Dee Forbes banging the RTE TV licence drum again 60m uncollected fee poll not working - pl ignore

James Brown · 11-12-2019 04:25PM

Stovepipe wrote: »

It isn't all about management failures; the RTE unions have a role in this too. No shortage of jobsworths there. Why do you think so many RTE programmes are made by third-party companies? Cheaper, non-union soeasier to work with and, cynically, easier to blame if something goes wrong. In my very, very limited association with film and TV work, the independent companies hate working with RTE permanent staff because of the unions, especially some of the technical staff. Getting a contract to make a show for RTE is regarded as good money but, as one friend in the business said to me, do as much of it as you can yourself without involving RTE staff, as the union rules will kill you. Look what's happened now; the journalists and broadcasters are at each others throats, despite being all in the same NUJ chapter, working in the same offices, eating in the same canteen,etc, all because of the huge payscales given to the top twelve. Dee Forbes has been given a poisoned chalice and she knows it and the politicals are trying to get the boot in, given half the chance.

Because the Arts Minister at the time, Michael D. Higgins, ensured RTE start putting contracts for new or renewed programming out to public tender.
That's when all the RTE heads went out and formed their own independent production companies.
Bill O'Herlihy owned the company produced his shows. Same with Pat Kenny and many many others.
Unions play a role in ensuring their members are looked after. The unions don't work for us and have no remit to consider us. You may as well be giving out that the Catholic Girl guides only look after the affairs of the Catholic Girl guides.

Forbes ain't going to do **** for the tax payer. She's not there to look after us either.

*EDIT*
Forgot to add, these 'private' companies use the same unionised production staff such as cameramen, sound, lighting.

Brendan Bendar · 11-12-2019 05:34PM

Stovepipe wrote: »

The top earners are essentially contractors and could be dropped at a moment's notice. They've done it before. Of all the earners, in the publicly well known faces, people like Mary Wilson earn well below that paid to the senior management and even well below that of the rest of the high earners. I'd justify keeping her any day. Another thing cropped up with the retirement of Mary Kennedy; it turns out she was a contractor and the station basically forced her to become staff 15 years ago, along with a few other well-known TV and radio names. She didnt want to, as being a freelancer suited her, but some accountant won the battle and she became staff. The option given, allegedly, was "become staff or be cast aside". No choice there then, but a widely disliked move because it left them with a very small RTE pension and no choice but to pay into it. Bit of a thoughtless move by some grey suit.

Happens to people in jobs every week, only in the pvt. sector it’s out the door and on your own.

The ordinary person hasn’t the luxury of being a contractor or staff.

There are plenty of people on small pensions so forgive me if I haven’t total sympathy with the issues in RTE.

If the company feels its more advantageous to have folk on staff, then that’s how it goes.

A company isn’t set up to aggrandize the staff, there are obligations to the shareholder, in this case JQ Taxpayer.

Regarding Ms Wilson and her pay, is it linked to senior management?

If she is not happy, then go into senior management.

This rubbish is annoying and while the top presenters should be paid well, no problem with that, the levels of pay are way above what would seem fair and commensurate with output and responsibility.

mgn · 11-12-2019 05:38PM

https://www.rte.ie/news/2019/1211/1098534-rte-lyric/

Just goes to show RTE is only a Government mouthpiece, you scratch my back and we will scratch yours.

I suppose Richard Bruton will be on the news now 5 times a week instead of 4.

elperello · 11-12-2019 05:48PM

mgn wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/2019/1211/1098534-rte-lyric/

Just goes to show RTE is only a Government mouthpiece, you scratch my back and we will scratch yours.

I suppose Richard Bruton will be on the news now 5 times a week instead of 4.

It only makes sense to delay the final decision pending the Commission. Not often I find myself in agreement with LV but he is right.

I thought it was a bad move in the first place considering that there was very little real saving. Also there are plans to revitalise the centre of Limerick which will involve considerable investment. Bad timing for a public service to be pulling in the opposite direction.

Expunge · 11-12-2019 07:37PM

But how are RTE executives supposed to do their jobs, whether it be good or bad, if government figures keep 'suggesting' changes to their plans? We had this a few years ago with that LW transmitter and now this with Lyric?

Lyric is essentially a collection of sound files on a computer with the odd, mostly substandard live presenter. It doesn't matter a crap where it is broadcast from. The 20 or so staff mobilised fellow luvvies into making it some life or death issue, which it is not.
The two local FG senators vying for Noonan's seat got to work and once again the RTE executives must back down. It's a great message sent out to all the self-entitled staff in RTE (which includes the Lyric staff). Get yer TDs and Senators onto and Dee will have to roll over.

NIMAN · 11-12-2019 08:02PM

elperello wrote: »

OK, it's just that you seemed to want to get rid of the four named presenters overnight.
I think better to go a bit slower rather than fire people without an idea where we are going.

