Jeffrey Epstein arrested on sex trafficking charges

TomOnBoard · 15-08-2019 05:32PM

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

If he did hang himself how did he remove the rope and make it disappear while dead.

AFAIK, he was found hanging from a sheet suspended from the top bunk in his cell. So, no rope was involved and none was removed.

Cheerful Spring2 · 15-08-2019 05:32PM

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Two studies reported that a broken hyoid also occurs in suicides by hanging. One study found it in 6% of cases, while another found it in 20+%. The greater incidence apparently occurs in cases involving more elderly people.

I see that most reports are saying that 'multiple' neck bones were broken, 'including the hyoid'. Very little is being said about the other bones that were broken, with the focus being placed on the hyoid. Clearly, the authorities are being a bit hesitant about issuing a more complete assessment of the damage at this time. This leaves way too much room for speculation to occur. They need to get the complete picture out asap, as otherwise wild speculation will only increase.

The theory out there ( officially) he hanged himself using a bunk bed thats only 5 or 6 foot tall. Consider here Epstein supposedly near 6 foot. How can he hang himself? I don't understand how he would have to strength and space to do it? Supposedly the sheets are made of light paper? He must weigh at least 190 pounds?

TomOnBoard · 15-08-2019 05:37PM

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

The theory out there ( officially) he hanged himself using a bunk bed thats only 5 or 6 foot tall. Consider here Epstein supposedly near 6 foot. How can he hang himself? I don't understand how he would have to strength and space to do it? Supposedly the sheets are made of light paper? He must weigh at least 190 pounds?

The sheets would have been paper-like if he had been still on suicide watch. However, he had been off suicide watch for some time, so would have had 'normal' bedding.

The reports of how he did it say that he would have put his weight on the 'noose' by falling forward and bending his knees, thereby resulting in a self-strangulation, rather than a drop-hanging.

tuxy · 15-08-2019 05:48PM

TomOnBoard wrote: »

The sheets would have been paper-like if he had been still on suicide watch. However, he had been off suicide watch for some time, so would have had 'normal' bedding.

The reports of how he did it say that he would have put his weight on the 'noose' by falling forward and bending his knees, thereby resulting in a self-strangulation, rather than a drop-hanging.

Correct it's actually a fairly common method and some people like that you can change your mind and stand up at any point up until you pass out.
People strangle themselves all the time from ground level, all that's needed is an anchor point and to be determined to lean into the noose very hard until you pass out from restricted blood flow. The the body weight does the rest once passed out.
Would such a method break many bones in the neck though?

This is the anti-suicide material available in U.S prisons used in both clothes and bedding. You would think he would have been left with this even if take off suicide watch. But perhaps because he was taken off it he had the right to request normal bedding and clothes.

Cheerful Spring2 · 15-08-2019 05:58PM

TomOnBoard wrote: »

The sheets would have been paper-like if he had been still on suicide watch. However, he had been off suicide watch for some time, so would have had 'normal' bedding.

The reports of how he did it say that he would have put his weight on the 'noose' by falling forward and bending his knees, thereby resulting in a self-strangulation, rather than a drop-hanging.

Is this information provided by an unnamed source? Are the reports reliable though? Every time i check this up the information, nobody willing to give their name on record. You have trust the people providing the info are not involved in a cover up of his death.

I just learned awhile ago Epstein roomate was bailed out on Friday. Next day Epstein dead in his cell. Whoever in charge of the MCC investigation, needs to check who provided the bail money to get him out of the cell.

Just so happened the guards fell asleep
Just so happened one of the guards was a rookie
Just so happend he not on suicide watch
Just so happened staff didnot think he would commit suicide second time.
Just so happened he was given the right bed sheet to commit suicide
Just so happened the camera recording nothing.

The two guards knew Epstein was a high profile prisoner. You might get away with if a normal prisoner did it, but ****ing up with Epstein you're going to end up facing criminal charges if you mess up. Reason i don't buy the official story. The two guards would have to be brain death to not understood, the consequences of failure that night. I betting they got paid off or they are involved somehow?

Question was the Rookie guard a plant- brought in from the outside to help? Conspiracy, i know, but this has to be looked into.

