John Delaney at the FAI Thread - (Mod Notes in OP)

s3rtvdbwfj81ch · 27-03-2019 10:27AM

Another loan he's given to a business he's involved in, this time 250k to a property firm he's a part owner of.

Link

Brock Turnpike · 27-03-2019 10:33AM

Faith Some Loop wrote: »

Another loan he's given to a business he's involved in, this time 250k to a property firm he's a part owner of.

Link

It's a director's loan. There is nothing out of the ordinary in that

The issue with him doing it for the FAI is that they hid it from the sports council.

ozzy jr · 27-03-2019 10:34AM

joeysoap wrote: »

:rolleyes:

Open to ideas but 13 team league is about the silliest I have ever heard.

Revert to a 12 team league, split it after 22 matches in two groups of 6, play each side in your group twice more (h+a)= 32 matches.

Would make the last 3/4 rounds of the 22 more interesting. The last 10 matches would be more competitive too as the teams would be more equal

Your idea is even worse.

A league should only ever be a format of playing each team home and away the same amount of times.

ozzy jr · 27-03-2019 10:39AM

secman wrote: »

Having watched the game on RTE, they didn't show any anti Delaney banners, looking at highlights on Sky and they showed them, censorship by RTE.

I was looking forward to a bit of debate prior to the match last night, but they started the broadcast by saying "we're concentrating on matters on the pitch".

Damian Duffs carry on was a bit

mugsymugsy · 27-03-2019 10:41AM

Brock Turnpike wrote: »

It's a director's loan. There is nothing out of the ordinary in that

The issue with him doing it for the FAI is that they hid it from the sports council.

My issue would be is that from an optics point of view we the tax payer were paying John Delaney approx 360k + his rent and he is able to loan his company 250k.

His salary is outrageous and even if it was halved would still be ridiculously high.

GLaDOS · 27-03-2019 10:43AM

Necro wrote: »

RTE, much like Delaney and his buddies in the FAI are another institution rife with cronyism and useless individuals on bloated salaries.

Both are loss-making organisations and both receive state funding yet both pay astronomic wages to people doing mediocre jobs.

It's no wonder they'd censor things as they very well might be next on the chopping block.

Fairly sure the FAI fined Shels years ago for singing anti-RTE chants and/or a banner to the same effect (to do with changing KO times as far as I remember). I'm sure a Shels fan will remember the details.

The FAI and RTE look after each other, you can be sure of that.

D14Rugby · 27-03-2019 10:45AM

The Talking Bread wrote: »

In fairness "your one" ? Moloney is entitled not to be impartial on an an issue such as this. Its outside the remit of conversation of the actual football analysis element and he is as much qualified as the rest to give his opinon. Id have less respect if he hid behind his presenters chair in this instance. Its not actual football talk.I thought "your one" was good last night in the discussion.

You seem disproportionately annoyed at me forgetting his name. You alright Darragh.
Stuff like trying to frame Quinns comments as him not interested in applying at all until he was pulled up on the fact he said he wouldn't apply as long as Delaney was there isn't how a presenter should be talking.

s3rtvdbwfj81ch · 27-03-2019 10:59AM

GLaDOS wrote: »

Fairly sure the FAI fined Shels years ago for singing anti-RTE chants

I can't type the chant here for fear of being carded, but it was referring to Dear Leader in less than endearing terms. they continued to send spies to the games, so the words were changed to be more wholesome

John Delaney is a lovely bloke
John Delaney is a lovely bloke
He loves the Shels
He treats us well
John we think you're really swell
John Delaney
is
a lovely
bloooooke

osarusan · 27-03-2019 11:02AM

Berserker wrote: »

More than happy to post that in a while (later tonight, I have meetings this afternoon) but I want to see what the LoI people want first. This is their league at the end of the day.

For me at least, it's not a question of what I 'want', but what I think is feasible.

Maybe I'm in a minority, but I don't see the structure as a big part of the problem. When I think of league structure, I'm talking about an All-Ireland League (AIL), or a 16-team LOI. There are some other structures, some other pie-in-the-sky notions like a Celtic League or Atlantic League, but none of those things will never happen.

