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Covid19 Part XV - 15,251 in ROI (610 deaths) 2,645 in NI (194 deaths) (19/04) Read OP

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Comments

  • #2582
    fin12
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,934 ✭✭✭✭fin12


    wakka12 wrote: »
    I must say Im shocked at Italy and Spain rushing to ease restrictions. Cases and deaths have decreased a lot but still a shocking number of new deaths occurring in both countries daily, 400-600 deaths a day is still an incredible number

    I read an article where they said a lot of people in the south of Italy work cash in hand jobs so not entitled to any welfare. They will literally starve or have to rob supermarkets if they can’t go back to work.


  • #2583
    Iamabeliever
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 464 ✭✭Iamabeliever


    Hobgoblin11 wrote: »
    they should assess it week to week

    Are they not?


  • #2584
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,361 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Wildlife Actor wrote: »
    Can someone help me with timelines here? So if Tony Holohan tells us we have 500 "new cases" this evening, when are they likely to have been infected?

    Let's say I get sneezed on and infected on day 1. Presumably it could be 10 to 14 days before I develop symptoms. I wait a day or two, hoping against hope. Then I go to the Doc who says, OK you're a proper person to send for a test. Then I wait X days for a test, get tested, and then I wait Y days for the result. Then I'm a "new case".

    Isn't it possible (even leaving aside the delayed German tests) that a lot of "new cases" are actually people who were infected up to 4 weeks ago? Possibly longer?

    Sorry if this has been asked and answered multiple times before.

    Which is why testing is secondary for victims. If you get the virus on Day 1, and get symptoms on Day 7, Then you will be at home recovering, in hospital recovering, in ICU fighting for your life, or the not nice alternative. These will happen whether you are tested or not.

    However, testing allows for contact tracing, and for the health service to track the development of the outbreak and provision services to fight the epidemic. It also helps if the health professionals are tested to allow them back to work in the fastest time that is safe.

    If people have been swabbed, they should get the result even if it is of not much use but it at least settles their concerns. Other than that, they are history.


  • #2585
    tobefrank321
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,527 ✭✭✭tobefrank321


    Ace2007 wrote: »
    Let's look at what your purposing...

    You want to close the borders, but not for Irish citizens, so the borders would be kinda be open. What do you do about Northern Ireland - are you going to put the Irish army on the border? Serious question there?

    Hotels are empty - Who feeds the people staying in the hotel - do the workers in the hotel now have to stay in isolation for the entire time so not to pass on any potential infection into the community?

    You want to make some exceptions for people, if they have the correct papers - so your happy for these people not to be quarantined.

    Like your logic makes no sense, given there are so few coming into the country in the first place, and those who are, are more than likely isolating anyway.

    There have been a few "social media" folk, who arrived home in Ireland in the last 2 week and you see the flights and airports are empty and that they go into isolation - rent an air bnb somewhere and stay there for 2 weeks.

    It's all well and good to say close this airport and that - but when the government are introducing the 2km restriction for Irish people, people are complaining on here, and wanting to visit folk 100km away.

    Lets look at what your proposing. Zero controls and restrictions for anyone coming in from a hotspot like London and allow them off into the community.

    6 months in and you still don't understand that 1 case in China led to almost 2 million cases and 100,000 deaths.

    You also don't understand that all our cases originally stemmed from people travelling from overseas and the UK.

    Control and restrictions on borders are a critical part of resolving this. They are just one part but a very important part.


  • #2586
    Allinall
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,275 ✭✭✭Allinall


    Hobgoblin11 wrote: »
    they should assess it week to week

    They are assessing it day to day, never mind week to week.


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  • #2587
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,361 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Professor Moriarty wrote: »
    I wonder if drug companies/governments could put in a disclaimer that would be legally valid?

    They are called 'trials'. Sometimes they have good outcomes, sometimes not so much.


  • #2588
    bekker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 912 ✭✭✭bekker


    Useful article from yesterday's Guardian on reliable sources and comparing countries, doesn't appear to have been posted previously.

    Coronavirus statistics: what can we trust and what should we ignore?
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/12/coronavirus-statistics-what-can-we-trust-and-what-should-we-ignore#maincontent


  • #2589
    Christy42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,106 ✭✭✭Christy42


    Professor Moriarty wrote: »
    I wonder if drug companies/governments could put in a disclaimer that would be legally valid?

    Not enough people would go for that. I wouldn't. I mean looking at he figures there is a small chance I get this while staying at home and even then a 0.2% chance of me dying so the odds of very serious harm are overall quite slim. If I don't trust the vaccine then I am not going for it. I don't get to see my mum and granny for a bit longer but I can deal.

