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Ireland Team Talk XI: Team of nervoUS MOD warning Post 1

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    #3182
    AbusesToilets
    Registered Users Posts: 10,010 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Clegg wrote: »
    We've a conundrum in the backrow. It's clear that our starting trio of POM, VDF and Stander didnt work well at the World Cup. Stander has played pretty well for Munster since returning and VDF is playing the best rugby of anyone in Ireland right now. I'd say PoM deserves dropping, but so many people are advocating his credentials as a captain. The next problem is that if he's not starting it's pointless having him as a sub so he's out of the 23 altogether. Don't know if Farrell would be brave enough for that.

    I'd go a bit left field and move Stander to 6 and bring Doris right in. Do what Schmidt did in 2017/18 and parachute the young guns straight into the side. If you're good enough, lack of experience doesn't matter

    Here's a wild idea, how about they accept the reality in front our faces and pick the backrow that performs week in, week out.

    Ruddock VDF Doris/ Deegan

    That's it. Stander remains what he's always been, a physical player, with limited ball skills.


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    #3183
    salmocab
    Registered Users Posts: 11,297 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    Felix Jones is God. wrote: »
    Only in boards posters eyes.... in Joe's and Andy's eyes he's been a demigod, and that's all that matters

    Loathe as I am to get involved in this debate we don’t know what Andy thinks yet.
    Personally I think the back row lacks balance it’s not particularly the individuals but the collective that hasn’t functioned. Heaslip was the Jedi prophecy and it was he that brought balance to the force/backrow.


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    #3184
    Interested Observer
    Registered Users Posts: 13,021 ✭✭✭✭Interested Observer


    I think Doris could make the extended squad at this rate.


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    #3185
    troyzer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,199 ✭✭✭troyzer


    Interested Observer wrote: »
    I think Doris could make the extended squad at this rate.

    I think he'll start at least against Italy.


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    #3186
    theVersatile
    Registered Users Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭theVersatile


    Were talking about POM and Beirne getting outmuscled and being too light yet we want to throw Dorris straight into the starting team? Deegan has some meat on him atleast but Doris is lean and would get thrown around at international level.


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    #3187
    Bazzo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,047 ✭✭✭Bazzo


    theVersatile wrote: »
    Were talking about POM and Beirne getting outmuscled and being too light yet we want to throw Dorris straight into the starting team? Deegan has some meat on him atleast but Doris is lean and would get thrown around at international level.

    Where are you getting that from? Looks totally comfortable at European level.


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    #3188
    Interested Observer
    Registered Users Posts: 13,021 ✭✭✭✭Interested Observer


    theVersatile wrote: »
    Were talking about POM and Beirne getting outmuscled and being too light yet we want to throw Dorris straight into the starting team? Deegan has some meat on him atleast but Doris is lean and would get thrown around at international level.

    Really don't agree with this at all, he's been very abrasive. He carried for about 130m in the past two games.


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    #3189
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    salmocab wrote: »
    Loathe as I am to get involved in this debate we don’t know what Andy thinks yet.
    Personally I think the back row lacks balance it’s not particularly the individuals but the collective that hasn’t functioned. Heaslip was the Jedi prophecy and it was he that brought balance to the force/backrow.


    Heaslip was a huge loss.....one which was filled by the Leavy so it wasn't noticed. When both Leavy and Heaslip where gone then the s**t hit the fan


    Anyone that thinks a back row of POM/VDF/Stander is going to work going forward is completely mad. I said it prior to the WC we would lose with that backrow.....

    I don't know if Doris or Deegan is the answer. Or moving Stander to 6. I think at this stage the only player who is certain to start if fit and still in form is VDF. Then you build players around him to get a balanced back row.

    Nobody has mentioned Ruddock who has been incredible this season so far and is a monster. Something we need against the English/French back rows.


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    #3190
    Dubinusa
    Registered Users Posts: 8,224 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Heaslip was a huge loss.....one which was filled by the Leavy so it wasn't noticed. When both Leavy and Heaslip where gone then the s**t hit the fan


    Anyone that thinks a back row of POM/VDF/Stander is going to work going forward is completely mad. I said it prior to the WC we would lose with that backrow.....

    I don't know if Doris or Deegan is the answer. Or moving Stander to 6. I think at this stage the only player who is certain to start if fit and still in form is VDF. Then you build players around him to get a balanced back row.

    Nobody has mentioned Ruddock who has been incredible this season so far and is a monster. Something we need against the English/French back rows.

