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ISIS people returning thread - no Lisa Smith talk (21/12/19)

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    recedite wrote: »
    Quite sure. See, you are not taking up another citizenship, just by losing your passport. Its not like burning your Irish passport deliberately while swearing allegiance to a foreign terrorist state.

    So it's for each citizen to make up their own rules?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    I would say Lisa could be in trouble, as apparently she sold out an extremist group living in Dublin if the papers are telling the truth.

    She could find it very isolating when she comes home as allot of groups from her religion wont touch her with a barge pole.


  • Registered Users Posts: 244 ✭✭Pythagorean


    It's worth looking at this in a slightly more detached, logical way. This woman is a European, English speaking member of Isis. As such, she could be a very valuable source of information about potential terrorists who may be a threat to European countries. She may be so glad to be back in the safe haven of Ireland, that she may well repent of her previous sins, and tell us all she knows, maybe there is a potential suicide bomber planning an attack somewhere that she may be able to prevent?. Rather than alienate her from the word go, why not give her the benefit of the doubt, at least initially, and see what she can tell us ?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭jmreire


    recedite wrote: »
    There is no need for us to do anything, except arrange for a few Gardai to meet her at Dublin airport, and say thank-you to the nice Turkish policeman who she should be handcuffed to when she is deported.
    It was a mistake for Varadkar to send Irish army rangers over there recently. It probably pissed off the Turks.

    Also there was no need to go arranging special passports and travel documents for her. People don't need travel documents when they are being deported.

    Not true....no doc's= no travel. 1st thing Frau Merkels invited refugee's did on arrival was to destroy their documents,,,they were told ( rightfully ) that unless they had documents proving their citizenship of the Country they came from, they could not be deported. If you ever watch the TC Show, Border Patrol, you will have seen the immigration official's ransacking the apartment's of suspected illegal immigrant's looking for passport's, and unless they find them, they cannot be deported.But once they do, it's hand cuff's on and a ride to the nearest nick.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,573 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    recedite wrote: »
    Actually the US and Ireland are both countries that allow dual citizenship.
    If you took up Dutch citizenship you would be revoking your Irish citizenship.

    You said that by swearing allegiance to another state she effectively renounced her irish citizenship. So why would the same not apply if she too US citizenship and pledged allegiance to that state? My point is that you are talking out of your arse.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,573 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    recedite wrote: »
    Yes, but we're just going to pretend that never happened.


    We're going to say Islamic State was just a bunch of terrorists that formed a death cult. Even though they had territory, a capital city, an army, a booming oil export business, and the immigration program you refer to.


    An Irish passport cannot be renounced so easily. It may go up in flames, but it can resurrected later if necessary, phoenix like. As Leo Varadkar has just proved.

    a passport is a piece of paper, nothing more. And she did not renounce her citizenship as I have already explained. Perhaps one day you may prefer facts over your baseless opinion. Clearly today is not that day.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭jmreire


    Not in the eyes of Daesh members,



    Remember they Only answer to Sharia law, not the laws of any Western Country.


    It is Legal under Sharia Law to commit Many acts that Western laws see as Criminal.


    Our laws mean Nothing to them. ( ISIS/DAESH members ).

    That's true in the case of isis, that is until the ass fell out of their Caliphate, and then, because they have to come back to the Civilized World, they must obey civilized world rules and regulation's. As Lisa has found out. And no matter what Islamic laws they obeyed with isis, they may be damn glad of the protection offered by western law's. Would be much worse if they were at the receiving end of their ( isis ) law's....


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭jmreire


    tuxy wrote: »
    Are you sure you don't lose your citizenship when this happens?

