Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - Read OP for Mod Warnings

Tenzor07 · 03-06-2020 01:33PM

manniot2 wrote: »

Im hoping the change in weather will change the lockdown enthusiasts view of the whole thing. A few weeks of rain with no BBQs, kids pools etc and they might start questioning the govs re-opening. Im firmly of the view many people will soon forget about this virus when it starts impacting their own pockets/lifestyles - many people have simply had it too good these last few months and are living in denial about the fiscal misery that is incoming.

There's many people, academics, medics, pensioners who are massive supporters of the Lockdown/shutdown of the Irish economy.
Why? Because each month their salary/payments get into the bank account without delay or issue.
No interest in speeding up the phases of unlocking the country, they will not suffer financially, unlike the 100's of thousands who want to work and are seeing their business and bank balances disappearing.

facehugger99 · 03-06-2020 01:36PM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Listening to PT on RTE lastnight it would appear that the Govt/tourist board have written off the Irish tourism season for 2020/2021.

This will see many small B&B/pubs/small tour companies go out of business permanently.

The absolute disdain shown towards small indigenous businesses here has been outrageous.

A bunch of lads who've spent their whole careers sucking on the public-purse tit have fed Irish entrepreneurs to the wolves.

FintanMcluskey · 03-06-2020 01:43PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

https://twitter.com/tancredipalmeri/status/1268156568610234368?s=19

Thats a depressing read.

Ireland has no justification for what happening

Its a police state in Ireland. End of. The restrictions have no justification anymore.

That Lord Sumption lad in the UK was some sort of high court judge and reckons the UK is bizzare to restrict its citizens and they never shut schools or imposed some ridiculous distance restrictions such as Ireland's.

03-06-2020 01:44PM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

A Doctor of Virology from UCD says that the 5k, 20k restrictions are pointless and are a massive contributor to the decimation of any domestic tourism industry due to people being stopped from travelling.
Local populations in rural places like Kerry cannot sustain the Cafe's and Restaurants which will soon open, so the HSE need to scrap these ridiculous distance limits now!

Sam McConkey speaking to Pat Kenny earlier this morning. Its the one thing he DOESN'T want to see changing. He says people from Dublin can then bring virus to areas that don't have it so scrapping the 5km or 20km is not going to happen!

This is also contributing to huge fear mongering among rural people! They think Covid is rampant in Dublin and its not, its not rampant anywhere anymore!
My sister lives in Donegal and is absolutely terrified of this virus. She hasn't been to a supermarket once since 12th March , even now

She gets her son to do the shopping, yet she is only 62. Her fear is borderline obsessive at this stage, she hasn't even been to a beach yet even though she lives in the middle of nowhere and would be driving to deserted beached 15km away.
I am really worrying about her at this stage and particularly her mental health. This fear is so destructive.

I think there is far more fear in rural areas about this virus being brought in. I saw on Prime Time last night that the Aran Islands closed BEFORE any Government guidelines at the beginning of March, they didn't want any cases on the island and I get that. But they are still completely closed , you cannot get on to the islands without permission, but they are cut off and will have absolutely no tourism income this Summer. Where do you decide you have to actually live your life, accept there is risk in everything, take baby steps but start getting back to some semblance of normality?

People in rural counties who have been barricading roads to beaches and putting up signs to "stay home" "no tourists" " tourists out " also have to realise that their very livelihoods and viability rely on the millions of euro those tourists provide every year. Tourism is their lifeblood. There is no other industry in some of these places. You can't have it every way.

Ginger n Lemon · 03-06-2020 01:45PM

Reality keeps hitting hard.

Seriously, lift them restrictions fast this is madness, how are we so special to have highest pandemic unemployment in entire Europe?

"Unemployment rate remains at near record 26.1% in May
CSO figures shows jobless rate on foot of coronavirus shutdown"

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/unemployment-rate-remains-at-near-record-26-1-in-may-1.4269603?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fbusiness%2Feconomy%2Funemployment-rate-remains-at-near-record-26-1-in-may-1.4269603

The horror figure will be July (if we lift restrictions in June) or August (if we lift all restrictions in July) if that 26% doesnt come down to 10% or under we are officially in a very bad place for unfortunately likely a very long time.

