Why would you vote SF?

Wtf ? · 27-03-2019 1:50am #1

They were voted into Stormont, They pulled out ?, They have seats in House of Commons, They don't attend (But collect expenses) They could be in London now downing the DUP and helping the no border brexit thing but they aint. They talk the talk etc. Why bother with them really. Flushing your ballot paper down the toilet would be better methinks. They are a wasted vote

bilbot79 · 27-03-2019 1:56am

Wtf ? wrote: »

They were voted into Stormont, They pulled out ?, They have seats in House of Commons, They don't attend (But collect expenses) They could be in London now downing the DUP and helping the no border brexit thing but they aint. They talk the talk etc. Why bother with them really. Flushing your ballot paper down the toilet would be better methinks. They are a wasted vote

Presumably they hold the only real hope of reuniting the country, a romantic idea that few want to let go of

Laois_Man · 27-03-2019 2:01am

Wtf ? wrote: »

They were voted into Stormont, They pulled out ?, They have seats in House of Commons, They don't attend (But collect expenses) They could be in London now downing the DUP and helping the no border brexit thing but they aint. They talk the talk etc. Why bother with them really. Flushing your ballot paper down the toilet would be better methinks. They are a wasted vote

None of those points relate to voting for a SF candidate in the Rep. Ireland which is where most of us are

But as for Northern Ireland....Maybe a vote for to a national parliament in what they don’t see as their nation is a vote that should be “wasted” as they see it?

By the way, their presence in Westminster would in no way down the DUP!

Fr Tod Umptious · 27-03-2019 2:03am

Wtf ? wrote: »

They were voted into Stormont, They pulled out ?, They have seats in House of Commons, They don't attend (But collect expenses) They could be in London now downing the DUP and helping the no border brexit thing but they aint. They talk the talk etc. Why bother with them really. Flushing your ballot paper down the toilet would be better methinks. They are a wasted vote

Because since the GFA and the parity of esteem that comes with it nationalists have had the loudest voice they have ever had in NI.

As a result they have moved towards to the party that promises to listen to that voice more intently than any other party.

On the other side the unionists have countered this which they perceive as a threat to their culture by morning towards the part the will listen to them.most intently.

So you have a society that is getting more and more divided and entrenched and it's a vicious circle.

That's why people voted for SF.

For over 100 years SF said they would not sit in the HOC so anyone voting for them know that full well.

Wtf ? · 27-03-2019 2:13am

Still a wasted vote tho, Nobody down here would go into Government with them and I see why. Their history does them no favors either. Their current mouthpiece does not help either, They just oppose everything and do nothing. Waste of space of a hopefully gone era.

Laois_Man · 27-03-2019 2:23am

Wtf ? wrote: »

Still a wasted vote tho, Nobody down here would go into Government with them and I see why. Their history does them no favors either. Their current mouthpiece does not help either, They just oppose everything and do nothing. Waste of space of a hopefully gone era.

Voting in an election is not supposed to be tantamount to backing a horse. You are supposed to be voting for the party closest to your convictions, not the party you think is going to win.

Wtf ? · 27-03-2019 2:32am

Laois_Man wrote: »

Voting in an election is not supposed to be tantamount to backing a horse. You are supposed to be voting for the party closest to your convictions, not the party you think is going to win.

Voting for an Independent is the same thing then, You can vote for them but they can't/wont do anything because they are 1 voice, Who might mumble once about something dear to your heart but really they can do nothing, Thats what I mean, A wasted vote. Mary Lou babbles on all the time but nobody really listens to her either

jm08 · 27-03-2019 10:40am

Wtf ? wrote: »

Voting for an Independent is the same thing then, You can vote for them but they can't/wont do anything because they are 1 voice, Who might mumble once about something dear to your heart but really they can do nothing, Thats what I mean, A wasted vote. Mary Lou babbles on all the time but nobody really listens to her either

You need an opposition as well to question the Government. Mary Lou was pretty good on the Public Accounts Committee.

maccored · 27-03-2019 1:25pm

Wtf ? wrote: »

They were voted into Stormont, They pulled out ?,

The DUP were caught with their hand in the till - thats why theres no stormont

Wtf ? wrote: »

They have seats in House of Commons, They don't attend (But collect expenses) They could be in London now downing the DUP and helping the no border brexit thing but they aint. They talk the talk etc. Why bother with them really. Flushing your ballot paper down the toilet would be better methinks. They are a wasted vote

They get elected on the simple fact they wont go to Westminister. No idea how you think an handful of SF mps will equal the couple of hundred votes the british government are short when it comes to 'downing the dup and helping with the no border brexit thing'.