I am no great fan of RTe's so-called stars, but would agree with you that they shouldn't all be fired.

They are like music and film, its very subjective. Some people like them, others don't.

But what you could do is to pay them a sensible salary. Next time contract negotiations are up, offer them a max 150k per year, take it or leave it deal.

I know we are continually told that the top 10 talent wages aren't a big contributor to the overall debt, but it would help RTe in their image with the public or man in the street, which is at rock bottom. And it of course save a hefty pile of cash every year.

end of the road · 11-12-2019 08:04PM

Expunge wrote: »

But how are RTE executives supposed to do their jobs, whether it be good or bad, if government figures keep 'suggesting' changes to their plans? We had this a few years ago with that LW transmitter and now this with Lyric?

Lyric is essentially a collection of sound files on a computer with the odd, mostly substandard live presenter. It doesn't matter a crap where it is broadcast from. The 20 or so staff mobilised fellow luvvies into making it some life or death issue, which it is not.
The two local FG senators vying for Noonan's seat got to work and once again the RTE executives must back down. It's a great message sent out to all the self-entitled staff in RTE (which includes the Lyric staff). Get yer TDs and Senators onto and Dee will have to roll over.

lyric is exactly what the license fee should be going on, all be it probably in it's original form, so quite rightly people spoke up and in turn got rte to make the correct decision to back down on any threat to close lyric.
nobody was mobilised to make it a life or death issue, rather they were mobilised to inform the station's listeners that there was a serious threat of the station potentially being lost or severely cut back.
if this is successful then brilliant for the listeners of the station, rte's radio services mostly do serve a ps remit even if the audiences may be tiny in some cases.
every station these days is a collection of sound files with some live presenters which go from anything from good to scraping the barrel. that's just life so i'm not sure why lyric should be singled out, at least it provides a service.

Stovepipe · 11-12-2019 08:25PM

Regarding the vehicles, 200k for five is probably a good deal, given that the vehicles will be fitted out like ESB off road vehicles, as mobile toolboxes for getting to difficult locations. All State and semi-State agencies are required to justify their vehicle fleet and RTE is no different. originally, the pay of the RTE staff, from top to bottom, was linked to the Civil Service, until people began to see what UK TV stars got and began to agitate for similar treatment.

SEPT 23 1989 · 11-12-2019 09:27PM

Simple solution

Contract up station in near insolvency so we are cutting your wages in half

But I have been offered more by some other stations on another small island off the west coast of Europe

That’s fine

Show us all the offers made to you and we will match them

Won’t do that

Out the door

Expunge · 11-12-2019 09:42PM

end of the road wrote: »

lyric is exactly what the license fee should be going on, all be it probably in it's original form, so quite rightly people spoke up and in turn got rte to make the correct decision to back down on any threat to close lyric.
nobody was mobilised to make it a life or death issue, rather they were mobilised to inform the station's listeners that there was a serious threat of the station potentially being lost or severely cut back.
if this is successful then brilliant for the listeners of the station, rte's radio services mostly do serve a ps remit even if the audiences may be tiny in some cases.
every station these days is a collection of sound files with some live presenters which go from anything from good to scraping the barrel. that's just life so i'm not sure why lyric should be singled out, at least it provides a service.

Yes, of course a lot (sadly not all) of Lyric's output is pure public service and merits support. Once a commitment was made to keep lyric on air, really there was little more to be said. Then the staff based locally made it about keeping lyric in Limerick City. This seems to have been a purely selfish campaign about preserving their terms and conditions and lifestyles with some guff about being embedded in that city.
It's nonsense. They should have been supported for the move or helped out the door.
That's what has happened recently in An Post, Bord na Mona and ESB. These RTE staffers see themselves as exceptional when the vast majority of them are anything but.

Brendan Bendar · 11-12-2019 10:06PM

Expunge wrote: »

Yes, of course a lot (sadly not all) of Lyric's output is pure public service and merits support. Once a commitment was made to keep lyric on air, really there was little more to be said. Then the staff based locally made it about keeping lyric in Limerick City. This seems to have been a purely selfish campaign about preserving their terms and conditions and lifestyles with some guff about being embedded in that city.
It's nonsense. They should have been supported for the move or helped out the door.
That's what has happened recently in An Post, Bord na Mona and ESB. These RTE staffers see themselves as exceptional when the vast majority of them are anything but.

Exactly the same tactic deployed when the old Health Boards were in action.

Huge deficit... what will we do?

There’s a small hospital there in Anytown, doesn’t do much but has doctors, nurses, security ,porters, upkeep, lighting heating,admin, clerical, maintenance etc..... we’ll close it down and move the workload to the district hospital 15 miles away.

