6 Nations 2019 Build Up thread

joseywhales · 09-03-2019 11:17pm

I don't understand the argument that Georgia haven't proved that they are good enough to warrant a playoff. If they are not good enough then they will lose to Italy every year and won't make promotion, so there is nothing to worry about.

PTH2009 · 09-03-2019 11:35pm

for us too win (an undeserved imo) championship we will need too win our next 2 games with BPs and hope Scotland beat England

10-03-2019 12:06am

PTH2009 wrote: »

for us too win (an undeserved imo) championship we will need too win our next 2 games with BPs and hope Scotland beat England

Fully resigned to an at best second place.

A loss to Wales would be disappointing but you wouldn't have bet against it at the start of the tournament. I keep reading about "underestimating Wales" but I rarely see people underestimate Wales, certainly not recently and we've never had a reliable record against them which most people recognise.

It's the England game that has unravelled us this year.

mangobob · 10-03-2019 12:54am

Deleted User wrote: »

Fully resigned to an at best second place.

I would be delighted with a second place finish at this stage tbh. I dont expect us to get it.

It's the England game that has unravelled us this year.

We really demonstrated the truth of the old adage that you can't win a Grand Slam on the first day, but you can lose it. In truth, we lost everything after that game - Grand Slam, championship and triple crown.

swiwi_ · 11-03-2019 6:19am

Last time Scotland beat England at twickenham was 1983.

molloyjh · 11-03-2019 9:01am

swiwi_ wrote: »

Last time Scotland beat England at twickenham was 1983.

Yeah, that isn’t going to happen. The title will go to either England or Wales. Wales have to be favourites at this stage. But if we beat Wales, then England will know any win at all will see them lift the trophy. They won’t slip up. It would be an enormous shock if they did.

jr86 · 11-03-2019 9:08am

molloyjh wrote: »

Yeah, that isn’t going to happen. The title will go to either England or Wales. Wales have to be favourites at this stage. But if we beat Wales, then England will know any win at all will see them lift the trophy. They won’t slip up. It would be an enormous shock if they did.

The only hope really was if they were to get white line fever and fail to get 4 tries. As it transpires any win will be enough, and I'd expect Farrell to just tick away at taking 3 pointers

t8010789 · 11-03-2019 4:15pm

jr86 wrote: »

The only hope really was if they were to get white line fever and fail to get 4 tries. As it transpires any win will be enough, and I'd expect Farrell to just tick away at taking 3 pointers

I don't even think he'll need to be worry about taking three pointers. Scotland are so depleted that I can't see anything but a bonus point win for England.

Anjobe · 11-03-2019 4:26pm

Don't be so pessimistic, all Ireland need to do is beat Wales by 80 points or so to put some pressure on England. Should be simple for the 2nd best team in the world, shouldn't it?

Dickie10 · 11-03-2019 4:50pm

id say we will be beaten but should be a cracker of a game im goin for something like 26-34. first time ever i hope ireland get beat just so england dont win it, plus i like wales there a great rugby nation, gatland is an unbeliveable manager and he started the golden years for us so hopefully they win the grand slam. i think they were missing 10 or 11 strting players before the tournament. unreal if they win it

Anjobe · 11-03-2019 5:19pm

Dickie10 wrote: »

first time ever i hope ireland get beat just so england dont win it

Cutting off your nose to spite your face? If Ireland lose to Wales then the notion that they are the top team in the Northern hemisphere, best placed to challenge New Zealand at the World Cup will be well and truly nixed. The rankings are a bit of mystery, I admit, but I think Wales will move into 2nd if they win.

Eod100 · 11-03-2019 5:26pm

Anjobe wrote: »

Cutting off your nose to spite your face? If Ireland lose to Wales then the notion that they are the top team in the Northern hemisphere, best placed to challenge New Zealand at the World Cup will be well and truly nixed. The rankings are a bit of mystery, I admit, but I think Wales will move into 2nd if they win.

We've a better win record vs NZ than Wales under JS! (albeit lower sample size for NZ games and Wales matches probably include warm up games)

Anjobe · 11-03-2019 5:40pm

Eod100 wrote: »

We've a better win record vs NZ than Wales under JS! (albeit lower sample size for NZ games and Wales matches probably include warm up games)

Yes, but recent form in sport is always more relevant that past form. There are really only three decent teams in the 6N, with not much between them. Ireland could hardly claim to be the best of these three when they have just been beaten by both of the other two.

