Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Healthy baby aborted at 15 weeks

Options
1…2425272930…55

Comments

  • Options
    #782
    stefanovich
    Registered Users Posts: 5,490 ✭✭✭stefanovich


    STB. wrote: »
    You need to get a grip of yourself. Constantly attacking other posters with your own moral compass.

    Unfortunately for you and your moral compass the constitutional ban on abortion was lifted by popular vote. Move on.

    People die in hospitals every day in every country because of wrong decisions/wrong scan results/wrong diagnosis. It wasn't a surprise that the pro-life lunatics jumped on this. We have moved far and away from putting all of this in religious orders hands thank fúck. They had their own way of doing things that certainly wasnt morally right.

    You are the one branding people lunatics. There are lots of people who are anti abortion that are also not religious.


  • Options
    #783
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    stefanovich wrote: »
    You are the one branding people lunatics. There are lots of people who are anti abortion that are also not religious.


    Lunatics who refuse to accept a democratic decision. Go judge somewhere else.


  • Options
    #784
    Caledonia
    Registered Users Posts: 152 ✭✭Caledonia


    See the parents are on about going to the DPP and the Attorney General because let’s face it - it’s not just a medical procedure. We can’t be that sanguine about it. They are facing the enormity of what they have lost.
    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    medical procedure went wrong, based on erroneous judgement/data

    common, lessons can be learned

    no reason to relitigate anything. its a process.


  • Options
    #785
    nullzero
    Registered Users Posts: 16,533 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    ****


    STB. wrote: »
    Lunatics who refuse to accept a democratic decision.

    In a democracy dissent is supposed to be encouraged.
    You can accept a decision whilst disagreeing with it.

    This is the main problem with people who aligned themselves with the repeal movement, a childish belief that all opinions divergent from their own being cast into some sort of abyss from where they should never be heard again.

    If the vote had gone the other way would the repeal movement have accepted it and never raised it again?


  • Options
    #786
    Mr.H
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,861 ✭✭✭Mr.H


    Faugheen wrote:
    Our laws don't allow for that. Our laws don't allow for abortions past the point which babies can survive outside of the womb. So your point is irrelevant.


    Well that is completely false. There is a small but real chance that a baby born before 20 weeks can live. In fact the youngest born was only 13 weeks which is 2 weeks younger than the one here.

    Have you any kids? You dont need to answer as it is a personal question. But one that you can think about yourself. Have you been for a 9 week scan, 12 week scan, 15 week scan, 20 week scan and so on. If you have then you do see when they start to form. I have a scan from 15 weeks and while it us blurry you can actually see some detail of my son in it. Its crazy how he was defined so early on and looks the exact same. The reason i ask is because quiet often people talk about stuff they know absolutely nothing about and purely because its popular opinion.

    Yes forced. The couple. Not just the woman, were told that their child would likely die very early on if it were born. The option was to go through with pregnancy and leave their child suffer for what little life they had, or have an abortion. Yes that is forcing someones decision. They were given the wrong information and if the laws didnt change they would have not been given the option. A healthy baby would have lived.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #787
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    nullzero wrote: »
    In a democracy dissent is supposed to be encouraged.
    You can accept a decision whilst disagreeing with it.

    This is the main problem with people who aligned themselves with the repeal movement, a childish belief that all opinions divergent from their own being cast into some sort of abyss from where they should never be heard again.

    If the vote had gone the other way would the repeal movement have accepted it and never raised it again?


    In a democracy, democratic decisions are meant to be respected. This vote overturned the previous in situ arrangements.

    Grasp all you want at straws.

    We certainly know how the democratic vote was respected by the minority.


  • Options
    #788
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    stefanovich wrote: »
    You are the one branding people lunatics. There are lots of people who are anti abortion that are also not religious.

    You can be anti abortion all you want, you just can’t interfere in anyone else’s choices.

