Relaxation of restrictions Part II

hmmm · 06-05-2020 10:09AM

partyguinness wrote: »

just to protect the elderly and sick who are well beyond their economic use. Let nature take its course.

Wow. And lots of "likes".

lawrencesummers · 06-05-2020 10:09AM

partyguinness wrote: »

Just another example of the Baby Boomer generation looking after themselves (along with cushy pensions, massive equity, and all the other perks you get at 65).

They have already screwed over the youth with Brexit, hoarded the housing stock, ****ed the environment and now this...oh but if anyone complains oh sure you are just a whiny 'snowflake' phone zombie.

ps I am writing this from England so a slightly different angle.

So your jealous of penioners because they have a pension?
Is it possible that they spent their entire life from 14years old onwards actually working?
People who lived through a world war, the 70’s and 80’s and people who had to endure the decisions people like Tatcher made.

What age are you?

lawrencesummers · 06-05-2020 10:13AM

partyguinness wrote: »

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-8290353/ALEX-BRUMMER-Madness-45s-work-economy-burns.html

Out of 27k odd deaths only 322 have been under 45. I know this is UK figures but the breakdown around the world will be similar.

So how many of that 27000 are people you know?

hopalongcass · 06-05-2020 10:15AM

Does anyone or can anyone explain why KFC appear to be able to reopen in the uk and not here,are the government subsidising KFC and McDonalds and the likes to stay closed?

Surely KFC want to be making money and if they are able to be in line with UK government when opening why not here?We locked down earlier and seemingly weren't hit as bad,so now because we weren't hit as bit we have to go through it longer,punished for doing what was asked of us.

So basically we cocooned to lower death rates we done that,but we have to now cocoon longer because actually no enough didn't die like in the UK and Italy,but yet had a lot died we they would have scaremongered us because of the high death rate into this same long shutdown.

We were damned if we did and damned if we didn't,because its not about lives its about prolonging it as long as the populace is willing to take this,so they extract as much money out of our childrens futures.

Cork Boy 53 · 06-05-2020 10:16AM

partyguinness wrote: »

Schools and educational institutions should be opened ASAP.

I have now come around to the view that it is completely arseways to screw over children's education and development just to protect the elderly and sick who are well beyond their economic use. Let nature take its course.

End the lock down and if people or certain sections of society are worried let them lock themselves away but let the rest of the world get on with it.

Why not just compulsory euthanize people who are "beyond their economic use " and be done with it? Hang your head in shame after that absolutely disgusting post.

LiquidZeb · 06-05-2020 10:18AM

lawrencesummers wrote: »

So how many of that 27000 are people you know?

How many of the 50 million people who die every year do you know? What about all the people who perish due to starvation or dehydration? Something that's probably just as preventable as covid. Do you say that about them too?

Nermal · 06-05-2020 10:21AM

partyguinness wrote: »

Just another example of the Baby Boomer generation looking after themselves (along with cushy pensions, massive equity, and all the other perks you get at 65).

They have already screwed over the youth with Brexit, hoarded the housing stock, ****ed the environment and now this...oh but if anyone complains oh sure you are just a whiny 'snowflake' phone zombie.

ps I am writing this from England so a slightly different angle.

There definitely is an element of this.

What concerns did our cabinet have about the NPHET plan - disruption to the education of our youth? Mass unemployment facing our college graduates? The whopping tax burden that will be paid by our children?

No, they rebelled to ensure over-70s would be allowed out to exercise.

Tell me that's not a gerontocracy.

partyguinness · 06-05-2020 10:21AM

lawrencesummers wrote: »

So your jealous of penioners because they have a pension?
Is it possible that they spent their entire life from 14years old onwards actually working?
People who lived through a world war, the 70’s and 80’s and people who had to endure the decisions people like Tatcher made.

What age are you?