    If it has gone through testing etc. as per every other vaccine I have been given in my life then that is fine.


  • #2590
    MrMusician18
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,080 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    Strumms wrote: »
    Frontline staff are superheroes, I had to find out the hard way. The ‘system’ is absolutely fücked though... the next politician or the next anyone who goes on about us having the ‘best healthcare in the world’ or even a ‘world class health system’ I’m going to personally try get them sectioned.

    We need to get away from this idea that frontline healthcare workers are superheroes, that this kind of work is a vocation..it's not..Even Louise O'Reilly said it's just a job for most.


  • #2591
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,394 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    They are called 'trials'. Sometimes they have good outcomes, sometimes not so much.

    Hmmm. Never in my life have I heard of 'trials'. Thanks so much for that. The poster I was responding to suggested a "rush to approve" and so my point was that, having rushed to approve the vaccine/drug, perhaps governments/drug companies could have a legally binding disclaimer.


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  • #2592
    Widdensushi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,539 ✭✭✭Widdensushi


    bekker wrote: »
    Useful article from yesterday's Guardian on reliable sources and comparing countries, doesn't appear to have been posted previously.

    Coronavirus statistics: what can we trust and what should we ignore?
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/12/coronavirus-statistics-what-can-we-trust-and-what-should-we-ignore#maincontent

    I didn't open that link as the it's a case of the kettle calling the pot black with some of the rubbish that paper published


  • #2593
    wakka12
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    Was surprised to hear London only has 16,000 confirmed cases, assumed it would be around 50% of the UK total at least, 40,000 or so cases. Dublin has about 5,000 doesnt it?

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/12/virus-hitting-hardest-modern-equivalent-victorian-slums


  • #2594
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,394 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    Christy42 wrote: »
    Not enough people would go for that. I wouldn't. I mean looking at he figures there is a small chance I get this while staying at home and even then a 0.2% chance of me dying so the odds of very serious harm are overall quite slim. If I don't trust the vaccine then I am not going for it. I don't get to see my mum and granny for a bit longer but I can deal.

    If it has gone through testing etc. as per every other vaccine I have been given in my life then that is fine.

    But you are relatively young and healthy. If you were 75 with severe asthma, you might think differently about taking a chance on a new vaccine or antiviral drug.


  • #2595
    s1ippy
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,980 ✭✭✭s1ippy


    Widdensushi wrote: »
    I didn't open that link as the it's a case of the kettle calling the pot black with some of the rubbish that paper published
    What are you actually on about, the Guardian is the best-regarded paper by scholars and professionals in the UK. What British paper would you defer to, as a matter of interest?

    The article is informative, balanced and well-written.


  • #2596
    igCorcaigh
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 12,391 Mod ✭✭✭✭igCorcaigh


    MrMusician18 wrote: »
    We need to get away from this idea that frontline healthcare workers are superheroes, that this kind of work is a vocation..it's not..Even Louise O'Reilly said it's just a job for most.

    Exactly. That sort of soppy language detracts from the professionalism of those doing a difficult job. (powered by love etc.)

    It also casts them as poor Florence Nightingale types, allowing them to be paid badly.


  • #2597
    tobefrank321
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,527 ✭✭✭tobefrank321


    Watching Sky News report from a Naples hospital now. Fascinating how they manage infection control. Zero staff infected.

    Will the HSE learn from it?


  • #2598
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,394 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    s1ippy wrote: »
    What are you actually on about, the Guardian is the best-regarded paper by scholars and professionals in the UK. What British paper would you defer to, as a matter of interest?

    The article is informative, balanced and well-written.

    Can't think of another paper in Britain that I would trust more.


  • #2599
    yerwanthere123
    Moderators, Sports Moderators, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,760 Mod ✭✭✭✭yerwanthere123


    bekker wrote: »
    Useful article from yesterday's Guardian on reliable sources and comparing countries, doesn't appear to have been posted previously.

    Coronavirus statistics: what can we trust and what should we ignore?
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/12/coronavirus-statistics-what-can-we-trust-and-what-should-we-ignore#maincontent

    Know how to get around the pay wall?


  • #2600
    Achasanai
    Closed Accounts Posts: 730 ✭✭✭Achasanai


    yerwanthere123 wrote: »
    Know how to get around the pay wall?


    There's no paywall (yet) on the Guardian.


