new coronavirus outbreak China, Korea, USA - mod warnings in OP (updated 24/02/20)

tom1ie · 12-02-2020 04:21PM

givyjoe wrote: »

No sh1t Sherlock. Hence people are discussing foods to keep them going, in the event of being locked at home etc. Fairly useful info. Equally as useful as discussing which cleaning products to use etc.

But lets just stick to endless arguments over unverifiable death rates instead. Much more helpful.

Sure thing chief.

wakka12 · 12-02-2020 04:21PM

Yurt! wrote: »

I'd love to know the science of this, but it appears when the virus has clusters of people in proximity to work on it appears to get more aggressive and virulent in its behaviour.

* Completely unscientific observation

I agree, does certainly seem that way. Does anyone know if thats a common thing, where the I dont know what youd call it 'higher concentration' of the virus passed to you has a bigger impact? Or does it not matter to your body what the quantity is?

ceadaoin. · 12-02-2020 04:22PM

givyjoe wrote: »

No sh1t Sherlock. Hence people are discussing foods to keep them going. Fairly useful info. Equally as useful as discussing which cleaning products to use etc.

But lets just stick to endless arguments over unverifiable death rates instead. Much more helpful.

Yeah talking about foods to keep them going, fortifying homes, spices and vitamins that will save them (lol) etc. In a country with zero confirmed cases. Bit premature dont you think? Yeah it's useful alright, at spreading anxiety and fear. More useful would be discussing hygiene methods to help prevent it spreading.

givyjoe · 12-02-2020 04:22PM

tom1ie wrote: »

I honestly don’t think you know what your on about. Run along to the cooking forum will you. This forum is about the virus.

Who do you actually think you are deciding what can and can be posted in a thread?! The irony of you telling me I don't know what I'm on about. Are you new to boards?

Got a problem with a post, report it.

cnocbui · 12-02-2020 04:23PM

Martina1991 wrote: »

I'm sure due to staff levels and maybe number of kits, they cant afford to test every single person.
Testing would be prioritised to those that are showing symptoms.
Those that remain "well" may just need quarentine until they are pass the incubation period and have not succumb to the virus.

How could we possibly dish out thousands of oxygen tanks to the general public. The cost would be huge.
Not to mention the health hazard of people operating oxygen tanks unsupervised in their homes where they may have open fires or candles. The tanks would explode.

An oxygen tank is not going to explode if someone has an open fire or a candle. The most serious danger with a pressurised gas cylinder is physically breaking the control manifold off, then it can release it's high pressure contents and shoot around. Thousands of people on the planet have Oxygen cylinders at home for emphysema and such.

cnocbui · 12-02-2020 04:30PM

gozunda wrote: »

If you flush - keep the seat down. Toilet system is suspected of being linked to Covid19 infection in Hong Kong

https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/12/asia/hong-kong-coronavirus-pipes-intl-hnk/index.html

Sorry, this is a bit pointless. The most likely person to cop anything is the flusher and they would already have it, in which case they should be somewhere isolated from others anyway.

givyjoe · 12-02-2020 04:30PM

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Yeah talking about foods to keep them going, fortifying homes, herbs that will save them etc. In a country with zero confirmed cases. Bit premature dont you think? More useful would be discussing hygiene methods to help prevent it spreading.

I'm referring to the posts which detailed what to purchase. Premature, really? It's not like it's already completely out of control in China, despite massive quarantine measures. The more people are prepared early, the less need for utter mayhem in shops grabbing the last available supplies.

odyssey06 · 12-02-2020 04:32PM

I don't think it's panic to have 2 weeks' worth of supplies in the house, should you self quarantine.
The stuff isn't going to end up in the bin, it has long shelf life and will be cycled through.

Hand gels etc are good to have regardless to stop you picking up coronavirus or just run of the mill stuff.

wakka12 · 12-02-2020 04:33PM

ceadaoin. wrote: »

People are losing the run of themselves in here. The posters who live in countries who actually have cases are calmer.

I dont think this is going to be another spanish flu. Hygiene and medical standards are very different these days (in certain places). The danger is for those less developed countries. Could be wrong obviously but panicking wont change anything if we're all doomed anyway.

Not to scare monger but being as infectious as it is it has the potential to infect several billion people easily, and has an estimated mortality rate of 2%. Swine flu is less infectious and infected up to more than 20% of the worlds population. So taking that figure of 20%, 1.6 billion people, 2% of that is 34 million deaths. Spanish flu killed 50 million. This is simply because the worlds population is so much larger than it was at the time of Spanish flu, but still, its a lot of deaths.