If we lift final restrictions in August I wouldnt even recommend looking at Sept unemployment figure, highly likely to be too upsetting.

end of the road · 03-06-2020 01:53PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Thats a depressing read.

Ireland has no justification for what happening

Its a police state in Ireland. End of. The restrictions have no justification anymore.

That Lord Sumption lad in the UK was some sort of high court judge and reckons the UK is bizzare to restrict its citizens and they never shut schools or imposed some ridiculous distance restrictions such as Ireland's.

it's not a police state in ireland, end of.
go to china or a middle eastern country or some african dictatorship to see an actual police state in action.
you don't know the meaning of the term police state.

road_high · 03-06-2020 01:57PM

end of the road wrote: »

it's not a police state in ireland, end of.
go to china or a middle eastern country or some african dictatorship to see an actual police state in action.
you don't know the meaning of the term police state.

No, Ireland is more of a nanny state.

growleaves · 03-06-2020 01:59PM

end of the road wrote: »

it's not a police state in ireland, end of.
go to china or a middle eastern country or some african dictatorship to see an actual police state in action.
you don't know the meaning of the term police state.

I think what you mean here is that there is no violence, torture or special system of camps or prisons.

However there is totalitarian control over basic freedoms, enforced by police who are supervising citizens' activities - without violence. Whatever you want to call it its not a normal state of affairs.

end of the road · 03-06-2020 02:01PM

growleaves wrote: »

I think what you mean here is that there is no violence, torture or special system of camps or prisons.

However there is totalitarian control over basic freedoms, enforced by police who are supervising citizens' activities - without violence. Whatever you want to call it its not a normal state of affairs.

still not a police state.

bb1234567 · 03-06-2020 02:05PM

road_high wrote: »

Yes one small outbreak let’s freak out and cancel all forms of life

It is frustrating and ridiculous that this is the reply to any piece of slightly negative news on this thread, as if I even slightly hinted at what you suggested . Of course one example such as this is in actual fact reason to 'freak out', 9 infected tourists will re start a pandemic and undo the whole lockdown . That is just from one single plane . Clearly if Greece was not careful about who it's letting in it will be very soon back to square one in March .

Ireland can and should open up, but tourism is a non runner unless we quarantine them for 14 days forcibly, which I can't see happening. So either we somehow live with an ongoing epidemic among normal daily life or tourism is a gonner for 2020 at least

Tenzor07 · 03-06-2020 02:06PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Sam McConkey speaking to Pat Kenny earlier this morning. Its the one thing he DOESN'T want to see changing. He says people from Dublin can then bring virus to areas that don't have it so scrapping the 5km or 20km is not going to happen!
This is also contributing to huge fear mongering among rural people! They think Covid is rampant in Dublin and its not, its not rampant anywhere anymore!.

Well, that's McConkey's opinion, just like in science there's rarely agreement and plenty of differing opinions.
Not to mention the fact that the 72 year old Pat Kenny is very conservative in his views.

Now that the fear of 10,000+ deaths and infections we saw in Northern Italy hasn't happened, but got us into Lockdown has abated, the damage has been done in the minds of the more elderly conservatives in this country who don't want to see domestic tourists unless there's a cure for Covid.

Ginger n Lemon · 03-06-2020 02:13PM

bb1234567 wrote: »

It is frustrating and ridiculous that this is the reply to any piece of slightly negative news on this thread . Of course one example such as this is in actual fact reason to 'freak out', 9 infected tourists will re start a pandemic and undo the whole lockdown . That is just from one single plane . Clearly if Greece was not careful about who it's letting in it will be very soon back to square one in March .

Ireland can and should open up, but tourism is a non runner unless we quarantine them for 14 days forcibly, which I can't see happening. So either we somehow live with an ongoing epidemic among normal daily life or tourism is a gonner for 2020 at least

I think that if we rephrase what happened there, as in reality we both agree 100 + planes landed in Greece in the last while, only because 1 of them had some infections (no deaths btw) a quick quarantine/isolation provided by receiving country (tons of empty hotels all over countries) should fix the issue.

Infections will 100% happen, and Greece arent debating whether they should cancel their summer now because of these 12 individuals who were infected on a landing plane.

