Is it just me or have SF vanished?

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 12:22PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Nonsense.
Much as I dislike FG currently I would never suggest Madigan was advocating that.

Accept it Sultan, you were once again - exaggerating.

Not really, no context in this type of situation is not the best idea.

Now, if you want exaggeration, you should look to Conor Murphy....

....on 27 March, Mr Murphy announced that he had made a “joint order” with the Irish government for a “significant” volume of personal protective equipment (PPE) which he said “should satisfy our supply demands”.

Five days earlier, in response to question about the lack of PPE for medical staff, deputy First Minister Michelle O’Neill had told the Assembly that the Finance Department had that morning “signed a contract that will see additional PPE brought in”.

However, last Friday – a week after Mr Murphy’s announcement – the Nolan Show revealed that in fact there was no order, with the Irish government stating that it had “not proved possible to place a joint order”.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 12:24PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

Not really, no context in this type of situation is not the best idea.

Now, if you want exaggeration, you should look to Conor Murphy....

We are desperate to change the subject aren't we.

09-04-2020 12:27PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

We are desperate to change the subject aren't we.

So what happened in this situation? Are you gonna call for more "transparency" from the MLA's up North?

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 12:27PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

We are desperate to change the subject aren't we.

Not really, I think I've made my point - a dumb idea is a dumb idea regardless of who shares it.

It would be better if it was explained that such masks will not protect you, but they may protect others if you are asymptomatic and shedding.

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 12:28PM

jh79 wrote: »

So what happened in this situation? Are you gonna call for more "transparency" from the MLA's up North?

.....or for NI to send out inspectors to China to check their consignments?

Mortelaro · 09-04-2020 12:34PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Where was that?

have you another 'sensational' screen grab where you are going to ask me to back-up something I never said?

Oh you did unsucessfuly try to deny a post all day yesterday
When you're done denying things you go WTF and move on

You were hung this morning again earlier on the china 2 week quarantine because all you are doing again is spoofing on pharma PPE reagents, test kits and dealing with China etc etc
Something you as spokesperson here for Sinn Féin clearly know nothing about

Threads like these are probably the only places with 4 0r 5 readers left for you to indulge such a lack of knowledge

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 12:36PM

jh79 wrote: »

So what happened in this situation? Are you gonna call for more "transparency" from the MLA's up North?

I seen this story when it emerged.

I don't know what happened but I did follow it up to see what each side was saying and the HSE were vague about what exactly happened.
Was an order agreed and then proved impossible to 'place' or was no order agreed at all?
I think we should know the answer.

However, the Department of Health has confirmed that no joint order has been placed for personal protective equipment (PPE) from China in conjunction with the Northern Ireland Executive

A spokeswoman said: “We are ready to discuss any area where we can co-operate effectively, North and South, including on procurement of PPE and critical supplies.

“In relation to procurement, while it has not so far proved possible to place a joint order in the context of what is an increasingly challenging international environment, discussions between procurement teams are ongoing and active, and it remains our intention to continue to co-operate in this area.”

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 12:38PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

Not really, I think I've made my point - a dumb idea is a dumb idea regardless of who shares it.

It would be better if it was explained that such masks will not protect you, but they may protect others if you are asymptomatic and shedding.

It isn't a 'dumb idea' if it increases the effect of social distancing.

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 12:40PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I seen this story when it emerged.

I don't know what happened but I did follow it up to see what each side was saying and the HSE were vague about what exactly happened.
Was an order agreed and then proved impossible to 'place' or was no order agreed at all?
I think we should know the answer.

So it's the HSE's fault??!?!?

Do SF ever take responsibility for anything? It can't always be Westminster's fault, or Dublin's fault, or the EU's fault, or China's fault.....if buck-passing was a sport they'd be the undisputed world champions!

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 12:40PM

Mortelaro wrote: »

Oh you did unsucessfuly try to deny a post all day yesterday
When you're done denying things you go WTF and move on

You were hung this morning again earlier on the china 2 week quarantine because all you are doing again is spoofing on pharma PPE reagents, test kits and dealing with China etc etc
Something you as spokesperson here for Sinn Féin clearly know nothing about

Threads like these are probably the only places with 4 0r 5 readers left for you to indulge such a lack of knowledge

You are still in fantasy land on this I see.

You asked me to back up something I never said.

I admitted I didn't know about the 2 week quarantine something you are clearly not able to do when you are wrong.

