Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - Read OP for Mod Warnings

Damian F · 13-05-2020 06:58PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Probably some gibberish about how flying is bad mkay.

If you fly to a warmer country to enjoy some sun and get vitamin D you are gonna have a bad time, mkay. Mkay.

Deleted User wrote: »

This.
People are all over social media saying they won’t send their kids back to school until there is a vaccine.

The government, the CMO and the media need to change the message. They need to explain how mild and low risk the illness is.

In late summer 2009, some people were calling for schools not to reopen in September because of swine flu

is_that_so · 13-05-2020 07:00PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Is this the indicator that a divergence between executive and nphet is underway. And right time too. Health emergency is coming under control and other considerations will at times begin to take priority

He went to say he didn't disagree with the suggestion but he was questioning that report about kids, due to very limited evidence.

MrDavid1976 · 13-05-2020 07:13PM

is_that_so wrote: »

He went to say he didn't disagree with the suggestion but he was questioning that report about kids, due to very limited evidence.

That is off the wall crazy. He did not disagree with the “suggestion” yet then decided to question the limited evidence.

Lads - Ireland has just had a coup.

The HorsesMouth · 13-05-2020 07:16PM

SusieBlue wrote: »

As opposed to not going back at all and sitting locked in their houses indefinitely, missing out on their education & interactions with other children?

That doesn’t look ideal or natural by any means but it’s a damn lot better than keeping them off school for 6 months.
We can’t keep them off school forever. Life absolutely must move on at some point.

No sorry I agree about the schools opening but no way in that form. I'm sure the vast majority of children would be damaged less by staying at home. Life must move on absolutely but not in that way. Getting covid19 would be less damaging than the damage that would do to their minds. I have kids and I am a teacher btw.

lord quackinton · 13-05-2020 07:16PM

MrDavid1976 wrote: »

The Taoiseach has been summoned to the Dept of Health this evening to explain himself. Clarification will be given tomorrow am in some press briefings.

i assume tony, leo and simone all attended private schools.
so leo should expect a real hazing tonight from tony and his team for daring to offer some hope - nobody goes over top boy tony's head.

LuckyLloyd · 13-05-2020 07:18PM

https://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2020/05/12/science.abc3517

Covid study using french data. Authoritative.

Grim read. They estimate 4.4% of French population has been infected. So if the French just let the virus run wild, we're talking ~600k deaths if everyone caught it.

There are a lot of you on the really wrong side of this thing hopecasting the way you would like it to be. But lads, it’s the other way and our Public Health officials need to act and recommend accordingly.

Rodin · 13-05-2020 07:25PM

The HorsesMouth wrote: »

No sorry I agree about the schools opening but no way in that form. I'm sure the vast majority of children would be damaged less by staying at home. Life must move on absolutely but not in that way. Getting covid19 would be less damaging than the damage that would do to their minds. I have kids and I am a teacher btw.

Why are kids minds more fragile these days?
To me it's a bit like telling a child that a spider is creepy or a snake slimy. Children are not born with fear.
Stop talking to them about anxiety all the time.

Every 2nd word from the leaving cert students was about their anxiety.

MrDavid1976 · 13-05-2020 07:27PM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

https://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2020/05/12/science.abc3517

Covid study using french data. Authoritative.

Grim read. They estimate 4.4% of French population has been infected. So if the French just let the virus run wild, we're talking ~600k deaths if everyone caught it.

There are a lot of you on the really wrong side of this thing hopecasting the way you would like it to be. But lads, it’s the other way and our Public Health officials need to act and recommend accordingly.

It also says this “Population immunity appears insufficient to avoid a second wave if all control measures are released at the end of the lockdown.” So limited controls, but protect the most vulnerable, allow the least vulnerable population circulate normally and to get the virus etc etc would have primed France to be better equipped for the second wave.

growleaves · 13-05-2020 07:27PM

From a psychiatric perspective, the damage from social isolation is clear and extreme - whether you are a 'snowflake' or not.

13-05-2020 07:29PM

lord quackinton wrote: »

i assume tony, leo and simone all attended private schools.
so leo should expect a real hazing tonight from tony and his team for daring to offer some hope - nobody goes over top boy tony's head.

Only Leo I believe. So much for assumptions

castletownman · 13-05-2020 07:34PM

A large traveller funeral in Gorey just as I was walking my usual route. Apart from the usual inconsiderate parking you would expect, they were gathered in groups with absolutely zero social distancing observed. The queue going into the funeral home was like the footage you see in the States on Black Friday.

There was a token garda presence, but you'd bet the average person would be more likely to get in any trouble for flouting any regulations.