Overall - yes live with the virus and accept it. Plenty of EU countries are already doing this, whatever spin BBC or RTE put on these developments will always be scaremongering/spike in new cases/"may be" "if" "possible" "potentially linked with" is irrelevant, just news outlets trying to grab attention. (their business model really)

Tenzor07 · 03-06-2020 02:16PM

bb1234567 wrote: »

Ireland can and should open up, but tourism is a non runner unless we quarantine them for 14 days forcibly, which I can't see happening. So either we somehow live with an ongoing epidemic among normal daily life or tourism is a gonner for 2020 at least

No tourist is going to book flights into a country with 14 day quarantine..

The time for 14 day enforced quarantine was when plane loads of Italian rugby fans travelled to Dublin in early March.
And the time 20,000 Irish visitors mixed with 250,000 other people.

Why are the HSE now going backwards and introducing a tourism killing law 3 months after the stable door was open?

Ginger n Lemon · 03-06-2020 02:16PM

On the 2 metre debate

"A STUDY OF almost 8,000 cases of different coronaviruses has found that there is a “much lower risk” of transmission when physical distance is greater than one metre.

The study also outlines that the wearing of face masks is not an alternative to physical distancing or basic measures to prevent the spread of Covid-19, such as hand hygiene.

The risk of Covid-19 infection is as low as 3% when people stand more than a metre away from an infected individual, compared to 13% when the distance is within a metre, according to the study published in The Lancet."

Overall, business viability or 10% less likely to get covid from an infected person the choice seems to be a no brainer.

https://www.thejournal.ie/covid19-study-physical-distancing-face-masks-5112579-Jun2020/

road_high · 03-06-2020 02:19PM

manniot2 wrote: »

Im hoping the change in weather will change the lockdown enthusiasts view of the whole thing. A few weeks of rain with no BBQs, kids pools etc and they might start questioning the govs re-opening. Im firmly of the view many people will soon forget about this virus when it starts impacting their own pockets/lifestyles - many people have simply had it too good these last few months and are living in denial about the fiscal misery that is incoming.

Lot of people have been in some of kind narnia over the whole thing. I can’t blame some of them- fantastic weather, Covid payment, working from home on full salary, increased quality time with kids. There have been hugely enjoyable aspects for some people. But it’s just not sustainable any longer. Meaning return to work ASAP or massive cuts to welfare meaning a huge drop in living standards

KrustyUCC · 03-06-2020 02:20PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

https://twitter.com/tancredipalmeri/status/1268156568610234368?s=19

Yet ours is 20th July

Almost 7 weeks away

We're some joke

Naos · 03-06-2020 02:20PM

polesheep wrote: »

Are you referring to your own drinking habits? You have no right to assume the drinking habits of others.

Is this the new "don't assume my gender"?

Do you genuinely think that the Irish approach to drink is the same as the Spanish, German or Belgian approach?

greensheep777 · 03-06-2020 02:21PM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Why are the HSE now going backwards and introducing a tourism killing law 3 months after the stable door was open?

Because the UK are doing it so we're following. We may as well rejoin the UK cos we sure as hell pay no attention to our fellow EU countries.

Mr. Karate · 03-06-2020 02:24PM

greensheep777 wrote: »

Because the UK are doing it so we're following. We may as well rejoin the UK cos we sure as hell pay no attention to our fellow EU countries.

The Irish have always been sheep. Or Lemmings if you prefer since they're eager to jump off the cliff at this point.

KrustyUCC · 03-06-2020 02:25PM

Publicans on Joe Duffy saying they will open same time as restaurants

Why would they stay closed when people got away with large March in Dublin

If they can have same social distance as restaurants whats the difference?

Fair play to those publicans

Stark · 03-06-2020 02:25PM

Naos wrote: »

Is this the new "don't assume my gender"?

Do you genuinely think that the Irish approach to drink is the same as the Spanish, German or Belgian approach?

Ah Ireland, home of 10% beers and Deireadh Fómhair Fest.

Have you ever bothered to try and validate your prejudices? We're middle of the pack for all stats around alcohol consumption. Your average American could drink the average Irish person under the table any day of the week. We have colleagues from the States who joke about how it's impossible for a New Yorker to get drunk in Dublin given what they're used to back home.

