Hogging a chargepoint

jerryg · 26-03-2019 10:37pm #1

I came across one of the worst cases of Hogging a charge point in Navan today when a person ahead of me in a new Black Nissan Leaf spent 55 minutes on the charger.I have an ev for nearly 3 years and this experience took the biscuit.
I was down to10 percent so I had to wait,
God help us all if we ever have a famine with such selfish people about.
The sooner we have charging for charging the better!

unkel · 26-03-2019 11:30pm

55 minutes? That's nothing. The last one I was waiting for was a brand new local Leaf in Blanchardstown that was charging for well over 2 hours (car abandoned). This is probably the second busiest fast charger in Ireland. Some people are just ignorant pricks / imbeciles. The only thing that works is bringing in hefty charges for charging.

Tacklebox · 26-03-2019 11:31pm

unkel wrote: »

55 minutes? That's nothing. The last one I was waiting for was a brand new local Leaf in Blanchardstown that was charging for well over 2 hours (car abandoned). This is probably the second busiest fast charger in Ireland. Some people are just ignorant pricks / imbeciles. The only thing that works is bringing in hefty charges for charging.

How long does it take for a full charge ?

Atlantic Dawn · 26-03-2019 11:35pm

There needs to be a €10 an hour charge added once you go an hour charging over full charge, that would police itself.

TBi · 26-03-2019 11:40pm

At one fast charger in Cork someone left a kona charging for an hour while they went off to walk their dog. They got very upset with me when i said it was rude.

All i needed was a 10 minute charge to get home...

Tacklebox · 26-03-2019 11:44pm

I was in ennis one day and seen a leaf charging for nearly 3 hour's.
Because I parked near them, and came back and the thing was still plugged in....

unkel · 27-03-2019 12:07am

Tacklebox wrote: »

How long does it take for a full charge ?

A new model Leaf? From empty to full I'd say maybe 2.5 hours. On a rapid charger

n97 mini · 27-03-2019 12:10am

I think we all have anecdotes about public charge points abuse.

My two personal favourites are the woman who left her 2016 red Leaf plugged in for 10 days at the SCP in Tesco Maynooth. She had been left a few notes by others and I just happened to be there when she returned (dropped off with suitcases, looked like she'd been away). She balled up the notes and threw them on the ground.

The other was a woman and her Leaf at the FCP in Longford. Parking at that one is very awkward. I pulled in and noticed she was plugged in but not charging. I had to awkwardly position the car with one wheel on the footpath so the cable would reach. I unplugged her and plugged in my own car. She arrived back 20 minutes later, and was a bit dismayed I'd unplugged her. She said she plugs in every morning for an hour while she walks the dog.

Billing for public charging can happen soon enough.

liam7831 · 27-03-2019 12:11am

Oh dear dunno why anyone would torture themselves with one of these before any proper infrastructure is built.

NSAman · 27-03-2019 12:15am

Went into a garage todaywas at 10% took 3 minutes to top up..was on the road again... the joys of petrol.

n97 mini · 27-03-2019 12:15am

liam7831 wrote: »

Oh dear dunno why anyone would torture themselves with one of these before any proper infrastructure is built.

EVs are great if you can charge at home. If you're gonna be reliant on the public infrastructure buy something else. That is, until billing starts. That'll sort out a lot of problems.

n97 mini · 27-03-2019 12:20am

NSAman wrote: »

Went into a garage todaywas at 10% took 3 minutes to top up..was on the road again... the joys of petrol.

Good lad. You're paying for that privilege with between 7x and 10x the fuel costs, higher motor tax, higher servicing costs, and a vastly inferior driving experience. But if it works for you.

Actually I think I'll buy a helicopter.

NSAman · 27-03-2019 12:23am

n97 mini wrote: »

Good lad. You're paying for that privilege with between 7x and 10x the fuel costs, higher motor tax, higher servicing costs, and a vastly inferior driving experience. But if it works for you.

Actually I think I'll buy a helicopter.

With petrol at 2.40 a gallon and road tax of 125 a year for me, it makes more sense than an EV currently.

In Ireland, the home charging is the only way to go. Public charging stations simply are not sufficient. Here they have charging stations in all supermarkets, which is fine for city/town driving, but with long haul it simply isn’t an option for most currently.

n97 mini · 27-03-2019 12:44am

NSAman wrote: »

With petrol at 2.40 a gallon and road tax of 125 a year for me, it makes more sense than an EV currently.