Absolutely sickening. Although I will say, I do find it easy to socially distance myself from them.

pjohnson · 13-05-2020 07:41PM

Penfailed wrote: »

https://www.facebook.com/255247787971045/posts/1631586777003799/

That ^^^ is allegedly a school in France. Would you want your kids going back to that?!

Dont forget how the open now crowd view schools

lord quackinton wrote: »

it’s a free crèche

Nermal · 13-05-2020 07:44PM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

https://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2020/05/12/science.abc3517

Covid study using french data. Authoritative.

Grim read. They estimate 4.4% of French population has been infected. So if the French just let the virus run wild, we're talking ~600k deaths if everyone caught it.

There are a lot of you on the really wrong side of this thing hopecasting the way you would like it to be. But lads, it’s the other way and our Public Health officials need to act and recommend accordingly.

Sigh...

1) More models. Not one single, solitary test done as part of this 'research'. Not authoritative. Worthless.

2) Real research, involving actual testing and not mathematical ****, sorry 'modelling', finds fatality rates of about 0.35%, not 0.7%.

3) I've no idea what parameters got you to 600K deaths. Even using the inflated guff in this paper, 66.99M * 65% * 0.7% would give half that figure.

4) So that we are not disoriented by large numbers, over 600K people died in France in 2018.

LuckyLloyd · 13-05-2020 07:45PM

MrDavid1976 wrote: »

It also says this “Population immunity appears insufficient to avoid a second wave if all control measures are released at the end of the lockdown.” So limited controls, but protect the most vulnerable, allow the least vulnerable population circulate normally and to get the virus etc etc would have primed France to be better equipped for the second wave.

Study reckons lockdown took R0 from 2.9 to 0.67.

And you’re at 4.4%. Talk of preventing second waves or creating “herd immunity” (when we’re not sure recovering from this confers immunity and certainly not expecting immunity to be conferred for long) is unsubstantiated bollocks.

Reduce restrictions slowly, test and trace aggressively and extensively, return to lockdown as subsequent waves take hold. Cross fingers for vaccine or effective treatment.

Rodin · 13-05-2020 07:46PM

castletownman wrote: »

A large traveller funeral in Gorey just as I was walking my usual route. Apart from the usual inconsiderate parking you would expect, they were gathered in groups with absolutely zero social distancing observed. The queue going into the funeral home was like the footage you see in the States on Black Friday.

There was a token garda presence, but you'd bet the average person would be more likely to get in any trouble for flouting any regulations.

Absolutely sickening. Although I will say, I do find it easy to socially distance myself from them.

They've immunity from the rules that apply to normal people

LuckyLloyd · 13-05-2020 07:50PM

Nermal wrote: »

Sigh...

1) More models. Not one single, solitary test done as part of this 'research'. Not authoritative. Worthless.

2) Real research, involving actual testing and not mathematical ****, sorry 'modelling', finds fatality rates of about 0.35%, not 0.7%.

3) I've no idea what parameters got you to 600K deaths. Even using the inflated guff in this paper, 66.99M * 65% * 0.7% would give half that figure.

4) So that we are not disoriented by large numbers, over 600K people died in France in 2018.

Your second point is willfully disingenuous, bravo. How do you think they extrapolate such testing?

This paper has been peer reviewed, etc. Unlike a lot of the studies latched onto by those desperately hoping away reality.

Doubling expected all cause mortality from one preventable new cause of death would be completely catastrophic and indefensible from a public health perspective.

13-05-2020 07:50PM

Rodin wrote: »

Why are kids minds more fragile these days?
To me it's a bit like telling a child that a spider is creepy or a snake slimy. Children are not born with fear.
Stop talking to them about anxiety all the time.

Every 2nd word from the leaving cert students was about their anxiety.

Anxiety and fear came via evolution, they're not taught as you're claiming. Pretending that mental health issues etc don't exist is pretty dense.

In terms of being anxious like the leaving cert, children are literally taught that it's the be all and end all. Some people will end up anxious about it as a result. Even more so this year.

Rodin · 13-05-2020 07:52PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Anxiety and fear came via evolution, they're not taught as you're claiming. Pretending that mental health issues etc don't exist is pretty dense.

In terms of being anxious like the leaving cert, children are literally taught that it's the be all and end all. Some people will end up anxious about it as a result. Even more so this year.

"....children are literally taught...."
Sure that's my point!

Some even want to stop giving them homework. Because it's too stressful. We are breeding youth who simply will not be able to cope with challenge and adversity.