Good luck, I won't be indulging you in your lies on this anymore.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 12:41PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

So it's the HSE's fault??!?!?

Do SF ever take responsibility for anything? It can't always be Westminster's fault, or Dublin's fault, or the EU's fault, or China's fault.....if buck-passing was a sport they'd be the undisputed world champions!

Who said it was the HSE's fault?

I quoted their statement where they are not clear about it.

I said I think we should know exactly what happened.

Get lost Sultan with your misrepresentations again!

09-04-2020 12:43PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I seen this story when it emerged.

I don't know what happened but I did follow it up to see what each side was saying and the HSE were vague about what exactly happened.
Was an order agreed and then proved impossible to 'place' or was no order agreed at all?
I think we should know the answer.

It's not the South that have to answer it, CM made the claim not the HSE.

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 12:45PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It isn't a 'dumb idea' if it increases the effect of social distancing.

That's the whole point - it doesn't!

Healthy people reading it are going to think a mask provides protection, therefore they can go into situations where they shouldn't because they're wearing a carefully folded bandana over their mouths.....or because other people are wearing them, even though, at best a folded home-made mask only catches 50% of virus particles being shed through respiration.....not good if you happen to run into a super-spreader.

smurgen · 09-04-2020 12:47PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

I know some of the counterfeit stuff we get sent to evaluate is almost indistinguishable from our own products - a few years ago we just had to worry about packaging being counterfeited, now its whole assemblies and components.....so I'm not sure how even a well trained team of auditors/assessors on an airport apron could even hope to inspect enough PPE, in sufficient detail to pass or reject a consignment - it's fantasyland stuff from people who have no clue how the real world runs.

Christ some reaching you're doing to excuse this away. gowns with three-quarter length sleeves, leaving arms exposed should be easily spotted.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 12:49PM

jh79 wrote: »

It's not the South that have to answer it, CM made the claim not the HSE.

Murphy has explained what happened on his end.

Was there an order agreed...the HSE don't say..only that it proved impossible to 'place' an order.

Which tallies with what Murphy said.

Mr Murphy said officials from the Republic of Ireland were forced to go ahead with an order for the equipment after global powers, including USA and India, entered the race for PPE, before a joint order was agreed with Northern Ireland.

"Yesterday afternoon, despite the best efforts of all involved, I received confirmation the order would not be fulfilled through this route," he said.

If he is lying then we clearly have to ask the HSE if an order was agreed or not.

And, I will say it again, I think we should know the answer.

smurgen · 09-04-2020 12:52PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

Sorry, but where in that final article you linked does it say Harris and/or the HSE bought PPE rom Alibaba?

No that was in relation to Harris saying we'd be testing 15 k.do you now agree he was foolish to say that?

09-04-2020 12:52PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Murphy has explained what happened on his end.

Was there an order agreed...the HSE don't say..only that it proved impossible to 'place' an order.

Which tallies with what Murphy said.

If he is lying then we clearly have to ask the HSE if an order was agreed or not.

And, I will say it again, I think we should know the answer.

Mr Murphy said officials from the Republic of Ireland were forced to go ahead with an order for the equipment after global powers, including USA and India, entered the race for PPE, before a joint order was agreed with Northern Ireland.

That is your answer right there. He announced it before it was agreed.

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 12:53PM

smurgen wrote: »

Christ some reaching you're doing to excuse this away. gowns with three-quarter length sleeves, leaving arms exposed should be easily spotted.

How?

How can you get inspection teams off the plane, to examine the kit etc all in the 3-hour turnaround permitted by the Chinese authorities? Even in a situation where they let one jet stay for 5 hours?

Each batch, according to Aer Lingus, "....consists of 600 tonnes of materials, including personal protective equipment like masks, goggles, gowns, gloves and more...."

So if you're not allowed off the plane, how do you inspect that quantity of kit in the confines of an aircraft cabin?

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 12:54PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

That's the whole point - it doesn't!

Healthy people reading it are going to think a mask provides protection, therefore they can go into situations where they shouldn't because they're wearing a carefully folded bandana over their mouths.....or because other people are wearing them, even though, at best a folded home-made mask only catches 50% of virus particles being shed through respiration.....not good if you happen to run into a super-spreader.

So YOU say. But others say different.

It's like washing hands or even the 2 meter rule, some washing of hands is better than none, some distance is better than none.
They are guidelines, not hard scientific methods of not catching the virus. As is a mask.

