Insignia engine gone?

trinewbie · 04-07-2019 03:59PM #1

Hi Folks - Have an insignia with roughly 190Kms on the clock. Engine seized last week and diagnosis from local garage is crankshaft seized, and likely pistons snapped/ valves bent so new engine or full rebuild required. Given the age of the car, its potential value, and the cost of a reconditioned engine/ rebuild , its not really an option.

The thing that is bugging me is that there were no warning signs, no knocking noises, nothing, just packed up suddenly. The same garage replaced the oil pump only two months ago, I trust them, but cant help feeling there might be a correlation. .. feel I should get a second opinion...thoughts?

colm_mcm · 04-07-2019 04:10PM

Google insignia engine failure.

04-07-2019 04:28PM

That a bummer as you tried to do the right thing getting the oil pump replaced instead of waiting for it to die. Hopefully the garage will help you with getting the car back on the road. It does sound like they could have made a mistake installing the new pump. If I remember it correctly the issue with them is that some plastic component/pipe/strainer breaks off from the pump and the engine is then starved from oil almost without a warning. Could it be that the same thing happened with the new setup too?

Midnight_EG · 04-07-2019 04:30PM

Certainly wouldn't be like an Insignia to pop an engine :eek:

Cordell · 04-07-2019 04:41PM

Why was the oil pump replaced?

04-07-2019 04:45PM

It actually seems that the issue with the 2.0 is that an O-ring between the oil galley in the block and the pickup stainer hardens and results in gradually worsening oil starvation. Did the garage really replace the oil pump or only that seal? If the seal was replaced there is a possibility of the symptoms returning if the the seal continues to be bad.

If the car was already suffering from low oil pressure two months ago (=i.e. there were symptoms which prompted you to get the repair done) it could just be that the damage was already done and the engine finally failed now due to the issues earlier this year.

trinewbie · 04-07-2019 05:06PM

samih wrote: »

It actually seems that the issue with the 2.0 is that an O-ring between the oil galley in the block and the pickup stainer hardens and results in gradually worsening oil starvation. Did the garage really replace the oil pump or only that seal? If the seal was replaced there is a possibility of the symptoms returning if the the seal continues to be bad.

If the car was already suffering from low oil pressure two months ago (=i.e. there were symptoms which prompted you to get the repair done) it could just be that the damage was already done and the engine finally failed now due to the issues earlier this year.

Got the work done following a low oil pressure error, stopped car immediately and got it towed. Pump was replaced, along with bottom end gasket set (as per invoice) , was driving fine until last week, then went without warning. Not arguing with the engine being totaled now, but I guess I'm questioning the garage doing the pump and gasket and whether or not they should have known at the time that it was going to be in vain.

Cordell · 04-07-2019 05:14PM

They should have known the Insignia issues and advise you to go for a full check of the crankshaft bearings (expensive to the point of not being worth it) before just replacing the pump. Before you got the error the oil pressure was marginally over the pressure switch threshold, which is enough to keep it off but still cause oil starvation.

trinewbie · 04-07-2019 05:20PM

Cordell wrote: »

They should have known the Insignia issues and advise you to go for a full check of the crankshaft bearings (expensive to the point of not being worth it) before just replacing the pump. Before you got the error the oil pressure was marginally over the pressure switch threshold, which is enough to keep it off but still cause oil starvation.

Cheers - thought I should have been advised alright. No recourse now though unfortunately I think.

Bigmac1euro · 04-07-2019 05:26PM

Do you mind me asking what year was the insignia ?

04-07-2019 05:27PM

trinewbie wrote: »

Got the work done following a low oil pressure error, stopped car immediately and got it towed. Pump was replaced, along with bottom end gasket set (as per invoice) , was driving fine until last week, then went without warning. Not arguing with the engine being totaled now, but I guess I'm questioning the garage doing the pump and gasket and whether or not they should have known at the time that it was going to be in vain.