Then again, surely you'd be aware of these things before starting a thread about it ... no?

Wtf ? · 27-03-2019 1:34pm

maccored wrote: »

The DUP were caught with their hand in the till - thats why theres no stormont

They get elected on the simple fact they wont go to Westminister. No idea how you think an handful of SF mps will equal the couple of hundred votes the british government are short when it comes to 'downing the dup and helping with the no border brexit thing'.

Then again, surely you'd be aware of these things before starting a thread about it ... no?

But you are assuming that your opinion is fact....No ?

McMurphy · 27-03-2019 1:38pm

Wtf ? wrote: »

They were voted into Stormont, They pulled out ?, They have seats in House of Commons, They don't attend (But collect expenses) They could be in London now downing the DUP and helping the no border brexit thing but they aint. They talk the talk etc. Why bother with them really. Flushing your ballot paper down the toilet would be better methinks. They are a wasted vote

Why'd they pull out?

What's preventing them going back in?

maccored · 27-03-2019 1:46pm

Wtf ? wrote: »

But you are assuming that your opinion is fact....No ?

which is my opinion?

Did the DUP bring down stormont due to dodgy actions? Yes
Do SF get elected on not going to Westminster? Yes

Both facts (kinda see how you ended up starting this thread)

blanch152 · 27-03-2019 6:34pm

maccored wrote: »

which is my opinion?

Did the DUP bring down stormont due to dodgy actions? Yes
Do SF get elected on not going to Westminster? Yes

Both facts (kinda see how you ended up starting this thread)

To be fair, both are opinions based on certain facts and assumptions and are not facts in and of themselves.

(1) In the case of bringing down Stormont, you are correct that the actions of the DUP were cited by SF as the reason why they were bringing down Stormont. However, that does not lead to a fact that the DUP brought down Stormont. The facts allow you to have the opinion that SF brought down Stormont or that the DUP brought down Stormont. Both opinions are valid, which is more valid is a matter for debate.

(2) In the second case, again you are correct that Sinn Fein have a policy of not taking up their seats at Westminister. However, it is not necessarily true that they got elected on that basis. People have myriad reasons for voting for political parties. Maybe Sinn Fein did get elected by those who voted for them to abstain from Westminister, maybe not. It is valid to hold an opinion that if you only include the votes for Sinn Fein that were on the basis of boycotting Westminister, then Sinn Fein would not have been elected to any of the seats. Therefore, you can have the opinion that they were not elected on that basis. Again, how much weight you give that opinion is up to you, but it is a valid opinion.

maccored · 27-03-2019 6:51pm

blanch152 wrote: »

To be fair, both are opinions based on certain facts and assumptions and are not facts in and of themselves.

(1) In the case of bringing down Stormont, you are correct that the actions of the DUP were cited by SF as the reason why they were bringing down Stormont. However, that does not lead to a fact that the DUP brought down Stormont. The facts allow you to have the opinion that SF brought down Stormont or that the DUP brought down Stormont. Both opinions are valid, which is more valid is a matter for debate.

if the DUP let the facts be known, then maybe we might get somewhere. You cant deny the scandal exists, and you cant deny these are the reasons SF used to walk out - therefore my point remains

blanch152 wrote: »

(2) In the second case, again you are correct that Sinn Fein have a policy of not taking up their seats at Westminister. However, it is not necessarily true that they got elected on that basis. People have myriad reasons for voting for political parties. Maybe Sinn Fein did get elected by those who voted for them to abstain from Westminister, maybe not. It is valid to hold an opinion that if you only include the votes for Sinn Fein that were on the basis of boycotting Westminister, then Sinn Fein would not have been elected to any of the seats. Therefore, you can have the opinion that they were not elected on that basis. Again, how much weight you give that opinion is up to you, but it is a valid opinion.

