Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - Read OP for Mod Warnings

is_that_so · 05-06-2020 09:17AM

ixoy wrote: »

It's different for office-based companies who can do things like rotas whilst still having people work from home.

Shops though need to maximise the number of customers they can safely handle and that's tougher. In some cases I imagine it could be things such as perspex - there's a big demand on it, and probably some shops have orders in that won't be fulfilled yet because of a backlog and that their target date was a few weeks away.
Or how to manage the layout of the floor which itself requires staff to go in safely and re-organise shelves, displays, etc.

Others were presumably waiting to see if there was any budge on the 2m rule before doing a lot of this too as it'd make a huge difference to how they can operate.

It doesn't negate my point that this has been planned for anyway. It's not just being sprung on them the weekend before, the way some posters choose to believe.

CruelSummer · 05-06-2020 09:17AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Can you tell me a mechanism where are less virulent strain of a virus would evolve in multiple places at the same time? The virus is not a hive. 1500 deaths in Brazil yesterday. Increasing trends all across Latam. Even increases being observed in the likes of Texas, Florida and Minnesota where deaths are at best plateauing if not increasing. As well as it is going in Europe, the virus will not disappear by itself and vigilance needs to remain as we return to normal.
McConkey loves the sound of his own voice however and is painful on this

No I’m not a doctor, I’m reading reports FROM doctors in Italy and the US, as well as the Wuhan report.
Why are you using Latin America to make a point? They’re just in their initial wave. Not relevant to here.

Ginger n Lemon · 05-06-2020 09:24AM

CruelSummer wrote: »

No I’m not a doctor, I’m reading reports FROM doctors in Italy and the US, as well as the Wuhan report.
Why are you using Latin America to make a point? They’re just in their initial wave. Not relevant to here.

Latin America is the only thing reporting everyday by Virgin media & RTE. Same video of mass graves shown every day.

I think posters here really dread the carry on of seeing 10 + coffins on TV. Impression = millions are dying.

I remember there was a poster here predicting 200k deaths by end of June for US. they had 989 die per day there. Hysteria is real

Jinglejangle69 · 05-06-2020 09:24AM

road_high wrote: »

Jesus Christ easy known someone never had a hand in running a business. Clueless doesn’t begin to describe this synopsis

Just a genuine question.

Hopefully the businessess can open back up especially with the stimulus packages been offered.

If they have opened before and been successful then they hopefully can do it again.

People are ready to get out and spend again.

Social distancing will be the big problem.

05-06-2020 09:35AM

CruelSummer wrote: »

No I’m not a doctor, I’m reading reports FROM doctors in Italy and the US, as well as the Wuhan report.
Why are you using Latin America to make a point? They’re just in their initial wave. Not relevant to here.

Of course its relevant - the virus is not dying out just because of a couple of reports of lower symptoms in Italy and the US. And it could easily return to Europe from these places, which is why vigilance must be maintained. Not lockdown mind before I'm accused of being a Lockdown Larry.

Selective pressure on the virus will tend to weaker strains over time, but these will be strains in particular areas only, not the entire global virus profile. And as the mutations that drive the the selection are random, it will only be a trend that will see some reversals where a previously milder strain becomes more viralant. What this does offer however, is the potential for a live vaccine to be developed which would be a game changer

05-06-2020 09:39AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Latin America is the only thing reporting everyday by Virgin media & RTE. Same video of mass graves shown every day.

I think posters here really dread the carry on of seeing 10 + coffins on TV. Impression = millions are dying.

I remember there was a poster here predicting 200k deaths by end of June for US. they had 989 die per day there. Hysteria is real

You do know that the US are on track to hit at least 130k dead by the end of June, with large parts of the country still in various degrees of lockdown, and questionable reporting in many states

Ginger n Lemon · 05-06-2020 09:41AM

Deleted User wrote: »

Of course its relevant - the virus is not dying out just because of a couple of reports of lower symptoms in Italy and the US. And it could easily return to Europe from these places, which is why vigilance must be maintained. Not lockdown mind before I'm accused of being a Lockdown Larry.

