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American vs Irish police officers

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  • 05-02-2020 7:57am
    #1
    mr_fegelien
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,483 ✭✭✭


    I've never understood the stereotype of police in the U.S. being donught eating pigs when in fact, they are in some ways more effective than Irish police officers in terms of policing.

    Now, don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want a harsh judicial system like that here but when you watch a show like Live PD on YouTube, you see how they make the Gardai look like kids with batons.

    How many guards would run a mile to chase a suspect. But I suppose from their point of view, there's no need when you don't even have any weapons.


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    #2
    Samuel T. Cogley
    Registered Users Posts: 10,684 ✭✭✭✭Samuel T. Cogley


    The US cops are such a diverse bunch. Some of the rural lads make our average guard look like a genius.


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    #3
    olestoepoke
    Registered Users Posts: 2,386 ✭✭✭olestoepoke


    I lived in NY for 15 years and the difference I noticed is that you never see the Garda in Ireland compared to their presence in the US. Are we under policed? It could be weeks before I catch a glimpse of a Guard.


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    #4
    1o059k7ewrqj3n
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,779 ✭✭✭1o059k7ewrqj3n


    mr_fegelien wrote: »

    How many guards would run a mile to chase a suspect. But I suppose from their point of view, there's no need when you don't even have any weapons.

    Guards have been shot and run over in this country, and regularly punched, kicked and are spat at in the face.


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    #5
    The_Kew_Tour
    Registered Users Posts: 34,056 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    You don’t even need to go as far as America. Look at England. The English Police force are on another level compared to Garda here. Their Presence, Professionalism, Manner, are on a way different level.

    Say a fight breaks out on Saturday night in nightclub for example. Here you be lucky to get 2 Garda here in space of 30 minutes and situation could last how long, over in UK they are at the scene within minutes, in big numbers and situation is dealt with in swift and professional manner and no passengers taken


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    #6
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,159 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    US policing is hugely decentralised, and professional and training standards vary enormously. You can take it for granted that a show like Live PD, which is made with the co-operation of the police departments involved, is highly selective and is only showing you material that the police departments would like you to see.

    The US is more heavily policed than Ireland - 298 police officers per 100,00 people in the US, as opposed to 265 in Ireland - but that statistic tells us nothing about the relative effectiveness or efficiency of US and Irish officers. Crime rates in Ireland are generally lower than in the US, which might suggest that Irish policing is more efficient, but of course that statistic is affected by a great many factors other than efficiency of police operations.


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    #7
    Montage of Feck
    Registered Users Posts: 3,527 ✭✭✭Montage of Feck


    Thankfully I don't to worry about being shot 23 times by the Guards after being pulled over for something innocuous. But anyway wikipedia states there are 17,985 different police agencies in the USA.

    🙈🙉🙊



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    #8
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users Posts: 26,159 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    Montage of Feck wrote: »
    Thankfully I don't to worry about being shot 23 times by the Guards after being pulled over for something innocuous.
    Like I say, "professional and training standards vary enormously". That's kind of a problem if police officers are to be armed.


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    #9
    Salary Negotiator
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,148 ✭✭✭Salary Negotiator


    I wouldn’t be a fan of the shoot first, lie and cover-up second policy that many US PDs seem to operate under.

    We have our own issues, too much depends on getting a decent or interested Garda when reporting less serious crimes but I wouldn’t want to replace our force with a US type force.

    Except maybe on the roads, flood the motorways with traffic police and adopt a zero tolerance attitude to help improve driving standards.


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    #10
    Woke Hogan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭Woke Hogan


    The Guards in Ireland are far from perfect themselves but at least we don’t suffer from the kind of despicable and evil institutionalised racism you see in the US.

    What’s funny to me, though, is that you can slag off the Guards to your heart’s content here but any comparison with them and those jackbooted fascists over in the States can only be negative in casual conversation.

    There was an “ask me anything” discussion on this website a few months ago where an American policeman fielded questions from the users. Any dissent and the bootlickers came out in force with their pathetic “we’re just having a bit of craic” bleating.

    I wonder how many people here fantasise about implementing some of the tough policing from the States: having to call policemen “sir” like a serf to his lord, praising their shooting of a fleeing suspect in the back for having a trace of melanin in his pigmentation, turning another cheek to their police going home and viciously beating their wives. American police are scum.