In Ireland, the home charging is the only way to go. Public charging stations simply are not sufficient. Here they have charging stations in all supermarkets, which is fine for city/town driving, but with long haul it simply isn’t an option for most currently.

Ok, didn't know you were abroad, apologies. 2.40 a gallon -- where is that? I lived in Utah in 2016 and petrol was $2.30 a gallon. Ironically EV charging was probably more developed than here. Fast forward to 2018 and petrol was closer to $2.90 a gallon. Go to California and you can add a dollar to that.

Oh, and the other irony is that electricity here was/is about 10% cheaper!

mickdw · 27-03-2019 12:55am

What are the general rules re hogging charge points.
I notice there is a single charge point outside the offices of Mayo co council in castlebar. Without fail, every time I pass there is a leaf plugged in. It would appear that this car remains plugged in all day everyday.
Parking is at a premium also at this location and as such, plugging in results in a handy parking spot.

ppn · 27-03-2019 12:59am

n97 mini wrote: »

I think we all have anecdotes about public charge points abuse.

My two personal favourites are the woman who left her 2016 red Leaf plugged in for 10 days at the SCP in Tesco Maynooth. She had been left a few notes by others and I just happened to be there when she returned (dropped off with suitcases, looked like she'd been away). She balled up the notes and threw them on the ground.

The other was a woman and her Leaf at the FCP in Longford. Parking at that one is very awkward. I pulled in and noticed she was plugged in but not charging. I had to awkwardly position the car with one wheel on the footpath so the cable would reach. I unplugged her and plugged in my own car. She arrived back 20 minutes later, and was a bit dismayed I'd unplugged her. She said she plugs in every morning for an hour while she walks the dog.

Billing for public charging can happen soon enough.

Was just gonna ask, can you just unplug someone else's car if they're taking the pi$$? Pig ignorant fckers everywhere these days!! No regard for anyone only themselves...

Overheal · 27-03-2019 1:02am

NSAman wrote: »

With petrol at 2.40 a gallon and road tax of 125 a year for me, it makes more sense than an EV currently.

In Ireland, the home charging is the only way to go. Public charging stations simply are not sufficient. Here they have charging stations in all supermarkets, which is fine for city/town driving, but with long haul it simply isn’t an option for most currently.

i dunno I like the regen braking on my hybrid. There is a bridge between these two worlds.

unkel · 27-03-2019 1:28am

mickdw wrote: »

What are the general rules re hogging charge points.
I notice there is a single charge point outside the offices of Mayo co council in castlebar. Without fail, every time I pass there is a leaf plugged in. It would appear that this car remains plugged in all day everyday.
Parking is at a premium also at this location and as such, plugging in results in a handy parking spot.

No rules really. First come first served. And all slow chargers like the one you mention are "destination chargers" where you can plug in and leave your car all day or all night. That's fine.

In Dublin you have to pay for your parking the same as any other car. Outside Dublin, in most places parking is free while you are plugged in. The Leaf you mention isn't doing anything wrong.

The problem we are discussing in this thread is the fast chargers though. Still no rules, but the problem is that only one car can charge at a time. If you plug in the new model Leaf (charging from empty to full takes 2.5 hours - probably longer than any other EV). There is nothing anybody can do about it

But it is very frustrating obviously for anyone waiting at a fast charger. Most EVs just need a top up, a charge from 20%-80% takes no more than 20-30 minutes in most EVs. Compare it with this situation at a conventional petrol station. You arrive completely empty and you would not make it to the next petrol station. There is only one pump. And the person filling their car up at the pump, is pumping in a few drops of petrol at a time. And they are completely ignorant and they don't listen to your advice of pressing the holder harder so more petrol flows. And you are waiting hours for them to finally finish.

Wtf ? · 27-03-2019 1:35am

Is it not possible to ''Engineer'' an extension lead say 20' long and just bypass the hogger and just unplug him ? I know nothing re the etiquette of this ev thing ?

unkel · 27-03-2019 1:49am

Wtf ? wrote: »

I know nothing re the etiquette of this ev thing ?

The problem is that the etiquette is not working even if 95% of the owners are the nicest, kindest bunch yet the remaining 5% are ignorant imbeciles...

Only a temp problem though. As soon as it costs say 30c per kWh plus 30c per minute, all those fukcers will be gone from the chargers

Welcome to boards.ie anyway, happy first post!