There so many events had to happen here for this to even go down like it did

ceadaoin. · 15-08-2019 06:09PM

I'd have thought that broken bones during hanging are caused by the force of dropping from a height. That wouldn't be possible in this case surely?

Franz Von Peppercorn II · 15-08-2019 06:18PM

No suicide theory seems consistent. If it was jumping off the bunk bed he didn’t have the height. Self strangulation isn’t consistent with the injuries.

Cheerful Spring2 · 15-08-2019 06:22PM

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

No suicide theory seems consistent. If it was jumping off the bunk bed he didn’t have the height. Self strangulation isn’t consistent with the injuries.

This may end up like the JFK conspiracy. Who killed Epstein?

TomOnBoard · 15-08-2019 06:28PM

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

No suicide theory seems consistent. If it was jumping off the bunk bed he didn’t have the height. Self strangulation isn’t consistent with the injuries.

I haven't seen any report suggesting that he might have jumped off the top bunk, so I dont see that as a runner.

I also need to see a rational explanation for how there would be 'multiple' broken neck bones in the 'bent knees' scenario. I can accept that the hyoid could be broken in that scenario, but the breach of 'multiple' bones in the neck stretches believability to me as a layman.

tuxy · 15-08-2019 06:32PM

I know there are no reports of jumping but could jumping off the top bunk knock him unconscious and then die with knees bent?

mick987 · 15-08-2019 06:45PM

tuxy wrote: »

You can't suicide two people in custody in such a short space of time, it would look a bit suspicious

She should not go sailing in the med this summer

Cheerful Spring2 · 15-08-2019 06:46PM

TomOnBoard wrote: »

I haven't seen any report suggesting that he might have jumped off the top bunk, so I dont see that as a runner.

I also need to see a rational explanation for how there would be 'multiple' broken neck bones in the 'bent knees' scenario. I can accept that the hyoid could be broken in that scenario, but the breach of 'multiple' bones in the neck stretches believability to me as a layman.

I think this is the reason why the autopsy results got delayed. This information leaked out. Fractures in his neck bones, i believe this worried the autopsy doctors and they were afraid to make a final decision or determination on cause of death. I think they wait till the MCC investigation over to provide their final verdict.

raze_them_all_ · 15-08-2019 09:13PM

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

The theory out there ( officially) he hanged himself using a bunk bed thats only 5 or 6 foot tall. Consider here Epstein supposedly near 6 foot. How can he hang himself? I don't understand how he would have to strength and space to do it? Supposedly the sheets are made of light paper? He must weigh at least 190 pounds?

You can hang yourself from a sink

kowloon · 15-08-2019 09:45PM

Tony EH · 15-08-2019 11:05PM

raze_them_all_ wrote: »

You can hang yourself from a sink

No, you can strangle yourself, but it certainly isn't easy and it takes an enormous amount of willpower to actually do it.

tuxy · 15-08-2019 11:16PM

Tony EH wrote: »

No, you can strangle yourself, but it certainly isn't easy and it takes an enormous amount of willpower to actually do it.

People frequently kill themselves in that way though. You could say it takes an enormous amount of willpower but it doesn't take an unusual amount or else it wouldn't happen so frequently.

Tony EH · 15-08-2019 11:18PM

tuxy wrote: »

People frequently kill themselves in that way though. You could say it takes an enormous amount of willpower but it doesn't take an unusual amount or else it wouldn't happen so frequently.

I don't know how "frequent" it is. But I certainly wouldn't say that it's a common way of checking out. There are easier ways. Much easier ways.

raze_them_all_ · 15-08-2019 11:19PM

Tony EH wrote: »

I don't know how "frequent" it is. But I certainly wouldn't say that it's a common way of checking out. There are easier ways. Much easier ways.

In a prison there isn't. You got blade, od or hanging.

Tony EH · 15-08-2019 11:23PM

raze_them_all_ wrote: »

In a prison there isn't. You got blade, od or hanging.

I'm not limiting it to a prison situation. But, if we're doing so, then maybe.

The point still remains, though, it takes an enormous amount of willpower to do it.

tuxy · 15-08-2019 11:35PM

Tony EH wrote: »

I'm not limiting it to a prison situation. But, if we're doing so, then maybe.