    Nope, You could lose the document easily enough ( happened to,me once or twice ) but not your citizenship. Problem is you cannot travel with out travel documents...they have a mini-passport available now, credit card sized one, and I have seen people use it within the EU...But I'm not sure of it's validity outside the EU.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    jmreire wrote: »
    Nope, You could lose the document easily enough ( happened to,me once or twice ) but not your citizenship. Problem is you cannot travel with out travel documents...they have a mini-passport available now, credit card sized one, and I have seen people use it within the EU...But I'm not sure of it's validity outside the EU.

    schengen transit visa?
    You can't travel without a passport in most cases but I believe you can still be deported. That said I'm sure most countries would produce travel documents for such cases if asked.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,927 ✭✭✭✭cj maxx


    Watching a good programme on History about the rise of ISIS. And about Europeans returning as self organizing sleeper cells


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭jmreire


    tuxy wrote: »
    schengen transit visa?
    You can't travel without a passport in most cases but I believe you can still be deported. That said I'm sure most countries would produce travel documents for such cases if asked.

    To the best of my knowledge, Schengen Visa's have to be applied for. And to get one, you must have the passport of your Country., What I know comes from Truck drivers, so I don't know the finer points of it. But all along the line, there is a paper trail. If Lisa could be deported without documentation , why did the Govt issue her with travel documents? Say Lisa arrives at Istanbul Airport, being deported, and without documents. I have traveled a lot, and have never seen anyone get into another Country without a passport, or other travel document. In fact, no plane will allow you to board without a passport, and depending where you are travelling to, a valid Visa. The airline's face stiff financial penalty's for accepting a passenger who does not have the correct document's..and have to return him / her to the point of origin. I had a big argument with Air Lingus staff at the check in desk one morning, all because my visa only had 6 weeks validity left. It did not even matter that I had a residency stamp in the passport, and already had spent more than 1 year working in that Country...and all because the rule's said 3 mths validity.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭jmreire


    tuxy wrote: »
    If she has committed a crime then I don't think the Garda can ignore it.
    That's why I mentioned the offences against the state act. But perhaps I'm looking at the wrong law.

    I think that what they are looking at is the 2005 Anti-Terrorist act.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    jmreire wrote: »
    If Lisa could be deported without documentation , why did the Govt issue her with travel documents? Say Lisa arrives at Istanbul Airport, being deported, and without documents. I have traveled a lot, and have never seen anyone get into another Country without a passport, or other travel document.

    Because Turkey has the right to deport her and Ireland can't reject that so why make it needlessly difficult unless the wish is to create tension between Turkey and Ireland?
    It's true that you are very unlikely to get into any country but your own with out a passport and even then it will take hours of interrogation before you can. There is nowhere they can send you when they find out you are only a citizen of the country you are in.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,927 ✭✭✭✭cj maxx


    jmreire wrote: »
    To the best of my knowledge, Schengen Visa's have to be applied for. And to get one, you must have the passport of your Country., What I know comes from Truck drivers, so I don't know the finer points of it. But all along the line, there is a paper trail. If Lisa could be deported without documentation , why did the Govt issue her with travel documents? Say Lisa arrives at Istanbul Airport, being deported, and without documents. I have traveled a lot, and have never seen anyone get into another Country without a passport, or other travel document. In fact, no plane will allow you to board without a passport, and depending where you are travelling to, a valid Visa. The airline's face stiff financial penalty's for accepting a passenger who does not have the correct document's..and have to return him / her to the point of origin. I had a big argument with Air Lingus staff at the check in desk one morning, all because my visa only had 6 weeks validity left. It did not even matter that I had a residency stamp in the passport, and already had spent more than 1 year working in that Country...and all because the rule's said 3 mths validity.
    It's a special plane , and seemingly the passport is to leave Ireland. Any citizen has the right to enter ireland. Passport or not. As far as I understand


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    It's worth looking at this in a slightly more detached, logical way. This woman is a European, English speaking member of Isis. As such, she could be a very valuable source of information about potential terrorists who may be a threat to European countries. She may be so glad to be back in the safe haven of Ireland, that she may well repent of her previous sins, and tell us all she knows, maybe there is a potential suicide bomber planning an attack somewhere that she may be able to prevent?. Rather than alienate her from the word go, why not give her the benefit of the doubt, at least initially, and see what she can tell us ?

    She hasn't renounced her views in the slightest and most of those she knew there are splatter.

    Realistically her Intel would be general, rather than preventive.

    Hard to be sure on that but for the immense threat she represents, not enough.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,722 ✭✭✭Field east


    Danzy wrote: »
    She hasn't renounced her views in the slightest and most of those she knew there are splatter.