They are the very same generation who did very very nicely out of Thatcher...so much so they kept the Tories in Government for 18 years with Thatcher at the helm for 11 years. Turned quite a lot into landlords over night, privatised the housing stock built in the post war years (by many an Irish labourer) and then left the current generation at the mercy of the private developers who of course bump up their profits to dish out dividends to the Baby Boomers and their pension funds. Nice circle of life going on there.

I don't begrudge pensioners their pensions in the slightest but I do think it is perverse that they always seem to be put first second and third.

Although they ****e on about it often enough the Baby Boomers did not live during any wars..they are generally those born between 1947 and 1963. Again another lucky break. But yet happy enough to send young lads off the Iraq and Afghanistan.

As a more learned commentator put it: The Baby Boomers are like a pig going through a python. Slowly and sucking up all the resources.

hopalongcass · 06-05-2020 10:22AM

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

Why not just compulsory euthanize people who are "beyond their economic use " and be done with it? Hang your head in shame after that absolutely disgusting post.

I suppose you were out protesting about all the homeless since the bank bailouts and houses losts and deaths caused by the last bank bailout.

Stop with this rubbish of pretend care for our brethren,we never gave a toss about our Irish brothers and sisters been dying on the streets and losing their homes this 10 years.

Everyone cares about their immediate family end of story,tired listening to this rubbish "if we can save one life its worth it",we never cared before so stop using it to browbeat and pedal fake care for your Irish brothers and sisters,you long sold them up the river my friend.

Cork Boy 53 · 06-05-2020 10:23AM

hmmm wrote: »

Wow. And lots of "likes".

And most of them by the usual open everything now gang.

easypazz · 06-05-2020 10:24AM

gozunda wrote: »

But more importantly - the issue of Covid-19 is not only with the over 70s and those in care homes. Only half the current deaths can be attributed to this cohort.

So first you say 50% of deaths are in the over 70's bracket and care homes

gozunda wrote: »

currently deaths from coronavirus in residential such care facilities account for some 61 per cent of all Covid-19 deaths.

Then you say 61% of deaths are in care homes alone.

Do you actually realise how little sense you make.

06-05-2020 10:26AM

partyguinness wrote: »

Schools and educational institutions should be opened ASAP.

I have now come around to the view that it is completely arseways to screw over children's education and development just to protect the elderly and sick who are well beyond their economic use. Let nature take its course.

End the lock down and if people or certain sections of society are worried let them lock themselves away but let the rest of the world get on with it.

Children have 60 years to catch up. And really, are you serious?

Bobtheman · 06-05-2020 10:26AM

At some point the economic argument will triumph
Because we can't run a state on welfare
I'm not for opening everything immediately but I think they could have opened more . Hair dressers for instance.
As for schools - as a teacher the lack of IT is becoming an issue. The State has not invested in this and you have teachers who don't have laptops. Pupils too.
Of course we can give 20 million to Connaught rugby club before an election !

the kelt · 06-05-2020 10:27AM

partyguinness wrote: »

Schools and educational institutions should be opened ASAP.

I have now come around to the view that it is completely arseways to screw over children's education and development just to protect the elderly and sick who are well beyond their economic use. Let nature take its course.

End the lock down and if people or certain sections of society are worried let them lock themselves away but let the rest of the world get on with it.

I believe when you look at our roadmap and compare it to other countries around Europe and the world that ours is way too conservative and it makes me wonder and ask the question why etc.

But i think the idea of the bold bit above is well kinda extreme dont ye think?

storker · 06-05-2020 10:28AM

hmmm wrote: »

Wow. And lots of "likes".

I think that tells you all you need to know about those individuals. Time to stop engaging with them. On any subject whatever. Leave them to their miserable little echo chamber where they can cherry-pick data points and congratulate each other on their wisdom. :rolleyes:

.

gozunda · 06-05-2020 10:29AM

partyguinness wrote: »

Schools and educational institutions should be opened ASAP.

I have now come around to the view that it is completely arseways to screw over children's education and development just to protect the elderly and sick who are well beyond their economic use. Let nature take its course.

