Is it just me or have SF vanished?

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 11:23AM

Yurt! wrote: »

I'm not sure where you're taking this. The professional on the podcast more or less said that the advice from the competent British authority on wearing homemade masks wasn't a bad one.

Just that it won't stop you picking up virus particles, which some commentators are suggesting - for example O'Rourke's tweet doesn't say "wear a maks if you are symptomatic or think you are infected" thus leaving the clear impression that a folded bandana will protect a healthy individual from contracting the virus.

The studies suggest surgical masks will limit the shedding of the virus (the Cowling study) and the PHE study suggests likewise and, additionally, that certain household materials may also hold some potential when it comes to limiting the shedding of the virus.

But the idea that a homemade mask, with no filter insert can stop you picking up the virus when its aersolised is a reckless one, and not something, I think, public reps should be encouraging.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 11:28AM

jh79 wrote: »

Unless you worked in the industry you wouldn't know this but in India and China it's like the wild west when it comes to supplying the medical / pharma industry.

Feckers in China once even built a fake second pharma plant exclusively for show to foreign regulators so they could get away with non-compliance in the real plant.

I would have no doubt about it.

But if you know that and I know that, shouldn't somebody spending 200 million have known it too?

As I keep saying, we could have ended up with a much much higher or even total defective rate.

What measures have been put in place to ensure quality in subsequent orders would be good to know too.

But 'questioning' seems to be not allowable.

blackwhite · 09-04-2020 11:28AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I said we have people out there already with business expertise and who know and have dealt with companies there. Were they tasked to help here? Could they have helped?

Usually people can last more than 2 hours without catching themselves in a lie.

That's not your original suggestion

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Had it been me, knowing China's reputation for varying quality I'd have sent a team out there to inspect the product before accepting it. A bit of logistics required but certainly doable. The defective materials were discovered very quickly on arrival...that could have been picked up in China by random sampling.

tikkahunter · 09-04-2020 11:28AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

WTF?

Where did I say anything about two weeks? I said we have people out there already with business expertise and who know and have dealt with companies there. Were they tasked to help here? Could they have helped?

With 200m at stake, we could just as easily ended up with none of it usable...is the point here. As other countries found to their cost...as posted by somebody last night, Finland's entire consignment was defective.

See the red herring is the gear was defective, none of the stuff we got was defective Francie, it was approved by the WHO , the main issue was some of the gowns where 3/4 length sleeve , obviously made for Chinese people or with a 3/4 length sleeve you would wear the longer gloves that go past the elbow but the gear was of a standard that complies with regulation. The stuff they where donated from the likes of that dick head Paddy Cosgrove (who was trying to act billy big balls) was sourced from alibaba and spurious sites was not up to standard, other countries fell into that trap in desperation, Spain for instance and Belgium. Then you see twitter stories where they say they got defective PPE from China , but not that they bought from spurious suppliers, that headline gets buried. We done very well to get the gear we did when demand is high and cut throat at the moment.

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 11:31AM

jh79 wrote: »

Unless you worked in the industry you wouldn't know this but in India and China it's like the wild west when it comes to supplying the medical / pharma industry.

Feckers in China once even built a fake second pharma plant exclusively for show to foreign regulators so they could get away with non-compliance in the real plant.

I know some of the counterfeit stuff we get sent to evaluate is almost indistinguishable from our own products - a few years ago we just had to worry about packaging being counterfeited, now its whole assemblies and components.....so I'm not sure how even a well trained team of auditors/assessors on an airport apron could even hope to inspect enough PPE, in sufficient detail to pass or reject a consignment - it's fantasyland stuff from people who have no clue how the real world runs.

eastie17 · 09-04-2020 11:31AM

Are balaclavas considered PPE? If they are I'd expect SF to step up and crack open that bunker with all the guns in it and the Northern Bank cash and hand it over to the HSE.
They could use some of the cash to buy more PPE from China as well

Yurt2 · 09-04-2020 11:33AM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

But the idea that a homemade mask, with no filter insert can stop you picking up the virus when its aersolised is a reckless one, and not something, I think, public reps should be encouraging.

