ESB eCars pricing introduction

Black_Knight · 05-11-2019 04:18AM

Did some not mention that the software they're using just comes with a reserve charger feature.

Calahonda52 · 05-11-2019 01:35PM

DrPhilG wrote: »

I'm totally against the concept of reserving chargers.

Hopefully if they do introduce it, there will be an extortionate fee for the priveledge.

Why?
The trick will be how will they kick folk off if they reach your reserve time

05-11-2019 01:44PM

I just can't see how it works , if someone reserves a charger, it's very difficult to be there within + or - 10 - 20 mins in reality, or you're hanging around because you're there 20+ mins earlier waiting on the charger to be free or if you get there and it's free you use it because you're early and there's no one around and by the time your reserved time comes you have enough charge and move on, but, the charger is still reserved ?

This is a bad solution , what's needed are enough chargers and that's the reality of it. I need to know when going to a charger that there are 3-4 + chargers there as there would be multiple petrol/diesel pumps.

Am I missing something here ?

liamog · 05-11-2019 02:24PM

In my opinion reservations make sense for destinations chargers, and communal chargers installed in shared car parks. I don't think it's really intended for rapid chargers.

fricatus · 05-11-2019 03:27PM

liamog wrote: »

In my opinion reservations make sense for destinations chargers, and communal chargers installed in shared car parks. I don't think it's really intended for rapid chargers.

Yes, being able to reserve a slow charger in an airport, cinema, shopping centre or theatre car park would make perfect sense, because you could go there in the knowledge that you will be able to plug in and come back to a full (or full enough) battery.

Reserving fast chargers is a bad idea IMO. What if I arrive along to an unoccupied charger just as your reservation time is beginning - let's say I have no alternative (2% SOC or something), and then you're delayed by 15 minutes (can easily happen due to traffic, even slowing down to conserve range in bad weather). Do I have to wait there at an unoccupied charger that I can't use, until you arrive, and then sit out your charging session?

What if I've reserved, and you're sitting there charging when I arrive? Do I tell you to move? Does the unit stop your charge, leaving you giving me dirty looks as you unplug with not enough battery left to make it all the way home? What if I'm a lone woman and you're a seedy/dangerous-looking man?

What about if I leave home, seeing no reservations on any of the chargers on my route, but then someone reserves within the two hours it took me to get there? I was of course being a responsible driver and not checking my phone along the way.

It's so fraught with difficulties, I can't see it working. Maybe one of a group of four could be reserved or something. I'm curious to know if it's done elsewhere, or if it was tried and abandoned.

For best practice around EVs, I always try to consider what Tesla or Norway would do, and I don't think either the Tesla superchargers, or any of the Norwegian networks, offer reserved chargers.

05-11-2019 03:52PM

fricatus wrote: »

What if I'm a lone woman and you're a seedy/dangerous-looking man?

LOl what if I'm a Man and I p1ssed off the "lone woman" by unplugging her car and she accuses me of assault ?

05-11-2019 03:54PM

I don't even think AC points should be reserved, I just don't think it will work, what we need are tonnes more AC points and of course DC.

Someone reserves and AC point and they don't show up, can they reserve a charge point for the day, 2 hrs, 8 hrs etc ?

Mike9832 · 05-11-2019 04:26PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I don't even think AC points should be reserved, I just don't think it will work, what we need are tonnes more AC points and of course DC.

Someone reserves and AC point and they don't show up, can they reserve a charge point for the day, 2 hrs, 8 hrs etc ?

Agree

If they pay upfront fair enough, no show, no cash back

Is that how it works?

Does it warn you it's reserved by someone?

Or can you reserve for free like Argos and never show up?

05-11-2019 04:32PM

Mike9832 wrote: »

Agree

If they pay upfront fair enough, no show, no cash back

Is that how it works?

Does it warn you it's reserved by someone?

Or can you reserve for free like Argos and never show up?

Reservation fee or not, it won't make available an unused charger if it's reserved for hrs, unless there is some kind of time limit and if it's not used by then then the reservation is lifted.