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    #11
    KaneToad
    Registered Users Posts: 3,182 ✭✭✭KaneToad


    mr_fegelien wrote: »
    I've never understood the stereotype of police in the U.S. being donught eating pigs when in fact, they are in some ways more effective than Irish police officers in terms of policing.
    ..

    What's your measure of effectiveness? How good the US cops look on TV and in the movies??


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    #12
    Graces7
    Registered Users Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    Would not live in or even visit the US if you paid me. Trigger happy police. I have almost always had good experiences when a Garda was needed here, The one exception was extraordinary! Was very glad he was not armed.


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    #13
    Winning_Stroke
    Closed Accounts Posts: 224 ✭✭Winning_Stroke


    American vs Irish police officers

    Yanks would win hands down.


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    #14
    Badly Drunk Boy
    Registered Users Posts: 6,477 ✭✭✭Badly Drunk Boy


    KaneToad wrote: »
    What's your measure of effectiveness? How good the US cops look on TV and in the movies??
    Extra points if they're good-looking?


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    #15
    nkl12xtw5goz70
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,497 ✭✭✭nkl12xtw5goz70


    Woke Hogan wrote: »
    What’s funny to me, though, is that you can slag off the Guards to your heart’s content here but any comparison with them and those jackbooted fascists over in the States can only be negative in casual conversation.

    Irish Americans have long dominated US police departments on the East Coast, particularly the NYPD, whose current police commissioner is Dermot Shea. The name says it all — he's the son of two Irish emigrants. So many of these so-called "jackbooted fascists" have often originated from right here.


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    #16
    Duffy the Vampire Slayer
    Registered Users Posts: 5,378 ✭✭✭Duffy the Vampire Slayer


    Trenton Deep Gladiator wrote: »
    Irish Americans have long dominated US police departments on the East Coast, particularly the NYPD, whose current police commissioner is Dermot Shea. The name says it all — he's the son of two Irish emigrants. So many of these so-called "jackbooted fascists" have often originated from right here.

    Irish Americans are often an embarrassment.


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    #17
    steves2
    Registered Users Posts: 284 ✭✭steves2


    Unfortunately I've been the victim of crime recently and so have talked with the guards quite a bit, the ones I've come across really are down to earth, sympathetic and easy to get along with. I think they're seriously under resourced hence you never see them around. Can't remember the last time I seen a guard on foot except to hop into a car. I don't think Irish people are serious on crime, we say it's terrible etc etc but allow governments to close down stations and don't make a big deal of it. Would not want the American style police force over here though, that's the other side of the coin and it actually doesn't seem to prevent crime given the crime rates.


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    #18
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Most local sherriffs in the US are the guy who won a popular vote. They give him a badge, a gun, a budget and the right to apply the law as he sees fit, with no legal or police training.

    Taken as a whole, the Gardai look like elite special forces compared to US cops.


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    #19
    Xertz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,069 ✭✭✭Xertz


    The best approach would be to work on developing what we have. The Gardaí have had their issues, and they’re under resourced and often not visible enough but by and large our approach to policing is pretty good in Ireland.

    In comparison, a lot of countries, notably the US but plenty of continental countries too, have police forces that are all about heavy handed enforcement.

    We need more resources tackling organised crime and that would trickle down to reducing the drugs issues.

    Also more visible presence on the streets and in public transit would solve a lot of the thuggish stuff that crops up.

    Beyond that I think they do a pretty decent job and suit the culture here. Despite what you read on forums like this, I can’t see Irish people welcoming heavy handed policing like you see in parts of the continent and the US.
    Culturally we are definitely more comfortable with the laid back approach.


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    #20
    whisky_galore
    Registered Users Posts: 15,854 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »
    Irish Americans are often an embarrassment.

    Yep. Tooralooraloora.


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    #21
    Woke Hogan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭Woke Hogan


    Trenton Deep Gladiator wrote: »
    Irish Americans have long dominated US police departments on the East Coast, particularly the NYPD, whose current police commissioner is Dermot Shea. The name says it all — he's the son of two Irish emigrants. So many of these so-called "jackbooted fascists" have often originated from right here.
    Irish Americans are dewy eyed maudlin sops who also love to perpetuate the "we were slaves too" myth in order to devalue the black man's experiences in the US. So I couldn't give a **** about Irish Americans.


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    #22
    WrenBoy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,614 ✭✭✭WrenBoy


    Woke Hogan wrote: »
    Irish Americans are dewy eyed maudlin sops who also love to perpetuate the "we were slaves too" myth in order to devalue the black man's experiences in the US. So I couldn't give a **** about Irish Americans.