Eod100 · 11-03-2019 6:15pm

Anjobe wrote: »

Yes, but recent form in sport is always more relevant that past form. There are really only three decent teams in the 6N, with not much between them. Ireland could hardly claim to be the best of these three when they have just been beaten by both of the other two.

Wouldn't disagree with that guess only qualifier is that results in 6N in a RWC year not necessarily indication of form in RWC. Arguably 6N is tougher than a lot of pools in RWCs. Aim should still be to beat Wales of course and don't think anyone would want us to lose just so England don't win Championship

joseywhales · 11-03-2019 8:48pm

Has anyone else noticed that it is really hard to get a yellow card or to get badly penalised this year.

Wales should have had a yellow and France could have had three.

The refs have a bias to try to keep teams in the game, not allow a YC dictate the result. Even after France got their YC, the substitute tighthead came straight on bored in at about 90 degrees in front of the ref and the ref allowed play on, as if he felt like he had penalised france enough. He seemed very reluctant to penalise the team that was being totally dominated. Are we also to believe that out of the 3 successive penalties he did give at the 5m scrum, that none of them were likely to result in a try if the offending payer were removed from the play? I also notice the refs have no memory, there can be a warning in the 22, a relieving kick, 10 minutes later there can be another penalty in the 22 and the penalty clock is somehow reset, happened over halftime in the french game. Also i notice that if advantage is played and a team scores a try, even if the opposition commit another foul during the play, the ref does not come back to YC. It's as though he is just trying to keep games as competitive as possible. If that first half had been strictly and consistently reffed, France could have been down to 12 players.

It's all well and good but teams will adapt to become more cynical again, scrums and mauls will collapse all day, rucks will be illegally slowed down etc.

Anjobe · 12-03-2019 10:43am

Dickie10 wrote: »

first time ever i hope ireland get beat just so england dont win it

Eod100 wrote: »

...don't think anyone would want us to lose just so England don't win Championship

Dickie10 wanted exactly that, my comments were just a warning to anyone engaging in that sort of begrudgery to be careful what they wish for.

Wheres Me Jumper? · 12-03-2019 3:05pm

looks like Van der Flier is out. groin.

O'Brien or Leavy i wonder?

Squidgy Black · 12-03-2019 3:44pm

Wheres Me Jumper? wrote: »

looks like Van der Flier is out. groin.

O'Brien or Leavy i wonder?

Leavy I'd imagine. He's already been called up to the squad.

Wheres Me Jumper? · 12-03-2019 4:13pm

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Leavy I'd imagine. He's already been called up to the squad.

sure but i think The Tank is a more exciting player.

Amprodude · 12-03-2019 9:57pm

Surely Wales will sail to victory on Saturday and we be all on here talking how average this Irish team really is after all. Gatland won't let Ireland win and you can guarantee that.

whatawaster · 13-03-2019 9:40am

Amprodude wrote: »

Surely Wales will sail to victory on Saturday and we be all on here talking how average this Irish team really is after all. Gatland won't let Ireland win and you can guarantee that.

I didn't realise Gatland has that power. Why haven't Wales won the last 2 World Cups so?

Dickie10 · 13-03-2019 4:25pm

jesus big statement, Gatland is a rugby genius though, best manager i can remember in world rugby even ahead of woodward. some acheivement what hes done in wales. i think it will be very tight but wales surely with home advantage and a grand slam on the line will do it. like i say we have nothing really to play for and i think the players dont belive they will actually win the championship,very hard to get overly up for the game in the same way wales will be. hopefully we dont go in with half an eye on club rugby and get tanked but i dont think the players will let that happen still the way we conceded tries in last five minutes to france is a worry. wales by 6

aloooof · 13-03-2019 4:38pm

Amprodude wrote: »

Surely Wales will sail to victory on Saturday and we be all on here talking how average this Irish team really is after all. Gatland won't let Ireland win and you can guarantee that.

Wales are 4/5 with the bookies, the spread being just a point. I presume you'll be lumping your life savings on to make your fortune, and this isn't just hyperbole on your part?