End the lock down and if people or certain sections of society are worried let them lock themselves away but let the rest of the world get on with it.

Jeez chxrst. That comment shows a pathetically absymal level of understanding or even logic.

As for you advocating for "the elderly and sick who are well beyond their economic use. Let nature take its course".

That's up there with the poster on this thread who declared that
"people in nursing homes on borrowed time anyway.

The current restrictions have nothing with placing one part of the population over another. They are every thing to do with keeping the numbers infected down and stop health services being overwhelmed.

Kids are getting schooled albeit at home. We are also close to the end of the academic year for most school kids so your rant about screwing with kids education and development is pure hyperbole

And it's not " people or certain sections of society" who are "worried" btw. The restrictions are based on epidemiology and disease control. The same restrictions are put in place by those who are charged with protecting all members of society and not just pandering to the deranged and perpetually outraged because it doesnt suit their world view or something

For all those ranting and raving about restrictions possibly the best course of action is to take off to the likes of Sweden or elsewhere and let the rest of the same majority get on with dealing with reality.

Ginger n Lemon · 06-05-2020 10:29AM

Just heard yesterday - there hasnt been a single vaccine developed for any of human corona viruses in our history.

Maintain social distancing.

Wash hands.

Open up.

seamus · 06-05-2020 10:30AM

partyguinness wrote: »

ps I am writing this from England so a slightly different angle.

The UK is off on its own bus here tbh. Your language around older people is harsh and uncalled for, but I can imagine how incredibly frustrating it must be in the UK to see big parts of the media fawning over Johnson's Nth child and some previously unknown scientist sneaking out for a quickie, rather than talking about the death toll and an economy up in flames.

That is, the media is talking about anything other than the complete and utter inability of England to govern itself.

partyguinness · 06-05-2020 10:31AM

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

Why not just compulsory euthanize people who are "beyond their economic use " and be done with it? Hang your head in shame after that absolutely disgusting post.

Hate to break it to you sunshine but there is a whole branch and a well developed branch of economics and theory going back to the 70s dedicated to this policy. It is also fundamental Tory policy in the UK (not saying its right). Hell, you can even see it back in the 1840s. Now I do not have the time to give you a whole treatsie.

Huff and puff and get as indignant as you want but the thinking behind my post is extremely prevalent in government policy all across the world but just not shouted from the rooftops.

lawrencesummers · 06-05-2020 10:32AM

LiquidZeb wrote: »

How many of the 50 million people who die every year do you know? What about all the people who perish due to starvation or dehydration? Something that's probably just as preventable as covid. Do you say that about them too?

Last year 7.
3 of which were preventable. 4 were not.

If your happy to have people die due to this illness Because “people die all the time” are you also advocating the closure of cancer research? Stopping places like pieta house? Maybe we should allow drink driving again and have no speeding limits, we could have firearms laws like they have in the US.

Where does your moral compass for reducing unnecessary deaths start and finish?

iamwhoiam · 06-05-2020 10:32AM

partyguinness wrote: »

Just another example of the Baby Boomer generation looking after themselves (along with cushy pensions, massive equity, and all the other perks you get at 65).

They have already screwed over the youth with Brexit, hoarded the housing stock, ****ed the environment and now this...oh but if anyone complains oh sure you are just a whiny 'snowflake' phone zombie.

ps I am writing this from England so a slightly different angle.

From someone over 65 , you are making a holy show of yourself .

partyguinness · 06-05-2020 10:33AM

seamus wrote: »

The UK is off on its own bus here tbh. Your language around older people is harsh and uncalled for, but I can imagine how incredibly frustrating it must be in the UK to see big parts of the media fawning over Johnson's Nth child and some previously unknown scientist sneaking out for a quickie, rather than talking about the death toll and an economy up in flames.

That is, the media is talking about anything other than the complete and utter inability of England to govern itself.

My language may be deemed harsh I agree but it is just words and as I have just posted it is very much a relevant factor whether we like it or not.