The point still remains, though, it takes an enormous amount of willpower to do it.

It's not even that unusual for kids to do it as a game, it was common in my school. Holding someones neck until they pass out then let go. The person gets a massive rush of euphoria as they wake up.
Blocking the carotid artery is far less painful than hanging with feet off the ground.

Tony EH · 15-08-2019 11:48PM

tuxy wrote: »

It's not even that unusual for kids to do it as a game, it was common in my school. Holding someones neck until they pass out then let go. The person gets a massive rush of euphoria as they wake up.
Blocking the carotid artery is far less painful than hanging with feet off the ground.

That's someone doing it to you though. That's not the same as strangling yourself.

Weird kids you "hung" around with. :pac:

tuxy · 16-08-2019 12:02AM

Tony EH wrote: »

That's someone doing it to you though. That's not the same as strangling yourself.

Weird kids you "hung" around with. :pac:

Yeah it wasn't the best school as you can probably tell but my point is it doesn't hurt much and it doesn't take long(about 1 minute) to lose consciousness. Asphyxiation is the most common type of suicide in many countries with low level of gun ownership. This is a method of asphyxiation that's less painful than hanging with feet off the ground, I don't think it's uncommon at all. All it takes is a very disturbed mindset. Some people even do it by accident when they go too far with auto erotic asphyxiation and pass out, so even people who are not suicidal will do this to themselves in some cases.

Pa ElGrande · 16-08-2019 08:53AM

So many questions

Of Epsteins, Lolitas and Hoaxes

Epstein was originally placed in a cell with a roommate, reported to have been a particularly violent ex-police officer. At some point, according to CNN, “that person was removed for reasons unknown.” The same unnamed source told CNN that “It’s protocol for inmates coming off suicide watch not to be placed alone in a cell.” A federal official told the nation’s most hilarious source of news that “no foul play was suspected.” An autopsy was performed August 11, but results have not yet been released. Michael Baden, a Fox News contributor known to JFK assassination researchers as a reliable establishment tool whose work with the House Select Committee on Assassinations concluded that Oswald acted alone, observed the proceedings.

Epstein was charged with sexual trafficking of underage girls in 2007, and received a “sweetheart deal” courtesy of future Trump Secretary of Labor Alexander Acosta, and future Trump nemesis Robert Mueller. He was arrested again in early July of this year, charged by New York prosecutors (among them the daughter of Trump nemesis James Comey) with operating a traffic ring of underage girls. Eyebrows were further raised when his trial date was postponed until next year, in a decidedly unusual move.

<snip>
According to Joseph Recarey, the lead detective on Epstein’s case, he was in effect operating a “sexual pyramid scheme.” Brown discovered about 80 women who claim they were molested or otherwise sexually abused by Epstein, and most assume the total number is much higher. “He told me he wanted them as young as I could find them,’’ Courtney Wild, who recruited 70 or 80 girls for Epstein, told Brown. “He wanted as many girls as I could get him. It was never enough.’’

<snip>

In March, the ninety six year old judge overseeing a key lawsuit against Epstein died. Now, at that age, sudden death is hardly unexpected. The question should be; what was a judge that old doing overseeing an important case? Are there 96 year old judges anywhere, overseeing any case?

source

Pa ElGrande · 16-08-2019 09:10AM

Jeffrey Epstein’s gal pal Ghislaine Maxwell spotted at In-N-Out Burger in first photos since his death

Maxwell, 57, the alleged madam to the multimillionaire pedophile, was scarfing down a burger, fries and shake al fresco at an In-N-Out Burger on Monday while reading “The Book of Honor: The Secret Lives and Deaths of CIA Operatives,” a nonfiction best seller by journalist Ted Gup.