I still don't think it's a good idea.

jhegarty · 05-11-2019 10:33PM

And what happens to the reservation fee when you get there and it's iced ?

unkel · 05-11-2019 10:52PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't even think AC points should be reserved, I just don't think it will work, what we need are tonnes more AC points and of course DC.

We don't need tonnes more AC points. AC charging (except tethered at home in your own driveway) is a pain in the hole and it would be more expensive to have loads of AC chargers instead of a few DC charge multibay (and if the ESB are listening, that does not mean 2 or 4 but more like 20, and expandable) stations that have a high occupancy

You can't buy petrol by the liter in every shop you go to, do you? And then several times a day poor the petrol into your tank (taking a few minutes)?

You just go to the nearest petrol station when you're empty, and quickly fill up (in about 5-10 minutes). That's what we need to have in a few years time when there are a hundred thousand EVs on the road

05-11-2019 11:20PM

unkel wrote: »

We don't need tonnes more AC points. AC charging (except tethered at home in your own driveway) is a pain in the hole and it would be more expensive to have loads of AC chargers instead of a few DC charge multibay (and if the ESB are listening, that does not mean 2 or 4 but more like 20, and expandable) stations that have a high occupancy

You can't buy petrol by the liter in every shop you go to, do you? And then several times a day poor the petrol into your tank (taking a few minutes)?

You just go to the nearest petrol station when you're empty, and quickly fill up (in about 5-10 minutes). That's what we need to have in a few years time when there are a hundred thousand EVs on the road

We need as many ways to charge as possible, AC , DC , having DC points everywhere is not practical.

There are plenty of situations where AC is perfectly acceptable, having 11 Kw AC is fantastic. Zoe owners with 22 Kw Ac probably laugh their heads off at the rest of us arguing over DC points.

Both AC and DC are needed. The more the merrier.

unkel · 05-11-2019 11:38PM

Deleted User wrote: »

having DC points everywhere is not practical.

Why not? We don't need them everywhere, I was thinking of a few hundred 20-50 bay stations nationwide within 5 years (at the moment there are about a thousand petrol stations in Ireland. So we'd probably end up with less EV chargers than we have petrol stations now.

Having AC points everywhere is not practical, it's expensive and imagine the legal problems with people tripping over all those cables being plugged in for hours on end in this country where everybody seems to sue for €50k over a scratch?

this.lad · 06-11-2019 12:49AM

unkel wrote: »

Why not? We don't need them everywhere, I was thinking of a few hundred 20-50 bay stations nationwide within 5 years (at the moment there are about a thousand petrol stations in Ireland. So we'd probably end up with less EV chargers than we have petrol stations now.

Having AC points everywhere is not practical, it's expensive and imagine the legal problems with people tripping over all those cables being plugged in for hours on end in this country where everybody seems to sue for €50k over a scratch?

Should we not stop looking at electric cars the same way as ICE cars altogether though?

I have to go to Waterford next week for example. Plugging in on AC while I'm at my thing will leave me ready to drive straight home. The alternative is to flute around waiting for a DC charger possibly for quite some time, and wait at least half an hour to charge then.

There needs to be a mix. The more on street there is the less queues at fast chargers I think.

unkel · 06-11-2019 01:06AM

this.lad wrote: »

I have to go to Waterford next week for example. Plugging in on AC while I'm at my thing will leave me ready to drive straight home. The alternative is to flute around waiting for a DC charger possibly for quite some time, and wait at least half an hour to charge then.

Yes, but that is today (and yesterday). As most cars today are very limited in how they can charge. Most can't even charge at 50kW and almost all fast chargers in Ireland are only 50kW

I'm trying to look at the near future. Where cars and chargers are far quicker. So your half an hour wait (@50kW) then suddenly is only 6 minutes (@250kW)

Tesla already does this today, they have 250kW superchargers chargers and Model 3 can charge at 250kW

this.lad wrote: »

Should we not stop looking at electric cars the same way as ICE cars altogether though?

No! That would be a big mistake. We've honed our filling stations skills for 100 years. We know what works best. It's is not for nothing that the most forward looking charging station companies like Tesla and Fastned, use exactly the petrol station layout for their chargers. Not parking spaces.

