beef price tracker

Good loser · 15-06-2020 01:25AM

Supply and demand determines the price of calves, the price of stores and the price of fat cattle (and always has). Larry Goodman has f**k all to do with it.
The price of cattle went up 20c to 25c per kg a couple of months ago throughout the system. Do people actually think that was an independant decision by LG to give farmers more for their cattle - because he felt they deserved it?

K.G. · 15-06-2020 09:35AM

Water John wrote: »

If only they'd rent their ground cheaply to you. You'd make good use of it.

I can assure you i have more than enough ground first year ever nobody has not come to talk about land and that suits fine.getting to the stage where i have enough cows too.i always leave it to people to approach me as everyone is entitled to do what they like with their own property.my point is the margins are not there to support smaller numbers andyou need some sort of scale to survive.its no different in the milking game.the margin in milk was never lower hardly than it is now its just the fellas have scaled up to compensate. I have no doubt that the margins are going to drop even more in both businesses

tanko · 15-06-2020 01:33PM

Good loser wrote: »

Supply and demand determines the price of calves, the price of stores and the price of fat cattle (and always has). Larry Goodman has f**k all to do with it.
The price of cattle went up 20c to 25c per kg a couple of months ago throughout the system. Do people actually think that was an independant decision by LG to give farmers more for their cattle - because he felt they deserved it?

To suggest that supply and demand determines the price of fat cattle is utter rubbish.
The beef market in Ireland is a classic example of a price fixing monopoly/cartel.

DBK1 · 15-06-2020 02:00PM

Cavanjack wrote: »

Good u grade bullocks can kill out at 58%.
R grades round 55%
Young continental bulls 58% is the norm.
Dairy type bulls 52%

Over the past few years majority of stock have been live weighed within a day or 2 of going to the factory.

O/R- grade herefords and dairy limousines ranged from 48 to 53%.
R=/+ continentals 55 to 58%
U grades 58 up to the best over the past few years of 64%. A cracking 29 month old U+ killing out at 424kgs. Majority of U grades killed out 60% and above the past winter. All heifers.

The factory they are being sent to makes a big difference to kill out percentages. This shouldn’t be the case but it’s only when you start live weighing you see the results from various factories.

blue5000 · 15-06-2020 02:03PM

DBK do you watch them being killed? Skinning takes off a fair lump of external fat IMHO.

DBK1 · 15-06-2020 03:39PM

blue5000 wrote: »

DBK do you watch them being killed? Skinning takes off a fair lump of external fat IMHO.

Hi Blue,

No I’ve never waited to see them being killed. Maybe it’s something I should do whenever it will be allowed again.

Cavanjack · 15-06-2020 03:58PM

DBK1 wrote: »

Over the past few years majority of stock have been live weighed within a day or 2 of going to the factory.

O/R- grade herefords and dairy limousines ranged from 48 to 53%.
R=/+ continentals 55 to 58%
U grades 58 up to the best over the past few years of 64%. A cracking 29 month old U+ killing out at 424kgs. Majority of U grades killed out 60% and above the past winter. All heifers.

The factory they are being sent to makes a big difference to kill out percentages. This shouldn’t be the case but it’s only when you start live weighing you see the results from various factories.

Wonder do bullocks and heifers kill out better out of the shed than off grass? Has anyone availed of the live weighing in the factories and any idea of the cost?

Duke92 · 15-06-2020 04:00PM

I’m beginning to think most people on here a small hobbie farmers that don’t really have a clue about finishing cattle
But have feck all else to be doing only giving out

wrangler · 15-06-2020 06:42PM

Duke92 wrote: »

I’m beginning to think most people on here a small hobbie farmers that don’t really have a clue about finishing cattle
But have feck all else to be doing only giving out

boards .ie wouldn't be the the worst by any means, there's farmers acting like children that don't know what they want on other forums.
Do they think that if they oppose everything they'll eventually get something right.
It's ironic in fact as you wouldn't let them run a tea party

Cavanjack · 15-06-2020 06:46PM

Duke92 wrote: »

I’m beginning to think most people on here a small hobbie farmers that don’t really have a clue about finishing cattle
But have feck all else to be doing only giving out