    I fundementally disagree with pretty much everything you’ve posted on this thread, you a citizen of equal status as me, so why should I be forced to live my life arrested by your morals?
    Especially when I’m not trying to force mine on you?
    Your opinion is not superior to mine. Particularly when it concerns my own womb.

    There will be no mandatory abortions.
    You can continue to live your life without having one and thinking it’s wrong.
    You just don’t get to impose that view on anyone else any more.

    Abortion has always been in Ireland, abortion will always be in Ireland.
    Banning it doesn’t stop it from happening, so get off your moral high horse and respect that there are women and couples out there today in awful & tragic circumstances that you will never understand that will NEED that choice.
    And maybe be a bit more grateful that it’s a choice you don’t need yourself.


  • Options
    #789
    Caledonia
    Registered Users Posts: 152 ✭✭Caledonia


    STB. wrote: »

    People die in hospitals every day in every country because of wrong decisions/wrong scan results/wrong diagnosis.

    They might die but they are NOT actively terminated.


  • Options
    #790
    nullzero
    Registered Users Posts: 16,533 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    ****


    STB. wrote: »
    In democracy, democratic decisions are meant to be respected.


    Grasp all you want at straws.

    How am I grasping at straws?

    Could you address what I said please?
    If Ireland had voted no should people on the yes side have never raised the issue again?


  • Options
    #791
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    Mr.H wrote: »
    Well that is completely false. There is a small but real chance that a baby born before 20 weeks can live. In fact the youngest born was only 13 weeks which is 2 weeks younger than the one here.

    Have you any kids? You dont need to answer as it is a personal question. But one that you can think about yourself. Have you been for a 9 week scan, 12 week scan, 15 week scan, 20 week scan and so on. If you have then you do see when they start to form. I have a scan from 15 weeks and while it us blurry you can actually see some detail of my son in it. Its crazy how he was defined so early on and looks the exact same. The reason i ask is because quiet often people talk about stuff they know absolutely nothing about and purely because its popular opinion.

    Yes forced. The couple. Not just the woman, were told that their child would likely die very early on if it were born. The option was to go through with pregnancy and leave their child suffer for what little life they had, or have an abortion. Yes that is forcing someones decision. They were given the wrong information and if the laws didnt change they would have not been given the option. A healthy baby would have lived.

    Link to the baby born alive at 13 weeks please? I believe the world record is held by a Canadian baby who was born at 21 weeks.
    I wouldn’t say there’s a ‘real’ chance babies born at 20 weeks can live when the world record for the most premature baby is 21 weeks.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #792
    nullzero
    Registered Users Posts: 16,533 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    ****


    STB. wrote: »
    In a democracy, democratic decisions are meant to be respected. This vote overturned the previous in situ arrangements.

    Grasp all you want at straws.

    We certainly know how the democratic vote was respected by the minority.

    You do realise that the eighth ammendment was something that was introduced to the constitution by means of a referendum in 1983 right?

    According to your logic that decision should have been respected and never challenged.

    Do you have any idea what your talking about?

    You can prove anything with facts...


  • Options
    #793
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,991 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    stefanovich wrote: »
    You are the one branding people lunatics. There are lots of people who are anti abortion that are also not religious.

    Were you not the one suggesting women be sectioned?


  • Options
    #794
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    nullzero wrote: »
    How am I grasping at straws?

    Could you address what I said please?
    If Ireland had voted no should people on the yes side have never raised the issue again?


    You are grasping at straws because you are using words like dissent in democracy whilst not having the cop on to realise that this is the very reason the referendum was raised to change something that the vast majority disagreed with in the first instance.

    That dissent has resulted in two thirds of the country voting in favour of repealing the 8th. Respect the democratic decision please.

    Even after the democracy had spoken, there were stupid legal challenges, graspers like yourself.
    nullzero wrote: »
    You do realise that the eighth ammendment was something that was introduced to the constitution by means of a referendum in 1983 right?

