Housing Crisis

bsloepro · 10-04-2019 10:54AM

I’m one of the dads in these situations.
Almost 2 years ago my ex who has primary custody of my two children got 3 months notice, they would have to move out of the house they lived in since our seperation almost 10 years ago. For a start rather than try and get a plan together she decided to go on holidays for 3 weeks to forget about it. Upon return refused totally to talk about it just telling me it would all work out. The 3 months started to pass by and coming close to the end of it communication broke down altogether and she refused to talk about it at all. I started to have serious concerns she was going to move into emergency accommodation with the kids, to try and get on the housing list as one of her friends had done it, had good success and got a house in castleknock next to the school her 5 kids were in. I offered to find accommodation for her In the commuter belt town I live in...she wasn’t having it. She moved into a hotel over 18 months ago not far from red cow roundabout. To rent a room there for a night at the weekend costs 150 euros. Last summer she was moved out of there into a similarly decent hotel in Dublin 4 - Ballsbridge - she been there since. In this whole time I have continued to pay her the court ordered maintenance of 1250 euros a month that is supposed to cover my share of their accommodation, food, and school costs. In this whole time she’s taken the money and paid for nothing - if I go back to court she submits an affidavit of means with no backup paperwork, regardless of me having receipts for everything, so withholding money is not an option, leads to too much fighting and considerable stress for the kids who have enough on their plate. I am court ordered to have them stay with me two (week) nights a week. I have a 2 bedroom apartment 30 mins from where they go to school, and to avoid them having to stay in said hotel, they stay with me, in their own rooms, I sleep (and gladly) on a mattress on the sitting room floor and have not had a room for two years. I get up at 6 to make them lunch and drop them to school before work and drive back to do a days work. I pay for their bus back over to mine in the evenings. I get paid about 3500 cash a month, pay her 1250, 1100 for my own rent, and then cover all other costs, bills, car costs, diesel, activities etc, if I don’t cover costs like uniforms, school books, glasses, birthdays, Xmas - they will go (and have) to school with nothing, or get nothing for their birthday, etc...I’ll take the hit rather than see this happen. She’s deluded - and currently will only look for suitable properties in Ballsbridge (and before that Dublin 15) that cost around 2000 a month rent, if she finds one of these she believes she will (and I have no reason to doubt based on other stories I heard), get that paid for her on HAP, and get 2 months deposit paid for her- 6000 to move in basically. She’s turned down two houses found for her so far by council obecause she didn’t like the look of the neighbours. Does she work ? Not at all - she been doing third level courses for 7 years now. I don’t know how this craic can happen, the government covering all this (hotel fees, rent, deposits and whatever else) while me and many others are out busting our balls to make ends meet. It’s totally unsustainable and unreasonable - if everybody did it where would we be.

Paddy Cow · 10-04-2019 10:59AM

john4321 wrote: »

Its shocking the state can only provide poor Sarah Jane with €450 per week for rent (HAP) + €237 One-Parent Family + child + €35 children's allowance + medical card etc. I can see why she is crying it must be with laughter.

https://twitter.com/RTE_PrimeTime/status/1115709947474534400

"The only way to live in this country is to get your social house". That sums up the entitlement generation perfectly :rolleyes:

Lillyfae · 10-04-2019 11:06AM

bsloepro wrote: »

In this whole time I have continued to pay her the court ordered maintenance of 1250 euros a month that is supposed to cover my share of their accommodation, food, and school costs. In this whole time she’s taken the money and paid for nothing - if I go back to court she submits an affidavit of means with no backup paperwork, regardless of me having receipts for everything, so withholding money is not an option, leads to too much fighting and considerable stress for the kids who have enough on their plate. I am court ordered to have them stay with me two (week) nights a week. I have a 2 bedroom apartment 30 mins from where they go to school, and to avoid them having to stay in said hotel, they stay with me, in their own rooms, I sleep (and gladly) on a mattress on the sitting room floor and have not had a room for two years. I get up at 6 to make them lunch and drop them to school before work and drive back to do a days work. I pay for their bus back over to mine in the evenings. I get paid about 3500 cash a month, pay her 1250, 1100 for my own rent, and then cover all other costs, bills, car costs, diesel, activities etc, if I don’t cover costs like uniforms, school books, glasses, birthdays, Xmas - they will go (and have) to school with nothing, or get nothing for their birthday, etc...I’ll take the hit rather than see this happen.