And I think those things are essentially window-dressing, and don't address the fundamental problem. Which is that the league is an unattractive proposition for people because of the perception that it is basically poor teams playing poor football in poor stadiums. That's a perception that I'd by and large agree with, and I don't think that having an AIL changes that. UCD versus Finn Harps would still be UCD versus Finn Harps, and UCD versus Ballymena isn't any more appealing either. It would still be poor teams playing poor football in poor stadiums.

Unless of course, the restructuring or rebranding comes with a huge bucket of cash, but I can't see where that is going to come from. Who is going to pay a load of money for the rights to broadcast an AIL. We had something a bit similar a few years ago with the Setanta Cup, and after initial success, it eventually died. People lost interest, viewing numbers went down, prize money went down, clubs lost interest.

So, I can't think of any structural change which is both realistic and which will bring any real amount of new money into the game. And I actually think a lot of energy is wasted tinkering with the league, looking for the one structure that will sort it.

Two things the FAI could do are - firstly, put more money directly into the league by increasing prize money from the current laughable levels and getting rid of the costly licencing criteria that has always been a joke. Secondly, the FAI could invest in a proper advertising team that would both advertise the league as a whole and liaise with the clubs to advertise themselves individually.

There is a fairly ignorant perception that LOI clubs and fans either don't want to improve, or don't realise how to improve. But the reality is that LOI clubs fans know what is needed, but the money simply isn't there. As a wise St. Pat's fan wrote once on a different forum: "There isn't a single problem with the LOI that can't be solved by money." But most LOI clubs are caught in a vicious circle whereby they don't have the money to make the improvements that would make them more attractive to the public. For many clubs, it is a struggle, and a real achievement, just to get enough money just to see each season out. Waterford nearly went bankrupt just a couple of years ago over €80000. Limerick couldn't afford to pay their players on time last year, and had to let some of them go.Clubs in these situations cant spare money for advertising or facilities or anything beyond survival, no matter how much long-term sense it makes.

So I am (obviously) a bit pessimistic about the idea that there will be a radical change in the LOI in the future. I don't see where the money is going to come from that would make dramatic improvements possible. I think the future of the LOI is much the same as now, clubs inching themselves forwards...or backwards...as much as money allows.

s3rtvdbwfj81ch · 27-03-2019 11:05AM

16 team league presumably means no Promotion/Relegation

This is a necessity for UEFA membership/international team afaik

TheCitizen · 27-03-2019 11:07AM

D14Rugby wrote: »

You seem disproportionately annoyed at me forgetting his name. You alright Darragh.
Stuff like trying to frame Quinns comments as him not interested in applying at all until he was pulled up on the fact he said he wouldn't apply as long as Delaney was there isn't how a presenter should be talking.

There was nothing wrong with the way he framed that question. He put it to them that Niall Quinn said he wasn't interested in being CEO and let them finish it by saying Niall Quinn said he wasn't interested in being CEO under the current set up. It was very much a leading question and not the way you portray it at all. You're a bit of a try hard on here with your I'm a big League of Ireland man schtick. Chill out there rugby boy.

TheCitizen · 27-03-2019 11:24AM

osarusan wrote: »

For me at least, it's not a question of what I 'want', but what I think is feasible.

Maybe I'm in a minority, but I don't see the structure as a big part of the problem. When I think of league structure, I'm talking about an All-Ireland League (AIL), or a 16-team LOI. There are some other structures, some other pie-in-the-sky notions like a Celtic League or Atlantic League, but none of those things will never happen.

And I think those things are essentially window-dressing, and don't address the fundamental problem. Which is that the league is an unattractive proposition for people because of the perception that it is basically poor teams playing poor football in poor stadiums. That's a perception that I'd by and large agree with, and I don't think that having an AIL changes that. UCD versus Finn Harps would still be UCD versus Finn Harps, and UCD versus Ballymena isn't any more appealing either. It would still be poor teams playing poor football in poor stadiums.

Unless of course, the restructuring or rebranding comes with a huge bucket of cash, but I can't see where that is going to come from. Who is going to pay a load of money for the rights to broadcast an AIL. We had something a bit similar a few years ago with the Setanta Cup, and after initial success, it eventually died. People lost interest, viewing numbers went down, prize money went down, clubs lost interest.

So, I can't think of any structural change which is both realistic and which will bring any real amount of new money into the game. And I actually think a lot of energy is wasted tinkering with the league, looking for the one structure that will sort it.