Local TDs hear this........ you will in your b****x... this will cause us to lose our seats, Mary the nurse married to John the Guard will lose their nice little cushy number and we are out the door.

Leave these lads and lassies alone and sure it’s only taxpayers money anyway, clear off outa that and try somewhere else.

Cut children’s allowances or something.

kenmc · 11-12-2019 10:14PM

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

Simple solution

Contract up station in near insolvency so we are cutting your wages in half

But I have been offered more by some other stations on another small island off the west coast of Europe

That’s fine

Show us all the offers made to you and we will match them

Won’t do that

Out the door

Unfortunately, we all know there's not a hope that any station in the world would even consider taking on tubridy, Darcy, Joe etc. We're bloody stuck with them. And yet they are paid rediculous amounts of our money in case they're poached.

Pay them 40k a year each. It's not like they've got many other options of employment, can't see any of them being able to do anything else.

fritzelly · 11-12-2019 10:24PM

I'm totally bemused by the claim that the likes of Joe Duffy bring in more money than they are paid - listened to LL today, there was hardly any ads by private companies
Then when you do get a private ad you get JD spitting his utter contempt at the ad
https://www.independent.ie/entertainment/radio/can-it-be-removed-from-liveline-joe-duffy-hits-out-at-atrocious-ad-but-rt-wont-say-if-it-will-be-pulled-38088773.html

Any wonder why no one wants to pay for the ad slots.

elperello · 11-12-2019 10:34PM

fritzelly wrote: »

I'm totally bemused by the claim that the likes of Joe Duffy bring in more money than they are paid - listened to LL today, there was hardly any ads by private companies
Then when you do get a private ad you get JD spitting his utter contempt at the ad
https://www.independent.ie/entertainment/radio/can-it-be-removed-from-liveline-joe-duffy-hits-out-at-atrocious-ad-but-rt-wont-say-if-it-will-be-pulled-38088773.html

Any wonder why no one wants to pay for the ad slots.

But that ad was terrible especially during the daytime.

381,000 listeners can't all be wrong.

Nevin Parsnipp · 11-12-2019 10:37PM

NIMAN wrote: »

I am no great fan of RTe's so-called stars, but would agree with you that they shouldn't all be fired.

They are like music and film, its very subjective. Some people like them, others don't.

But what you could do is to pay them a sensible salary. Next time contract negotiations are up, offer them a max 150k per year, take it or leave it deal.

I know we are continually told that the top 10 talent wages aren't a big contributor to the overall debt, but it would help RTe in their image with the public or man in the street, which is at rock bottom. And it of course save a hefty pile of cash every year.

Lookit ! What get's peoples goat is that some Dude or Dudes has AGREED these payment levels to the so called stars...and has being paying them very substantial wedges over the past number of years.

While at the same time crying to the Govt. via the taxpayer for more money.

Everybody gets that the "Stars" salaries are only a small percentage of the overall wage bill .

But paying dudes just south of half a million euirons for at best competent performance is just not on.

The focus may be on the "Stars" but the entire RTE wage bill and expenditure needs to be looked at before spending any more taxpayers money.

fritzelly · 11-12-2019 10:47PM

elperello wrote: »

But that ad was terrible especially during the daytime.

381,000 listeners can't all be wrong.

Eight (8) complaints, one of which was probably JD - I heard the show and he riled up the listeners to agree with him

Doesn't send a good message when the host spends the whole show complaining about the ad that is trying to promote radio advertising.
Calling for it to be removed from his show - who does he think he his? Shows the attitude these presenters have - believe they are beyond reproach

elperello · 11-12-2019 10:52PM

fritzelly wrote: »

Eight (8) complaints, one of which was probably JD - I heard the show and he riled up the listeners to agree with him

Doesn't send a good message when the host spends the whole show complaining about the ad that is trying to promote radio advertising.
Calling for it to be removed from his show - who does he think he his? Shows the attitude these presenters have - believe they are beyond reproach

Sorry I phrased that post badly.

They were meant to be two separate points.

1- the ad in question was terrible especially during the day.

2- the show must be doing something right with 381,000 listeners.

NIMAN · 11-12-2019 11:04PM

Nevin Parsnipp wrote: »

Lookit ! What get's peoples goat is that some Dude or Dudes has AGREED these payment levels to the so called stars...and has being paying them very substantial wedges over the past number of years.
.

Totally with you on this.

Thing is, some of the big earners aren't actually RTe employees, but contractors.

So the next time it comes to negotiate 'the contract' that their company provides to RTe, tell them "look we were able to pay 495k last year but we're broke, and can only offer 150k this year".

Let them decide then if they want to take that deal or go to Newstalk, TV3 or wherever and get more.

With RTe employees it might be harder to make them take such a massive cut, as they probably have union rights and would only have to take whatever percentage cut the rest of RTE staff are taking.

fritzelly · 11-12-2019 11:05PM

elperello wrote: »

2- the show must be doing something right with 381,000 listeners.