    I've pushed Ruddock! Easily the best in form 6 for quite a while now! Offers brute strength, speed and skill. In fact, he would take some of the load off Stander and Healy! His defense is top notch. He's capable at the line out and is a good leader.
    I wouldn't be surprised to see Nordi getting some minutes either. He in turn has a huge upside, plays all 3 positions, has experience and is a really good player.


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    #3191
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Dubinusa wrote: »
    I've pushed Ruddock! Easily the best in form 6 for quite a while now! Offers brute strength, speed and skill. In fact, he would take some of the load off Stander and Healy! His defense is top notch. He's capable at the line out and is a good leader.
    I wouldn't be surprised to see Nordi getting some minutes either. He in turn has a huge upside, plays all 3 positions, has experience and is a really good player.

    Nordi best position is 7, I think he is quality as well. When he started the NZ game he was the answer to 7, that injury opened up the door to VDF....I still like him and he is best option on bench because he can cover all positions

    Ruddock is a man beast, it would have been jnteresting if we got SA in qtr I would have expected him to start

    I do think we have quality players and lots of them, just need to figure out what best combination is


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    #3192
    stephen_n
    Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    theVersatile wrote: »
    Were talking about POM and Beirne getting outmuscled and being too light yet we want to throw Dorris straight into the starting team? Deegan has some meat on him atleast but Doris is lean and would get thrown around at international level.

    He’s 3kg’s lighter than Deegan, not a huge amount and at 106kg’s he’s only a kg lighter than POM


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    #3193
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    theVersatile wrote: »
    Were talking about POM and Beirne getting outmuscled and being too light yet we want to throw Dorris straight into the starting team? Deegan has some meat on him atleast but Doris is lean and would get thrown around at international level.

    Without in anyway discussing his chances for a call up nor comparing him to Beirne or POM, Dorris has pretty formidable stopping power. His excellent tackle stats are genuinely only half the story, he works very hard to be in the right place and he is properly solid in contact. He added plenty of physicality and urgency to our defence. I think the conversation has shifted from Doris v Deegan to Doris v Conan.

    For the sake of clarity - absolutely none of this had anything to do with Peter O'Mahony.


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    #3194
    troyzer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,199 ✭✭✭troyzer


    Midi Olympique are reporting that Sexton has been approached by Lyon who are looking to buy out the last year of his contract.


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    #3195
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    troyzer wrote: »
    Midi Olympique are reporting that Sexton has been approached by Lyon who are looking to buy out the last year of his contract.

    Meh. He owes us nothing. If he wants to get well paid for his last year or two instead of winning silverware then I've no issue with that.

    He obviously made an impression in the away fixture. Confirms my impression that he is playing first class rugby at the moment, despite what happened at the World Cup.


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    #3196
    Squidgy Black
    Registered Users Posts: 21,609 ✭✭✭✭Squidgy Black


    troyzer wrote: »
    Midi Olympique are reporting that Sexton has been approached by Lyon who are looking to buy out the last year of his contract.

    Would be shocked if it happened, mostly because I don't think the IRFU would be keen to set a precedent saying central contracts can be bought out if big clubs coming banging on the door.


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    #3197
    Clegg
    Registered Users Posts: 16,789 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    I wonder would Sexton be keen to leave a second time. His time at Racing wasn't very successful and Lyon don't play a brand of rugby that he'd be keen on. Suppose it all comes down to money though.


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    #3198
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Clegg wrote: »
    I wonder would Sexton be keen to leave a second time. His time at Racing wasn't very successful and Lyon don't play a brand of rugby that he'd be keen on. Suppose it all comes down to money though.


    I said on leinster thread


    He has mentioned a few times when him and Misses left they had no kids. Young and free. They had a kid over in Paris, I think when he was still in France he done an interview saying how hard it was with no grandparents etc


    I think they have a few now.....I doubt he has any interest in going to France unless he leaves the family here and commutes over and back. Seemingly Pinear was doing it from Belfast to Montpellier and I know DOC was doing it when in England.



    Would Sexton really need the money? also in Lyon does he really have the chance of winning the Top 14?



    I think his time was ok, Racing wanted to sign him again and offered him huge money. When he didn't resign then the French took the hump. All sorts came out after that. Before when they wanted him to stay it was all rosy


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    #3199
    yerrahbah
    Registered Users Posts: 1,366 ✭✭✭yerrahbah


    https://twitter.com/CianTracey1/status/1206593203513806848


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    #3200
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    The big question is who is not in the squad

    Rob Kearney is the big name for me not on thelist

    Anyone else?