If he made such a claim I'd agree with you, but I don't believe he did.

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 11:34AM

Yurt! wrote: »

If he made such a claim I'd agree with you, but I don't believe he did.

No, but is this really a situation where you want ambiguity - no context when you're providing information is probably not where we want to be.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 11:41AM

blackwhite wrote: »

Usually people can last more than 2 hours without catching themselves in a lie.

That's not your original suggestion

Yes...because I can accept that something I said was wrong and rethink. I didn't know that people sent out had to do 2 weeks quarantine nor that the pilots were not allowed off the plane until somebody said it here..so I do what I always do...I looked for another possibility/solution.
I didn't just throw my hands in the air and say...ah that can't be done.

09-04-2020 11:41AM

blackwhite wrote: »

Indeed. Applying the most basic aspect of critical thought or analysis does seem to be completely beyond you alright. We saw it before in your despicable defences of anti-vaxxers (but only Shinner anti-vaxxers mind). "I'm just asking questions" isn't a defence for proffering knowingly dangerous theories time and again.

Anyone with half a brain could have figured out that the 14-day quarantine being imposed by the Chinese would prevent flying out inspectors - all of course except our resident "businessman"

Your solution is to send out an inspection team and wait 2 weeks to get 75% of the consignment approved and shipped.

The simpler and safer solution - which was followed - was to take the delivery immediately and inspect it on arrival in Ireland and have use of the 75% of confirming PPE without delay.

But f*ck anyone who happens to die because of the delays by you "just asking questions" - right Francie? They're not as important as point-scoring for SF on the internet :rolleyes:

Pretty much. There's no end to easy answers SF won't promote.

09-04-2020 11:42AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I would have no doubt about it.

But if you know that and I know that, shouldn't somebody spending 200 million have known it too?

As I keep saying, we could have ended up with a much much higher or even total defective rate.

What measures have been put in place to ensure quality in subsequent orders would be good to know too.

But 'questioning' seems to be not allowable.

Of course they knew there is a risk with orders form China but anyone with experience in the industry would know that there isn't a lot you can do except check the order on delivery and liaise with the supplier to ensure the quality of subsequent orders and if that doesn't work maybe add financial penalties in the procurement contract and in the background try an find an alternative supplier.

But in a pandemic your hands are tied even more.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 11:42AM

This is so embarrassing...Josepha retweeting the exact same tweet.

https://twitter.com/ciarakellydoc/status/1246429238317715457

09-04-2020 11:42AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Yes...because I can accept that something I said was wrong and rethink. I didn't know that people sent out had to do 2 weeks quarantine nor that the pilots were not allowed off the plane until somebody said it here..so I do what I always do...I looked for another possibility/solution.
I didn't just throw my hands in the air and say...ah that can't be done.

You could just say the Governmen/HSE got this one right.

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 11:47AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

This is so embarrassing...Josepha retweeting the exact same tweet.

https://twitter.com/ciarakellydoc/status/1246429238317715457

Is that not Ciara Kelly, and yes it's not embarassing - it's still a stupid idea.

Mortelaro · 09-04-2020 11:48AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Yes...because I can accept that something I said was wrong and rethink. I didn't know that people sent out had to do 2 weeks quarantine nor that the pilots were not allowed off the plane until somebody said it here..so I do what I always do...I looked for another possibility/solution.
I didn't just throw my hands in the air and say...ah that can't be done.

So you're admitting you are posting stuff without the facts
Hmmmm.... this looks like deja vu
You were at that all day yesterday denying you'd said the government were picking what advice to take from NPHET with no evidence to back that up whatsoever

You do this kind of fake news a lot

Yurt2 · 09-04-2020 11:48AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

This is so embarrassing...Josepha retweeting the exact same tweet.

https://twitter.com/ciarakellydoc/status/1246429238317715457

This just went from reckless and irresponsible to pretty good idea actually.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 11:51AM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

Is that not Ciara Kelly, and yes it's not embarassing - it's still a stupid idea.

