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has covid 19 been blown out of all proportion?

24567…26

Comments

  • #32
    smeal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 623 ✭✭✭smeal


    As someone who is really hoping that certain restrictions, especially the abolishment of the 2k limit, will be lifted next week I still think that it was 100% worth it.

    I’m also a very social person and miss being out and about but I will still be happy to comply with social distancing systems in public going forward and am in agreement with large scale events being cancelled for the foreseeable to avoid potential mass reinfections. I would hate to think that what we’ve sacrificed so far would go to waste for the sake of people being able to get p*ssed up at a Cheltenham sized event. I think the public will be able to keep up the willpower to keep up prevention measures if certain restrictions are eased come the 5th May such as being allowed to travel further to visit family or friends even it means seeing them from a distance. Otherwise I fear we’ll become very fatigued.

    There is no knowing exactly how many cases and deaths we have prevented but as other posters have said if anything like the Italy situation was a potential risk then I’m glad we’ve done what we did especially in city areas. Also very glad that countries have pulled together to essentially stop global travel as I know of several young healthy people who picked it up in major EU cities or airports at least before lockdown.


  • #33
    CinemaGuy45
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭CinemaGuy45


    HeidiHeidi wrote: »
    CinemaGuy45 wrote: »
    And I am questioning and rebutting (some of) those opinions.
    I am not rebutting anything life is complicated and non of us are ever 100% right.

    I am reading all those opinions and weighing them up in my mind.

    People shift their opinion in gradual steps this is a discussion not a courtroom.


  • #34
    polesheep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,950 ✭✭✭polesheep


    CinemaGuy45 wrote: »
    This virus is running rampant in nursing and care homes I agree vulnerable people need to be protected however this does not seem to be working out too well in that regard.

    I agree with everything in you first post, except that I would add the vulnerable and elderly in the community to the nursing homes in terms of those who needed protection. What happened in Italy caused an overreaction. However, despite what some posters claim, Italy does not have an amazing health care system. They are stretched to their limits every flu season. They also made the decision early on to put everyone who required it onto a ventilator, whether they were able for it or not. This led to all the stories of triaging for ventilation. Do I blame our government for overreacting? No, I am much happier that they overreacted rather than fail to react. Do I believe they should now change tack? Yes. And I would like to think that they would react differently to a Covid-20.


  • #35
    endainoz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,655 ✭✭✭endainoz


    polesheep wrote: »
    I agree with everything in you first post, except that I would add the vulnerable and elderly in the community to the nursing homes in terms of those who needed protection. What happened in Italy caused an overreaction. However, despite what some posters claim, Italy does not have an amazing health care system. They are stretched to their limits every flu season. They also made the decision early on to put everyone who required it onto a ventilator, whether they were able for it or not. This led to all the stories of triaging for ventilation. Do I blame our government for overreacting? No, I am much happier that they overreacted rather than fail to react. Do I believe they should now change tack? Yes. And I would like to think that they would react differently to a Covid-20.

    So you'd have no issue if our health system collapsed completely with people dying on trolleys? Because that's exactly what would have happened if no precautions were taken.


  • #36
    CinemaGuy45
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭CinemaGuy45


    endainoz wrote: »
    So you'd have no issue if our health system collapsed completely with people dying on trolleys? Because that's exactly what would have happened if no precautions were taken.

    Those people who died in nursing home most were never brought to the hospitals anyway.


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  • #37
    endainoz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,655 ✭✭✭endainoz


    CinemaGuy45 wrote: »
    Those people who died in nursing home most were never brought to the hospitals anyway.

    Rubbish, of course they were.


  • #38
    polesheep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,950 ✭✭✭polesheep


    endainoz wrote: »
    So you'd have no issue if our health system collapsed completely with people dying on trolleys? Because that's exactly what would have happened if no precautions were taken.

    That's your opinion. I believe that if the CORRECT precautions had been taken i.e. protect the vulnerable, then our health system would have coped fine.


  • #39
    polesheep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,950 ✭✭✭polesheep


    endainoz wrote: »
    Rubbish, of course they were.

    But they should never have been exposed to it in the first place. We should have protected the vulnerable.


  • #40
    endainoz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,655 ✭✭✭endainoz


    polesheep wrote: »
    That's your opinion. I believe that if the CORRECT precautions had been taken i.e. protect the vulnerable, then our health system would have coped fine.