The media over here are a complete disgrace.

lawrencesummers · 06-05-2020 10:33AM

partyguinness wrote: »

Hate to break it to you sunshine but there is a whole branch and a well developed branch of economics and theory going back to the 70s dedicated to this policy. It is also fundamental Tory policy in the UK (not saying its right). Hell, you can even see it back in the 1840s. Now I do not have the time to give you a whole treatsie.

Huff and puff and get as indignant as you want but the thinking behind my post is extremely prevalent in government policy all across the world but just not shouted from the rooftops.

You gotta love when people have to go back 180 years for an example that illustrates their ridiculous point

pjohnson · 06-05-2020 10:34AM

I assume "beyond economic use" also applies to anyone overweight/with asthma/cancer/dialysis etc. regardless of age.

Interesting view. Compulsary euthansia for anyone not contributing to the economy or just send them to a gulag till they expire?

Dr. Bre · 06-05-2020 10:35AM

Could the reason be for our conservative roadmap that we are neighbours with the UK who have had most cases in Europe ? The HSE afraid of getting it wrong

LiquidZeb · 06-05-2020 10:37AM

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Last year 7.
3 of which were preventable. 4 were not.

If your happy to have people die due to this illness Because “people die all the time” are you also advocating the closure of cancer research? Stopping places like pieta house? Maybe we should allow drink driving again and have no speeding limits, we could have firearms laws like they have in the US.

Where does your moral compass for reducing unnecessary deaths start and finish?

You're completely misconstruing my point. What im saying is you pulled up the poster for his reaction to the current death toll for covid and I asked what about the other 50 million deaths per annum. I don't know how you got around to cutting pieta house and cancer research funding other than a half arsed attempt to shame me.

lawrencesummers · 06-05-2020 10:37AM

partyguinness wrote: »

They are the very same generation who did very very nicely out of Thatcher...so much so they kept the Tories in Government for 18 years with Thatcher at the helm for 11 years. Turned quite a lot into landlords over night, privatised the housing stock built in the post war years (by many an Irish labourer) and then left the current generation at the mercy of the private developers who of course bump up their profits to dish out dividends to the Baby Boomers and their pension funds. Nice circle of life going on there.

I don't begrudge pensioners their pensions in the slightest but I do think it is perverse that they always seem to be put first second and third.

Although they ****e on about it often enough the Baby Boomers did not live during any wars..they are generally those born between 1947 and 1963. Again another lucky break. But yet happy enough to send young lads off the Iraq and Afghanistan.

As a more learned commentator put it: The Baby Boomers are like a pig going through a python. Slowly and sucking up all the resources.

If you removed pensioner and replaced it with government you might make semblance of sense, a very small one.

The oldies playing bridge don’t owe anyone a living.

growleaves · 06-05-2020 10:37AM

For all those ranting and raving about restrictions possibly the best course of action is to take off to the likes of Sweden or elsewhere and let the rest of the same majority get on with dealing with reality.

No, people should have their say. Take off to foreign climes yourself if you can't handle disagreement. You're free to take the government line on everything and rubbish anyone with a different opinion but people can talk back too.

Penfailed · 06-05-2020 10:37AM

LiquidZeb wrote: »

No let him off. He's already made his mind up that everyone's a shallow drunk but him. He's the hero.

Hang on. You said I'm the only one talking about pubs. When it's pointed out that it's not true, you agree that it's not true but still manage to turn it into an attack on me. Well done.

partyguinness · 06-05-2020 10:39AM

lawrencesummers wrote: »

You gotta love when people have to go back 180 years for an example that illustrates their ridiculous point

No read it again. I pointed out that this ideology is well established going back several hundred years even if it comes as great shock to some people in 2020.

It also underpins the economics of the 'herd mentality' that you may have heard about in the news. That is what the English ideally wanted to do but figured it was probably bad optics allowing nature take its course.

Relaxation of restrictions Part II

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