

Well my maths are

FF 38 + FG 35 + Greens 12 = 85

Remaining seats 75

hatrickpatrick · 25-06-2020 02:48PM

Bishop of hope wrote: »

The washings of the bag like, how, would SF supporters feel about MM as Taoiseach?
Would the SF membership pass a deal with FF and the Greens, would FF membership or the Greens for that matter?
Is it just about getting SF in without a thought of a programme for government?
Lads, just because this current deal is rejected, if it is, doesn't mean wahey it's FF SF and whoever!

I can't definitively speak for anyone else but I would be willing to bet that a huge volume of the young people who flocked to SF would be happy with any government which tackled the cost of living and housing through left wing policies. The issue isn't that we'd still oppose FFG if they brought in such measures, the issue is that we don't trust them to do it regardless of what they say or what agreements they sign off on. They'll find some excuse to pander to neoliberalism and not change course even if they promised to change course to begin with. FG at least are honest about not wanting to fix the problem, FF come across as a bunch of dishonest gobsh!tes on the issue considering their prior record in office.

Point being, if they do go in and they do change policy in this area, then great. It's not about party or personality but policy. The surge in support for SF is entirely born out of opposition to FFG's shared ideology and support for SF's opposing ideology. Obviously if FFG genuinely adopted the opposing ideology, then people would stop having as big an issue with them. The problem is, though, that they've sullied their reputations so much in this regard that even if they said they were changing policy, a lot of young people would assume they were just lying to get the pressure off their backs, and would come up with some excuse for reneging on commitments further down the line.

Eoghan Murphy, for example, single handedly did more damage to FG's reputation among young people than any individual politician has done for any political party in my entire memory of observing and participating in Irish politics. Even if they change policy, people still remember the attitude this man had towards the suffering of the young, and the fact that he had Leo's backing throughout his entire term in that office. Direct attacks against a demographic of the kind Murphy engaged in are extremely difficult to forget in terms of coming around to trusting a party. That's why people don't trust FG. FF at least have left wing policies in their past, which proves that they could come back around to them.

Essentially, while FF + SF wouldn't be as attractive as SF with other parties aside from FF and FG, it's still orders of magnitude better than any government involving FG. In that scenario, I think many SF voters would accept MM as Taoiseach if it meant a change in national policy alongside ensuring that FG got nowhere near power again for at least the next five years.

hatrickpatrick · 25-06-2020 02:50PM

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Well my maths are

FF 38 + FG 35 + Greens 12 = 85

Remaining seats 75

The "numbers were there" commentary is based upon the very reasonable assumption that the Greens would be happy to talk to a left wing alliance if it included environmentalist policies.

dundalkfc10 · 25-06-2020 02:56PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The "numbers were there" commentary is based upon the very reasonable assumption that the Greens would be happy to talk to a left wing alliance if it included environmentalist policies.

Awh pet, its ok. FF/SF and the Greens will be talking tomorrow night

Yeah_Right · 25-06-2020 03:39PM

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Yes what Catholics went through in the North was a disgrace (My Parents were 2 of them) You should read about it, while the Govt down here done nothing about it.

So did Bobby "The Freedom Fighter" Storey do anything to help your parents? Or did he just get revenge for what they went through?

The government in the Republic were probably more concerned about "The Freedom Fighters" killing their police force than worrying about what was happening to catholics in another country.

dundalkfc10 · 25-06-2020 04:15PM

Yeah_Right wrote: »

So did Bobby "The Freedom Fighter" Storey do anything to help your parents? Or did he just get revenge for what they went through?

The government in the Republic were probably more concerned about "The Freedom Fighters" killing their police force than worrying about what was happening to catholics in another country.

Fine Gael: The party's full official title is “Fine Gael – The United Ireland Party”.

Fianna Fáil: Yes. A United Ireland is a founding goal of our party.