As someone from the north who voted for SF in the 80s and 90s, it was one of the reasons I voted for them - plus everyone else I grew up with who voted for them. In fact Ive never heard of anyone - in my experience - voting for SF who wanted them to take their seats.

Unless you can find me something to suggest otherwise, my point on this still stands too. In this case its YOUR opinion being stated. Mine is based on reality plus what SF say themselves

horsebox1977 · 27-03-2019 6:55pm

Wtf ? wrote: »

Still a wasted vote tho, Nobody down here would go into Government with them and I see why. Their history does them no favors either. Their current mouthpiece does not help either, They just oppose everything and do nothing. Waste of space of a hopefully gone era.

To be honest, your just showing complete and utter ignorance to pretty much everything.

It's clear you have no real understanding of politics North or South.

blanch152 · 27-03-2019 7:14pm

maccored wrote: »

if the DUP let the facts be known, then maybe we might get somewhere. You cant deny the scandal exists, and you cant deny these are the reasons SF used to walk out - therefore my point remains

As someone from the north who voted for SF in the 80s and 90s, it was one of the reasons I voted for them - plus everyone else I grew up with who voted for them. In fact Ive never heard of anyone - in my experience - voting for SF who wanted them to take their seats.

Unless you can find me something to suggest otherwise, my point on this still stands too. In this case its YOUR opinion being stated. Mine is based on reality plus what SF say themselves

I didn't put them forward as my opinions, I put them forward as valid alternative opinions.

(1) You say they are the reasons that "SF used to walk out". That implies that you accept that Stormont was brought down by the action of SF walking out. You justify their walking out by citing facts that the scandal exists, but whether the facts justified a walkout is undoubtedly an opinion. Again, people are entitled to a different opinion, including the one that it was SF's fault the Assembly collapsed as the scandal didn't merit a walk-out. Again, no point disputing with me whether the opinion is correct, but it could be a valid opinion, based on the known facts.

(2) I never said that there was anyone "voting for SF who wanted them to take their seats". What I disagreed with was your statement that "SF get elected on not going to Westminster." Sinn Fein get elected because they are a nationalist party, because they favour marriage equality and abortion, because they want a united Ireland, because they want to increase social welfare etc. etc. and not solely or even majorly because they are not going to Westminister. However, I would agree that many (possibly most) of those who voted for SF in the 1980s voted for them because they didn't take up their seats. However, they only held one seat for a part of the time in the 1980s, and didn't win any in the early 1990s, before getting two in the late 1990s. That suggests that merely having a policy of abstention doesn't appear to be sufficient to get one elected. Again, as there is no hard evidence or facts to support either side, all you can have is an opinion which could be yours or could be the alternative.

satguy · 27-03-2019 7:25pm

I vote SF because I'm tired of seeing FG looking after rich people like Dinny or giving Wesley College another hockey pitch.
Plus as it stands now if I vote FF they just sit on their hands and give FG another confidence and supply agreement, so that's just a waste of a vote.

So SF it is ..

James Brown · 27-03-2019 7:32pm

For me I've given them the nod off and on depending on what else is on offer.
They never used tax payer monies for sweet deals, lost the tax payer monies on bad deals or 'looked after their own' with state appointments. Also they never were responsible for the economy crashing or ignoring growing crises to concentrate on a proven to be flawed economic system. So I'd vote SF long before I'd vote FF/FG.

jimmycrackcorm · 27-03-2019 7:45pm

satguy wrote: »

I vote SF because I'm tired of seeing FG looking after rich people like Dinny or giving Wesley College another hockey pitch.
Plus as it stands now if I vote FF they just sit on their hands and give FG another confidence and supply agreement, so that's just a waste of a vote.

So SF it is ..

SF were urging us to follow Sryzia in Greece in their approach against the EU.
I shudder to think how things might be for us now had they been in power.

They're a very immature party in the sense that they've never had to implement real world decisions that might be unpopular.

In power in the North they couldn't make the cut in welfare changes, leaving the unpopular to the British government.

Odhinn · 27-03-2019 9:04pm

Wtf ? wrote: »

Still a wasted vote tho, Nobody down here would go into Government with them and I see why. Their history does them no favors either. Their current mouthpiece does not help either, They just oppose everything and do nothing. Waste of space of a hopefully gone era.