Sitting alone with a pet pooch, she was surprised to be found and told an onlooker, “Well, I guess this is the last time I’ll be eating here!”

source

Jeffrey Epstein shipped $100K cement truck to 'Pedophile Island' three weeks before damning expose was released, paying for machine up front so it would arrive quicker, as experts say he could have 'literally covered up evidence'

Blood vessels in Jeffrey Epstein's eyes had popped and he had broken bones in his neck linked to hanging OR strangulation, autopsy reveals - as pedophile's mystery 'associate' claims the body

Jeffrey Epstein’s Bodyguard on His Former Boss’s Lifestyle, Cruelty, Suicide

In our conversation in 2015, you described his relationship with teenage girlfriends: “So many time I tried to stop him. I try to tell tell him my opinion about that. He don’t listen to me. That’s the reason why I’m not working for him no more. I make him do that — to let me go.” Do you remember saying that?

It’s not the teenage girls. I never see the teenage girls. I tell you I never see teenage girls.

Plenty of times when I work for him I never see anything unproper or teenage girls around him.

That’s what I say.

source

notobtuse · 16-08-2019 02:14PM

There is one thing that doesn’t make sense to me regarding all the theories he was offed… He continued his wicked ways even after he was given his sweetheart deal back in 2008. This means double jeopardy wouldn’t apply for anything he did after the deal. Since it seems most knew that he continued with illegal acts he would probably once again be charged. So, if people were worried of being exposed by him some time in the future, why not off him while he walked around free as a bird for 10 years? It would have been easy for the rich and powerful to make it look like an accident.

MadYaker · 16-08-2019 02:40PM

notobtuse wrote: »

There is one thing that doesn’t make sense to me regarding all the theories he was offed… He continued his wicked ways even after he was given his sweetheart deal back in 2008. This means double jeopardy wouldn’t apply for anything he did after the deal. Since it seems most knew that he continued with illegal acts he would probably once again be charged. So, if people were worried of being exposed by him some time in the future, why not off him while he walked around free as a bird for 10 years? It would have been easy for the rich and powerful to make it look like an accident.

It would have been easier to kill him before he was charged, but people who were afraid of him talking probably had no reason to want to kill him until he was arrested and charged. These people don’t live in the real world, they probably feel they are untouchable. You can see why Epstein might have felt that way when you consider the plea deal he got. I still don’t understand how there hasn’t been an investigation into that.

Cheerful Spring2 · 16-08-2019 02:58PM

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

So many questions

Of Epsteins, Lolitas and Hoaxes

It is interesting Michael Baden was there as an observer watching the autopsy. Not jumping to conclusions yet, he was in place to cover up Epstein was murdered. He did not perform the autopsy himself, we know this.

Epstein neck "hyoid bone was found to be broken, assuming here of course the Washington Post autopsy leaks are correct ? Its super rare to find a Hyoid bone broken when someone hangs themselves. The statistics vary but normally you find this bone breaks in just 20 per cent of hangings, and typically the other 80 percent ends up being a strangulation. When police learn the hyoid bone broken in a suicide case, they change course and they open a murder investigation.

The Medical staff who have done the Epstein autopsy have delayed releasing their results. This discovery is most likely reason why.

The worry here is they claim suicide yet its the less likely cause of death, especially if you place all the inconsistencies together with Epstein hyoid broken bone. MCC and the authorties might cover up a conspiracy occurred inside the jail. Epstein did it alone and MCC was just negligent, media groups like CNN and CBS what you to believe this already, i fear we going to end up in a coverup situation. I hope i am wrong.

Alrigghtythen · 16-08-2019 03:00PM

notobtuse wrote: »

There is one thing that doesn’t make sense to me regarding all the theories he was offed… He continued his wicked ways even after he was given his sweetheart deal back in 2008. This means double jeopardy wouldn’t apply for anything he did after the deal. Since it seems most knew that he continued with illegal acts he would probably once again be charged. So, if people were worried of being exposed by him some time in the future, why not off him while he walked around free as a bird for 10 years? It would have been easy for the rich and powerful to make it look like an accident.

Who would the go to get underage children from if they killed him?

notobtuse · 16-08-2019 03:05PM

Alrigghtythen wrote: »

Who would the go to get underage children from if they killed him?

I think many powerful would be far more worried about being exposed and spending decades in jail than Epstein’s ability to find underage girls for them.

tigger123 · 16-08-2019 03:57PM

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

This may end up like the JFK conspiracy. Who killed Epstein?

You reckon Lee Harvey Oswald killed Epstein?

Jeffrey Epstein arrested on sex trafficking charges

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