Damian F · 13-05-2020 07:54PM

castletownman wrote: »

A large traveller funeral in Gorey just as I was walking my usual route. Apart from the usual inconsiderate parking you would expect, they were gathered in groups with absolutely zero social distancing observed. The queue going into the funeral home was like the footage you see in the States on Black Friday.

There was a token garda presence, but you'd bet the average person would be more likely to get in any trouble for flouting any regulations.

Absolutely sickening. Although I will say, I do find it easy to socially distance myself from them.

Fair play to them, social distancing is a load of bollocks.

pjohnson · 13-05-2020 08:04PM

Damian F wrote: »

Fair play to them, social distancing is a load of bollocks.

Guess they will now be the poster citizens of Ireland!

Quite a change from how boards normally treat Travellers!

13-05-2020 08:04PM

Rodin wrote: »

"....children are literally taught...."

They're not being taught anxiety, they're taught that the leaving cert will define their futures.... Do you think anxiety is just new to this generation? Eg my 77 year old father suffers from pretty debilitating anxiety at times, he's not fragile. It's a trait that people cope with to various degrees.

And realistically, the current situation is a point where a person can easily develop anxiety. So I can understand parents being concerned about what sort of educational environment their children are being sent into.

pjohnson · 13-05-2020 08:06PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

They're not being taught anxiety, they're taught that the leaving cert will define their futures.... Do you think anxiety is just new to this generation? Eg my 77 year old father suffers from pretty debilitating anxiety at times, he's not fragile. It's a trait that people cope with to various degrees.

And realistically, the current situation is a point where a person can easily develop anxiety. So I can understand parents being concerned about what sort of educational environment their children are being sent into.

Those parents would need to care about their child. Not every parent does. And schools are just a creche according to some.

FintanMcluskey · 13-05-2020 08:07PM

Tell me how wrote: »

This is the worst pandemic in 100 years and virtually every country is experiencing difficulties in understanding and communicating what is a changing situation on a daily basis.

Anyone who wants to is free to run for elected office. This keyboard democracy is closer to science fiction writing than the real world.

The most restrictive lockdown in Europe this Summer, that has no justification, shows little sign of easing, and will remain unchallenged with attitudes like this.

pjohnson · 13-05-2020 08:08PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The most restrictive lockdown in Europe, that has no justification, shows little sign of easing, and will remain unchallenged with attitudes like this.

Christ :pac:

Benimar · 13-05-2020 08:10PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The most restrictive lockdown in Europe, that has no justification, shows little sign of easing, and will remain unchallenged with attitudes like this.

You have officially jumped the shark :pac:

FintanMcluskey · 13-05-2020 08:12PM

pjohnson wrote: »

Christ :pac:

Another quality discussion point from yourself

13-05-2020 08:17PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The most restrictive lockdown in Europe this Summer, that has no justification, shows little sign of easing, and will remain unchallenged with attitudes like this.

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Another quality discussion point from yourself

It's simply not true, we had an incredibly mild lockdown. Spain was only allowed outdoor exercise on the 2nd of May. In Italy, dog walking was a good way to get outside but it couldn't be a long walk. France was fining people for being outside if they didn't have the correct authorisation papers.

We have a lot more freedom than most European nations did during this....

Mike3287 · 13-05-2020 08:19PM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Study reckons lockdown took R0 from 2.9 to 0.67.

And you’re at 4.4%. Talk of preventing second waves or creating “herd immunity” (when we’re not sure recovering from this confers immunity and certainly not expecting immunity to be conferred for long) is unsubstantiated bollocks.

Reduce restrictions slowly, test and trace aggressively and extensively, return to lockdown as subsequent waves take hold. Cross fingers for vaccine or effective treatment.

Sadly

Hard decisions are going to have be made soon with regard handling the old and unhealthy

Antibody testing and virus spreading silently in masses from December are starting to look unfounded now

Its looking more and more like we are big trouble

I was a believer but not anymore

Dont know where the government go from here

pjohnson · 13-05-2020 08:19PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Another quality discussion point from yourself

Well how the fùck is that meant to be answered?

Its an amazing detachment from any kind of reality.

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It's simply not true, we had an incredibly mild lockdown. Spain was only allowed outdoor exercise on the 2nd of May. In Italy, dog walking was a good way to get outside but it couldn't be a long walk. France was fining people for being outside if they didn't have the correct authorisation papers.

We have a lot more freedom than most European nations did during this....

Even some of the countries lauded for "opening up" are barely at where we are now ffs :pac:

13-05-2020 08:21PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The most restrictive lockdown in Europe this Summer, that has no justification, shows little sign of easing, and will remain unchallenged with attitudes like this.

Much of the wailing on here has been about us not lifting restrictions we never had

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - Read OP for Mod Warnings