Wtf ? · 27-03-2019 1:55am

unkel wrote: »

The problem is that the etiquette is not working even if 95% of the owners are the nicest, kindest bunch yet the remaining 5% are ignorant imbeciles...

Only a temp problem though. As soon as it costs say 30c per kWh plus 30c per minute, all those fukcers will be gone from the chargers

Welcome to boards.ie anyway, happy first post!

Thank you, Address my extension lead theory ?

NSAman · 27-03-2019 2:01am

n97 mini wrote: »

Ok, didn't know you were abroad, apologies. 2.40 a gallon -- where is that? I lived in Utah in 2016 and petrol was $2.30 a gallon. Ironically EV charging was probably more developed than here. Fast forward to 2018 and petrol was closer to $2.90 a gallon. Go to California and you can add a dollar to that.

Oh, and the other irony is that electricity here was/is about 10% cheaper!

Charging stations are pretty well developed in most towns/cities here. The local supermarket has 15 Tesla high speed chargers. In all the times I have been shopping I have only seen one car using it. Despite the number of Tesla car on the road here, I think most are home charged.

Electricity is cheap here. Illinois... someone was saying they liked the hybrid, I did toy with getting a hybrid, but simply the cost even with the incentive was not worth it for me. Certain things here cannot go electric, even though they have electronic part engines eg. Trucks...Ram/F150. Power and hauling are what they are used for brute force basically.

I am still enthralled that etiquette rules have not been issued in relation to public chargers there in Ireland...common sense dictates that you should not hog a charger, but judging by many of the eco-die-hards here (and I know this is a generalization) common sense doesn’t play a large part in their psyche.

27-03-2019 8:01am

unkel wrote: »

A new model Leaf? From empty to full I'd say maybe 2.5 hours. On a rapid charger

Unlike some other makers Nissan allows the car to charge to 100 percent at a rapid which is not great. On a sufficiently cool battery the low to 80 percent is reached in 40 minutes, the next 10 percent takes another 10 minutes and the remaining 90-100 takes another 30 minutes more so 1:20 in total.

The car should really just auto stop at 90 percent. IMO.

redlead · 27-03-2019 8:31am

What actually is the etiquette? For instance I see people complaining about cars being plugged in for 55 mins / an hour but I would have thought that that is the norm and would be perfectly acceptable? Also if someone needs a charge to 80% and someone else arrives saying they need 10 mins then are they expected to stop charging and let them charge? I don't have a clue but was just wondering.

I obviously don't have an EV but it's clear to me from passing my local charge points that not charging seems to be a disaster. For instance there is what looks to be a fast charger in the Lidl just off the M1 in Drogheda. Whenever I go there there always seems to be the same leaf and outlander phev parked up charging. This means that anyone coming off the motorway that genuinely needs a charge can never use it.

I'd imagine once EVs go more mainstream that there will be some awful road rage incidents.

The Bishop Basher · 27-03-2019 8:45am

n97 mini wrote: »

a vastly inferior driving experience.

In comparison to what ?

What are you driving and what are you comparing the experience to ?

upinsmoke · 27-03-2019 8:49am

Are those chargers free? People been frugal?

Wanderer78 · 27-03-2019 9:31am

How long does it take to fully charge a car from dead?

ELM327 · 27-03-2019 9:55am

Wanderer78 wrote: »

How long does it take to fully charge a car from dead?

The car is not usually dead, you would arrive with 5-15%
To get from that to 80% in a new leaf can take 45-55 minutes.
In an Ioniq it would take ~25 and in a kona could take 80 minutes +

upinsmoke wrote: »

Are those chargers free? People been frugal?

Yes they are currently free, it's people being arseholes to be honest.

slave1 · 27-03-2019 10:02am

Are we not going in circles again, consistent consensus is the current infrastructure is inadequate and if you need to rely on it on a regular basis then an EV is not for you at the present time.
I've fast charged three times in over two years and maybe up to 10 times on the slow chargers.
An EV suits us perfectly as a second car but as above would never serve us as our only means.

2019 is a bit of a dud year for EV's (availability/pricing) so I'd say it will be another 3yrs+ before the infrastructure becomes in any way adequate

ImARebel · 27-03-2019 10:03am

I would go loopy if I'd paid for a car that wouldn't get me from A to B without stopping no matter how much money I was saving

To be on the road to Cork only to have to stop off, possibly get stuck behind some eejit like mentioned above and add an extra hour+ onto the journey with the kids screaming blue murder and the other half throwing me dirty looks for buying the car in the first place

instead of a fore court, I'd be heading to the divorce courts.

it's all grand in theory until you realise that any lengthy journey means a possible clash with a a$$hole (I'd have to find a public charger in cork too as the house at home wouldn't have one)

not for me I'm afraid

Effects · 27-03-2019 10:11am

ImARebel wrote: »

I'd have to find a public charger in cork too as the house at home wouldn't have one

Sounds like a fairly rustic house in Cork that doesn't have any electrical sockets.