    Realistically her Intel would be general, rather than preventive.

    Hard to be sure on that but for the immense threat she represents, not enough.

    It beggars belief that she can walk off a plane in Dublin a free woman legally. Irish intellegance then interviews her to see if she is a threat to the state. This could take a number of weeks/ months to carry out - as they cannot go in with all guns firing from the start. If she is found to be a serious threat to the state / individuals in it - eg have a knife in her bag and slash all around her in a supermarket- she is then arrested. , I assume, and the court system takes over and her ‘movement is restricted’ if found guilty. If that is the case, let’s hope that she does nothing on behalf if ISIS in the meantime.
    ABOUT 30 years ago an insurance company, I think, went bankrupt. The gov at the time had some involvement in it - a partner, underwriter or trying to save it. If the law stayed as it was it would have cost , I think, the Gov millions at the time- being sued by those who were out of pocket.
    What did the Gov do . The Dail met on day one to discuss a change in the law to head off claims, and it was voted into law the following day.

    What has all this got to do with Lisa Smith? I think that if an Irish citizen ‘makes efforts ‘to support an organization / movement that carries out atrocities overseas , Irish law should be clear as to how such a person should be brought to account. This does not seem to be the case with LisaSmith.
    The Irish Gov has sufficient information to be suspicious of she being involved / supporting very illegal activities and therefor should arrest her as she arrives.
    Irish people are arrested every day if the guards are suspicious of he/she being involved in something illegal.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭jmreire


    tuxy wrote: »
    Because Turkey has the right to deport her and Ireland can't reject that so why make it needlessly difficult unless the wish is to create tension between Turkey and Ireland?
    It's true that you are very unlikely to get into any country but your own with out a passport and even then it will take hours of interrogation before you can. There is nowhere they can send you when they find out you are only a citizen of the country you are in.

    I don't think so tuxy.. from the very start, Leo has made it clear that Lisa is an Irish Citizen, and entitled to come back home. The fact that it has taken so long is a different issue. So they have prepared travel documents for her, and the tension you speak about will not happen,
    Hypothetically speaking, assume that the Turks ( or any other Country in a similar situation) don't have any proof of Citizenship of any particular refugee / prisoner etc. Then they simply can't deport them. Britain ( and probably other EU Country's too) have loads of people who they cannot deport simply because they don't have any documentation.
    Say for the sake of argument, Lisa did not have any documents at all, and they put her on a direct flight to Ireland ( or anywhere else either ) and if it worked, what is to stop Turkey ( or the Kurd's )shipping the 70'000 isis member's to anywhere they like? Not going to happen, simply because they will not be accepted without Passport's or alternative travel document's. And in the World we live in nowadays...more than ever we need to watch who is coming in to Ireland.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭jmreire


    Field east wrote: »
    It beggars belief that she can walk off a plane in Dublin a free woman legally. Irish intellegance then interviews her to see if she is a threat to the state. This could take a number of weeks/ months to carry out - as they cannot go in with all guns firing from the start. If she is found to be a serious threat to the state / individuals in it - eg have a knife in her bag and slash all around her in a supermarket- she is then arrested. , I assume, and the court system takes over and her ‘movement is restricted’ if found guilty. If that is the case, let’s hope that she does nothing on behalf if ISIS in the meantime.
    ABOUT 30 years ago an insurance company, I think, went bankrupt. The gov at the time had some involvement in it - a partner, underwriter or trying to save it. If the law stayed as it was it would have cost , I think, the Gov millions at the time- being sued by those who were out of pocket.
    What did the Gov do . The Dail met on day one to discuss a change in the law to head off claims, and it was voted into law the following day.

    What has all this got to do with Lisa Smith? I think that if an Irish citizen ‘makes efforts ‘to support an organization / movement that carries out atrocities overseas , Irish law should be clear as to how such a person should be brought to account. This does not seem to be the case with LisaSmith.
    The Irish Gov has sufficient information to be suspicious of she being involved / supporting very illegal activities and therefor should arrest her as she arrives.
    Irish people are arrested every day if the guards are suspicious of he/she being involved in something illegal.