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    #3201
    Felix Jones is God.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 93 ✭✭Felix Jones is God.


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    The big question is who is not in the squad

    Rob Kearney is the big name for me not on thelist

    Anyone else?

    Jordi Murphy and John Ryan are out?


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    #3202
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,191 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    A few international careers ended. Rob Kearney, John Ryan, Sean Cronin....Marmion possibly completely out of the reckoning?

    Curious that Sexton is there and Beirne isn't. Sexton clearly has a big part to play for Farrell.


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    #3203
    irelandrover
    Registered Users Posts: 3,704 ✭✭✭irelandrover


    Why is Carty not in the squad?


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    #3204
    Bazzo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,047 ✭✭✭Bazzo


    Buer wrote: »
    A few international careers ended. Rob Kearney, John Ryan, Sean Cronin....Marmion possibly completely out of the reckoning?

    Curious that Sexton is there and Beirne isn't. Sexton clearly has a big part to play for Farrell.

    Doubt Marmion is completely out of the reckoning. Has been injured and Blade has been lighting it up in his absence, wouldn't make sense to include him ahead of Blade and there are already 45 scrum halves in the squad there. Marmion has been around for so long that people tend to forget he's only a year older than McGrath.
    irelandrover wrote: »
    Why is Carty not in the squad?

    Hasn't hit the form of pre world cup again yet.. I'd back him to work his way back into form and consideration though, overall he's shown a lot of mental fortitude throughout his career.


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    #3205
    LuckyGent88
    Registered Users Posts: 14,150 ✭✭✭✭LuckyGent88


    Burns over Carty!!! Not a hope of have that anyway.

    Would have thought Jack O Donoghue would get a spot in the squad.


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    #3206
    thomond2006
    Registered Users Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Dave Heffernan
    Rob Herring
    Niall Scannell
    Ronan Kelleher

    Dave Kilcoyne
    Cian Healy

    Andrew Porter
    Tadhg Furlong
    Marty Moore
    Tom O’Toole

    Ultan Dillane
    Iain Henderson
    Jean Kleyn
    Quinn Roux
    James Ryan
    Devin Toner

    Will Connors,
    Max Deegan
    Caelan Doris
    Peter O’Mahony
    Josh van der Flier
    Rhys Ruddock
    CJ Stander

    Caolin Blade
    John Cooney
    Jamison Gibson Park
    Luke McGrath
    Conor Murray

    Billy Burns
    Ross Byrne
    Joey Carbery,
    Jonathan Sexton

    Bundee Aki
    Chris Farrell
    Robbie Henshaw
    Stuart McCloskey
    Garry Ringrose
    Rory Scannell

    Will Addison
    Andrew Conway
    Keith Earls
    Mike Haley
    Dave Kearney
    Jordan Larmour
    Jacob Stockdale

    RWC squad members not named: Sean Cronin, Rory Best (retired), John Ryan (injured/tbc), Tadhg Beirne (injured), Jack Conan (injured), Jordi Murphy, Jack Carty, Rob Kearney


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    #3207
    errlloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 12,603 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    Buer wrote: »
    A few international careers ended. Rob Kearney, John Ryan, Sean Cronin....Marmion possibly completely out of the reckoning?

    Curious that Sexton is there and Beirne isn't. Sexton clearly has a big part to play for Farrell.

    I suspect injuries are ruling people out. Including Cronin and Beirne.


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    #3208
    Granny15
    Registered Users Posts: 1,129 ✭✭✭Granny15


    errlloyd wrote: »
    I suspect injuries are ruling people out. Including Cronin and Beirne.

    They're not ruling out Carbery or Sexton.


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    #3209
    errlloyd
    Registered Users Posts: 12,603 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    thomond2006 wrote: »
    Tom O’Toole
    Dave Kilcoyne
    Cian Healy

    Tom O Toole is a tighthead.


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    #3210
    Zzippy
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,166 Mod ✭✭✭✭Zzippy


    Well I think we know who gave Joe the nudge to pick McGrath over Marmion now.

    I suppose it is just a one day "stocktake" but good to see a lot of young guys being brought into the squad. Paul Boyle can feel hard done by from a Connacht perspective but back row is a very competitive area.


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    #3211
    Dubinusa
    Registered Users Posts: 8,224 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Nordi? What the hell?


This discussion has been closed.
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