I've voted Sinn Fein on every given opportunity now for 32 years. I've watched them go from a party with no seats to the third largest party in the state. Based on that I'd say their era is far from gone.

maccored · 27-03-2019 9:37pm

blanch152 wrote: »

I didn't put them forward as my opinions, I put them forward as valid alternative opinions.

(1) You say they are the reasons that "SF used to walk out". That implies that you accept that Stormont was brought down by the action of SF walking out. You justify their walking out by citing facts that the scandal exists, but whether the facts justified a walkout is undoubtedly an opinion. Again, people are entitled to a different opinion, including the one that it was SF's fault the Assembly collapsed as the scandal didn't merit a walk-out. Again, no point disputing with me whether the opinion is correct, but it could be a valid opinion, based on the known facts.

(2) I never said that there was anyone "voting for SF who wanted them to take their seats". What I disagreed with was your statement that "SF get elected on not going to Westminster." Sinn Fein get elected because they are a nationalist party, because they favour marriage equality and abortion, because they want a united Ireland, because they want to increase social welfare etc. etc. and not solely or even majorly because they are not going to Westminister. However, I would agree that many (possibly most) of those who voted for SF in the 1980s voted for them because they didn't take up their seats. However, they only held one seat for a part of the time in the 1980s, and didn't win any in the early 1990s, before getting two in the late 1990s. That suggests that merely having a policy of abstention doesn't appear to be sufficient to get one elected. Again, as there is no hard evidence or facts to support either side, all you can have is an opinion which could be yours or could be the alternative.

whatever youre having yourself - im not going down a rabbit hole. the basic point is the dup actions caused stormont to fall and sf voters vote for sf knowing they wont take seats in westminster. both of those points are still factual.

For Forks Sake · 27-03-2019 10:43pm

jm08 wrote: »

You need an opposition as well to question the Government. Mary Lou was pretty good on the Public Accounts Committee.

The current PAC is an absolute disgrace, nothing but soundbites with various TDs jockeying to get their mug on the evening news headlines, and Mary Lou has been the very worst of the lot.

TheRepentent · 28-03-2019 2:05am

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

they've never had to implement real world decisions that might be unpopular.

This ^^

I think they have made a decent enough effort to move away from the troubles(still haunted by it though) but they really are just a populist party and I think they'd either crap themselves when faced with reality or totally ruin the country if they had unfettered control.

VinLieger · 28-03-2019 10:37am

satguy wrote: »

giving Wesley College another hockey pitch.

Ohh look a SF supporter misrepresenting the facts to suit their own agenda, yeah Shane Ross who was responsible for that is an independent so nothing to do with FG and it was roundly proven there was no favoritism or special representations made by him regarding it. In fact it was exactly the opposite with Mary Lou herself making special representations regarding a boxing club in her constituency.

laoch na mona · 28-03-2019 1:59pm

Wtf ? wrote: »

They were voted into Stormont, They pulled out ?, They have seats in House of Commons, They don't attend (But collect expenses) They could be in London now downing the DUP and helping the no border brexit thing but they aint. They talk the talk etc. Why bother with them really. Flushing your ballot paper down the toilet would be better methinks. They are a wasted vote

Stormont collapsed due to a scandal the DUP created and a refusal to deliver on aspects of the GFA such as the Irish language act, Theres has been negotiations to get the assembly back running it's not Sinn Fein who are preventing this

Sinn Fein MPs are elected on an abstentionist basis, their voters know this

The idea that Irish MPs can have any influence in Westminster is a fantasy Sinn Fein are proactive on Brexit where it counts in Brussels

jm08 · 28-03-2019 2:09pm

For Forks Sake wrote: »

The current PAC is an absolute disgrace, nothing but soundbites with various TDs jockeying to get their mug on the evening news headlines, and Mary Lou has been the very worst of the lot.

Mary Lou hasn't been on the PAC for at least a year now.

James Brown · 28-03-2019 2:25pm

jm08 wrote: »

Mary Lou hasn't been on the PAC for at least a year now.

Made a good soundbite though

McMurphy · 28-03-2019 2:37pm

VinLieger wrote: »

Ohh look a SF supporter misrepresenting the facts to suit their own agenda, yeah Shane Ross who was responsible for that is an independent so nothing to do with FG and it was roundly proven there was no favoritism or special representations made by him regarding it. In fact it was exactly the opposite with Mary Lou herself making special representations regarding a boxing club in her constituency.