    As the law stands, we are considered innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, and this is a very important piece of protection everyone is afforded. So will not be any different for Lisa. People are not arrested here just on suspicion of having committed a crime. They may be taken to a Guarda station for questioning but they will be arrested only after the Guard's have enough ground's to make a case against them. When the Lisa case first hit the headlines, the main discussion focused on the fact that regardless of what she may have done with /for isis abroad, she had not broken any Law's here in Ireland. So based on this, she would be free as a bird if she came home. Meanwhile, in other Country's, with more experience in these matter's ( terrorist bombings, shooting's ,stabbings etc.) they had already made laws concerning people who carried out these act's,even if they were carried out oversea's. So while Ireland may have plans to upgrade our Law's in line with say Germany, the only option they have realistically at the moment is the Anti-Terrorist Laws from 2005.And these Laws do have teeth...from 5 -10 years on conviction. Lisa is under investigation ( and has been since this issue came to light. ) But we will have to wait and see what will happen when and if she arrive's back.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,593 ✭✭✭cfuserkildare


    jmreire wrote: »
    As the law stands, we are considered innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, and this is a very important piece of protection everyone is afforded. So will not be any different for Lisa. People are not arrested here just on suspicion of having committed a crime. They may be taken to a Guarda station for questioning but they will be arrested only after the Guard's have enough ground's to make a case against them. When the Lisa case first hit the headlines, the main discussion focused on the fact that regardless of what she may have done with /for isis abroad, she had not broken any Law's here in Ireland. So based on this, she would be free as a bird if she came home. Meanwhile, in other Country's, with more experience in these matter's ( terrorist bombings, shooting's ,stabbings etc.) they had already made laws concerning people who carried out these act's,even if they were carried out oversea's. So while Ireland may have plans to upgrade our Law's in line with say Germany, the only option they have realistically at the moment is the Anti-Terrorist Laws from 2005.And these Laws do have teeth...from 5 -10 years on conviction. Lisa is under investigation ( and has been since this issue came to light. ) But we will have to wait and see what will happen when and if she arrive's back.




    So how does the law stand in regards to membership of a known terrorist organisation?
    Is Lisa Smith going to walk free when she already freely stated that she went there to Join ISIS?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,573 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    So how does the law stand in regards to membership of a known terrorist organisation?
    Is Lisa Smith going to walk free when she already freely stated that she went there to Join ISIS?

    ISIS was not (is not??) on the list of proscribed terrorist organisations in this country.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭jmreire


    So how does the law stand in regards to membership of a known terrorist organisation?
    Is Lisa Smith going to walk free when she already freely stated that she went there to Join ISIS?

    That is what the investigation is all about...and as I mentioned in the very last line of my post... we will have to see what actually happen's when / if she arrives back. Afaik, in addition to the RW members ( who we are now told were not sent out to "extract" Lisa, but to give their "support"... what ever that mean's) there are member's of An Garda Siochana there too. So no, I can't see Lisa just walking off the plane, through Passport / Custom's control and into a waiting car which will take her home. If fact, I could see there being quite a delay between leaving the Airport and Arriving in her own front door.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,455 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    ISIS was not (is not??) on the list of proscribed terrorist organisations in this country.

    He said known not proscribed


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,573 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    He said known not proscribed

    it is not illegal to be a member of a known terrorist organisation if they are not proscribed.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,593 ✭✭✭cfuserkildare


    So how does that apply to the two in Waterford accused of fundraising for ISIS?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,573 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    So how does that apply to the two in Waterford accused of fundraising for ISIS?

    who are they and what were they charged with?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,877 ✭✭✭donegal_man


    So how does the law stand in regards to membership of a known terrorist organisation?
    Is Lisa Smith going to walk free when she already freely stated that she went there to Join ISIS?