    Christ, that was exactly the point of restrictions and social distancing, to protect the vunerable.


  • #41
    CinemaGuy45
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭CinemaGuy45


    endainoz wrote: »
    Christ, that was exactly the point of restrictions and social distancing, to protect the vunerable.

    And at the start I agreed this has not worked out very well however.


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  • #42
    Charles Babbage
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,599 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage


    cian68 wrote: »
    That is precisely BECAUSE of the precautions taken


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  • #43
    marklazarcovic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,195 ✭✭✭marklazarcovic


    It's killed nearly 200k people in 4 months, it's killed nearly 1000 in Ireland,in that time I've not heard of a single death by 'flu' ..nor have I ever tbh, but anyway,it's only on the go 4 months,it could mutate to something far far worse yet once it's really gotten hold around the globe.


  • #44
    endainoz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,655 ✭✭✭endainoz


    polesheep wrote: »
    But they should never have been exposed to it in the first place. We should have protected the vulnerable.

    Oh god, are you actually listening to yourself? Let's take a simple example: Health care worker works in a care home, they have a teenage kid in school. Kid gets exposed to virus in school before they get shut down and shows no symptoms. Kid passes it on to their parent, and despite their best efforts, they bring the virus to the care home.

    100s of health care workers got exposed to it, even though they took every precaution. The efforts of people of the main population have an obvious knock on effect on the vunerable people.


  • #45
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Charles Babbage wrote: »
    EWErisYWoAUy4l4?format=jpg&name=medium

    An incredibly stupid analogy tbh . Which I have seen on other threads and greeted with the same disdain I have for it.


  • #46
    Cockadoodledoo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 243 ✭✭Cockadoodledoo


    CinemaGuy45 wrote: »
    I am openly asking questions we are allowed to do that still.

    Children do not seem to really get hit by this thing but the schools are closed to stop the spread and protect the elderly?

    The elderly in the care homes are being hit hard by this thing the very group this was suppose to protect.

    In response to your first sentence, I responded honestly as someone who works in the health sector. I’m not sure why you are getting defensive? It wasn’t my intention for it to be an attack.

    It isn’t practical to expect staff to stay in a unit for a long period of time. Mental health and exhaustion comes into play and their ability to provide quality care is then greatly reduced putting people at great risk. I would much prefer to see somebody who has been home, refreshed and following the guidelines coming in.

    It’s important to remember that it is not in every nursing home so why is that?. The virus is spread due to people not following the guidelines, not washing/sanitising their hands correctly which may be due to lack of training, incorrect use of PPE, inadequate supply of PPE or just simply implementing procedures when it was too late.


  • #47
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,388 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    CinemaGuy45 wrote: »
    So it's 100 times less because of the lockdown?

    Sweden seems to be getting along ok without the lockdown.

    Sweden has twice our population and 3 times our number of deaths.
    Something isn't working for them.


  • #48
    HeidiHeidi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,795 ✭✭✭✭HeidiHeidi


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    An incredibly stupid analogy tbh . Which I have seen on other threads and greeted with the same disdain I have for it.
    I think it's a great analogy.


  • #49
    CinemaGuy45
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭CinemaGuy45


    Charles Babbage wrote: »
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    340?cb=20191030054123


    latest?cb=20191030054112

    giphy.gif


  • #50
    Sleeper12
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,257 ✭✭✭✭Sleeper12


    CinemaGuy45 wrote:
    However under 1'000 dead we got warnings of upwards of 100'000 dead I think it is pretty safe to say that number now looks way over the top.


    Just to put the above in perspective 200 to 500 people die in Ireland from the flu. We are taking about 2 to 5 times to annual flu rate in a little over a month. This doesn't take into account deaths from covid 19 in patients that haven't been tested.

    We've only managed to keep the figures this low because of the lock down. No lock down & we could be in the 10s of thousands by now.


  • #51
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,121 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    spurious wrote: »
    Sweden has twice our population and 3 times our number of deaths.
    Something isn't working for them.

    You can’t say that yet. Maybe they will have a big single peak and we have multiple smaller peaks and they end up better in the long run (with less economic fallout). We will only know when this is over and the analysis done in a couple of years


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  • #52
    Balf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 667 ✭✭✭Balf


    spurious wrote: »
    Sweden has twice our population and 3 times our number of deaths.
    Something isn't working for them.
    Maybe.