Your children will thank you in the future for giving them a good role model. I'd suggest you talk to a lawyer, if she's refusing paid for suitable accommodation and would rather haul them around the city to various hotels then she's unfit imo. A shared custody agreement might make a difference to you financially. It's beyond me why it's up to you to fund her and not just your children.

Undividual · 10-04-2019 11:08AM

One eyed Jack wrote: »

They do, because just like yourself they’re quite fond of looking down on people less fortunate than themselves. They’re not interested in the answers to the tough questions though or coming up with viable solutions, they tend to be more interested in acting the prick under the guise of feigning concern for the children.

Nice argument. Seems to me to be a genuine problem.

I know a single mother who had a child with a drug addict (she was on drugs at the time), who works, attends counselling and is thinking about going back to college. I have no problem with that kind of person. The kind of person I have a problem with is one who has no intention of working / repaying to society what they have received.

Without hypothesizing others' motivations, why don't you give us a viable solution?

Pronto63 · 10-04-2019 11:16AM

One eyed Jack wrote: »

They do, because just like yourself they’re quite fond of looking down on people less fortunate than themselves. They’re not interested in the answers to the tough questions though or coming up with viable solutions, they tend to be more interested in acting the prick under the guise of feigning concern for the children.

Who asks the tough question?
From the media, who asks them?

10-04-2019 11:16AM

Paddy Cow wrote: »

"The only way to live in this country is to get your social house". That sums up the entitlement generation perfectly :rolleyes:

Do you rent now paddy or have you rented?

You know the rental prices have gone bonkers in the last few years don't you?

My working friends and myself got badly squeezed by rental prices, and the lack of places available, and we didn't have kids to worry about.

Padraig Mor · 10-04-2019 11:19AM

Dalomanakora wrote: »

But at the same time, I can't massively begrudge single mothers. With the price of childcare, they'd be working purely to pay for said childcare, they wouldn't afford private rent on top of that. The system is broken when it's financially better for a single mother to stay on welfare than to work. .

Welfare scroungers get free or heavily subsidised childcare - even if they're not working! I've even seen posters here say that they (working full time) couldn't get their kids into creches as most of the places were held for welfare types, including those that would arrive in their pyjamas to drop off their kids, before heading back home to bed.

Lillyfae · 10-04-2019 11:20AM

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Do you rent now paddy or have you rented?

You know the rental prices have gone bonkers in the last few years don't you?

My working friends and myself got badly squeezed by rental prices, and the lack of places available, and we didn't have kids to worry about.

You do realise that you're in competition with the people demanding to be housed by the government- defacto your working friends and yourself- don't you? Except these people aren't held back by such trivialities as household budgeting

Pronto63 · 10-04-2019 11:21AM

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

Social housing priority should be given to working parent(s), not scroungers who have never worked a day in their entire lives and are trying to game the system.

+ 1

I don't know how social housing is allocated.

In my opinion there should be a large weighting given towards work history.

Social housing, and yes the government should build much more, should be for low paid workers. Productive members of society.

The only productive thing that young lady has done is reproduce!!

10-04-2019 11:22AM

Lillyfae wrote: »

If someone buys a house then yes, that is a reflection of their status and wealth. If the property prices are pushed up because some scrounger expects the taxpayer to fund a house in that area then is it any wonder why said taxpayer is outraged that they can't live there? If they're being outbid by a housing association who will provide it basically free of charge to someone who doesn't work??

How do you know they won't be working?, have you a link on how many houses are being purchased by housing associations? I am not being rude to you or your point but so far this thread has not turned in to a self-righteous frenzy when the anecdotes start is usually the turning point.

Paddy Cow · 10-04-2019 11:23AM

Maeve Deep Species wrote: »

Well, there should be! Somebody who is working full-time should have more disposable income than somebody who never intends to lift a finger.

TomSweeney wrote: »

Less fortunate ?
She's making €2,888 CLEAN a month for nothing, she is a lot better off than me !!

After Tax I earn €2,500 and I have 2 kids and pay a mortgage - fair enough I live in Spain, costs are less ... but this is ****ing crazy!!!

The problem with lifetime benefit scroungers, is that they have no real concept of disposable income. The woman getting €2,888 a month doesn't consider she's getting that much because €1,875 goes direct to the landlord, which "only" leaves her with €700. As far as she's concerned, the government should be giving her more because she has to pay bills, buy food etc. Boo hoo. More than likely she has a medical card. Again, she won't see that as getting money from the government because she has never had to go out and earn to pay for health care. She sees it as just another entitlement to take for granted.