Why would they give a **** though

Bishop of hope · 25-06-2020 04:57PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

I can't definitively speak for anyone else but I would be willing to bet that a huge volume of the young people who flocked to SF would be happy with any government which tackled the cost of living and housing through left wing policies. The issue isn't that we'd still oppose FFG if they brought in such measures, the issue is that we don't trust them to do it regardless of what they say or what agreements they sign off on. They'll find some excuse to pander to neoliberalism and not change course even if they promised to change course to begin with. FG at least are honest about not wanting to fix the problem, FF come across as a bunch of dishonest gobsh!tes on the issue considering their prior record in office.

Point being, if they do go in and they do change policy in this area, then great. It's not about party or personality but policy. The surge in support for SF is entirely born out of opposition to FFG's shared ideology and support for SF's opposing ideology. Obviously if FFG genuinely adopted the opposing ideology, then people would stop having as big an issue with them. The problem is, though, that they've sullied their reputations so much in this regard that even if they said they were changing policy, a lot of young people would assume they were just lying to get the pressure off their backs, and would come up with some excuse for reneging on commitments further down the line.

Eoghan Murphy, for example, single handedly did more damage to FG's reputation among young people than any individual politician has done for any political party in my entire memory of observing and participating in Irish politics. Even if they change policy, people still remember the attitude this man had towards the suffering of the young, and the fact that he had Leo's backing throughout his entire term in that office. Direct attacks against a demographic of the kind Murphy engaged in are extremely difficult to forget in terms of coming around to trusting a party. That's why people don't trust FG. FF at least have left wing policies in their past, which proves that they could come back around to them.

Essentially, while FF + SF wouldn't be as attractive as SF with other parties aside from FF and FG, it's still orders of magnitude better than any government involving FG. In that scenario, I think many SF voters would accept MM as Taoiseach if it meant a change in national policy alongside ensuring that FG got nowhere near power again for at least the next five years.

The problem is personal finance in Dublin anyway, or at least a huge percentage of it.
The costs concerned with building are huge, cheap housing is just impossible I think.
OK just say SF manage to get in and embark on a housebuilding splurge and manage to build 15 or 20 thousand houses a year and they can be bought for their own figure of 240k and rented for between 700 and 900 pm, how does that help anyone who doesn't qualify for this housing?
If you are looking to house people on low incomes then a 240 k mortgage is probably unachievable so it would be mostly rentals I'd say.
You're alienating a lot of people probably just above whatever income level is set but probably just surviving currently in the open market.
Go back out in 5 years to those paying 120k more for houses and double or treble in rent, you'd be booed of the doorsteps and rightly so.
There's too much loose talk regarding this housing provision and if it comes to pass you're going to burden future generations with more debt for the price of a stint in govt.

blanch152 · 25-06-2020 05:30PM

McMurphy wrote: »

Why assume Michaeál would be Taoiseach?

So now the shinners do want to govern afterall? Careful now Bishop, few lads on here going to be arguing with you on this.

If you think there is any chance of FF walking into the Dail to vote for Mary-Lou as Taoiseach this year, I would like some of what you are smoking.

They might do it later as part of a rotation, but they wouldn't do it now.

Jinglejangle69 · 26-06-2020 12:38AM

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Awh pet, its ok. FF/SF and the Greens will be talking tomorrow night

Oh dear.

Mary Lou saying the day of the election she will talk to the other parties about forming a government.

Are you telling me she can't do simple maths that you can?????

Ah no surely not.

I'll educate you.

The numbers were there for SF.

Did you forget the independents?

Jinglejangle69 · 26-06-2020 12:41AM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The "numbers were there" commentary is based upon the very reasonable assumption that the Greens would be happy to talk to a left wing alliance if it included environmentalist policies.

So who's fault is that??

FG won't talk to SF= bad.

Greens won't talk to SF= democracy.

Unbelievable.

joeguevara · 26-06-2020 01:48AM

Constant barage on my Facebook of posts about FF bribing FFFGGreen councillors with 8k to vote in favour. No idea it’s for every councillor bringing their pay from 17-25k and removing untouched expenses. Also no idea who actually votes for programme for government.

I’ll be glad when it’s all over, and see whoever is in power can implement what they promised.

blackwhite · 26-06-2020 06:44PM

I see SF are nominating Paddy Holohan for mayor of SDCC.