    Isn't her claim that she wasn't a member of ISIS as a "military" entity rather a member of ISIS as a "state" ie she was at all times a civilian while she was there.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,279 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    jmreire wrote: »
    I don't think so tuxy.. from the very start, Leo has made it clear that Lisa is an Irish Citizen, and entitled to come back home. The fact that it has taken so long is a different issue. So they have prepared travel documents for her, and the tension you speak about will not happen,
    Hypothetically speaking, assume that the Turks ( or any other Country in a similar situation) don't have any proof of Citizenship of any particular refugee / prisoner etc. Then they simply can't deport them. Britain ( and probably other EU Country's too) have loads of people who they cannot deport simply because they don't have any documentation.
    Say for the sake of argument, Lisa did not have any documents at all, and they put her on a direct flight to Ireland ( or anywhere else either ) and if it worked, what is to stop Turkey ( or the Kurd's )shipping the 70'000 isis member's to anywhere they like? Not going to happen, simply because they will not be accepted without Passport's or alternative travel document's. And in the World we live in nowadays...more than ever we need to watch who is coming in to Ireland.

    i would be surprised if they don't have proof though, i would be surprised if the americans weren't sharing information with turkey for example which would throw up information as to where they came from.
    i don't know for definite obviously but it would seem logical to me anyway.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭jmreire


    i would be surprised if they don't have proof though, i would be surprised if the americans weren't sharing information with turkey for example which would throw up information as to where they came from.
    i don't know for definite obviously but it would seem logical to me anyway.

    Agreed 110%. I'd say that there is a fat file with her name on it..


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,593 ✭✭✭cfuserkildare


    who are they and what were they charged with?




    Oh this is classic,


    Argue a point when you have not done your research properly.


    Firstly was 1 man as per the article attached ( not 2 as I mistakenly stated)


    https://www.waterfordlive.ie/news/home/322438/man-jailed-for-fundraising-for-isis-in-waterford.html


    and another, just to be sure:-


    https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/crime/four-isis-terrorist-fundraising-suspects-13898448


    And just to confirm the sentiments:-

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/suspected-isis-fundraisers-held-in-dublin-over-syria-cash-transfers-1.3767202


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,573 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Oh this is classic,


    Argue a point when you have not done your research properly.


    Firstly was 1 man as per the article attached ( not 2 as I mistakenly stated)


    https://www.waterfordlive.ie/news/home/322438/man-jailed-for-fundraising-for-isis-in-waterford.html


    and another, just to be sure:-


    https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/crime/four-isis-terrorist-fundraising-suspects-13898448

    we were discussing Lisa smith. surely you cant expect me to know every islamist in the country? now back to the point. They were not charged with membership of a proscribed organisation, which is what i responded to. these people were charged with a specific offence that does not reference proscribed organisations. such an offence is not relevant in the case of lisa smith. Nor is she quilty of membership of a proscribed organisation as ISIS was not such an organisation when she left to join them.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,593 ✭✭✭cfuserkildare


    ohnonotgmail,

    Yeh thats fair.

    Isn't ISIS one of those organisation's now on the " Bad " list?

    Especially with their ties to Boko Haram and child abuse/smuggling? etc.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,573 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    ohnonotgmail,

    Yeh thats fair.

    Isn't ISIS one of those organisation's now on the " Bad " list?

    Especially with their ties to Boko Haram and child abuse/smuggling? etc.

    the question was asked in the Dail earlier in the year. the answer given is as clear as mud

    http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/PQ-02-04-2019-213


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,722 ✭✭✭Field east


    jmreire wrote: »
    As the law stands, we are considered innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, and this is a very important piece of protection everyone is afforded. So will not be any different for Lisa. People are not arrested here just on suspicion of having committed a crime. They may be taken to a Guarda station for questioning but they will be arrested only after the Guard's have enough ground's to make a case against them. When the Lisa case first hit the headlines, the main discussion focused on the fact that regardless of what she may have done with /for isis abroad, she had not broken any Law's here in Ireland. So based on this, she would be free as a bird if she came home. Meanwhile, in other Country's, with more experience in these matter's ( terrorist bombings, shooting's ,stabbings etc.) they had already made laws concerning people who carried out these act's,even if they were carried out oversea's. So while Ireland may have plans to upgrade our Law's in line with say Germany, the only option they have realistically at the moment is the Anti-Terrorist Laws from 2005.And these Laws do have teeth...from 5 -10 years on conviction. Lisa is under investigation ( and has been since this issue came to light. ) But we will have to wait and see what will happen when and if she arrive's back.