YMMV, and sounds like unfortunately you did not win this time. Reading about the issue it appears that the prognosis for successful recovery is bad and once you see the low oil pressure message you have already had weeks/months of cold starts with reduced oil flow without a warning. The Insignia warning system seem to allow the engine to run with low oil pressure for quite some time without triggering the warning which would be a normal situation when starting the engine at extreme low temperatures.

At the start the O-ring leaks just enough to create a small void in the pickup tube but even then the engine does run with reduced oil pressure while the bubbles go through the oil pump and upstream the system. Eventully it takes long enough for the oil pressure to build up for the car to show a warning but at the stage there have already been excess air bubbles in the oil circuit.

The garage could have done more at the time. One option would have been to crack open the main journals when the sump was out. They would most likely have seen wear in the bearings. Anyway, it's too late now. You can talk to the garage to ask if they did inspected anything two months ago. The oil filter and the drained oil could have been checked for contamination by the bearing metal. With perfect 20/20 vision that really should have been done in case like this when the symptoms are low oil pressure and it's a known issue with the engine.

Hurrache · 04-07-2019 06:36PM

samih wrote: »

It does sound like they could have made a mistake installing the new pump. If I remember it correctly the issue with them is that some plastic component/pipe/strainer breaks off from the pump and the engine is then starved from oil almost without a warning. Could it be that the same thing happened with the new setup too?

I think it's a seal around the pick up that gets brittle so it's like sucking through a cracked straw and starves of oil.

grogi · 04-07-2019 06:48PM

trinewbie wrote: »

Got the work done following a low oil pressure error, stopped car immediately and got it towed. Pump was replaced, along with bottom end gasket set (as per invoice) , was driving fine until last week, then went without warning. Not arguing with the engine being totaled now, but I guess I'm questioning the garage doing the pump and gasket and whether or not they should have known at the time that it was going to be in vain.

In response to the o-ring fiasco, Opel just disabled the warning light with software update. It doesn't show until it is too late. If it showed an error, the engine was already toasted

Gorgeousgeorge · 04-07-2019 07:04PM

Same happened Sunday evening to a friends. Oil pressure warning light came on he stopped immediately and it was still to late it locked up solid. It's a 2011 with 180000 km.

trinewbie · 04-07-2019 10:19PM

Gorgeousgeorge wrote: »

Same happened Sunday evening to a friends. Oil pressure warning light came on he stopped immediately and it was still to late it locked up solid. It's a 2011 with 180000 km.

Bummer. Read elsewhere that the bottom end was reworked sometime after 2012 so shouldn’t be as prevalent an issue in later years - doesn’t help me ,or your friends :-( .

Left with a massive sour taste with opel / vauxhall after this ,owned the car since 2012 and have had nothing but hassle ,new turbo, power steering pump , oil pump , gear selector , turbo hoses , electrical issue ,the list goes on ! Can safely say I’ll never drive one again , and will avoid the garage used in future .

zilog_jones · 05-07-2019 04:18PM

I wouldn't discount Opel now they're owned by Peugeot since 2017, and not GM. So all new platforms, engines, etc. are totally unrelated to what came before. But they might want to make some interesting cars first...

Cordell · 05-07-2019 04:25PM

By today's standards the new Insignia is indeed bland and uninteresting, but the original one was quite interesting when it launched. The engine itself was not bad by any standard, except for this problem is quite reliable and preventive maintenance would fully prevent it - if only Opel would have chosen to recommend it rather than hide it with that software update. There are many other brands and models with more serious problems.

beauf · 05-07-2019 04:37PM

What's a more serious problem than one that destroys the engine to the point it's an economic write off?

Other than a safety issue that harms the occupants obviously.

Everyone I know who had one of these really liked the car. The repairs though broke their hearts and wallets. Does the Astra have the same engine? Don't hear as many issues with the Astra.

Cordell · 05-07-2019 04:47PM

beauf wrote: »

What's a more serious problem than one that destroys the engine to the point it's an economic write off?