I’d say most on here are suckler or dairy farmers with very few finishing cattle only and sure 100 acres is regarded by some as a hobby these days.

blue5000 · 15-06-2020 06:54PM

Duke92 wrote: »

I’m beginning to think most people on here a small hobbie farmers that don’t really have a clue about finishing cattle
But have feck all else to be doing only giving out

I reckon every beef farmer, big or small is a hobby farmer, certainly not in it for the money at present anyway.

memorystick · 15-06-2020 07:22PM

Any quotes

Hershall · 15-06-2020 10:28PM

memorystick wrote: »

Any quotes

3.60 midlands hfrs and bks

Good loser · 15-06-2020 11:05PM

tanko wrote: »

To suggest that supply and demand determines the price of fat cattle is utter rubbish.
The beef market in Ireland is a classic example of a price fixing monopoly/cartel.

So why did the price of cattle go up by 20 to 25c per kg a couple of months ago? If LG pulls prices down he must also be responsible for them going up.

And why did he settle on those numbers?
Give that a think.

charolais0153 · 16-06-2020 12:25AM

Good loser wrote: »

So why did the price of cattle go up by 20 to 25c per kg a couple of months ago? If LG pulls prices down he must also be responsible for them going up.

And why did he settle on those numbers?
Give that a think.

Wrangler has said it before, we are undercutting the british so logically our price is behind theirs, wonder what the brits think of lg

Fireside Solicitor · 16-06-2020 07:32AM

Duke92 wrote: »

I’m beginning to think most people on here a small hobbie farmers that don’t really have a clue about finishing cattle
But have feck all else to be doing only giving out

Just like an IFA meeting

wrangler · 16-06-2020 07:47AM

Fireside Solicitor wrote: »

Just like an IFA meeting

Or anywhere that irish farmers congregate,
You never see a word about larrys' conspiracies on english farming forums or 'everyones out to get us' theories
much healthier altogether

Good loser · 16-06-2020 08:56AM

charolais0153 wrote: »

Wrangler has said it before, we are undercutting the british so logically our price is behind theirs, wonder what the brits think of lg

Why not address my questions?

Surely all meat factories sell their product at the best price they can achieve? (that.s how I sell my cattle).

Why would they do otherwise?

893bet · 16-06-2020 09:14AM

Good loser wrote: »

So why did the price of cattle go up by 20 to 25c per kg a couple of months ago? If LG pulls prices down he must also be responsible for them going up.

And why did he settle on those numbers?
Give that a think.

But he can control the price through his own feedlots. If the price goes up due to increased demand/competition he can kill more from controlled feedlot which increases supply and drags price back down.

kk.man · 16-06-2020 09:38AM

wrangler wrote: »

Or anywhere that irish farmers congregate,
You never see a word about larrys' conspiracies on english farming forums or 'everyones out to get us' theories
much healthier altogether

That's not true Wrangler one site recently posted the famous 'world in action' program via utube and then they published an article from the 'Scottish Farmer' tbh they really want to town on him.
I actually thought it was unfair how far they went.

wrangler · 16-06-2020 10:48AM

893bet wrote: »

But he can control the price through his own feedlots. If the price goes up due to increased demand/competition he can kill more from controlled feedlot which increases supply and drags price back down.

They don't just appear in the feedlots, surely he has to go out and compete in the market place for their replacements

Fireside Solicitor · 16-06-2020 10:52AM

Jim Power wasn’t able to answer it because he doesn’t have access to the management accounts of each processor (not the statutory accounts) and the communication records between processors. There are plenty of ways to manage margin and the most important one of all is to make sure you are buying your inputs (our cattle) at the right price and the right mix.

All that said cattle processing is not a high margin business. It is a low margin and all about volume. The retailers in some circumstances demand open books before they will give a contract.

A bread maker here years ago told me that Tesco sent over their bread team to him to go through his books and make sure his costs were as efficient as possible before they would price his bread contract. They even looked at his flour arrangements and forced him to buy forward. On price increases the way the bread lads did it was a simple as one of them would agree to put the price up and go first with the retailer then the others would follow. The retailer would put up with it when they had demand but would then delist some bread makers when things got tight. The delisted boy had to discount to get back in on the shelf and so the price overall came back again. The same principles apply with meat processing from the retailers perspective. The Government should introduce minimum price legislation but they’ll never do that.