Two things the FAI could do are - firstly, put more money directly into the league by increasing prize money from the current laughable levels and getting rid of the costly licencing criteria that has always been a joke. Secondly, the FAI could invest in a proper advertising team that would both advertise the league as a whole and liaise with the clubs to advertise themselves individually.

There is a fairly ignorant perception that LOI clubs and fans either don't want to improve, or don't realise how to improve. But the reality is that LOI clubs fans know what is needed, but the money simply isn't there. As a wise St. Pat's fan wrote once on a different forum: "There isn't a single problem with the LOI that can't be solved by money." But most LOI clubs are caught in a vicious circle whereby they don't have the money to make the improvements that would make them more attractive to the public. For many clubs, it is a struggle, and a real achievement, just to get enough money just to see each season out. Waterford nearly went bankrupt just a couple of years ago over €80000. Limerick couldn't afford to pay their players on time last year, and had to let some of them go.Clubs in these situations cant spare money for advertising or facilities or anything beyond survival, no matter how much long-term sense it makes.

So I am (obviously) a bit pessimistic about the idea that there will be a radical change in the LOI in the future. I don't see where the money is going to come from that would make dramatic improvements possible. I think the future of the LOI is much the same as now, clubs inching themselves forwards...or backwards...as much as money allows.

I think it's bound to change over the coming years. Young Irish players don't get the opportunities to go and join big clubs in England as much as they used to, so it's as good or better for them to stay here longer as opposed to go over to join Division 1 clubs, and if they stay here longer it will improve the quality of the league. Ireland is becoming a more developed country generally all the time, investment in sport makes sense for private companies. There is an opportunity for change for the better in domestic football in Ireland and a different outlook and new blood at board level can help in a big way to manage and promote that change.

Necro · 27-03-2019 11:27AM

I think people would be happier if the LOI had a plan, any plan at all that would see some form of growth and development of the league.

First and foremost would be an increase in prize money, that's relatively obvious.

If the FAI cannot negotiate television rights for more games, then allow the LOI to do it instead. Open up the possibility of streaming each clubs games and allow them to have some from of revenue stream from it.

More so than that though, the aim should be to develop a full time self sufficient professional league.

A 10 year plan with bridging loans to clubs to assist them in this transition.

I don't think people are looking for handouts for their clubs or the League here, just a chance for it to be allowed to grow.

Not a LOI guy really btw, I used to follow Sligo Rovers as a kid but tbh I don't anymore.

D14Rugby · 27-03-2019 11:36AM

TheCitizen wrote: »

There was nothing wrong with the way he framed that question. He put it to them that Niall Quinn said he wasn't interested in being CEO and let them finish it by saying Niall Quinn said he wasn't interested in being CEO under the current set up. It was very much a leading question and not the way you portray it at all. You're a bit of a try hard on here with your I'm a big League of Ireland man schtick. Chill out there rugby boy.

It wasn't a question. He asked Duff what he'd change, Duff said Quinn is talking the big talk but it's debatable if he can walk the walk. Darragh tried to shut that down by saying Quinn had ruled himself out, like he tried to shoot everything else down with 'well the Oireachtas.. "

That you're only comeback?" Oh you like other sports too so even though I don't do anything to help domestic Irish football myself go shut up"? Play a new tune.

D14Rugby · 27-03-2019 11:43AM

Necro wrote: »

I think people would be happier if the LOI had a plan, any plan at all that would see some form of growth and development of the league.

First and foremost would be an increase in prize money, that's relatively obvious.

If the FAI cannot negotiate television rights for more games, then allow the LOI to do it instead. Open up the possibility of streaming each clubs games and allow them to have some from of revenue stream from it.

More so than that though, the aim should be to develop a full time self sufficient professional league.

A 10 year plan with bridging loans to clubs to assist them in this transition.

I don't think people are looking for handouts for their clubs or the League here, just a chance for it to be allowed to grow.

Not a LOI guy really btw, I used to follow Sligo Rovers as a kid but tbh I don't anymore.

The league have tried doing their own thing fot tv and asking for more prize money but the FAI have blocked everything to the best of their ability.

The Talking Bread · 27-03-2019 11:44AM

D14Rugby wrote: »

You seem disproportionately annoyed at me forgetting his name. You alright Darragh.
Stuff like trying to frame Quinns comments as him not interested in applying at all until he was pulled up on the fact he said he wouldn't apply as long as Delaney was there isn't how a presenter should be talking.