The one that does the same but can't be solved by preventive maintenance. Or when the preventive maintenance can be an economic write off by itself.
This one happens usually well after 150k and can be solved and diagnosed well before it becomes serious. So for engine write-off causing issues this one is towards the low end of the scale

Cee-Jay-Cee · 05-07-2019 10:56PM

The only thing you can be absolutely 100% guaranteed of with an Insignia diesel is that the engine WILL **** itself at some stage.

06-07-2019 09:32AM

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

The only thing you can be absolutely 100% guaranteed of with an Insignia diesel is that the engine WILL **** itself at some stage.

Knowing what I know now if I had one of these 2.0 diesels that still works I would be dropping the sump today to replace that O-ring. And then same again every 5 years.

Now that's preventive maintenance

grogi · 06-07-2019 09:33AM

samih wrote: »

Knowing what I know now if I had one of these 2.0 diesels that still works I would be dropping the sump today to replace that O-ring. And then same again every 5 years.

Now that's preventive maintenance

That's exactly what you should be doing. Same in any AR 159

Hellrazer · 06-07-2019 11:07AM

grogi wrote: »

In response to the o-ring fiasco, Opel just disabled the warning light with software update. It doesn't show until it is too late. If it showed an error, the engine was already toasted

No they didn't. The software update was for an unrelated issue.
The issue is caused by poor maintenance. Most of them I see in the door has had the wrong oil used,a ****ty cheap oil filter or missed services.

realdanbreen · 06-07-2019 01:08PM

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

The only thing you can be absolutely 100% guaranteed of with an Insignia diesel is that the engine WILL **** itself at some stage.

Gulp! Would that also be the case with a Vauxhall Insignia? Just bought a 09 one.

realdanbreen · 06-07-2019 01:13PM

realdanbreen wrote: »

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

The only thing you can be absolutely 100% guaranteed of with an Insignia diesel is that the engine WILL **** itself at some stage.

Gulp! Would that also be the case with a Vauxhall Insignia? Just bought a 09 one.

BTW 140k on the clock.

bazz26 · 06-07-2019 01:40PM

realdanbreen wrote: »

Gulp! Would that also be the case with a Vauxhall Insignia? Just bought a 09 one.

They are the same car, just different badges.

grogi · 06-07-2019 03:08PM

Hellrazer wrote: »

No they didn't. The software update was for an unrelated issue.
The issue is caused by poor maintenance. Most of them I see in the door has had the wrong oil used,a ****ty cheap oil filter or missed services.

Yes they did. Heaps of clients complained about oil low pressure warning displayed shortly after starting the engine. GM simply calculated that the cost of replacing few engines that would fail during warranty was smaller that fixing the root of oil pressure problem. This wasn't a safety issue, so there wasn't to be a litigation fallback from it either. To silence the complaints, the warning was simply hidden.

GM was right: majority of the cars easily reached end of warranty period. Money saved, someone got bonus. The damage to already struggling brand is long lasting though.

CoBo55 · 06-07-2019 04:43PM

realdanbreen wrote: »

Gulp! Would that also be the case with a Vauxhall Insignia? Just bought a 09 one.

Get a dependable garage to drop the sump and replace the pickup seal.

Hellrazer · 06-07-2019 06:38PM

grogi wrote: »

Yes they did. Heaps of clients complained about oil low pressure warning displayed shortly after starting the engine. GM simply calculated that the cost of replacing few engines that would fail during warranty was smaller that fixing the root of oil pressure problem. This wasn't a safety issue, so there wasn't to be a litigation fallback from it either. To silence the complaints, the warning was simply hidden.

Have you any actual proof of this other than hearsay on the internet. Because you are completely wrong.

Hurrache · 06-07-2019 06:41PM

samih wrote: »

Knowing what I know now if I had one of these 2.0 diesels that still works I would be dropping the sump today to replace that O-ring. And then same again every 5 years.

Now that's preventive maintenance

I done it when changing the timing belt, but lost confidence in it regardless, mainly because of this site!

grogi · 06-07-2019 07:39PM

Hellrazer wrote: »

Have you any actual proof of this other than hearsay on the internet. Because you are completely wrong.

You clearly know better, share the details with us.

Insignia engine gone?

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