You're absolutely right, I'd say he meant to mention James Reilly's primary care scandal instead.

laoch na mona · 28-03-2019 3:17pm

Wtf ? wrote: »

Still a wasted vote tho, Nobody down here would go into Government with them and I see why. Their history does them no favors either. Their current mouthpiece does not help either, They just oppose everything and do nothing. Waste of space of a hopefully gone era.

what ever your opinion of their politics that's factually false Sinn fein introduce bills to the dail contribute to debates, publish a fully costed alternative budget each year and help get important legislation like the banded hours bill passed

You might politically disagree with them but their record as elected reps shows they definitely don't do nothing

Laois_Man · 28-03-2019 3:39pm

laoch na mona wrote: »

Stormont collapsed due to a scandal the DUP created and a refusal to deliver on aspects of the GFA such as the Irish language act, Theres has been negotiations to get the assembly back running it's not Sinn Fein who are preventing this

But Stormont really collapsed because the timing really suited SF's agenda to push for a border poll within the environment created by Brexit - an agenda also made easier with the absence of a devolved parliament.

laoch na mona wrote: »

publish a fully costed alternative budget each year

Ah yes, their creative accounting. Like the years they spent advocating a rise in corporation tax to 17% and counting all the new tax receipts that would ensue.

Until they got tired of the ridicule and had to admit that the 12.5% should stay and that it should also be the rate applied in N. Ireland.

BonnieSituation · 28-03-2019 3:42pm

laoch na mona wrote: »

what ever your opinion of their politics that's factually false Sinn fein introduce bills to the dail contribute to debates, publish a fully costed alternative budget each year and help get important legislation like the banded hours bill passed

You might politically disagree with them but their record as elected reps shows they definitely don't do nothing

And I'm sure our friend above remembers how they took a case to get FF to move the writ for the Donegal by-election after Pat the Cope headed off to Europe.

So obviously they do nothing...

daveob007 · 28-03-2019 3:49pm

Wtf ? wrote: »

Still a wasted vote tho, Nobody down here would go into Government with them and I see why. Their history does them no favors either. Their current mouthpiece does not help either, They just oppose everything and do nothing. Waste of space of a hopefully gone era.

All the parties in the south have a history but they try to forget that and bash SF for the same thing, shower of hypocrites. SF are the only party which didn't abandon the people in the six counties or gave up on getting a united Ireland.

daveob007 · 28-03-2019 3:52pm

maccored wrote: »

The DUP were caught with their hand in the till - thats why theres no stormont

They get elected on the simple fact they wont go to Westminister. No idea how you think an handful of SF mps will equal the couple of hundred votes the british government are short when it comes to 'downing the dup and helping with the no border brexit thing'.

Then again, surely you'd be aware of these things before starting a thread about it ... no?

By taking seats in Westminster they would be accepting the six counties as part of the UK. They are part of Ireland occupied by the UK. Big difference.

daveob007 · 28-03-2019 3:56pm

blanch152 wrote: »

To be fair, both are opinions based on certain facts and assumptions and are not facts in and of themselves.

(1) In the case of bringing down Stormont, you are correct that the actions of the DUP were cited by SF as the reason why they were bringing down Stormont. However, that does not lead to a fact that the DUP brought down Stormont. The facts allow you to have the opinion that SF brought down Stormont or that the DUP brought down Stormont. Both opinions are valid, which is more valid is a matter for debate.

(2) In the second case, again you are correct that Sinn Fein have a policy of not taking up their seats at Westminister. However, it is not necessarily true that they got elected on that basis. People have myriad reasons for voting for political parties. Maybe Sinn Fein did get elected by those who voted for them to abstain from Westminister, maybe not. It is valid to hold an opinion that if you only include the votes for Sinn Fein that were on the basis of boycotting Westminister, then Sinn Fein would not have been elected to any of the seats. Therefore, you can have the opinion that they were not elected on that basis. Again, how much weight you give that opinion is up to you, but it is a valid opinion.