    “—— May have plans to upgrade our laws in line with say Germany, ——“
    That phrase encapsulates my core point. The Gov should act immediately very fast track the upgrading the law - like it did b4 with that insurance company collapse a number of years ago.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,722 ✭✭✭Field east


    ISIS was not (is not??) on the list of proscribed terrorist organisations in this country.

    Can the dail, right now put ISIS on that list and backdate to the date that it was know to exist


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,713 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    Field east wrote: »
    Can the dail, right now put ISIS on that list and backdate to the date that it was know to exist


    You can't apply the law retroactively.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,904 ✭✭✭mgn


    Charlie Flanagan & Co have no time to look at new laws.

    Their too busy going around giving interviews calling people racist, or trying to think of what kind of new penalty points or fines the can dish out to motorist.


  • Registered Users Posts: 514 ✭✭✭Mules


    Charlie Flanagan is some ghoul. He was useless in foreign affairs and he's worse in justice.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,220 ✭✭✭✭biko


    US-born Alabama woman who joined ISIS is not an American citizen, judge rules
    https://www.foxnews.com/us/us-born-woman-who-joined-isis-not-american-citizen
    A federal judge ruled Thursday that an American-born woman who traveled to Syria to join the Islamic State (ISIS) group and now wants to return to her family in Alabama is not a U.S. citizen.

    Muthana, 25, currently lives with her 2-year-old son in a refugee camp in Syria and has since repudiated the terrorist group. A court motion said she and child, identified only as John Doe, were moved from the Roj refugee camp after receiving death threats from ISIS supporters and that their lives are in danger, The New York Times reported.

    In 2014, Muthana withdrew from college and left her home in Alabama to travel to Syria after being radicalized by ISIS online. She promoted the group's ideology on social media and called on Muslims to commit attacks in America, such as drive-by shootings and attempts to assassinate former President Barack Obama.

    She has since apologized for her actions and said she wishes to return to the U.S. In February, Muthana said she wanted to come home even if it meant facing charges. Her passport was canceled in 2016 under the Obama administration.

    The judge said he received thousands of messages mostly "spewed with hate" and threats against him if he ruled in Muthana's favor. He described them as failed attempts to "intimidate the court."


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,220 ✭✭✭✭biko


    Oh and a trigger warning is needed
    The State Department had said she wasn't a citizen, and
    President Trump
    ordered Secretary of State Mike Pompeo not to let her in the country.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,904 ✭✭✭mgn


    biko wrote: »
    US-born Alabama woman who joined ISIS is not an American citizen, judge rules
    https://www.foxnews.com/us/us-born-woman-who-joined-isis-not-american-citizen

    Great to see someone calling out this bulls*it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,904 ✭✭✭mgn


    biko wrote: »
    Oh and a trigger warning is needed

    Pity we dident have someone with the bottle to do this.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,983 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    mgn wrote: »
    Pity we dident have someone with the bottle to do this.

    The lesson here is, if you want to break international law then you need to be a powerful country like America. Also Turkey are probably very happy with Trump right now so won't complain about holding on to her.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,220 ✭✭✭✭biko


    Only Allah's laws are infallible.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭jmreire


    tuxy wrote: »
    The lesson here is, if you want to break international law then you need to be a powerful country like America. Also Turkey are probably very happy with Trump right now so won't complain about holding on to her.