Selective pressure on the virus will tend to weaker strains over time, but these will be strains in particular areas only, not the entire global virus profile. And as the mutations that drive the the selection are random, it will only be a trend that will see some reversals where a previously milder strain becomes more viralant. Why this does offer however, is the potential for a live vaccine to be developed which would be a game changer

Virus is dying out. It is dying out because number of people recovering from covid is GREATER THAN number of live cases. Really that simple. Covid goes away after 14 days or so. People do not LIVE WITH COVID. Its a 14 day sickness. 14 days. Not freaking 3 months or 6 months. You are completely underestimating the recovery of cases and the total number recovered already, which impairs your judgement big time.

Preaching things like "it could easily return to Europe" and you dont want to be accused of being Lockdown Larry? 2nd wave much?

Ginger n Lemon · 05-06-2020 09:43AM

Deleted User wrote: »

You do know that the US are on track to hit at least 130k dead by the end of June, with large parts of the country still in various degrees of lockdown, and questionable reporting in many states

Oh for crying out, questionable reporting?

So, Belarus have questionable reporting. China has questionable reporting, now you are saying US has questionable reporting? Didnt you accuse Germany of under reporting cases recently too?

Either countries do not report covid, or its not there. Take a pick.

PS you are right on one thing

Washington state over-reporting COVID-19 deaths

https://www.freedomfoundation.com/washington/washington-state-over-reporting-covid-19-deaths/

05-06-2020 09:53AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Virus is dying out. It is dying out because number of people recovering from covid is GREATER THAN number of live cases. Really that simple. Covid goes away after 14 days or so. People do not LIVE WITH COVID. Its a 14 day sickness. 14 days. Not freaking 3 months or 6 months. You are completely underestimating the recovery of cases and the total number recovered already, which impairs your judgement big time.

Preaching things like "it could easily return to Europe" and you don't want to be accused of being Lockdown Larry? 2nd wave much?

If less than 10% of the population have had it a second wave cannot be ruled out. I don't think it will happen, but it cannot be ruled out. But once again you are arguing a point I did not raise

05-06-2020 10:02AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Oh for crying out, questionable reporting?

So, Belarus have questionable reporting. China has questionable reporting, now you are saying US has questionable reporting? Didnt you accuse Germany of under reporting cases recently too?

Either countries do not report covid, or its not there. Take a pick.

PS you are right on one thing

Washington state over-reporting COVID-19 deaths

https://www.freedomfoundation.com/washington/washington-state-over-reporting-covid-19-deaths/

Did I accuse Germany of under reporting? Don't ever recall making such a suggestion. In the early days of the outbreak, German death rates did look very low, but in general these have tended to the mean over time given their extensive testing and are not particularly far away from ours as a proportion of positive cases

And what I said is US is on track to hit 130k by end of June, so projections were not widely off and driven by Hysteria. And even if the Freedom Foundation is right, and the entire country has over counted by 13% that's still 113k dead.
What we do know however is that reporting varies from state to state in the US and there will be puts and takes.

Ginger n Lemon · 05-06-2020 10:08AM

Deleted User wrote: »

If less than 10% of the population have had it a second wave cannot be ruled out. I don't think it will happen, but it cannot be ruled out. But once again you are arguing a point I did not raise

I think today is too big of a day to be speculating over 2nd waves. Leo is due to make a big announcement, IBEC is coming out with its economic predictions and most importantly, its going to be ANOTHER DAY of under 100 new cases. Wrapping up ANOTHER WEEK of under R number under 1. But we are still not there yet according to Simon & Tonyy...

PS we both know if there were 2nd waves and 2nd lockdowns youd be linking those, so hope you agree with me that covid has not re appeared in any EU countries and has definitely not caused any other EU country to go into 2nd lockdown. So the whole conversation of "2nd wave can not be ruled out" is for Gerry Killeen and tonight shows.

I hope you trust EU countries reporting numbers.

stephenjmcd · 05-06-2020 10:12AM

Irish Times reporting this now :

A dramatic escalation of the roadmap to reopen Ireland is on the cards, with the Cabinet on Friday considering accelerating entire phases of the existing plan.

Well-placed sources have said the National Public Health Emergency Team (Nphet) has been asked to examine if entire phases can be brought forward or merged.

It is understood, however, that significant work would have to be done before this could be deemed to be possible.

Ministers are expected to consider such a move at their meeting on Friday morning.

The Government is considering the possibility that some pubs will open earlier than planned and the total lifting of travel restrictions is being discussed.

frillyleaf · 05-06-2020 10:14AM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Irish Times reporting this now :

A dramatic escalation of the roadmap to reopen Ireland is on the cards, with the Cabinet on Friday considering accelerating entire phases of the existing plan.