Nobody suggested these were medical standard safeguards...just another deterrent in the absence of better.

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 12:56PM

smurgen wrote: »

No that was in relation to Harris saying we'd be testing 15 k.do you now agree he was foolish to say that?

Do you admit it was foolish to state he was getting PPE from Alibaba?

Saying we'd do 15,000 tests was foolish if he just pulled the figure from thin air and offered without any basis, but if he's been briefed that such a figure is do-able then all he is doing is passing on information - that's not foolish, that's just doing his job.

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 12:59PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So YOU say. But others say different.

It's like washing hands or even the 2 meter rule, some washing of hands is better than none, some distance is better than none.
They are guidelines, not hard scientific methods of not catching the virus. As is a mask.

Nobody suggested these were medical standard safeguards...just another deterrent in the absence of better.

No, it's not the same - the 2m rule is based on scientific facts relating to droplet and aerosol spread, likewise handwashing with soap, is not a guideline - its a fact because the lipid corona of the SARS-CoV-2 virus is broken down by soap and detergent.

Untreated folded cotton is not a recognised public health control measure - if people want to advocate otherwise they should indicate as much.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 01:02PM

jh79 wrote: »

Mr Murphy said officials from the Republic of Ireland were forced to go ahead with an order for the equipment after global powers, including USA and India, entered the race for PPE, before a joint order was agreed with Northern Ireland.

That is your answer right there. He announced it before it was agreed.

The journalist is saying that from my reading of it.

Here is the BBC's reporting what he said:

On Friday afternoon, Mr Murphy said he had agreed to process an order for PPE with Dublin from China last week, and was arranging the transfer of payment when a number of "significant players had moved in", thwarting the order.

It does require transparency and clearing up.

Mortelaro · 09-04-2020 01:09PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Good luck, I won't be indulging you in your lies on this anymore.

Mainly because I'm exposing you is it?
Shur everyone is exposing you here because you are doing so much spoof posting

09-04-2020 01:15PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The journalist is saying that from my reading of it.

Here is the BBC's reporting what he said:

It does require transparency and clearing up.

I agree SF need to explain what happened.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 01:24PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

No, it's not the same - the 2m rule is based on scientific facts relating to droplet and aerosol spread, likewise handwashing with soap, is not a guideline - its a fact because the lipid corona of the SARS-CoV-2 virus is broken down by soap and detergent.

Untreated folded cotton is not a recognised public health control measure - if people want to advocate otherwise they should indicate as much.

'Based on' scientific facts. It is no guarantee though.

NOBODY suggested that folded cotton is a recognised public health measure. We have gone from touching elbows in greeting to staying 2m's away in trying to control the spread of this...if we need to move to medically approved ones as the crisis deepens, I am sure we will and all TD's will be promoting them.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 01:26PM

jh79 wrote: »

I agree SF need to explain what happened.

But what good would that do for people who don't believe a word they say.
We need clarity and that is going to involve definitive statements from both party's involved. As it always does.

What perplexes me is what gain there was for Murphy when it was going to be apparent very quickly that no PPE was coming.

09-04-2020 01:38PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

But what good would that do for people who don't believe a word they say.
We need clarity and that is going to involve definitive statements from both party's involved. As it always does.

What perplexes me is what gain there was for Murphy when it was going to be apparent very quickly that no PPE was coming.

Did the HSE say a contract was in place , if not what do they need to clarify?

All PM has to do is clarify if he went public prior to the contract being signed.

09-04-2020 01:47PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

What perplexes me is what gain there was for Murphy when it was going to be apparent very quickly that no PPE was coming.

Maybe he's not very good at his job.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 01:58PM

jh79 wrote: »

Did the HSE say a contract was in place , if not what do they need to clarify?

All PM has to do is clarify if he went public prior to the contract being signed.

The HSE said an 'order could not be placed'.

I haven't seen anything else from them. Murphy seems to be saying the order went south after he had agreed on it and had been processing payment.

Would you process payment without a contract?

Short answer is I don't know what to believe and I will say again there needs to be transparency here. Which is what I was asked about. One side can't give that.

Asking Connor Murphy to confirm your suspicions isn't transparency, unfortunately.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 01:59PM

jh79 wrote: »

Maybe he's not very good at his job.

Maybe. Plenty of TDs, Ministers, MP's and MLA's aren't.

Is it just me or have SF vanished?

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