I vote SF for many reasons including not taking seats in London, if they changed their policy on that issue alone it would be enough for me not to vote them as is the same for most of their voters.

maccored · 28-03-2019 4:10pm

Laois_Man wrote: »

But Stormont really collapsed because the timing really suited SF's agenda to push for a border poll within the environment created by Brexit - an agenda also made easier with the absence of a devolved parliament.

jaysus talk about conspiracy theories

maccored · 28-03-2019 4:12pm

daveob007 wrote: »

By taking seats in Westminster they would be accepting the six counties as part of the UK. They are part of Ireland occupied by the UK. Big difference.

There is a big difference between being occupied and swearing allegiance to a foreign power. Are you saying there isn't?

devlinio · 28-03-2019 4:33pm

I wouldn't they're all talk, and oppose everything. Fine Gael may have problems, but they're still a solid party to lead the next government.

BluePlanet · 28-03-2019 4:37pm

Wtf ? wrote: »

They were voted into Stormont, They pulled out ?, They have seats in House of Commons, They don't attend (But collect expenses) They could be in London now downing the DUP and helping the no border brexit thing but they aint. They talk the talk etc. Why bother with them really. Flushing your ballot paper down the toilet would be better methinks. They are a wasted vote

My understanding is that no, they do not collect ministerial full salaries from Westminister nor expenses and are very transparent about what they receive:

https://www.sinnfein.ie/contents/16460

blanch152 · 28-03-2019 4:38pm

BluePlanet wrote: »

My understanding is that no, they do not collect ministerial full salaries from Westminister nor expenses and are very transparent about what they receive:

https://www.sinnfein.ie/contents/16460

Yes, they were very transparent about only getting the industrial wage in the South, forgetting to tell us that there were a large number of exceptions and that they took the amount as a net figure when it is only a gross figure.

BluePlanet · 28-03-2019 4:43pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Yes, they were very transparent about only getting the industrial wage in the South, forgetting to tell us that there were a large number of exceptions and that they took the amount as a net figure when it is only a gross figure.

Oh goodness me, what a horrible thing to do, they must be awfully nasty people. :eek: /sarcasm

James Brown · 28-03-2019 5:27pm

devlinio wrote: »

I wouldn't they're all talk, and oppose everything. Fine Gael may have problems, but they're still a solid party to lead the next government.

Even if that were the case I'd rather all talk than record breaking crises led by the 'solid' willful incompetence of the people of Fine Gael and Fianna Fail.

Seth Brundle · 28-03-2019 5:31pm

laoch na mona wrote: »

Sinn Fein MPs are elected on an abstentionist basis, their voters know this

I understand this SF's stance.
I just don't get why people would rather have no representation in NI when it matters.
People in NI complain about Brexit for example yet voted for a group that would not defend the views of the majority in NI on the matter. Now they're complaining that whilst NI voted to remain,it looks like they're being forced to leave against their wishes. Someone should be representing these people, not necessarily SF but someone!

laoch na mona wrote: »

The idea that Irish MPs can have any influence in Westminster is a fantasy Sinn Fein are proactive on Brexit where it counts in Brussels

In fairness representation for nationalists counts in Westminster also.
Due to the lack of engaged representation for nationalists in NI wihtin Westminster, the DUP are now actively seeking the removal of NI from Europe!

joe swanson · 28-03-2019 5:52pm

I would never vote for them. Underneath the or machine they are still the sectarian, murder supporters they always have been.

They are good at appealing to the welfare classes who want everything for nothing and someone to blame for their predicament

James Brown · 28-03-2019 5:54pm

joe swanson wrote: »

I would never vote for them. Underneath the or machine they are still the sectarian, murder supporters they always have been.

They are good at appealing to the welfare classes who want everything for nothing and someone to blame for their predicament

Yet SF never brought in any welfare changes, increases or the like. If I wanted something, for anything including nothing, I'd be voting FG/FF.

blanch152 · 28-03-2019 6:04pm

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Yet SF never brought in any welfare changes, increases or the like. If I wanted something, for anything including nothing, I'd be voting FG/FF.

I've never seen a hurler on the ditch score a point so that isn't surprising.

When faced with difficult decisions in the North, they ran away, citing some scandal, hoping for direct rule to be brought back.