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223763-fastned-4_rgb-7b97cb-original-1473172599-e1486493864438.jpg?quality=82&strip=all&w=1600

McGiver · 06-11-2019 01:25AM

liamog wrote:

In my opinion reservations make sense for destinations chargers, and communal chargers installed in shared car parks. I don't think it's really intended for rapid chargers.

Pretty sure the stuff in the framework/platform code is not all for FCPs. It may be for SCPs as well order may not be used by eCars at all...

Batesy · 06-11-2019 09:02AM

Reservations would be a disaster for destination chargers IMO. What’s to stop the same customer reserving the same charger every day for example?

Effectively making it there own private charger.

Black_Knight · 06-11-2019 09:47AM

Can we just all be clear. Reservations is pure speculation! Ecars hasn't implemented reservations, and has made no indication that they will in the future.

06-11-2019 10:41AM

New Map view, notice the "session started" time ?

slave1 · 06-11-2019 10:59AM

I agree with as many chargers as possible including AC, there are many commuters (including myself) that would benefit from a charge whilst street/public car parked all day, this would also take considerable pressure off the DC chargers as any car will get significant charge off a slow charger if charging during the typical working day/night hours

06-11-2019 11:17AM

Black_Knight wrote: »

Can we just all be clear. Reservations is pure speculation! Ecars hasn't implemented reservations, and has made no indication that they will in the future.

I think this is pretty clear they intend or at least seriously thinking about implementing reservations.

06-11-2019 11:45AM

Notice the length of time some cars are plugged in ? one in the pic below since 6:07 PM yesterday

liamog · 06-11-2019 12:00PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I think this is pretty clear they intend or at least seriously thinking about implementing reservations.

The platform they are using is called Driivz, it's also used by CentricaEVs which is primarily a workplace charging service.

The software platform is the same, so I suspect eCars just didn't bother paying to disable the reservation icon.

https://www.centrica.com/what-we-do/centrica-innovations/electric-vehicle-services/

06-11-2019 12:10PM

liamog wrote: »

The platform they are using is called Driivz, it's also used by CentricaEVs which is primarily a workplace charging service.

The software platform is the same, so I suspect eCars just didn't bother paying to disable the reservation icon.

https://www.centrica.com/what-we-do/centrica-innovations/electric-vehicle-services/

Maybe, who knows ?

September1 · 06-11-2019 12:26PM

I predict that on 18th of November charging for charging will not work well and there will be another delay. I'm usually wrong about predicting future, so nothing to worry about.

ELM327 · 06-11-2019 12:32PM

Probably won't work at all!
I really hope they implement a "free vend" as default.

Mickeroo · 06-11-2019 12:36PM

Yeah I would not want to be relying on public rapid chargers in the first couple of weeks of this rollout.

unkel · 06-11-2019 12:40PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Notice the length of time some cars are plugged in ? one in the pic below since 6:07 PM yesterday

That's perfectly allowed. Probably a local resident coming home from work last night, plugging in and having a lie in today. It's a destination charger. That's what it is for.

One of the reasons these AC slow chargers are useless. Or at least useless in public streets.

Fair enough to have a million AC chargers at homes and at work car parks, where they are not in anyone's way

Royale with Cheese · 06-11-2019 12:45PM

Has anyone else had trouble signing up? My verification email never turned up so my account still isn't activated, if I try and sign up with a different email address it tells me my phone number is in use by another account. I've contacted ESB about it twice so far and no reply.

Does the phone number linked to your account matter? If they don't get back to me I was just gonna sign up using my girlfriend's number.

06-11-2019 12:50PM

unkel wrote: »

That's perfectly allowed. Probably a local resident coming home from work last night, plugging in and having a lie in today. It's a destination charger. That's what it is for.

One of the reasons these AC slow chargers are useless. Or at least useless in public streets.

Fair enough to have a million AC chargers at homes and at work car parks, where they are not in anyone's way

No It's not what the AC points are for, it's unavailable for many hours and another driver could be using it that needs it.

Like any charge point, it's intended use is to charge the car and then the driver should move on to make it available for another person, they are not personal charge points.

ESB eCars pricing introduction

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