03-06-2020 02:27PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

On the 2 metre debate

"A STUDY OF almost 8,000 cases of different coronaviruses has found that there is a “much lower risk” of transmission when physical distance is greater than one metre.

The study also outlines that the wearing of face masks is not an alternative to physical distancing or basic measures to prevent the spread of Covid-19, such as hand hygiene.

The risk of Covid-19 infection is as low as 3% when people stand more than a metre away from an infected individual, compared to 13% when the distance is within a metre, according to the study published in The Lancet."

Overall, business viability or 10% less likely to get covid from an infected person the choice seems to be a no brainer.

https://www.thejournal.ie/covid19-study-physical-distancing-face-masks-5112579-Jun2020/

I'm all for easing restrictions but you've interpreted that wrong. 13% vs 3% isn't 10% more likely, its over 4 times more likely to get infected.

Naos · 03-06-2020 02:27PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

On the 2 metre debate

"A STUDY OF almost 8,000 cases of different coronaviruses has found that there is a “much lower risk” of transmission when physical distance is greater than one metre.

The study also outlines that the wearing of face masks is not an alternative to physical distancing or basic measures to prevent the spread of Covid-19, such as hand hygiene.

The risk of Covid-19 infection is as low as 3% when people stand more than a metre away from an infected individual, compared to 13% when the distance is within a metre, according to the study published in The Lancet."

Overall, business viability or 10% less likely to get covid from an infected person the choice seems to be a no brainer.

https://www.thejournal.ie/covid19-study-physical-distancing-face-masks-5112579-Jun2020/

What's the point of your statement there?

Idbatterim · 03-06-2020 02:30PM

The 26.1 % unemployment rate, I take it that doesn't include tens orvhundreds of thousands of nearly the entire wage government are paying to employees, for employers to keep them on?!

Naos · 03-06-2020 02:32PM

Stark wrote: »

Ah Ireland, home of 10% beers and Deireadh Fómhair Fest.

Have you ever bothered to try and validate your prejudices? We're middle of the pack for all stats around alcohol consumption. Your average American could drink the average Irish person under the table any day of the week. We have colleagues from the States who joke about how it's impossible for a New Yorker to get drunk in Dublin given what they're used to back home.

What prejudices?

I'm Irish and I like a drink as much as the next Irishman. My preference, bar draught Guinness, is for stronger beers around the 5.5/6% range. I've also lived in other parts of Europe.

Still doesn't mean I'm not oblivious to how the Irish act when they're out on the beer compared to our mainland European neighbours.

Idbatterim · 03-06-2020 02:32PM

Take a look at the attached lads from the journal. People not seeing their parents for a few months because the big boys told them not too. Lol.......

Ginger n Lemon · 03-06-2020 02:33PM

Naos wrote: »

What's the point of your statement there?

Its actually from Lancet, not my statement.

Its a scientific study.

Naos · 03-06-2020 02:34PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Its actually from Lancet, not my statement.

Its a scientific study.

I understand, but what was the reason to post it? Is it proof we should adhere to more than 1m social distance?

Idbatterim · 03-06-2020 02:35PM

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Publicans on Joe Duffy saying they will open same time as restaurants

Why would they stay closed when people got away with large March in Dublin

If they can have same social distance as restaurants whats the difference?

Fair play to those publicans

It does make total sense , there are so many of them. Many facing wipe out and the dates government picked out of their ass are nonsensical. Nobody cares if lockdown4eva crew dont go, actually please dont!

Ginger n Lemon · 03-06-2020 02:40PM

Naos wrote: »

I understand, but what was the reason to post it? Is it proof we should adhere to more than 1m social distance?

You know it.

Not that we should adhere to it because 1 m is safer or less safer, but because the trade of of businesses letting go of 50% of their staff and operating at 30-50% capacity for god knows how long and becoming nonviable is just too much of a trade off.

the 3% vs 13% is covid infection. then you gotta remember severe cases is only 20%, so you quickly arrive at very small numbers that our ICU and empty hospitals would easily be able to handle.

Talking about "yeah but if 4.9m population start to do 1 metre then 13% get infected" etc is waffle but You are a good poster and wont start this waffle i am sure.

Afterall, we are to live with the virus, not to eradicate it. Unless your name is Gerry, then you may just disagree with me.

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - Read OP for Mod Warnings