People like this won't go out and get a job because they simply do not have the skills or experience to get at job that would pay more than their benefits. It's crazy that she's cribbing about having to pay €125 a month for a two bed apartment in Dublin. Working people pay that and more just for a room in a house share and she's crying about thirty euro for her own place? :mad:

And yet some posters think people are just looking down on the less fortunate :rolleyes:

Paddy Cow · 10-04-2019 11:25AM

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Do you rent now paddy or have you rented?

You know the rental prices have gone bonkers in the last few years don't you?

My working friends and myself got badly squeezed by rental prices, and the lack of places available, and we didn't have kids to worry about.

If you had kids and the government offered you an apartment in Dublin where your contribution to the rent would be €35 a week, would you take it or be humming and hawing? I know which option I'd take

Trump Is Right · 10-04-2019 11:25AM

bri007 wrote: »

Try paying €400-600 a week rent.... the bills are also crazy at the moment! A friend of mine is renting and he can’t afford to top up his electricity meter. He has worked since leaving school over 15 years ago and just works to pay his rent, thing is he never once complains just gets on with it.

If I was facing those kinds of rent rates, I would simply refuse to pay that...

I would rather sleep in my car or camp out in a tent, and just get a gym membership for shower and toilet facilities. Partly on a point of principal - because those rates are scandalous, but also just because I would not be able to keep working hard everyday and stomach that situation. I would lose my mind paying that...

And if more people got creative and refused to pay those extortionate rates, you might find that they will start to go down in time! You need to take a stand against that kind of nonsense!

bsloepro · 10-04-2019 11:26AM

Lillyfae wrote: »

Your children will thank you in the future for giving them a good role model. I'd suggest you talk to a lawyer, if she's refusing paid for suitable accommodation and would rather haul them around the city to various hotels then she's unfit imo. A shared custody agreement might make a difference to you financially. It's beyond me why it's up to you to fund her and not just your children.

There is a lot of sense to what you say - hard to argue with. Thing is, is once I keep paying the money, she lets them stay over as much as they want. If I don’t access goes back to minimum and they’re back in the hole, I’ve gone the tough route before with some success but the 3 months (minimum) it takes to get seen in the family court has been pure hell for everyone, and right now a combination of me not wanting to put the kids through that on top of everything else, as well as hoping it would get fixed in the next 3 months has put me off. I’ll take quality time with them, and quality of life for them over cash any day of the week. They are starting to see the wood from the trees here and it is her relationship with them she is damaging. They’re hitting the age where they can more or less decide where they want to stay and they are opting to spend more and more time at my place.

Cordell · 10-04-2019 11:27AM

amadangomor wrote: »

Socialism should be based on equality for people

Equality is a key concept in liberalism. As in equal rights, not outcomes...

amadangomor wrote: »

and everyone who can contributing to the social pact.

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs"
Karl Marx

But I agree with you, it's not socialism either, as evil as it may be socialism has very little sympathy for parasites.

10-04-2019 11:28AM

Lillyfae wrote: »

You do realise that you're in competition with the people demanding to be housed by the government- defacto your working friends and yourself- don't you? Except these people aren't held back by such trivialities as household budgeting

I do and there are some very very infuriating examples out there.... Erica was lovely on primetime, very different to her Twitter persona!:rolleyes:

But I believe that there are vunerable people genuinely in need of help, rental prices are gone insane. We rented a 3 bed apartment in Dublin a few years ago for 1500 pm, in the same block now a 2 bed is 1800 pm.

The situation is disastrous both for renters and for landlords who are getting out of the business in large numbers too.

Boom_Bap · 10-04-2019 11:33AM

I know I shouldn't be judging others, I really shouldn't, I don't know their full situation. But she is complaining about €35 euro a week and bills.....but she is wearing a pair of runners that retail at €210.
Someone concerned about money whilst wearing the most expensive retail runners for women is a puzzler for me.

Paddy Cow · 10-04-2019 11:34AM

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

I do and there are some very very infuriating examples out there.... Erica was lovely on primetime, very different to her Twitter persona!:rolleyes:

But I believe that there are vunerable people genuinely in need of help, rental prices are gone insane. We rented a 3 bed apartment in Dublin a few years ago for 1500 pm, in the same block now a 2 bed is 1800 pm.

The situation is disastrous both for renters and for landlords who are getting out of the business in large numbers too.