Well considering Delaney aint going anywhere........what he stated was bang on.
I dont get what you are reading into that comment anyway??? What ulterior motive would he have to frame Quinns stance that way. Everyone knew what Quinn said anyway.
Kelly, Sadlier and Duff have no more qualifications to discuss the matter than Moloney, its nothing to do with the football. In fact Sadlier and Moloney seemed to be the only 2 really interested or relatively informed in discussing it properly last night. And it needed to be discussed. Being a presenter with regard the football meant f all to the discussion.

Idbatterim · 27-03-2019 11:48AM

Ireland play Gibraltar on tenth June. You won’t be a better “competitive” match to boycott! Also why we sport ireland pouring 2.7 million of tax payer money into the farce that is the fai?!

Dots1982 · 27-03-2019 12:09PM

osarusan wrote: »

For me at least, it's not a question of what I 'want', but what I think is feasible.

Maybe I'm in a minority, but I don't see the structure as a big part of the problem. When I think of league structure, I'm talking about an All-Ireland League (AIL), or a 16-team LOI. There are some other structures, some other pie-in-the-sky notions like a Celtic League or Atlantic League, but none of those things will never happen.

And I think those things are essentially window-dressing, and don't address the fundamental problem. Which is that the league is an unattractive proposition for people because of the perception that it is basically poor teams playing poor football in poor stadiums. That's a perception that I'd by and large agree with, and I don't think that having an AIL changes that. UCD versus Finn Harps would still be UCD versus Finn Harps, and UCD versus Ballymena isn't any more appealing either. It would still be poor teams playing poor football in poor stadiums.

Unless of course, the restructuring or rebranding comes with a huge bucket of cash, but I can't see where that is going to come from. Who is going to pay a load of money for the rights to broadcast an AIL. We had something a bit similar a few years ago with the Setanta Cup, and after initial success, it eventually died. People lost interest, viewing numbers went down, prize money went down, clubs lost interest.

So, I can't think of any structural change which is both realistic and which will bring any real amount of new money into the game. And I actually think a lot of energy is wasted tinkering with the league, looking for the one structure that will sort it.

Two things the FAI could do are - firstly, put more money directly into the league by increasing prize money from the current laughable levels and getting rid of the costly licencing criteria that has always been a joke. Secondly, the FAI could invest in a proper advertising team that would both advertise the league as a whole and liaise with the clubs to advertise themselves individually.

There is a fairly ignorant perception that LOI clubs and fans either don't want to improve, or don't realise how to improve. But the reality is that LOI clubs fans know what is needed, but the money simply isn't there. As a wise St. Pat's fan wrote once on a different forum: "There isn't a single problem with the LOI that can't be solved by money." But most LOI clubs are caught in a vicious circle whereby they don't have the money to make the improvements that would make them more attractive to the public. For many clubs, it is a struggle, and a real achievement, just to get enough money just to see each season out. Waterford nearly went bankrupt just a couple of years ago over €80000. Limerick couldn't afford to pay their players on time last year, and had to let some of them go.Clubs in these situations cant spare money for advertising or facilities or anything beyond survival, no matter how much long-term sense it makes.

So I am (obviously) a bit pessimistic about the idea that there will be a radical change in the LOI in the future. I don't see where the money is going to come from that would make dramatic improvements possible. I think the future of the LOI is much the same as now, clubs inching themselves forwards...or backwards...as much as money allows.

Very good post

TheCitizen · 27-03-2019 12:14PM

D14Rugby wrote: »

It wasn't a question. He asked Duff what he'd change, Duff said Quinn is talking the big talk but it's debatable if he can walk the walk. Darragh tried to shut that down by saying Quinn had ruled himself out, like he tried to shoot everything else down with 'well the Oireachtas.. "

https://twitter.com/RTEsoccer/status/1110670164859584512

Calm down and quit your angry fan routine and look at it again. Moloney is not addressing the issue as you are portraying it.

D14Rugby wrote: »

That you're only comeback?" Oh you like other sports too so even though I don't do anything to help domestic Irish football myself go shut up"? Play a new tune.

I'm actually involved in grassroots soccer but that's none of your business and not relevant to points people make on this thread anyway.