Well-placed sources have said the National Public Health Emergency Team (Nphet) has been asked to examine if entire phases can be brought forward or merged.

It is understood, however, that significant work would have to be done before this could be deemed to be possible.

Ministers are expected to consider such a move at their meeting on Friday morning.

The Government is considering the possibility that some pubs will open earlier than planned and the total lifting of travel restrictions is being discussed.

Did they say what date the travel restrictions are due to lift? If this was the end of June tourism would hugely benefit. It may be too early to lift the 20km limit with so many shops opening on Monday but they may bring it forward to June 29th!

stephenjmcd · 05-06-2020 10:15AM

frillyleaf wrote: »

Did they say what date the travel restrictions are due to lift? If this was the end of June tourism would hugely benefit. It may be too early to lift the 20km limit with so many shops opening on Monday but they may bring it forward to June 29th!

Looks like 20k could be gone 29th June.

Seems like a fair few changes to be considered today.

bush · 05-06-2020 10:23AM

Looking at the tonight show last night didn't give me much hope of it being accelerated that much.

manniot2 · 05-06-2020 10:25AM

Country will be re-open by the end of June.

JDD · 05-06-2020 10:28AM

manniot2 wrote: »

Country will be re-open by the end of June.

I think you're right. Everything I have read, from confirmation that large outlets will open on Monday, to the additional early reopenings being considered today, to various doctors saying that the virus is weakening, leads me to believe that we will be reopened, nearly completely, in 4-8 weeks.

frillyleaf · 05-06-2020 10:29AM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Looks like 20k could be gone 29th June.

Seems like a fair few changes to be considered today.

That would be fantastic for businesses and the tourism industry!! I imagine that things at airports will be tightened up to avoid us going into this situation going forward , assuming the virus doesn’t burn itself out!

frillyleaf · 05-06-2020 10:29AM

manniot2 wrote: »

Country will be re-open by the end of June.

Yes everything will be open then !

FintanMcluskey · 05-06-2020 10:35AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Latin America is the only thing reporting everyday by Virgin media & RTE. Same video of mass graves shown every day.

I think posters here really dread the carry on of seeing 10 + coffins on TV. Impression = millions are dying.

I remember there was a poster here predicting 200k deaths by end of June for US. they had 989 die per day there. Hysteria is real

Some posters are so oddly disconnected from the real world they seem to think once Covid is a distant memory nobody will die again.

Some of the responses to the point I made yesterday was bizzare, one lad in particular got so overly emotional I was going to arrange help for him.

I quoted how Sweden wasnt doing as poorly as the media is saying compared to Ireland, because, as its killing over 65s, so the more vulnerable citizens a nation has, obviously it will have more deaths, thus younger populations will appear to preform better but it will not be related to restrictions.

Allegedly I was sentencing the over 65's to death, bizzare stuff tbh,

Ginger n Lemon · 05-06-2020 10:35AM

Yesssss Boris Johnson probably advised on this

The Government is to change its advice to the public from “stay home” to “stay local” from Monday.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/government-slogan-to-change-from-stay-home-to-stay-local-from-monday-1003552.html

We are opening up. and quickly, whether you like it or not.

Remember, stay alert, go to work, defeat the virus.

Ginger n Lemon · 05-06-2020 10:38AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Some posters are so oddly disconnected from the real world they seem to think once Covid is a distant memory nobody will die again.

Some of the responses to the point I made yesterday was bizzare, one lad in particular got so overly emotional I was going to arrange help for him.

I quoted how Sweden wasnt doing as poorly as the media is saying compared to Ireland, because, as its killing over 65s, so the more vulnerable citizens a nation has, obviously it will have more deaths, thus younger populations will appear to preform better but it will not be related to restrictions.

Allegedly I was sentencing the over 65's to death, bizzare stuff tbh,

Ahhh Fintan Stalin what are you doing :rolleyes:

In all seriousness, Sweden was predicted to have 96k deaths by this month at their "no lockdown model", 4 k in reality. Another day in the office for Neil Fergusons

FintanMcluskey · 05-06-2020 10:38AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Yesssss Boris Johnson probably advised on this

The Government is to change its advice to the public from “stay home” to “stay local” from Monday.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/government-slogan-to-change-from-stay-home-to-stay-local-from-monday-1003552.html

We are opening up. and quickly, whether you like it or not.