It may not be the Spanish flu but it could very easily be the worst pandemic since the Spanish flu, by a very wide margin. I dont feel any panic really, but I dont understand the insistence by many that it is the flu, when most signs would imply its a more serious issue.

BanditLuke · 12-02-2020 04:35PM

ceadaoin. wrote: »

People are losing the run of themselves in here. The posters who live in countries who actually have cases are calmer.

I dont think this is going to be another spanish flu. Hygiene and medical standards are very different these days (in certain places). The danger is for those less developed countries. Could be wrong obviously but panicking wont change anything if we're all doomed anyway.

Once again who is panicking?

Preperation is not panicking BTW.

BlaktainPicard · 12-02-2020 04:36PM

Lots of companies are pulling out of the mobile world congress in Barcelona because of this, but Huawei aren't and will be sending 100s of employees over.
Very irresponsible.

Stark · 12-02-2020 04:36PM

Corona in Barcelona. Has a catchy ring to it.

12-02-2020 04:39PM

ceadaoin. wrote: »

People are losing the run of themselves in here. The posters who live in countries who actually have cases are calmer.

In contrast to Vietnam, China's next door neighbour, this thread is mad. Particularly so in the last few days.

It's like the first scractch on your new car.. You try and you care and you try and you care, and then it happens. And it's a bit of an adjustment, but it's fine. The scratch is there. And it's something you deal with over a couple of weeks and then you move on and things are ok.

A few cases in Ireland will have a bunch of people ready to throw themselves of cliffs, but it will be grand. It'll arrive in Dublin and the people who freaked out before it arrived will freak out less when it's here and does nothing.

ceadaoin. · 12-02-2020 04:40PM

givyjoe wrote: »

I'm referring to the posts which detailed what to purchase. Premature, really? It's not like it's already completely out of control in China, despite massive quarantine measures. The more people are prepared early, the less need for utter mayhem in shops grabbing the last available supplies.

Its "out of control" in one region of China, a huge country. But by all accounts there are plenty of supplies remaining and the supermarkets are well stocked and without mayhem. Yeah in some regions you can only go to get groceries every other day, oh no society is collapsing. Have a look on reddit. There are accounts from people in the quarantine zones and even on the cruise ship. It's not mayhem. Boredom seems to be the main issue

josip · 12-02-2020 04:41PM

There's a good chance MWC won't go ahead this year so the Huawei irresponsibility will be moot.

BlaktainPicard · 12-02-2020 04:44PM

josip wrote: »

There's a good chance MWC won't go ahead this year so the Huawei irresponsibility will be moot.

Problem is too that Barcelona city council should cancel it, they aren't planning to ... greed getting in the way of things.

Wibbs · 12-02-2020 04:44PM

wakka12 wrote: »

https://www.reddit.com/r/China_Flu/comments/f2s75c/a_japanese_official_tests_positive_after/
Virus jumps ship!
A japanese official from the Health Ministry surveying the ship has tested positive, I assume he was in a hazmat suit or at least a lot of protective gear, shows how infectious it is

Well... maybe W.

Now this may be well outa left field, but.. I've been thinking on this and in particular the test for this coronavirus. I have a few questions, questions that keep getting louder for me with every passing week into this epidemic.

Numero Uno; how accurate is this test? Does it give a positive for all coronaviruses for example. That dose that was doing the rounds just after christmas, IIRC that was another coronavirus, albeit a harmless if irritating one. Would this test give a positive for this WuFlu? Would the test give a positive for other coronaviruses or is it very specific?

My reasoning such as it is, is that if we consider this test(one that was by necessity rushed to market) is giving false positives and possibly negatives it might explain the apparently oddball nature of this particular virus. The ever increasing incubation period(almost by day, up to 40 days now IIRC?) before symptoms, those people who are asymptomatic, or those who have very few symptoms, or a bit of a sniffle for a week and it's over. Then compared to those who come down with very serious illness. Sure it tends to hit the elderly more, but it's also killing young healthy and fit people.