    According to your logic that decision should have been respected and never challenged.

    Do you have any idea what your talking about?

    You can prove anything with facts...

    You do realise that it is no longer 1983, and that the 8th has been repealed by a democratic vote.

    I know what I am talking about and voted accordingly.

    Facts are that 75% agreed in Dublin and 66% nationwide.

    Its like talking to a simpleton.


  • Options
    #795
    stefanovich
    Registered Users Posts: 5,490 ✭✭✭stefanovich


    STB. wrote: »
    Lunatics who refuse to accept a democratic decision. Go judge somewhere else.

    Are you talking about remainers?


  • Options
    #796
    nullzero
    Registered Users Posts: 16,533 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    ****


    STB. wrote: »
    You are grasping at straws because you are using words like dissent in democracy whilst not having the cop on to realise that this is the very reason the referendum was raised to change something that the vast majority disagreed with in the first instance.

    That dissent has resulted in two thirds of the country voting in favour of repealing the 8th. Respect the democratic decision please.

    Even after the democracy had spoken, there were stupid legal challenges, graspers like yourself.

    Do you propose that it should be a criminal offence to express opinions which do not agree with abortion?

    If not I have no idea what you're getting at.

    You have shown a complete lack of insight into how things work in a democracy, your argument was poor and now your nose is out of joint because you were pulled up on it, and surprise surprise you revert to snide comments.
    You have also failed to answer simple questions and instead have resorted to personal abuse.

    EDIT. The points I've raised are valid, your cognitive dissonance is astounding and as much as I'd love to take you to task on your frankly comical contribution here I have had to report your post for the comment you made comparing me to a simpleton, so I'm just going to let the moderators deal with this from here. If you can't be civil I'm not going to talk to you.


  • Options
    #797
    cournioni
    Moderators, Regional North East Moderators Posts: 12,739 Mod ✭✭✭✭cournioni


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    The pregnancy whilst it exists is part of her body, your attitude is one of extreme ignorance tbh.

    How many toes does the mother have while she is pregnant? Twenty? On the contrary, I think your attitude is extremely ignorant towards the baby tbh.


  • Options
    #798
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    cournioni wrote:
    How many toes does the mother have while she is pregnant? Twenty?


    Same as before she is pregnant 10 and the same after. Now the foetus depends on the stage of development. Any other stupid question you'd like to pose?


  • Options
    #799
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    nullzero wrote: »
    Do you propose that it should be a criminal offence to express opinions which do not agree with abortion?

    If not I have no idea what you're getting at.

    You have shown a complete lack of insight into how things work in a democracy, your argument was poor and now your nose is out of joint because you were pulled up on it, and surprise surprise you revert to snide comments.


    It is you that has shown a complete lack of respect or understanding for democratic decisions.

    Your pissed off because it didn't agree with your moral sensibilities. You'll have to get over that I am afraid.

    Like I said grasping at straws.
    cournioni wrote: »
    How many toes does the mother have while she is pregnant? Twenty? On the contrary, I think your attitude is extremely ignorant towards the baby tbh.

    Ignorant, disgusting. You don't have much of a vocabulary do you.

    Here's a sentence for you containing both. I think its disgusting that you don't wish to respect a democratic decision made by the people of Ireland and I think you are ignorant in your responses to posters here. Whoever's decision it was to allow you mod a forum with such an attitude needs to take a second look at the manner in which you respond to posters here.


  • Options
    #800
    stefanovich
    Registered Users Posts: 5,490 ✭✭✭stefanovich


    STB. wrote: »
    It is you that has shown a complete lack of respect or understanding for democratic decisions.

    Your pissed off because it didn't agree with your moral sensibilities. You'll have to get over that I am afraid.

    Like I said grasping at straws.

    It's funny how the left defends democracy when it is in their favour but are utterly hostile towards it when it goes against.