I rent in Galway. Six years ago €800 would rent you a good two bedroom apartment in the city centre. A couple I'm friends with moved into a one bedroom apartment before christmas and the rent was €850. It was only that cheap because they got a decent landlord who said he knew he could charge more rent for it but he didn't think it was worth it. Rents have gone insane. A combination of lack of new builds and a lot of LL's turning to Air BnB because they make more money and have less risk.

Idbatterim · 10-04-2019 11:34AM

Lads people aren’t really gaming the system. The system is just weak and pathetic. They’d be out of their minds not to do it. The scum in power have created an outrageous situation. One group of poor people work. The other group of poor people, don’t work , no commute. No stress. Probably better off financially in many cases. There is far too much money and resources going to the non workers. There need to be rent hikes for these people up to 30% of income in my opinion. Scrap Xmas bonus. No welfare hikes any more. One group are fcuked , because the other group are getting far more than their “fair share”..

Pronto63 · 10-04-2019 11:35AM

bri007 wrote: »

The point that poster I think was making was that people who are working, paying rent or mortgages have very little choice where they can buy or rent.

Also, is it too much to ask for someone renting or buying a house to not have to commute more than 100-200kms a day to get to and from work.... while people on RTÉ like last night can pick and choose where they want to live and decline it. People working haven’t that choice unfortunately due to high rents so yes they actually can’t pick where they like to rent or buy. I know plenty of friends from my way that have bought in border counties and do serious amount of mileage every week. They don’t get to see there kids until the weekend as they are up at 5:30 and not home until late evening.

I think the points people are trying to make on here is that working people have to take anything or anywhere to buy a house, but the frustrating thing is some that stay at home have more of a choice without the cost involved!

So the social housing should be for these commuters. Would reduce the states carbon footprint also.

Years ago if you couldn't afford to move out of your ma's, guess what?

You lived at home, got a job, saved up and then moved!

Not an option for this young lady though.

Paddy Cow · 10-04-2019 11:35AM

Boom_Bap wrote: »

I know I shouldn't be judging others, I really shouldn't, I don't know their full situation. But she is complaining about €35 euro a week and bills.....but she is wearing a pair of runners that retail at €210.
Someone concerned about money whilst wearing the most expensive retail runners for women is a puzzler for me.

I shouldn't judge or speculate either but maybe she knows someone who was able to get them on the cheap for her

Boom_Bap · 10-04-2019 11:38AM

Paddy Cow wrote: »

I shouldn't judge or speculate either but maybe she knows someone who was able to get them on the cheap for her

There could be any number of reasons, they could have been a gift, could have been a loaner for her spot on TV....

Pronto63 · 10-04-2019 11:44AM

bsloepro wrote: »

I’m one of the dads in these situations.
Almost 2 years ago my ex who has primary custody of my two children got 3 months notice, they would have to move out of the house they lived in since our seperation almost 10 years ago. For a start rather than try and get a plan together she decided to go on holidays for 3 weeks to forget about it. Upon return refused totally to talk about it just telling me it would all work out. The 3 months started to pass by and coming close to the end of it communication broke down altogether and she refused to talk about it at all. I started to have serious concerns she was going to move into emergency accommodation with the kids, to try and get on the housing list as one of her friends had done it, had good success and got a house in castleknock next to the school her 5 kids were in. I offered to find accommodation for her In the commuter belt town I live in...she wasn’t having it. She moved into a hotel over 18 months ago not far from red cow roundabout. To rent a room there for a night at the weekend costs 150 euros. Last summer she was moved out of there into a similarly decent hotel in Dublin 4 - Ballsbridge - she been there since. In this whole time I have continued to pay her the court ordered maintenance of 1250 euros a month that is supposed to cover my share of their accommodation, food, and school costs. In this whole time she’s taken the money and paid for nothing - if I go back to court she submits an affidavit of means with no backup paperwork, regardless of me having receipts for everything, so withholding money is not an option, leads to too much fighting and considerable stress for the kids who have enough on their plate. I am court ordered to have them stay with me two (week) nights a week. I have a 2 bedroom apartment 30 mins from where they go to school, and to avoid them having to stay in said hotel, they stay with me, in their own rooms, I sleep (and gladly) on a mattress on the sitting room floor and have not had a room for two years. I get up at 6 to make them lunch and drop them to school before work and drive back to do a days work. I pay for their bus back over to mine in the evenings. I get paid about 3500 cash a month, pay her 1250, 1100 for my own rent, and then cover all other costs, bills, car costs, diesel, activities etc, if I don’t cover costs like uniforms, school books, glasses, birthdays, Xmas - they will go (and have) to school with nothing, or get nothing for their birthday, etc...I’ll take the hit rather than see this happen. She’s deluded - and currently will only look for suitable properties in Ballsbridge (and before that Dublin 15) that cost around 2000 a month rent, if she finds one of these she believes she will (and I have no reason to doubt based on other stories I heard), get that paid for her on HAP, and get 2 months deposit paid for her- 6000 to move in basically. She’s turned down two houses found for her so far by council obecause she didn’t like the look of the neighbours. Does she work ? Not at all - she been doing third level courses for 7 years now. I don’t know how this craic can happen, the government covering all this (hotel fees, rent, deposits and whatever else) while me and many others are out busting our balls to make ends meet. It’s totally unsustainable and unreasonable - if everybody did it where would we be.