  • #2601
    yerwanthere123
    Moderators, Sports Moderators, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,760 Mod ✭✭✭✭yerwanthere123


    Achasanai wrote: »
    There's no paywall (yet) on the Guardian.

    Ah yes sorry, saw that it wanted me to register, assumed it was gonna cost me. Thanks :)


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  • #2602
    yerwanthere123
    Moderators, Sports Moderators, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,760 Mod ✭✭✭✭yerwanthere123


    I work in a busy hotel in Killarney which is obviously currently closed. Someone in the work Whatsapp group asked our manager if we'll still be reopening as planned on May 14th. I mean... :confused:


  • #2603
    smelly sock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,820 ✭✭✭smelly sock


    Rob A. Bank wrote: »
    An powerful rendition of ‘Amazing Grace’ to the empty Piazza del Duomo, literally the center of Milan, and so emotional to hear the blind Andrea Bocelli emphasize the lines “was blind, but now I see”.

    From Andrea Bocelli: Music For Hope - Live From Duomo di Milano yesterday (@ 18.35 rewind for the complete 25 minute performance)

    The Irish connection to the hymn, Donegal weather, Tory Island, Buncrana and Lough Swilly.


    Didnt think i would make it through these times until i saw that. Floods of tears here. Wow. Beautiful.


    We should all head outside at 8 tonight and clap for Andrea.


  • #2604
    Speak Now
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,764 ✭✭✭Speak Now


    Professor Moriarty wrote: »
    Can't think of another paper in Britain that I would trust more.

    The amount of Daily Mail and The Sun links on here....shudder.


  • #2605
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,361 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Professor Moriarty wrote: »
    Hmmm. Never in my life have I heard of 'trials'. Thanks so much for that. The poster I was responding to suggested a "rush to approve" and so my point was that, having rushed to approve the vaccine/drug, perhaps governments/drug companies could have a legally binding disclaimer.

    There you are. You can sign up if you are willing.

    https://www.centerwatch.com/clinical-trials/listings/location/international/Ireland/


  • #2606
    Speak Now
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,764 ✭✭✭Speak Now


    Another 667 dead in England including a 17 year old :(


  • #2607
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,394 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    There you are. You can sign up if you are willing.

    https://www.centerwatch.com/clinical-trials/listings/location/international/Ireland/

    As to the point I made?


  • #2608
    poppers
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 667 ✭✭✭poppers


    Professor Moriarty wrote: »
    I wonder if drug companies/governments could put in a disclaimer that would be legally valid?

    Doubt it otherwise every playground adventure park would get you to sign such a disclaimer before you enter.


  • #2609
    Christy42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,106 ✭✭✭Christy42


    Professor Moriarty wrote: »
    But you are relatively young and healthy. If you were 75 with severe asthma, you might think differently about taking a chance on a new vaccine or antiviral drug.

    Antiviral drug even I would think about if I was struggling and had the virus. A vaccine. It depends. Would those vulnerable people also be more vulnerable to the effects of a vaccine? However in any case if you are only giving the vaccine to a small proportion of the population it is more a test than a roll out which will happen anyway.

    In this case I would still stay indoors. Even if my granny had it I would avoid her in case it didn't work.


  • #2610
    tobefrank321
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,527 ✭✭✭tobefrank321


    wakka12 wrote: »
    Was surprised to hear London only has 16,000 confirmed cases, assumed it would be around 50% of the UK total at least, 40,000 or so cases. Dublin has about 5,000 doesnt it?

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/12/virus-hitting-hardest-modern-equivalent-victorian-slums

    UK are only testing people who end up in hospital or with severe symptoms is my understanding and the vast majority of cases aren't being diagnosed. All we can do is estimate UK and London cases. One rule of thumb is a 1% fatality rate. So UK is likely to have somewhere between 1-2 million cases. And London several hundred thousand, many of them asymptomatic.


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  • #2611
    screamer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,193 ✭✭✭screamer


    MrMusician18 wrote: »
    We need to get away from this idea that frontline healthcare workers are superheroes, that this kind of work is a vocation..it's not..Even Louise O'Reilly said it's just a job for most.

    You can call them what you like. Fact is, that while the rest of us hide at home, they move to the front line. I saw them myself over the weekend in a trip to the hospital, normal people doing a hard job at the best of times, some with ****ty papery masks, some with none at all. Young, old, pregnant all there to help, risking their own lives to save ours.
    You can call them what you like, I call them vulnerable, at risk, professional and the last bastion we have against this virus. They are amazing people and deserve all our gratitude and respect. They are heroes to me.


This discussion has been closed.
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