    No, you don't need to be a big and powerful Country to act as Trump has. Leo ( or our President ) could do exactly the same thing, if the same conditions existed. Because while the Lady in question was born on American soil, and the Constitution guarantee's citizenship because of that, there are exceptions, and they apply in this case because she was the daughter of an active Diplomat at the time of her birth. This cancel's the usual constitutional right to citizenship. She is a Yemeni citizen, because her Father represented Yemeni at that time. So for once Trump is right, and separately, another Federal Judge has also ruled in this case that she is not an American Citizen. So seem's like she will be repatriated to Yemen.......be interesting to see how that works out in International Law.
    As for Turkey being happy to hold her indefinitely,,,I would not be to sure about that,,,Erdogan so far has kept to his word to repatriate ALL foreign isis members on Turkish controlled territory...look at how quick our Lisa is being shipped back. There is no delay or appeal's when it come's to granting "leave to stay" in Turkey..You are either in or out.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    The late late show is calling ,

    What the actual ****


    "Smith is set to be arrested as soon as she touches down at Baldonnel Aerodrome, near Dublin in Ireland on Tuesday, according to sources, the Irish Mirror reports .

    And she has requested that she has an interview on popular Irish chat show the Late Late Show when she returns to Ireland.

    A spokesman for the family, Peter Fitzpatrick said: “They’ve been approached by the Late Late Show and other media all looking for interviews, but Lisa told them she wants to give her own version.”


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,455 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    Gatling wrote: »
    The late late show is calling ,

    What the actual ****


    "Smith is set to be arrested as soon as she touches down at Baldonnel Aerodrome, near Dublin in Ireland on Tuesday, according to sources, the Irish Mirror reports .

    And she has requested that she has an interview on popular Irish chat show the Late Late Show when she returns to Ireland.

    A spokesman for the family, Peter Fitzpatrick said: “They’ve been approached by the Late Late Show and other media all looking for interviews, but Lisa told them she wants to give her own version.”
    So Lisa tell us what attracted you to Isis when you joined up? Was it all the beheading videos at the time they were posting? Throwing gays off roofs?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,518 ✭✭✭rgossip30


    So Lisa tell us what attracted you to Isis when you joined up? Was it all the beheading videos at the time they were posting? Throwing gays off roofs?

    Turbirdy will be drooling over her . The show will no longer be called the late late show but the freak show .


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,904 ✭✭✭mgn


    Gatling wrote: »
    The late late show is calling ,

    What the actual ****


    "Smith is set to be arrested as soon as she touches down at Baldonnel Aerodrome, near Dublin in Ireland on Tuesday, according to sources, the Irish Mirror reports .

    And she has requested that she has an interview on popular Irish chat show the Late Late Show when she returns to Ireland.

    A spokesman for the family, Peter Fitzpatrick said: “They’ve been approached by the Late Late Show and other media all looking for interviews, but Lisa told them she wants to give her own version.”

    The Late Late Show should be boycotted if that evil twisted bitch is giving airtime.
    All this is going to do is give her a platform to promote her twisted ideology and anyone else who wants to follow in her footsteps, people will do what the like around the world,and if it doesn't work out, well you're always welcome home. Its time this s*hit in RTE is called out.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    mgn wrote: »
    The Late Late Show should be boycotted if that evil twisted bitch is giving airtime.
    All this is going to do is give her a platform to promote her twisted ideology and anyone else who wants to follow in her footsteps, people will do what the like around the world,and if it doesn't work out, well you're always welcome home. Its time this s*hit in RTE is called out.

    Well if the rags are to be believed they want to try and get her on but it really depends on the pressure that comes when she arrives home, also if she will be allowed on straight away.

    I would expect an arrest/conversation with the guards and the child to be either taken off of her or have a very heavy tulsa presence. How she could be allowed on anything while there was an open case we shall see.

    The Late Late will be an attempt at whitewashing what she has done and trying to paint her as a victim, id be more than boycotting.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭jmreire


    Calhoun wrote: »
    Well if the rags are to be believed they want to try and get her on but it really depends on the pressure that comes when she arrives home, also if she will be allowed on straight away.

    I would expect an arrest/conversation with the guards and the child to be either taken off of her or have a very heavy tulsa presence. How she could be allowed on anything while there was an open case we shall see.

    The Late Late will be an attempt at whitewashing what she has done and trying to paint her as a victim, id be more than boycotting.

    That would be my reasoning too...for sure there won't be any limousine to whisk her from Dublin Airport ( if that's where she will land) to the RTE studio's. ( assuming she arrives on the right day ) And I think that there will not be too many welcoming her back to Dundalk either.


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