    Any bites today ?


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    #23
    EmmetSpiceland
    Registered Users Posts: 10,563 ✭✭✭✭EmmetSpiceland


    Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »
    Irish Americans are often an embarrassment.

    Some people want to give them the right to vote in “presidential” elections. Can you imagine that?

    “It is not blood that makes you Irish but a willingness to be part of the Irish nation” - Thomas Davis



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    #24
    Woke Hogan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭Woke Hogan


    WrenBoy wrote: »
    Any bites today ?
    Excuse me?


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    #25
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 11,614 ✭ [Deleted User]


    mr_fegelien wrote: »
    I've never understood the stereotype of police in the U.S. being donught eating pigs when in fact, they are in some ways more effective than Irish police officers in terms of policing.

    Now, don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want a harsh judicial system like that here but when you watch a show like Live PD on YouTube, you see how they make the Gardai look like kids with batons.

    How many guards would run a mile to chase a suspect. But I suppose from their point of view, there's no need when you don't even have any weapons.

    I would.

    I was talking to a taxi driver in Vegas. Her son was doing 5 years in the slammer. The sum of his crimes were:

    Stole a car - strike 1
    Caught with an 8-ball of blow - Strike 2
    Stole a DVD from a shop - Strike 3, go directly to jail, mandatory minimum 5 years.

    Sounds harsh, but if you had 2 strikes against you, why the flip would you risk jail to steal a DVD?

    Meanwhile in Dublin, Anto is wandering around Crumlin with 56 convictions.


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    #26
    Quantum Erasure
    Registered Users Posts: 8,267 ✭✭✭Quantum Erasure


    Winning_Stroke wrote: »
    Yanks would win hands down.

    Hands Up!


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    #27
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    I've come to the conclusion that there are people who are literally incapable of distinguishing between some and all. Not just on the right, but people who ironically complain about racism at the same time.
    EmmetSpiceland wrote: »
    Some people want to give them the right to vote in “presidential” elections. Can you imagine that?
    Jaysus, the anti Irish WASP crowd would have been saying that. But that kinda prejudice is ok.


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    #28
    Quantum Erasure
    Registered Users Posts: 8,267 ✭✭✭Quantum Erasure


    WrenBoy wrote: »
    Any bites today ?

    There's one...


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    #29
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I would.

    I was talking to a taxi driver in Vegas. Her son was doing 5 years in the slammer. The sum of his crimes were:
    The 3 strikes rule neither reduces crime or reoffending rates.

    Like all harsh penal systems, it's based on the fallacy that the only reason people don't commit crimes is because of the risk of punishment.

    That's not the reality; people don't burgle houses, because they don't want to. People who burgle houses, want to. The risk of capture is merely a hindrance, nit a deterrent.

    All the 3 strikes rule actually does is fill prisons up with poor people. It's popular in the US because prisons are private and get paid by head. So the US system is not interested in preventing crime, its primary motivation is getting people into prisons for profit.


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    #30
    CrankyHaus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,281 ✭✭✭CrankyHaus


    Irish and American policing are totally different: in culture, method, equipment, resources and threat environment.

    A better comparison would be Irish to UK policing, as our policing model comes from the Peelian Principles that UK forces were based on and probably best exemplify today. Essentially it is the idea that policing must be by the consent and support of the community with restraint of force by the police.

    The US model of increasingly militarised policing through force is not remotely attractive. But people criticising it from Ireland ignore the vastly different threat environment in the US. With the prevalence of guns and high crime rates over there any encounter can turn into a fatal shooting so police who value their lives have to adopt a more defensive approach that puts the lethal use of force on a hair trigger.


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    #31
    Witcher
    Registered Users Posts: 14,525 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I would.

    I was talking to a taxi driver in Vegas. Her son was doing 5 years in the slammer. The sum of his crimes were:

    Stole a car - strike 1
    Caught with an 8-ball of blow - Strike 2
    Stole a DVD from a shop - Strike 3, go directly to jail, mandatory minimum 5 years.

    Sounds harsh, but if you had 2 strikes against you, why the flip would you risk jail to steal a DVD?

    Meanwhile in Dublin, Anto is wandering around Crumlin with 56 convictions.

    But your anecdote is evidence that it actually doesn't work so why would we implement it?

    You argued against your own point.


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