363,000 at last count a month or so ago and still declining - and even at that it's just statistical figures based on a small sampling that doesn't take in to account if someone actually listened to the whole show or 5 minutes.

Atlantic Dawn · 11-12-2019 11:09PM

fritzelly wrote: »

I'm totally bemused by the claim that the likes of Joe Duffy bring in more money than they are paid - listened to LL today, there was hardly any ads by private companies
Then when you do get a private ad you get JD spitting his utter contempt at the ad
https://www.independent.ie/entertainment/radio/can-it-be-removed-from-liveline-joe-duffy-hits-out-at-atrocious-ad-but-rt-wont-say-if-it-will-be-pulled-38088773.html

Any wonder why no one wants to pay for the ad slots.

And when he basically uses his show to freely advertise his bukes without a single cent needing to be spent by the publisher on RTE you really do wonder how the money struggling organisation is run.

Nevin Parsnipp · 11-12-2019 11:09PM

elperello wrote: »

Sorry I phrased that post badly.

They were meant to be two separate points.

1- the ad in question was terrible especially during the day.

2- the show must be doing something right with 381,000 listeners.

Didn't hear the show so don't know what the ad was.

Sure the show must be doing something right ...but would it still do something right with a different presenter/s at a quarter of the salary ?

I think it would ...

elperello · 11-12-2019 11:10PM

fritzelly wrote: »

363,000 at last count a month or so ago and still declining - and even at that it's just statistical figures based on a small sampling that doesn't take in to account if someone actually listened to the whole show or 5 minutes.

I didn't know it had gone down but it's still a very high listenership.
That's the method they use, good enough for me.

NIMAN · 11-12-2019 11:11PM

Listenership figures dropping as they die off (I'd guess the average LL listener is relatively old).

elperello · 11-12-2019 11:15PM

Nevin Parsnipp wrote: »

Didn't hear the show so don't know what the ad was.

Sure the show must be doing something right ...but would it still do something right with a different presenter/s at a quarter of the salary ?

I think it would ...

Marian Finucane used to be good as was Derek Davis.
Most of the stand ins when Joe is off have not impressed me.

It is the format that is the winner though and who's to say if they got the right jockey it could be even better.

Anyway Joe won't be there forever.

Nevin Parsnipp · 11-12-2019 11:15PM

NIMAN wrote: »

Listenership figures dropping as they die off (I'd guess the average LL listener is relatively old).

That post really did not add anything to the debate my friend ...

Nevin Parsnipp · 11-12-2019 11:16PM

NIMAN wrote: »

Listenership figures dropping as they die off (I'd guess the average LL listener is relatively old).

Check the top of your head ?

Might be a few more posts lurking there ?

Nevin Parsnipp · 11-12-2019 11:21PM

elperello wrote: »

Marian Finucane used to be good as was Derek Davis.
Most of the stand ins when Joe is off have not impressed me.

It is the format that is the winner though and who's to say if they got the right jockey it could be even better.

Anyway Joe won't be there forever.

"Anyway Joe won't be there forever "?

We are talking about RTE pal ...wake up ! think Gaybo...Larry G...Dave Fanning....John Bowman..

Are you sayin we should pay him his massive wedge until he decides to go ?

Heeeey...explain yourself Dude ..

fritzelly · 11-12-2019 11:24PM

This is only from a few months ago - don't remember it being brought up anywhere
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/rte-signalling-its-readiness-to-offload-2rn-network-wing-tfg7qbs9j

How the hell can they be considering selling off the infrastructure for tv/radio etc to a private company so they can raise some money (and you know where that will head)? As far as I'm concerned this should be held in public hands - totally separate from RTE, and I would assume require government approval or would it? Seeing as they are selling off public assets to fund themselves.

elperello · 11-12-2019 11:26PM

Nevin Parsnipp wrote: »

"Anyway Joe won't be there forever "?

We are talking about RTE pal ...wake up ! think Gaybo...Larry G...Dave Fanning....John Bowman..

Are you sayin we should pay him his massive wedge until he decides to go ?

Heeeey...explain yourself Dude ..

I'm awake thanks, but not for much longer , bed beckons, early start in AM

I don't care what he is paid. The contract was negotiated and will be again on renewal.Let the chips fall where they may.

I only listen to the radio, which by the way is free at point of use, I don't expect to micro manage the staff.

11-12-2019 11:33PM

RTE are not selling the RTE Guide after a half hearted attempt to sell it for two weeks. And now they aren't selling the Limerick studio.

So, what are they going to do for money?

Dee Forbes banging the RTE TV licence drum again 60m uncollected fee *poll not working - pl ignore*

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Dee Forbes banging the RTE TV licence drum again 60m uncollected fee poll not working - pl ignore