Brexit discussion thread VIII (Please read OP before posting)

MrFresh wrote: »

Channel 4 interviewing a Labour MP who reckons the 5 MP who voted against the 3 line whip should resign. Says thee's no discipline in Parliament at the moment. Can't disagree with her there.

It's bang on

There has to be punishment other wise other MPs will see there's no repercussions and will continue to vote against the whip.

At least the conservatives MPs who voted for the indicative resigned from government and I have alot of respect for them

Headshot wrote: »

It's bang on

There has to be punishment other wise other MPs will see there's no repercussions and will continue to vote against the whip.

At least the conservatives MPs who voted for the indicative resigned from government and I have alot of respect for them

Considering the leader of the LP made it his mission to vote against the whip, it is hardly surprising that other folk see the merit in it

MrFresh wrote: »

Channel 4 interviewing a Labour MP who reckons the 5 MP who voted against the 3 line whip should resign. Says thee's no discipline in Parliament at the moment. Can't disagree with her there.

If there was vaguely functioning party discipline, the ERG would have been expelled en masse quite some time ago - when a smaller group and there was a working majority to do so - and there'd be new actually Tory candidates (because the ERG have basically become a party of their own) running against them

In many cases, you could put a blue rosette on a dead donkey and it'd get elected, meaning the ERG member would lose their seat. In others it'd split the vote sufficiently to get someone else in.

Similarly, Hoey's constituency would probably elect a dead donkey with a red rosette and she should have been expelled and replaced a decade or more ago!

And over here, Corbyn would have been expelled from the Labour Party in the late 80s and I suspect would probably have just vanished then, doubt he'd have got elected against them.

Irishmale0399 wrote: »

More like they are surplus to requirements now in London and are affraid TM or others will sacrifice NI to get the Brexit over the line.

Until there is a general election in which case the confidence and supply agreement ends for this current parliament they unfortunately do have power which they don't really deserve to have and it's only by political naivety from Theresa May when she really shouldn't have been naive.

Deleted User wrote: »

Are Yaxley-Lennon's crowd going to kick off tonight?

Probable

https://twitter.com/georginafstubbs/status/1111715367615901701

The DUP letting the ERG know if they're thrown under a bus, they may throw Brexit under their flute band. You couldn't write a script this good.

It looks to me like the prospects of a hard or no-deal Brexit are now vanishing. The indicative votes showed the appetite is more towards a customs union or a second referendum. The question is can May come up with some way of getting Brexiteers to realise her deal is as hard as it's going to get, or are the Tories hoping a general election will help them realign the numbers.

My sense is we're looking at a longer extension due to another general election but I've no idea what new mess that will throw up. I don't think that will alter the dynamic much at all.

boggerman1 wrote:

What has been unleashed by brexit will be hard to put back into the box

Agreed. Someone was telling me a few days back that revoking Article 50 without a mandate to do so would be no big deal on the basis that Farage's march had few people on it. As I said at the time that little parade was the tip of the iceberg. There's a very nasty, sinister underbelly on the far right that are just waiting for a good excuse to kick off. If even a tiny percentage of that 17.4 million are willing to go beyond purely democratic methods they can do enormous damage.

I really think the UK is on its last legs at this point. There is no quick fix solution and every possible pathway is fraught with danger and negative consequences.

The Scots would be mad to choose this version of the UK over the EU on a second referendum. Same goes for NI in the inevitable border poll down the line.

SNIP.

SNP saying they voted against the CU on Wednesday because it didn't offer the Single Market, but I would be amazed if they didn't either vote for it on Monday, or support Common Market 2.0:

http://twitter.com/NicolaSturgeon/status/1111646559693877250

Strazdas wrote: »

Brilliant article. The cast of villains on the Brexit side is huge. The country couldn't be undergoing such a calamity, not without a significant swathe of their public figures, media and population going rogue.

Did some of them think the brexit vote was indicative of a sea change in public opinion and a shift to populism??

20silkcut wrote: »

Did some of them think the brexit vote was indicative of a sea change in public opinion and a shift to populism??

Many probably thought a vote to leave could somehow transform Britain into a utopia, almost overnight. Fintan O'Toole makes the interesting point that Brexit was doomed from the outset as it was trying to solve a "problem" (EU membership) that didn't even exist - it was impossible there ever could have been a tangible benefit to it, as they were doing just fine in the EU.

It would be akin to a team sacking their manager who is winning every match for them and convincing themselves they could do even better without him.

The shift to right wing populism would probably have happened anyway, even if the UK wasn't an EU member.