There you go again with your "I'm an ultra League of Ireland head" routine. You play a new tune, boring the pants off everyone on here with your uberfan schtick. Yawn.

Dots1982 · 27-03-2019 12:15PM

Idbatterim wrote: »

Ireland play Gibraltar on tenth June. You won’t be a better “competitive” match to boycott! Also why we sport ireland pouring 2.7 million of tax payer money into the farce that is the fai?!

So you want to save Irish football by starving it of it’s finance?

The state make huge money from sport through tax income and the economy as a whole makes huge money from sport in terms of how it pumps money into businesses around the country. Think of all the people attending GAA games; spending money in bars, restaurants, taxis, hotels, shops, petrol stations, on bus tickets and train tickets.

Unfortunately our government is the stingiest government in the entire EU when it comes to sports investment. But no one talks about that. They just blame the FAI for everything and don’t see the bigger picture.

That is the problem with opinions like yours.

TheCitizen · 27-03-2019 12:18PM

Idbatterim wrote: »

Ireland play Gibraltar on tenth June. You won’t be a better “competitive” match to boycott! Also why we sport ireland pouring 2.7 million of tax payer money into the farce that is the fai?!

The tax payers money id the key to get at the FAI to introduce and implement necessary change. The board's been there too long 14 years Delaney has been there. change is needed at board level to prepare for the changes that are coming in Irish soccer down the line. The tax payers funding should be conditional on the FAI being ready for changing the guard and bringing in new blood with new ideas.

listermint · 27-03-2019 12:26PM

Dots1982 wrote: »

So you want to save Irish football by starving it of it’s finance?

The state make huge money from sport through tax income and the economy as a whole makes huge money from sport in terms of how it pumps money into businesses around the country. Think of all the people attending GAA games; spending money in bars, restaurants, taxis, hotels, shops, petrol stations, on bus tickets and train tickets.

Unfortunately our government is the stingiest government in the entire EU when it comes to sports investment. But no one talks about that. They just blame the FAI for everything and don’t see the bigger picture.

That is the problem with opinions like yours.

I don't want tax payer money being poured into this organisation. The board and its former CEO have alot to answer for. The board's itself isn't keeping the CEO to account and visa versa. There's scant all separation of powers. This stuff shouldn't fly especially with public money.

Your drama about starving Irish football is just that drama. Change needs to be made and a thorough root out is what's needed.

Also I'm getting frequently more suspicious about connections of posters in this thread to the organisation because there's alot of white washing going on. That's very evident.

MaceFace · 27-03-2019 12:34PM

While I think everyone agrees that the FAI needs a complete clear out, I think it is fanciful to think it will result in any any real upturn in the game in this country.
At best, we will get more transparency and realize the size of the problem and maybe then start having a conversation about how it can be improved.

Sure there are things that can be done to improve the LOI, but it is just tinkering around the edges. The problem is that the game at the grassroots level is just pitiful.

At my club, up to adolescence, we hear the same thing all the time - my child prefers soccer but the GAA is the priority. I don't blame them as the GAA is built on the community and local pride. Players play for the same club for their entire youth. Soccer players move clubs all the time and teams are folding all the time because a lack of coaches and players.
The support the GAA receives from the local community, business, and the GAA organisation will always leave soccer struggling, particularly outside Dublin. In Dublin, underage teams are focused too much on winning their leagues rather than developing players, and it's always going to be that way until clubs develop care more about developing players and people rather than silly rolls of honors on club house walls showing how many U14 titles they have.

While most people only care about the Ireland team and a smaller number the LOI, whatever happens with the FAI, the focus needs to be at the grassroots level which in future years will benefit the LOI and international teams. It's a very long term project but one that needs to be done at the local town level and not Abbotstown.

Dots1982 · 27-03-2019 12:39PM

listermint wrote: »

I don't want tax payer money being poured into this organisation. The board and its former CEO have alot to answer for. The board's itself isn't keeping the CEO to account and visa versa. There's scant all separation of powers. This stuff shouldn't fly especially with public money.

Your drama about starving Irish football is just that drama. Change needs to be made and a thorough root out is what's needed.

Also I'm getting frequently more suspicious about connections of posters in this thread to the organisation because there's alot of white washing going on. That's very evident.