  • Options
    #801
    cournioni
    Moderators, Regional North East Moderators Posts: 12,739 Mod ✭✭✭✭cournioni


    STB. wrote: »
    You need to get a grip of yourself. Constantly attacking other posters with your own moral compass.

    Unfortunately for you and your moral compass the constitutional ban on abortion was lifted by popular vote. Move on.

    People die in hospitals every day in every country because of wrong decisions/wrong scan results/wrong diagnosis. It wasn't a surprise that the pro-life lunatics jumped on this. We have moved far and away from putting all of this in religious orders hands thank fúck. They had their own way of doing things that certainly wasnt morally right.
    That’s all fine and well, but my vote didn’t contribute towards the death of a viable baby, the “popular” one did. Then again, sheep don’t have to be all that clever.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #802
    nullzero
    Registered Users Posts: 16,533 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    ****


    stefanovich wrote: »
    It's funny how the left defends democracy when it is in their favour but are utterly hostile towards it when it goes against.

    Cognitive dissonance.

    I wish I could say I'm shocked by people thanking the type of abusive claptrap that user posted but thats the triablism of identity politics in action. Pathetic weak arguments and childish behaviour.


  • Options
    #803
    volchitsa
    Registered Users Posts: 7,118 ✭✭✭volchitsa


    Mr.H wrote: »
    Well that is completely false. There is a small but real chance that a baby born before 20 weeks can live. In fact the youngest born was only 13 weeks which is 2 weeks younger than the one here.

    Have you any kids? You dont need to answer as it is a personal question. But one that you can think about yourself. Have you been for a 9 week scan, 12 week scan, 15 week scan, 20 week scan and so on. If you have then you do see when they start to form. I have a scan from 15 weeks and while it us blurry you can actually see some detail of my son in it. Its crazy how he was defined so early on and looks the exact same. The reason i ask is because quiet often people talk about stuff they know absolutely nothing about and purely because its popular opinion.

    This from the poster who says that babies have survived at under 15 weeks gestation.
    13 weeks? You must know this is impossible. Are you lying or just deeply ignorant about pregnancy?
    Wiki he say:
    In 2014, Lyla Stensrud, born in San Antonio, Texas, U.S. became the youngest premature baby in the world. She was born at 21 weeks 4 days and weighed 410 grams (less than a pound). Kaashif Ahmad resuscitated the baby after she was born. As of November 2018, Lyla was attending preschool. She had a slight delay in speech, but no other known medical issues or disabilities.[150]

    Amillia Taylor is also often cited as the most premature baby.[151] She was born on 24 October 2006 in Miami, Florida, U.S. at 21 weeks and 6 days' gestation.[152] This report has created some confusion as her gestation was measured from the date of conception (through in vitro fertilization) rather than the date of her mother's last menstrual period, making her appear 2 weeks younger than if gestation was calculated by the more common method.[135] At birth, she was 9 inches (22.9 cm) long and weighed 10 ounces (280 g).[151] She suffered digestive and respiratory problems, together with a brain hemorrhage. She was discharged from the Baptist Children's Hospital on 20 February 2007.


    And that's not taking into account the likely consequences on the child even when it does survive.
    Mr.H wrote: »
    Yes forced. The couple. Not just the woman, were told that their child would likely die very early on if it were born. The option was to go through with pregnancy and leave their child suffer for what little life they had, or have an abortion. Yes that is forcing someones decision. They were given the wrong information and if the laws didnt change they would have not been given the option. A healthy baby would have lived.
    The only way they wouldn't have had the same wrong information is if the UK hospital they would have had to go to instead had given them the right information.

    Isn't that a reason to improve Irish hospital system and procedures, rather than banning the medical intervention?

    Do you think we should add a ban on ending ectopic pregnancies too, since a woman recently died in the same hospital when that procedure was botched? They had to send out to a pub for ice FFS.

    Here's a radical idea: we need to improve Irish hospitals in general, and make all procedures safer, not ban them one by one every time a hospital gets something wrong.