Mickeroo · 27-03-2019 10:12am

ImARebel wrote: »

I would go loopy if I'd paid for a car that wouldn't get me from A to B without stopping no matter how much money I was saving

To be on the road to Cork only to have to stop off, possibly get stuck behind some eejit like mentioned above and add an extra hour+ onto the journey with the kids screaming blue murder and the other half throwing me dirty looks for buying the car in the first place

instead of a fore court, I'd be heading to the divorce courts.

it's all grand in theory until you realise that any lengthy journey means a possible clash with a a$$hole (I'd have to find a public charger in cork too as the house at home wouldn't have one)

not for me I'm afraid

Does your home house not have a three pin plug you could reach?

Either way, I wouldn't advise buying an EV if you make long journeys with regularity unless you can afford at least a Kona.

Effects · 27-03-2019 10:12am

Wtf ? wrote: »

Thank you, Address my extension lead theory ?

Wtf ? wrote: »

Is it not possible to ''Engineer'' an extension lead say 20' long and just bypass the hogger and just unplug him ? I know nothing re the etiquette of this ev thing ?

The lead gets locked in place in the charger and the car. At least that's how it worked with a Kia Niro PHEV I had for a few days last year.

antix80 · 27-03-2019 10:14am

I actually thought those EV parking spots in carparks were for all-day parking! I'm not even trolling. I just thought you went off to work or shopping or whatever you want to do and came back to a charged car when you were done (at your leisure) rather than returning in an hour to move it to a regular spot.

Effects · 27-03-2019 10:15am

Mickeroo wrote: »

Either way, I wouldn't advise buying an EV if you make long journeys with regularity unless you can afford at least a Kona.

I'm looking at an i3 and do 200km trip west regularly enough. We are planning to run current car and the i3 for a while to see how we get on.

Not sure of the model range on the i3 yet. It'll be bought from a family member that's emigrating.

antix80 · 27-03-2019 10:16am

n97 mini wrote: »

Good lad. You're paying for that privilege with between 7x and 10x the fuel costs, higher motor tax, higher servicing costs, and a vastly inferior driving experience. But if it works for you.

Petrol doesn't cost that much when you strip out government tax.
Motor tax.. EVs use the road, tax them too and the government can raise even more revenue. (just maybe wait until more people have them before hiking tax and saying people need to use hydro powered cars or whatever the next scam will be)
Servicing costs.. no idea if they're higher.
Inferior driving experience... that would be the EVs. I like the growl my diesel makes.

Effects · 27-03-2019 10:16am

antix80 wrote: »

I just thought you went off to work or shopping or whatever you want to do and came back to a charged car when you were done

Do you need much more than an hour to do your shopping?

ELM327 · 27-03-2019 10:17am

ImARebel wrote: »

I would go loopy if I'd paid for a car that wouldn't get me from A to B without stopping no matter how much money I was saving

To be on the road to Cork only to have to stop off, possibly get stuck behind some eejit like mentioned above and add an extra hour+ onto the journey with the kids screaming blue murder and the other half throwing me dirty looks for buying the car in the first place

instead of a fore court, I'd be heading to the divorce courts.

it's all grand in theory until you realise that any lengthy journey means a possible clash with a a$$hole (I'd have to find a public charger in cork too as the house at home wouldn't have one)

not for me I'm afraid

Unfortunately this is the reality of EV ownership at the moment in Ireland until the network is financed.

Mickeroo · 27-03-2019 10:18am

Effects wrote: »

I'm looking at an i3 and do 200km trip west regularly enough. We are planning to run current car and the i3 for a while to see how we get on.

Not sure of the model range on the i3 yet. It'll be bought from a family member that's emigrating.

If you have a second car then go for it, i3 is a great car. Is it a Rex model? If so then you won't have to worry about public chargers at all.

antix80 · 27-03-2019 10:26am

Effects wrote: »

Do you need much more than an hour to do your shopping?

I've often gone for coffee, did some clothes shopping, met a friend for lunch.. could be parked up for hours.