Farmers don’t want to hear it but whatever bargaining power they had on beef was lost a long time ago. You now have a family farm model versus large retailer model and the two just don’t mix. The processor is in the middle and doing everything they can to keep their profits up. Then to top all the consumer taste is moving. Only way is for Government legislation on the retailers.

Grueller · 16-06-2020 12:10PM

Duke92 wrote: »

I’m beginning to think most people on here a small hobbie farmers that don’t really have a clue about finishing cattle
But have feck all else to be doing only giving out

10/10 for condescension there Duke.

charolais0153 · 16-06-2020 01:51PM

Jjameson wrote: »

So how have all the processors got identical operating cost? Despite geographical location,stage of development? Can you answer the question Jim power wasnt fit to. What is the formula that determines the price? How does every price pull and rise move with almost perfect uniformity? The retail price remains constant. The restaurant and catering industry tell us that there’s never any downward fluctuation in their purchasing.

You may well be right (I don’t think so but I’m only a gom of a small hobby farmer 5’11 with a beer belly.) but it is incredulous that we never organised a proper Investigation.

I agree with wrangler to a point about farmers with illogical conspiracy theories and such and bringing such stuff to any table is a waste of energy and actually weakens our case.

90% of beef is exported, doesnt nake muxh differnece what supervalu are doing tbh

richie123 · 16-06-2020 02:26PM

charolais0153 wrote: »

90% of beef is exported, doesnt nake muxh differnece what supervalu are doing tbh

The best answer to this whole beef price-fixing debate is go out and pay someone kill your own stock and store it at your own expense then deal with restaurant s wholesalers etc.
You won't be long about finding out how tight the margins are.
Beef is a high output low margin business..
That's how the Larry Goodman's of this world make there money.

Fireside Solicitor · 16-06-2020 06:32PM

An uncle of mine used deal with Larry back when he started out tangling. That was the early 60s. Look at how the diary co-ops have developed since and look at beef. You could argue that Larry took the place of a beef co-op but then he was allowed to as the farmers could never get cohesive like the dairy men

Fireside Solicitor · 16-06-2020 06:34PM

And you could say Charlie Haughey made him but there was nothing to stop the farmers doing the same deals with Haughey for the export refunds if they got their act together. Haughey didn’t care where his money was coming from!

Aravo · 16-06-2020 07:53PM

Animal tested last year on say 20th June and reading say on 23rd June. What is the expiry date for slaughter this year.

Good loser · 16-06-2020 08:40PM

Jjameson wrote: »

So how have all the processors got identical operating cost? Despite geographical location,stage of development? Can you answer the question Jim power wasnt fit to. What is the formula that determines the price? How does every price pull and rise move with almost perfect uniformity? The retail price remains constant. The restaurant and catering industry tell us that there’s never any downward fluctuation in their purchasing.

You may well be right (I don’t think so but I’m only a gom of a small hobby farmer 5’11 with a beer belly.) but it is incredulous that we never organised a proper Investigation.

I agree with wrangler to a point about farmers with illogical conspiracy theories and such and bringing such stuff to any table is a waste of energy and actually weakens our case.

That's an easy one. Supply and demand determines price. That's why prices go up AND down. The market is constantly adjusting.

At the micro level the farmer has little clout. See every week in Market Trends in the IFJ where large sellers of lamb can squeeze 10c extra from the factory fairly often - but not always. When supplies are plentiful the factories can stick to their quotes.

Last year I wanted to sell 4 or 5 cattle. My agent said it was unlikely he could get €x per kg. as he had four loads of cattle stacked for the last two weeks looking for this price. And there was no budge. I let them off at the lower price.
It's not complicated.

epfff · 16-06-2020 09:56PM

Aravo wrote: »

Animal tested last year on say 20th June and reading say on 23rd June. What is the expiry date for slaughter this year.

No expiry on slaughter date but dept will lock up herd probably after killing

beef price tracker

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