Yeah_Right · 13-03-2019 5:10pm

Dickie10 wrote: »

jesus big statement, Gatland is a rugby genius though, best manager i can remember in world rugby even ahead of woodward.

Steve Hansen finds this statement hilarious.

Buer · 13-03-2019 5:18pm

Yeah_Right wrote: »

Steve Hansen finds this statement hilarious.

He might have a chuckle but look at some of the players Gatland has achieved success with recently. Parkes, Anscombe, Tomos Williams, Josh Navidi, Adam Beard, Owen Watkin, Aaron Wainwright, Tom Young, Elliot Dee...these are guys that have been starting for Wales in this tournament.

2 years ago, people would have laughed at the idea of some of those names winning a Grand Slam....they wouldn't have even heard of the others.

Gatland deserves a huge amount of respect for what he has achieved at test level on limited resources and with a domestic game that is perenially on the brink of collapse. Whatever it is about his style of management and the Welsh psyche, it's a perfect match. They absolutely buy into him and he knows how to bring them to a level they'll never reach under anyone else.

Eod100 · 13-03-2019 5:25pm

French and Wales teams were both out last Tuesday. Presume they will be out tomorrow this week. Keeping cards close to their chest for last game?

errlloyd · 13-03-2019 5:36pm

Buer wrote: »

He might have a chuckle but look at some of the players Gatland has achieved success with recently. Parkes, Anscombe, Tomos Williams, Josh Navidi, Adam Beard, Owen Watkin, Aaron Wainwright, Tom Young, Elliot Dee...these are guys that have been starting for Wales in this tournament.

2 years ago, people would have laughed at the idea of some of those names winning a Grand Slam....they wouldn't have even heard of the others.

Gatland deserves a huge amount of respect for what he has achieved at test level on limited resources and with a domestic game that is perenially on the brink of collapse.

Gareth Thomas, Dwayne Peel, Martyn Williams, Colin Charvis, Steven Jones, Gethin Jenkins.... These are the guys that were starting for Wales in the 2003 tournament. When Steve Hansen was coach.

Looking back you'd laugh at the idea of them getting a wooden spoon, well beaten by Italy and Scotland. Came close to beating Ireland in the Millenium Stadium but ultimately failed. Hansen deserves at least some visibility over the fact he was dramatically less successful as a coach up here than Warren Gatland.

sydthebeat · 13-03-2019 5:37pm

ireland will win this..... ive decided today

Yeah_Right · 13-03-2019 6:06pm

Buer wrote: »

He might have a chuckle but look at some of the players Gatland has achieved success with recently. Parkes, Anscombe, Tomos Williams, Josh Navidi, Adam Beard, Owen Watkin, Aaron Wainwright, Tom Young, Elliot Dee...these are guys that have been starting for Wales in this tournament.

2 years ago, people would have laughed at the idea of some of those names winning a Grand Slam....they wouldn't have even heard of the others.

Gatland deserves a huge amount of respect for what he has achieved at test level on limited resources and with a domestic game that is perenially on the brink of collapse. Whatever it is about his style of management and the Welsh psyche, it's a perfect match. They absolutely buy into him and he knows how to bring them to a level they'll never reach under anyone else.

True. But look at their opposition. Basically 2nd tier

Leinstertomas · 13-03-2019 9:24pm

Buer wrote: »

He might have a chuckle but look at some of the players Gatland has achieved success with recently. Parkes, Anscombe, Tomos Williams, Josh Navidi, Adam Beard, Owen Watkin, Aaron Wainwright, Tom Young, Elliot Dee...these are guys that have been starting for Wales in this tournament.

2 years ago, people would have laughed at the idea of some of those names winning a Grand Slam....they wouldn't have even heard of the others.

Gatland deserves a huge amount of respect for what he has achieved at test level on limited resources and with a domestic game that is perenially on the brink of collapse. Whatever it is about his style of management and the Welsh psyche, it's a perfect match. They absolutely buy into him and he knows how to bring them to a level they'll never reach under anyone else.

Those players are hardly poor and I'd say most winning teams have had players in the squad and even 15 who you wouldn't class as top level
But I definitely agree that he's done a great job overall for Wales

6 Nations 2019 Build Up thread

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