Laois_Man · 28-03-2019 6:39pm

maccored wrote: »

jaysus talk about conspiracy theories

OK, the institutions collapsed due to the Renewable Heat Incentive scandal - which first became a concern in 2013 (and which SF initially tried to prevent an injury on - until they discovered that wouldn't work). It went ahead and in December 2018 completed its hearings - The final report is expected to be published in a couple of months. If the Foster/DUP are cleared of wrongdoing (as they probably will be - because everybody except shinners knows it was only an excuse to bring down Stormount), will SF accept that the devolved parliament can then restart?

Not a chance....coz they have a backup of a problem with the DUPs lack of respect for women, the Irish language and ethnic minorities - but they waited 19 years to decide it was worthy of collapsing the Parliament, and it's a pure coincidence that it happened to occur just as Article 50 was about to be triggered.

Alrighty then

Sunny Disposition · 28-03-2019 6:44pm

Never have before but possibly will now.
The IRA haven't been active for more than 20 years, a long time. It's actually 25 years since the first ceasefire prior to the talks. I abhor what they did, but there was a certain amount of context (not enough to justify bombing and killing civilians) and I don't believe there is any risk of more violence. Plus I feel partition is an important issue that no other party will push, at least not unless a party whose raison d'etre is fighting it becomes prominent. I probably won't vote for them, but they've a good enough candidate over here and he'll get one of my higher preferences.

tipptom · 28-03-2019 6:52pm

joe swanson wrote: »

I would never vote for them. Underneath the or machine they are still the sectarian, murder supporters they always have been.

They are good at appealing to the welfare classes who want everything for nothing and someone to blame for their predicament

No you prefer the sectarian murder machine that the British government brought to Ireland and executed by their army,mi5 spooks while running loyalist murder machines with guns and information to murder Catholics cheered on from the sidelines by the Unionist partys.

You are good at blaming someone else for your predicament when nationalists say enough to the real murder machine and fight back..

Interesting that you say about certain classes want everything for nothing while Stormont was rightly brought down because of a certain wealthy class attempting to divvy up hundreds of millions among themselves for nothing.

BluePlanet · 28-03-2019 6:57pm

I would like to see SF take their seats in WM too, however it would take a seriously strong party leader to abruptly change a policy that the party has since it's creation!

And if Gerry Adams wouldn't do it (or couldn't?) then there is just no way that Mary Lou or Michelle G could.

maccored · 28-03-2019 7:51pm

Laois_Man wrote: »

OK, the institutions collapsed due to the Renewable Heat Incentive scandal - which first became a concern in 2013 (and which SF initially tried to prevent an injury on - until they discovered that wouldn't work). It went ahead and in December 2018 completed its hearings - The final report is expected to be published in a couple of months. If the Foster/DUP are cleared of wrongdoing (as they probably will be - because everybody except shinners knows it was only an excuse to bring down Stormount), will SF accept that the devolved parliament can then restart?

Not a chance....coz they have a backup of a problem with the DUPs lack of respect for women, the Irish language and ethnic minorities - but they waited 19 years to decide it was worthy of collapsing the Parliament, and it's a pure coincidence that it happened to occur just as Article 50 was about to be triggered.

Alrighty then

I cant see the DUP getting cleared. Arlene introduced it and they were basically paying people to burn the fuel (may as well have been since the price was cheaper than the cost) - absolute con or complete stupidity one of the two. Where SF meant to sit there and say nothing?

March 2017 was when article 50 was triggered. This whole hoohaa came to light in Oct/Nov 2016. you'll be telling me SF are psychic next

McMurphy · 28-03-2019 8:49pm

Laois_Man wrote: »

OK, the institutions collapsed due to the Renewable Heat Incentive scandal - which first became a concern in 2013 (and which SF initially tried to prevent an injury on - until they discovered that wouldn't work). It went ahead and in December 2018 completed its hearings - The final report is expected to be published in a couple of months. If the Foster/DUP are cleared of wrongdoing (as they probably will be - because everybody except shinners knows it was only an excuse to bring down Stormount), will SF accept that the devolved parliament can then restart?

Not a chance....coz they have a backup of a problem with the DUPs lack of respect for women, the Irish language and ethnic minorities - but they waited 19 years to decide it was worthy of collapsing the Parliament, and it's a pure coincidence that it happened to occur just as Article 50 was about to be triggered.

Alrighty then

Why do you think they probably will be?

Is it probably, or hopefully?

Why would you vote SF?

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