Something about this virus, its virulence, strong transmissibility and how it's operating just doesn't make sense to me at the moment. However if the test isn't accurate and is giving false positives/negatives that makes much more sense. IE more people could be diagnosed as sick with this but aren't and they just recover from a non threatening bug that's in the population anyway. People aren't actually showing weeks long incubation periods, but are showing that they're triggering a false positive and some might actually get the real thing weeks down the line, while others don't.

So TL;DR? How actually accurate is this text for the WuFlu?

saabsaab · 12-02-2020 05:07PM

Australia is well prepared. We have plans that we are adapting as we learn more about the virus and how it spreads.
Australian Government agencies and state and territory governments are working together to coordinate an evidence-based response. This includes:

providing information in English and Chinese based on the latest medical advice, including through Facebook, Twitter, Weibo, WeChat and Chinese newspapers
applying a 14-day isolation period to people at risk of getting coronavirus
applying travel restrictions to reduce the number of travellers from mainland China
organising assisted departure for Australian citizens in Wuhan
tracing coronavirus cases
continuing to screen travellers who arrive in Australia
continuing with border surveillance
applying enhanced border measures at international air and sea ports, including announcements and signs

State and territory health authorities are:

testing anyone who shows symptoms of the virus
monitoring close contacts of confirmed cases every day

ohnonotgmail · 12-02-2020 05:13PM

Wibbs wrote: »

Well... maybe W.

Now this may be well outa left field, but.. I've been thinking on this and in particular the test for this coronavirus. I have a few questions, questions that keep getting louder for me with every passing week into this epidemic.

Numero Uno; how accurate is this test? Does it give a positive for all coronaviruses for example. That dose that was doing the rounds just after christmas, IIRC that was another coronavirus, albeit a harmless if irritating one. Would this test give a positive for this WuFlu? Would the test give a positive for other coronaviruses or is it very specific?

My reasoning such as it is, is that if we consider this test(one that was by necessity rushed to market) is giving false positives and possibly negatives it might explain the apparently oddball nature of this particular virus. The ever increasing incubation period(almost by day, up to 40 days now IIRC?) before symptoms, those people who are asymptomatic, or those who have very few symptoms, or a bit of a sniffle for a week and it's over. Then compared to those who come down with very serious illness. Sure it tends to hit the elderly more, but it's also killing young healthy and fit people.

Something about this virus, its virulence, strong transmissibility and how it's operating just doesn't make sense to me at the moment. However if the test isn't accurate and is giving false positives/negatives that makes much more sense. IE more people could be diagnosed as sick with this but aren't and they just recover from a non threatening bug that's in the population anyway. People aren't actually showing weeks long incubation periods, but are showing that they're triggering a false positive and some might actually get the real thing weeks down the line, while others don't.

So TL;DR? How actually accurate is this text for the WuFlu?

The short answer seems to be that the test is not very accurate at all.

According to the South China Morning Post

The test, first developed during the Sars outbreak, extracts nucleic acid from a sample of the patient’s mucus taken from their nose or throat to determine if the virus is present. The nucleic acid contains the genetic information of the virus, which can then be identified in a lab via either biochemical reaction or gene sequencing. The whole process takes just hours.

However, since the test involves several steps, a mistake at any one stage could affect the outcome, Li Yan, head of the diagnostic centre at the People’s Hospital of Wuhan University, said in an interview with state broadcaster CCTV on Sunday.

The accuracy rate of the test is only 30 to 50 per cent, said Wang Chen, president of the Chinese Academy of Medical Sciences, during a CCTV interview on Wednesday.

Given the nature of the test it will also lead to false negatives in the early stages of infection. There just wont enough of the virus to detect.

RebelButtMunch · 12-02-2020 05:19PM

wakka12 wrote: »

I agree, does certainly seem that way. Does anyone know if thats a common thing, where the I dont know what youd call it 'higher concentration' of the virus passed to you has a bigger impact? Or does it not matter to your body what the quantity is?

Please consult your horoscope. That's the territory your heading to...

odyssey06 · 12-02-2020 05:24PM

RebelButtMunch wrote: »

Please consult your horoscope. That's the territory your heading to...

It's a reasonable question. And here's an explanation of sorts from a medical professional.

https://www.straitstimes.com/singapo...led-whos-fight
How severe the illness in a person is depends both on the person's own immune system, as well as how large the viral load is when the person is infected. If someone who is very sick sneezes or coughs in the person's face, the viral load could be high.
(according to Professor David Heymann, who headed the WHO response to SARS)

Wibbs · 12-02-2020 05:28PM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

The short answer seems to be that the test is not very accurate at all.