Clearly there were some severe consequences from the disciplinary action they took in January :rolleyes:

JohnnyFlash · 26-06-2020 06:58PM

blackwhite wrote: »

I see SF are nominating Paddy Holohan for mayor of SDCC.

Clearly there were some severe consequences from the disciplinary action they took in January :rolleyes:

An extremely unusual decision. Even though when you have the likes of Murray and Ellis in a party then you shouldn’t be too surprised. Lie down with dogs, wake up with fleas.

Horsebox9000 · 26-06-2020 09:10PM

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

An extremely unusual decision. Even though when you have the likes of Murray and Ellis in a party then you shouldn’t be too surprised. Lie down with dogs, wake up with fleas.

Ellis is a good man of integrity. He was in solidarity with his base when he took home the average wage.... oh wait...

Paddy is the SF version of George Lee. Just has a name so they use him

blanch152 · 26-06-2020 09:59PM

blackwhite wrote: »

I see SF are nominating Paddy Holohan for mayor of SDCC.

Clearly there were some severe consequences from the disciplinary action they took in January :rolleyes:

I was astonished to read this.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/sinn-fein-hierarchy-claims-it-was-not-aware-paddy-holohan-would-get-nomination-for-mayor-39319362.html

Unbelievable stuff. Imagine nominating a racist homophobe for mayor?

Pkiernan · 26-06-2020 10:05PM

blanch152 wrote: »

I was astonished to read this.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/sinn-fein-hierarchy-claims-it-was-not-aware-paddy-holohan-would-get-nomination-for-mayor-39319362.html

Unbelievable stuff. Imagine nominating a racist homophobe for mayor?

The IRA still at large perhaps?

Edgware · 26-06-2020 10:24PM

blanch152 wrote: »

I was astonished to read this.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/sinn-fein-hierarchy-claims-it-was-not-aware-paddy-holohan-would-get-nomination-for-mayor-39319362.html

Unbelievable stuff. Imagine nominating a racist homophobe for mayor?

Not unbelievable. This is S.F.

smurgen · 26-06-2020 11:08PM

blanch152 wrote: »

I was astonished to read this.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/sinn-fein-hierarchy-claims-it-was-not-aware-paddy-holohan-would-get-nomination-for-mayor-39319362.html

Unbelievable stuff. Imagine nominating a racist homophobe for mayor?

Crazy ****. And a real turn off for those of us looking for alternatives to FF & FG.

blackwhite · 27-06-2020 12:54AM

Gotta feel sorry for the poor volunteers that SF send out to blindly defend this one.

It’s up there with happyman and his staunch defences of the paedo Liam Adams when it comes to Parnell Square asking the acolytes to take one for the team

Edgware · 27-06-2020 01:04AM

smurgen wrote: »

Crazy ****. And a real turn off for those of us looking for alternatives to FF & FG.

Welcome to realS.F.
Don't be upset. You were not the first to be fooled by the propaganda aimed at the useful idiots

Notmything · 27-06-2020 01:18AM

It's grand lads, sf leadership didn't know about the nomination ðŸ™„ðŸ™„ðŸ™„

https://amp.independent.ie/irish-news/sinn-fein-hierarchy-claims-it-was-not-aware-paddy-holohan-would-get-nomination-for-mayor-39319362.html?__twitter_impression=true

Bonniedog · 27-06-2020 01:19AM

They are not pleased by the way things have turned out with the coalition deal.

Had another election been called and they did as well as polls are saying, or even as well as January, and ran multiple candidates they would have been looking at up to 50 seats.

That would have guaranteed them a place in government most likely.

We may be grateful that did not come to pass despite the cost being having the wacky Greens in power.

If virus remains under control and economy picks up shinners will be in bad place.

Especially as the extremely poor quality of their TDs, councillors and senators will be exposed. Sure to be more scandals too. Would not be surprised if Big Bobby's death leads to more revelations regarding MI5/Branch control of the upper echelons of their militia.

Is it just me or have SF vanished?

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