Effects · 27-03-2019 10:29am

antix80 wrote: »

Inferior driving experience... that would be the EVs. I like the growl my diesel makes.

What kind of diesel is that? If you had said the growl of a petrol engine, then maybe. I'd put driving experience down to more than just the sound of an engine myself.

Effects · 27-03-2019 10:31am

Mickeroo wrote: »

If you have a second car then go for it, i3 is a great car. Is it a Rex model? If so then you won't have to worry about public chargers at all.

Pretty sure it isn't a Rex model. It's used as a second car in London at the moment. So they never had plans to use it on longer journeys.

Effects · 27-03-2019 10:32am

antix80 wrote: »

I've often gone for coffee, did some clothes shopping, met a friend for lunch.. could be parked up for hours.

Then it makes sense that you shouldn't leave it taking up a charge space when someone else probably needs it.
I think that's part of the problem. People don't think about how to use the spots properly with consideration of other people.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 27-03-2019 10:34am

antix80 wrote: »

Inferior driving experience... that would be the EVs. I like the growl my diesel makes.

That doesn't make any sense. The noise of your car correlates with your experience? Motorhead at full volume and off you go...

unkel · 27-03-2019 10:38am

antix80 wrote: »

Inferior driving experience... that would be the EVs. I like the growl my diesel makes.

A nice growl? Horrific cancer causing sick sounding rattle of a large bag of broken spanners rubbing together more like. But I guess different strokes for different folks and all that...

ELM327 · 27-03-2019 10:38am

Effects wrote: »

Pretty sure it isn't a Rex model. It's used as a second car in London at the moment. So they never had plans to use it on longer journeys.

Be careful, a lot of early i3 sold in UK cities did not come with DC fast charging.

BENDYBINN · 27-03-2019 10:39am

jerryg wrote: »

I came across one of the worst cases of Hogging a charge point in Navan today when a person ahead of me in a new Black Nissan Leaf spent 55 minutes on the charger.I have an ev for nearly 3 years and this experience took the biscuit.
I was down to10 percent so I had to wait,
God help us all if we ever have a famine with such selfish people about.
The sooner we have charging for charging the better!

I’m completely lost here.......
If this man had another 100 km to get home surely he was entitled to charge his car fully???

creedp · 27-03-2019 10:42am

BENDYBINN wrote: »

I’m completely lost here.......
If this man had another 100 km to get home surely he was entitled to charge his car fully???

If is an NB word here

miamee · 27-03-2019 10:50am

A lot of people post about their bad experiences out of frustration giving the impression that we are all being hampered at chargers by ignoramuses who hog chargers without regard to anyone else. The reality is very different. Myself and my partner have two EVs, an Ioniq and a Leaf. The Ioniq is the main car and has brought us literally all over the country, with a little planning for the long journeys. It is rare to be hampered at a charger by a hogger and most people are very friendly, happy to chat, tell you they'll be done in 15 minutes (or whatever) or, if they are making a long stop, they might allow you to plug in for a while ahead of them - yes this has happened on more than one occasion.

My own rule of thumb would be if they are still actively charging then there is no issue with them being plugged in. If you really need the charge you'll just have to wait or in some cases, seek out the next closest one if it's free (and you can make it

)

Travelling by EV is definitely something that takes getting used to if doing long journeys but we only do those in our leisure time, not for work, so we're never in too much of a hurry and are used to planning our charge stops now.

ELM327 · 27-03-2019 10:53am

BENDYBINN wrote: »

I’m completely lost here.......
If this man had another 100 km to get home surely he was entitled to charge his car fully???

There is no car that takes 55 minutes on a fast charger to get 100km

TomasMacR · 27-03-2019 10:58am

I find for a nation of people who supposedly have a good reputation for being friendly, generous and look after one another we are far from it underneath it all. For the most part there is a very prevalent 'mé féiner' attitude, put yourself in front of everyone no matter what. Queue skipping, nobody has a clue how to enter/exit public transport, walk into a very busy cafe/restaurant find half the tables are being held by someone while someone else is up getting food first while people stand there with trays of food already paid for looking for seats, not to mention kids screaming in restaurants (I have one by the way but dont bring him into restaurants), rubbish dumped everywhere...(had a skip rented a fortnight ago for a house move and overnight it was half full of other houses rubbish). All small stuff, but basically we have no understanding of consideration for others. I'd love to get an electric car but until there is some kind of formal charging system in place with penalties most likely I won't bother.

Hogging a chargepoint

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