Fair play to you.

Primetime should do a special on your situation.

Family court and how your ex is "abusing" the kids and gaming the system.

xi5yvm0owc1s2b · 10-04-2019 11:46AM

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

But I believe that there are vunerable people genuinely in need of help, rental prices are gone insane. We rented a 3 bed apartment in Dublin a few years ago for 1500 pm, in the same block now a 2 bed is 1800 pm.

The combination of extortionate rents, high taxes, and crippling childcare costs mean that many working families are just struggling to get by, with no prospect of meaningful change on the horizon.

We are creating perverse incentives for young people, where somebody who drops out of school at 16 and gets pregnant can wind up in a better situation than somebody who studies hard, goes to college, and gets a professional job.

MintyMagnum · 10-04-2019 11:46AM

Maeve Deep Species wrote: »

Someone sitting pretty with her three or four kids, free house in Dublin, and generous state benefits is, in all reality, far more "fortunate" than some poor sod of a taxpayer commuting and working 11+ hours a day in the hopes of maybe someday being able to afford a home and family of his own.

And anyone who does work hard all their life can't leave their home or savings to their nearest and dearest without their relatives taxed a third of that as well.

Paddy Cow · 10-04-2019 11:48AM

MintyMagnum wrote: »

And anyone who does work hard all their life can't leave their home or savings to their nearest and dearest without their relatives taxed a third of that as well.

That's if there's anything left. If they have a heart attack and die, sure but if they get old and need nursing care, doesn't the government get to take a huge chunk to cover the cost or has that changed?

Mad_maxx · 10-04-2019 11:49AM

Yer Da sells Avon wrote: »

I'm sure what she meant was that she (or, more importantly, her kids) wouldn't have anywhere near the same level of long-term security with a privately-owned house as they would with a council-owned house.

The state should be building homes - and renting them to people at an affordable price - and not handing over huge amounts of money to private landlords.

Current system is cheaper as for every euro paid out in Hap, 50 cent comes back in taxes, add to that if the tenant ceases paying their modest monthly contribution, it's the landlord who has to deal with the problem while the council freezes the HAP payment

xi5yvm0owc1s2b · 10-04-2019 11:51AM

MintyMagnum wrote: »

And anyone who does work hard all their life can't leave their home or savings to their nearest and dearest without their relatives taxed a third of that as well.

Paddy Cow wrote: »

That's if there's anything left. If they have a heart attack and die, sure but if they get old and need nursing care, doesn't the government get to take a huge chunk to cover the cost or has that changed?

The "fair society" in action.

Paddy Cow · 10-04-2019 11:52AM

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Current system is cheaper as for every euro paid out in Hap, 50 cent comes back in taxes, add to that if the tenant ceases paying their modest monthly contribution, it's the landlord who has to deal with the problem while the council freezes the HAP payment

I thought the council pay the full rent to the LL and then takes the small contribution from the tenant's social welfare payment? That made it more appealing to landlords than rent allowance because tenants got RA as part of their social payment and were keeping it rather than passing it to the LL.

Mad_maxx · 10-04-2019 11:53AM

Maeve Deep Species wrote: »

Someone sitting pretty with her three or four kids, free house in Dublin, and generous state benefits is, in all reality, far more "fortunate" than some poor sod of a taxpayer commuting and working 11+ hours a day in the hopes of maybe someday being able to afford a home and family of his own.

You are of course correct but the free home brigade are " officially vulnerable"

Housing Crisis

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