  • Options
    #804
    stefanovich
    Registered Users Posts: 5,490 ✭✭✭stefanovich


    cournioni wrote: »
    That’s all fine and well, but my vote didn’t contribute towards the death of a viable baby, the “popular” one did. Then again, sheep don’t have to be all that clever.

    NPC-13-groupthink-992x1024.jpg


  • Options
    #805
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    cournioni wrote:
    Then again, sheep don’t have to be all that clever.


    I don't have an issue with a Mod posting, I'm just surprised your behaviour in this thread so far is tolerated. A regular poster would not get the latitude you have gotten so far.


  • Options
    #806
    Mr.H
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,861 ✭✭✭Mr.H


    SusieBlue wrote:
    Link to the baby born alive at 13 weeks please? I believe the world record is held by a Canadian baby who was born at 21 weeks. I wouldn’t say there’s a ‘real’ chance babies born at 20 weeks can live when the world record for the most premature baby is 21 weeks.


    Ill see if i can find the link later. It was a documentary i was watching. I think the couple where australian. The documentary was nothing to do with the baby. It was about frakking companies destroying small towns. They were saying the baby being born that premature was a reaction to the chemicals etc. Im out and about at the moment with the little one and ill have more time later if your genuinely interested.

    But if not then dont get blinded by my obvious facetious point. The statement i replied to was "a woman can choose to do what she wants with her body". Its not as simple as that. That one line means a woman can have an abortion up to the second before birth. The sentence is too open ended. Therefore an invalid opinion. I agree with abortion. I voted for it ffs. But i also believe in science and my own experience of seeing how early my unborn son started to develope.


  • Options
    #807
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    stefanovich wrote: »
    It's funny how the left defends democracy when it is in their favour but are utterly hostile towards it when it goes against.


    The left ? I think you have confused me with somebody else.
    cournioni wrote: »
    That’s all fine and well, but my vote didn’t contribute towards the death of a viable baby, the “popular” one did. Then again, sheep don’t have to be all that clever.

    You mean you didnt get a choice in someone else's private and difficult decision.

    Don't refer to the democratic electorate as sheep just because they didn't agree with you. That's just childish, disrespectful and ignorant.


  • Options
    #808
    stefanovich
    Registered Users Posts: 5,490 ✭✭✭stefanovich


    nullzero wrote: »
    Cognitive dissonance.

    I'm not sure can even be described as cognitive dissonance. I think the correct term is stupid.


  • Options
    #809
    cournioni
    Moderators, Regional North East Moderators Posts: 12,739 Mod ✭✭✭✭cournioni


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Same as before she is pregnant 10 and the same after. Now the foetus depends on the stage of development. Any other stupid question you'd like to pose?
    Thank you for answering my question. So then you agree that the ridiculous opinion that it is just the woman’s body is completely wrong?


  • Options
    #810
    stefanovich
    Registered Users Posts: 5,490 ✭✭✭stefanovich


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    I don't have an issue with a Mod posting, I'm just surprised your behaviour in this thread so far is tolerated. A regular poster would not get the latitude you have gotten so far.

    They disagreed with you? I have seen all sorts of mods here hold strong views in all directions.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #811
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    cournioni wrote: »
    That’s all fine and well, but my vote didn’t contribute towards the death of a viable baby, the “popular” one did. Then again, sheep don’t have to be all that clever.

    Your No vote would have contributed to forcing distressed vulnerable women and couples to travel to foreign countries to obtain basic healthcare.
    Your No vote didn’t care if they were rape victims, victims of domestic violence, young teenagers, babies with FFA, women with cancer who needed treatment, or simply a woman who didn’t have the physical, financial or emotional means to cope with another child.
    Your No vote didn’t give a cr*p about that, it said ‘tough, I disagree with abortion so you have to stay pregnant’.
    That’s nothing to be proud of.


Advertisement