    But they're not seeing 100,000 deaths, which is what we were told would happen without the lockdown.

    So I suspect something isn't working for us, either.


  • #53
    CinemaGuy45
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭CinemaGuy45


    Cockadoodledoo wrote: »
    In response to your first sentence, I responded honestly as someone who works in the health sector. I’m not sure why you are getting defensive? It wasn’t my intention for it to be an attack.

    It isn’t practical to expect staff to stay in a unit for a long period of time. Mental health and exhaustion comes into play and their ability to provide quality care is then greatly reduced putting people at great risk. I would much prefer to see somebody who has been home, refreshed and following the guidelines coming in.

    It’s important to remember that it is not in every nursing home so why is that?. The virus is spread due to people not following the guidelines, not washing/sanitising their hands correctly which may be due to lack of training, incorrect use of PPE, inadequate supply of PPE or just simply implementing procedures when it was too late.

    Sorry if I came across the wrong way I did not take your post as an attack.

    The whole situation is very frustrating I think the care homes should have been protected better I don't have all the answers as to how.


  • #54
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,388 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    Balf wrote: »
    Maybe.

    But they're not seeing 100,000 deaths, which is what we were told would happen without the lockdown.

    So I suspect something isn't working for us, either.

    Many Swedes have limited their social actions. They can get foreign TV.


  • #55
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    HeidiHeidi wrote: »
    I think it's a great analogy.

    It's not though and if you apply a little critical thinking you would understand why it's not a good analogy.


  • #56
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 19,178 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Balf wrote: »
    Maybe.

    But they're not seeing 100,000 deaths, which is what we were told would happen without the lockdown.

    So I suspect something isn't working for us, either.

    Sweden have over 2000 deaths, compared to their near neighbours, Finland & Norway have less then 200.
    Bit I believe there is a whole thread dedicated to Sweden, for some reason


  • #57
    CinemaGuy45
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭CinemaGuy45


    Balf wrote: »
    Maybe.

    But they're not seeing 100,000 deaths, which is what we were told would happen without the lockdown.

    So I suspect something isn't working for us, either.

    At the start of this I was up to 90 and I was part of the mob attacking people who disagreed with the idea of lockdown my opinion has changed based on what I have experienced seen heard and read over the last few weeks.


  • #58
    CinemaGuy45
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭CinemaGuy45


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    It's not though and if you apply a little critical thinking you would understand why it's not a good analogy.

    Careful now.;)


  • #59
    wakka12
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    CinemaGuy45 wrote: »
    So it's 100 times less because of the lockdown?

    Sweden seems to be getting along ok without the lockdown.

    The esimate of 100,000 was over a period of at least a year if not more I dont recall and was withou any restrictions to curb the spread

    It has been 6 weeks since Ireland's first death and will likely reach 1000 deaths before May with a massive scale lockdown so yes, definitely could be 100 times greater

    Sweden has also implemented extensive measures to curb the spread of the virus , just less severe. Footfall in central stockholm is down to 30% of what it was in February, most people work from home, elderly and vulnerable are being protected, mass gatherings banned, people are being much more hygienic. Sweden is experiencing a similar number of deaths as the rest of Europe because of those reasons


  • #60
    EDit
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 819 ✭✭✭EDit


    wakka12 wrote: »
    The esimate of 100,000 was over a period of at least a year if not more I dont recall and was withou any restrictions to curb the spread

    It has been 6 weeks since Ireland's first death and will likely reach 1000 deaths before May with a massive scale lockdown so yes, definitely could be 100 times greater

    Sweden has also implemented extensive measures to curb the spread of the virus , just less severe. Footfall in central stockholm is down to 30% of what it was in February, most people work from home, elderly and vulnerable are being protected, mass gatherings banned, people are being much more hygienic. Sweden is experiencing a similar number of deaths as the rest of Europe because of those reasons

    Exactly. Neither Sweden nor Ireland have been under lockdown. Sweden has certain restrictions and Ireland has slightly stricter restrictions. I’d hazard a guess that the Swedish are a bit more compliant, which helps their cause as well.


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  • #61
    storker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,739 ✭✭✭storker


    cian68 wrote: »
    That is precisely BECAUSE of the precautions taken

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=113221984&postcount=3615


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