30-50% isn't very accurate alright O. This could explain quite a bit of the oddball stuff about this virus. For a start the quite wildly differing outcomes between "feel fine/bit of a sniffle" to ICU and/or pine box due to an overwhelming onslaught on the lungs/cytokine storm.

If you compare it to SARS or MERS it's quite different. In SARS the vast majority had quite clear and serious symptoms and shorter incubation and resolution and fatality periods. In MERS it was the same, if not more so. 75% of patients required intubation ventilation. Both were far more consistent in mechanism(?) even in the middle of the outbreaks and concern.

With this dose the differences are far more stark and so far outside of China and Chinese folks those differences are even starker. Much lower death rate for a start. Even the UK "superspreader"(which sounds like a porn category

) has recovered and feels fine and reports the dose as not much of one. If he is indeed one such case of a highly infectious individual he must have had some level of virus being produced in him and yet...

Between China's reticence with facts and an inefficient test and general panic and conjecture something is not adding up for me at all.

ObiTwoKenobi · 12-02-2020 05:31PM

Wading in here to repeat the suggestion that it will be the progression of cases outside China that may offer the best insight to the real nature of the virus re rates of infection, recovery and death.

RebelButtMunch · 12-02-2020 05:36PM

ObiTwoKenobi wrote: »

Wading in here to repeat the suggestion that it will be the progression of cases outside China that may offer the best insight to the real nature of the virus re rates of infection, recovery and death.

I'd agree. Not many other places would be able to lockdown citizens like China did.

ardinn · 12-02-2020 05:36PM

Just going back to the tumeric debate - its something I have been looking at and stocking up slowly on.

Tumeric is a natural anti inflammatory - the pneumonia caused by CV inflames the (some medical term here) in the lungs. During the virus should you have it, the end of week one would be a good time to start taking a good dose of it along with some ibuprofen.

Reduce the inflammation - reduce the need for oxygen - reduce the need for hospitalisation.

It is a very small but simple step that may help recovery or or stop the onset of serious complications.

Im gonna chance it anyway! Definately wont kill me!

ardinn · 12-02-2020 05:38PM

ObiTwoKenobi wrote: »

Wading in here to repeat the suggestion that it will be the progression of cases outside China that may offer the best insight to the real nature of the virus re rates of infection, recovery and death.

Currently the best experiment is on the ship in japan. And i believe that is a worst case scenario situation.

The prison in England will be the next experiment!

car_radio19834 · 12-02-2020 05:41PM

Markets in US still hitting all time highs. They seem unfazed by this.

ardinn · 12-02-2020 05:41PM

And also also

To completely reduce inflammation in the body - go on a carnivore diet. Green veg and meat - stay below 10g of carbs a day - Something I do sporadically, the trick is to go keto.

You would be amazed the difference in your joints when you reintroduce bread or spuds or pasta - similar to what getting hit by a truck feels like.

ObiTwoKenobi · 12-02-2020 05:42PM

Has anyone seen the "Andology" channel on YouToob. Seems crazy to me. He has a prediction tool, available for download, that is predicting millions dead by the summer. He is also advocating a prepper approach, boarding up your house, and arming yourself against the looters.

lolanacho · 12-02-2020 05:43PM

A student from my child’s classroom has just came back to school today after spending the last two months in China with his grandparents.

Apparently the teacher was talking to all the kids yesterday regarding this pupil but never mentioned he’d be in today. The teacher was reassuring the kids that this pupil was ok because he was in Central China and were virus free over there!

The school haven’t informed the parents about our children sharing a classroom with someone who has just came back from China, following the advice from the HSE the child doesn’t have to stay at home for 14 days.

Now, this child has a younger brother who attends the same school but who didn’t go to China, he stayed in Ireland with his parents.
I’ve just found out that the parents are keeping the brothers separated from each other for a couple of weeks so they are not sharing the same house, car etc at the moment. The child that came back from China is at the moment living with his grandparents, if virus free he’ll go back to his parents in two weeks.

I understand they are concerned about him passing something onto his younger brother...... but they don’t give a crap about sending him to school and sharing a classroom with another 26 children!

I’m thinking about talking to the Principal tomorrow and keep my child at home for two weeks.

Any advise? Thanks

new coronavirus outbreak China, Korea, USA - mod warnings in OP (updated 24/02/20)

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