I added a screen grab as the retweet didn't show.

09-04-2020 11:55AM

Yurt! wrote: »

This just went from reckless and irresponsible to pretty good idea actually.

For front line workers?

Can I interest you in a range of homeopathic virus cures?

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 11:56AM

Yurt! wrote: »

This just went from reckless and irresponsible to pretty good idea actually.

This isn't about ideology - it's still a dumb idea, promoting the idea that home-made masks offer protection against picking up SARS-CoV-2 particles.

A virus particle is between 70 & 90 nm in diameter - cotton weave, even in layers isn't going to catch that.

Mortelaro · 09-04-2020 11:56AM

Yurt! wrote: »

This just went from reckless and irresponsible to pretty good idea actually.

Last several pages was on ppe for frontline staff
These are for the general public who may be asymptomatic
To offer some protection to others
It's the advice in the USA

Yurt2 · 09-04-2020 11:56AM

Deleted User wrote: »

For front line workers?

Can I interest you in a range of homeopathic virus cures?

Who suggested this for front line workers? Not I or anyone else as far as I'm aware. So you may withdraw the snark

Yurt2 · 09-04-2020 11:57AM

Mortelaro wrote: »

Last several pages was on ppe for frontline staff
These are for the general public who may be asymptomatic
To offer some protection to others
It's the advice in the USA

I'm fully aware of that

Yurt2 · 09-04-2020 11:58AM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

This isn't about ideology - it's still a dumb idea, promoting the idea that home-made masks offer protection against picking up SARS-CoV-2 particles.

A virus particle is between 70 & 90 nm in diameter - cotton weave, even in layers isn't going to catch that.

No scientific claims pertaining to the above were made be me, the SF TD or Josepha Madigan for that matter.

And it obviously is about ideology when someone attempted a bash at a SF TD for retweeting a video about homemade masks, which happens to be CDC advice.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 11:59AM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

This isn't about ideology - it's still a dumb idea, promoting the idea that home-made masks offer protection against picking up SARS-CoV-2 particles.

A virus particle is between 70 & 90 nm in diameter - cotton weave, even in layers isn't going to catch that.

Now just who 'promoted' that idea Sultan?

You are exaggerating again.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 12:00PM

Yurt! wrote: »

No scientific claims pertaining to the above were made be me, the SF TD or Josepha Madigan for that matter.

And it obviously is about ideology when someone attempted a bash at a SF TD for retweeting a video about homemade masks, which happens to be CDC advice.

Do I hear the sound of frantic scurrying?

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 12:05PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Now just who 'promoted' that idea Sultan?

You are exaggerating again.

anyone circulating that tweet

Sultan_of_Ping · 09-04-2020 12:07PM

Glad to see SF abiding by the social distancing requirements in Northern Ireland....

https://www.derryjournal.com/news/people/questions-asked-about-social-distancing-after-crowds-attend-funeral-republican-francie-mcnally-2534182

TUFZMTIxODg3Mzc4.jpg?crop=982:524,smart&width=640

TUFZMTIxODg3Mzc4.jpg?crop=982:524,smart&width=640

Mortelaro · 09-04-2020 12:07PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Now just who 'promoted' that idea Sultan?

You are exaggerating again.

Was it not introduced here in the ppe discussion in the context of your 'moving mountains ' speech ?

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 12:16PM

Mortelaro wrote: »

Was it not introduced here in the ppe discussion in the context of your 'moving mountains ' speech ?

Where was that?

have you another 'sensational' screen grab where you are going to ask me to back-up something I never said?

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2020 12:17PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

anyone circulating that tweet

Nonsense.
Much as I dislike FG currently I would never suggest Madigan was advocating that.

Accept it Sultan, you were once again - exaggerating.

Is it just me or have SF vanished?

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