Remember, stay alert, go to work, defeat the virus.

Ah its all over so.

I've made some fantastic friends on here I will cherish for years, others, I hope my only contact with will be limited to them waving at me through their letterbox this Summer

bb1234567 · 05-06-2020 10:40AM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Irish Times reporting this now :

A dramatic escalation of the roadmap to reopen Ireland is on the cards, with the Cabinet on Friday considering accelerating entire phases of the existing plan.

Well-placed sources have said the National Public Health Emergency Team (Nphet) has been asked to examine if entire phases can be brought forward or merged.

It is understood, however, that significant work would have to be done before this could be deemed to be possible.

Ministers are expected to consider such a move at their meeting on Friday morning.

The Government is considering the possibility that some pubs will open earlier than planned and the total lifting of travel restrictions is being discussed.

Fantastic news

ZX7R · 05-06-2020 10:47AM

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Yesterday's briefing would suggest otherwise IMO. Tony Holohan's language has completely shifted. Previously when asked about speeding things up he was very clear that they wouldn't be recommending anything like that. There was very little language like that being used yesterday.

There is a growing consensus know in Europe that control has been obtained over the virus, This is evident in how Tony and team are going to judge things and a new government to to be formed soon.
Things will speed up it's a formality at the current status of things

05-06-2020 10:52AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

I think today is too big of a day to be speculating over 2nd waves. Leo is due to make a big announcement, IBEC is coming out with its economic predictions and most importantly, its going to be ANOTHER DAY of under 100 new cases. Wrapping up ANOTHER WEEK of under R number under 1. But we are still not there yet according to Simon & Tonyy...

PS we both know if there were 2nd waves and 2nd lockdowns youd be linking those, so hope you agree with me that covid has not re appeared in any EU countries and has definitely not caused any other EU country to go into 2nd lockdown. So the whole conversation of "2nd wave can not be ruled out" is for Gerry Killeen and tonight shows.

I hope you trust EU countries reporting numbers.

If you like you can go back and look through my posts to see the multiple times I have suggested opening up quicker, argued against those who believe we are still in a high risk situation at the moment and provided numbers to support the fact that we are currently in control. It doesn't stop me challenging those of you who believe lockdown achieved nothing however, or conclusions that appear to be drawn on erroneous data or data taken out of context. And nobody can yet say a second wave is not possible, even if what data I see currently indicates that that is unlikely. The current trend may be a result of SAR-CoV2 being seasonal like influenza, in which case there is a significant risk, not least because after years of study they don't really fully understand why the Flu is seasonal. Or it may be due to a level cross immunity with other corona viruses - I had a post either here or another site I post on in the early days where I asked the question as to whether the reason the effect in kids is so mild is because the are highly likely to have recent exposure to some of the coronavirus species that cause 15% of colds so the immune system is attuned to dealing with these type of infections, whereas in adults, in many cases, our immune systems are out of practice - maybe this is also helping.
My point is we don't know enough yet to draw firm conclusions either way, but I believe returning towards normality, quicker than we are, and remaining vigilant is the best strategy.

ThewhiteJesus · 05-06-2020 10:52AM

first time since covid 19 started i see lot's of positive news/posts here today which is great,
i for one will not take my civil liberties for granted ever again, or the simple things in life like a hug or a decent conversation when this is over !

Gael23 · 05-06-2020 10:56AM

We won’t e speeding under Tony’s watch

Ginger n Lemon · 05-06-2020 11:12AM

What a day we are having.

Feels like we are playing roulette and putting all our money on red 4 times in a row and winning

"Minister Heather Humphreys has said limited international air travel will return in the coming weeks as Ireland looks to negotiate 'air bridges' with countries who have suppressed Covid-19.

Ms Humphreys said it is a "challenging time for everyone" particularly those in the aviation industry as the "virus has no mercy", but that international travel will commence within weeks."

https://www.independent.ie/life/travel/international-travel-to-return-within-weeks-via-air-bridges-as-phase-two-of-lockdown-rolls-out-39262248.html

At this rate, at about 2 o clock today we could hear announcement about coppers and diceys re opening dates being brought forward.

VonLuck · 05-06-2020 11:12AM

Does anyone know what time Leo is giving his speech today?

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - Read OP for Mod Warnings