If you take 2.7 million of public away from the FAI, football in this country will struggle to function. That isn’t drama. That’s fact. This is a organization that struggles to meet its cash flow requirements.

This thing you peddle about “whitewashing” because a minority of opinions don’t agree with yours is drama however. It is drama and nonsense and the fact that the only thing you can come back with is this bull**** paranoia shows that your arguments are weak.

I don’t really want to get in to a tit for tat.

Successive Irish governments grossly underfunds sport in this country going back decades...that isn’t drama either, its fact, it’s borne out my internationally published studies.

Amirani · 27-03-2019 12:41PM

Dots1982 wrote: »

Unfortunately our government is the stingiest government in the entire EU when it comes to sports investment. But no one talks about that. They just blame the FAI for everything and don’t see the bigger picture.

Any source for that whatsoever? Or are you just going to throw out wild unverified statements?

Dots1982 · 27-03-2019 12:45PM

Amirani wrote: »

Any source for that whatsoever? Or are you just going to throw out wild unverified statements?

Yes, I’ll dig out the report and put it up.

Don’t believe the media spin that the government pumps money into the FAI and it’s all a big waste. Do your own research, form your own opinions.

kippy · 27-03-2019 12:46PM

Dots1982 wrote: »

If you take 2.7 million of public away from the FAI, football in this country will struggle to function. That isn’t drama. That’s fact. This is a organization that struggles to meet its cash flow requirements.

This thing you peddle about “whitewashing” because a minority of opinions don’t agree with yours is drama however. It is drama and nonsense and the fact that the only thing you can come back with is this bull**** paranoia shows that your arguments are weak.

I don’t really want to get in to a tit for tat.

Successive Irish governments grossly underfunds sport in this country going back decades...that isn’t drama either, its fact, it’s borne out my internationally published studies.

Why does it struggle to meet it's cash flow requirements?

Idbatterim · 27-03-2019 12:49PM

They are already losing millions a year due to people not going to matches. Look at Delaney obscene salary. What are the rest of the board etc on ? Withdraw the state funding and let them reduce their own pay and come up with Ways to generate more income. The position Delaney holds in the fai allows the crook to hold another position with fifa worth e160,000. If it wasn’t Delaney running the fai, he’d never be paid that. Half a million a year? It’s obscehe. They would leverage the e160k he’s getting from Uefa and pay an appropriate salary!

GavRedKing · 27-03-2019 12:56PM

Dots1982 wrote: »

If you take 2.7 million of public away from the FAI, football in this country will struggle to function. That isn’t drama. That’s fact. This is a organization that struggles to meet its cash flow requirements.

This thing you peddle about “whitewashing” because a minority of opinions don’t agree with yours is drama however. It is drama and nonsense and the fact that the only thing you can come back with is this bull**** paranoia shows that your arguments are weak.

I don’t really want to get in to a tit for tat.

Successive Irish governments grossly underfunds sport in this country going back decades...that isn’t drama either, its fact, it’s borne out my internationally published studies.

The government shouldnt be forced either to prop up an organisation with money.

The FAI made 5m in profit in 2017, so take away the grants and theyre still making 2m+ in profit.

The FAI play the poor mouth card very well when it suits but wont look inward at its top earners to see where cuts could be made.

Its basically like RTE anytime they whinge and moan to the government about license fees and lost revenue when they've useless idiots robbing a living on their pay roll earning 6 figures.

If the government pulled the plug on the funding it might force the FAI into action and cut its cloth accordingly, I doubt it would though, there would probably be price hikes on international tickets and license fees for the LoI would go through the roof.

Not that either are astronomically high as it stands.

listermint · 27-03-2019 01:13PM

Dots1982 wrote: »

If you take 2.7 million of public away from the FAI, football in this country will struggle to function. That isn’t drama. That’s fact. This is a organization that struggles to meet its cash flow requirements.

This thing you peddle about “whitewashing” because a minority of opinions don’t agree with yours is drama however. It is drama and nonsense and the fact that the only thing you can come back with is this bull**** paranoia shows that your arguments are weak.

I don’t really want to get in to a tit for tat.

Successive Irish governments grossly underfunds sport in this country going back decades...that isn’t drama either, its fact, it’s borne out my internationally published studies.

Confirming my original thoughts..

John Delaney at the FAI Thread - (Mod Notes in OP)

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