Margaret Cash steals €300 worth of clothes from Penneys and aftermath/etc!

freshpopcorn · 22-02-2019 11:39PM

I think I might have a bit of Gypsy blood because I can see into the future and predict who's going to like certain posts!

normanoffside · 22-02-2019 11:46PM

I have lots of respect for many travellers.
Andy Lee is the perfect example. He got out of the traveller 'trap'; educated himself, dedicated himself to his sport, studied, read, 'actually' travelled (to other parts of the world) and ended up marrying outside the wider travelling family (to a settled girl as Bernard Sweeney would say).
It's clear as day to me that when travellers look outside their own culture they are just as able as anyone else to do well in the world.

While Andy can see that he and other travellers were prejudiced against (when he was a child) instead of moaning about it, he decided to take the other road and not conform to traveller stereotypes. He has triumphed and is now widely revered. No one would say a bad word about him Andy is now almost universally praised and this shows there is no Instinctive racism to travellers amongst Irish people IMO (Just disgust at their often bad behaviour).

Other travellers have been unfortunately less lucky than Andy. Look at Francie Barrett. He carried the flag for Ireland at the 1996 Olympics and after turning pro was stabbed when he refused to engage in a bare knuckle match with a rival traveller family who was calling him out. If he had boxed him he'd have lost his pro license. https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/olympic-boxer-and-father-left-cut-and-bleeding-after-car-park-stabbing-26121142.html

Then there's John Joe Nevin who won Olympic Silver. Turned pro, won several fights before getting his legs broke in a 'Feud' with a rival traveller gang. https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/other-sports/john-joe-nevin-told-both-his-legs-were-broken-in-attack-1.1754734
His pro career has been effectively ruined since.

To me it seems it's very difficult to get out of the traveller trap as anyone doing so is seen as getting 'too big for their boots' and dragged right back down again. Anybody who breaks the norm has my utmost respect.

I honestly don't have any prejudice against individual travellers, just the traveller culture which is bringing them all down.

I wish we had less John Connors and Maggie cashes and more Andy Lees.

freshpopcorn · 22-02-2019 11:54PM

normanoffside wrote: »

I honestly don't have any prejudice against individual travellers, just the traveller culture which is bringing them all down.

I wish we had less John Connors and Maggie cashes and more Andy Lees.

I think everybody would like to see more Andy Lee's or just people doing their best to work raise their kids and get an some type of an education.
Nobody is saying they've to go off and become rocket scientists but just do their bit and it will mainly benefit themselves.

NIMAN · 23-02-2019 12:16AM

Is there pressure within traveller families to keep their kids away from education?

This is one of the major things which could change their lot in life. Surely some parents out there really want their kids to get an education and better themselves? There must be some.

normanoffside · 23-02-2019 12:43AM

NIMAN wrote: »

Is there pressure within traveller families to keep their kids away from education?

This is one of the major things which could change their lot in life. Surely some parents out there really want their kids to get an education and better themselves? There must be some.

There absolutely is. When I was in primary school (in the 80’s) I had a few travelller boys in my class. Some of them were quite bright and well liked but they were often absent.
One particular lad passed the 11+ and got a place in the grammar school (Northern Ireland) but he rejected the the place and went to the local intermediate school. He was one of the brightest kids in the class but his family didn’t want him mixing with people who wanted to go to university.

I met him about 5 years later, he was having his wedding party at the local hotel on his 16th birthday.

freshpopcorn · 23-02-2019 12:48AM

NIMAN wrote: »

Is there pressure within traveller families to keep their kids away from education?

This is one of the major things which could change their lot in life. Surely some parents out there really want their kids to get an education and better themselves? There must be some.

Just based on what I know or people I know.
Travellers seem to be attending primary education a lot more. This may because of extra support financially and also the extra resources.
These are also in place in secondary school but for some reason there is a disconnect.
This have improved tough.
But it seems to be because in there culture/group they marry younger/start families and sometimes they traveller around. I have also heard travelers say they don't feel comfortable mixing there settled teenage children around homosexuality, contraception, drugs,etc because these are against there religious beliefs.

corks finest · 23-02-2019 01:21AM

Paddy Cow wrote: »

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Wrong question, with respect. Your question is a bit like asking 'are poor people poor because of circumstances, or because they are stupid?'. Neither answer is correct. A better question might be, 'are traveller children achieving optimal educational and life-expectation outcomes in their current living conditions?'. The answer to that is an unambiguous No, and it's all to do with upbringing.

.

Absolutely. If you are brought up to believe that working 40 hours a week is a mugs game and there is an easier option of filling out a few forms and getting the weak settled folk to subsidise your existence based on your "culture", why would the kids think any differently?

Adult travellers are the problem. They take the young ones out of school between the ages of 12-15 because they don't want them mixing with settled kids. God forbid a traveller girl would get into a relationship with a settled male and want a life for herself outside the confines of being a baby factory. God forbid that traveller kids would realise that education means that you can actually have a career that gives you fulfilment. Not all jobs are minimum wage but you have to get educated to get them. My brother is a programmer and he is the stereotypical nerd. He LOVES his job and bores the rest of us to tears with his "exciting" stories.

They could become doctors, firefighters, paramedics etc if only they stayed in school. They are not pushed out of school by settled people. The government spends loads of money trying to keep them there but the adults won't have it. They want to keep them isolated and uneducated because an uneducated teen is far more compliant than a mid 20's adult with a university education and options.

You are living in la la land. 60 years ago many people have stories about letting Travellers stay on their land and the Travellers did farm work etc. Those days of Travellers being Travellers and self sufficient are long gone. Nowadays most "Travellers" live in houses provided by the state taxpayer and are subsidised by social welfare/medical cards, also provided by the state taxpayer.

Your comparison with the poor also doesn't hold weight. As has been quoted many times on this thread, Margaret Cash herself said "I'm not poor, I'm homeless. I'm on benefits just like everyone else". They have money, they just spend it stupidly on gaudy furniture and expensive communion outfits. God forbid they'd spend it on their kids education or giving them a healthy diet.

Welfare is their "income" to spend how they see fit but don't be saying that they are discriminated against. They are adults who have the same choices as everyone else. They make poor choices and foist those same choices on their children by depriving them of an education and a fair shot at life. The cycle rinses and repeats.

I have a serious question for you. What do you think is the future for Margaret's daughter? Do you think she will finish secondary school and go onto university or will she be taken out of school before finishing the Junior Cert and married off to someone? If she is married off, is that because of settled discrimination? That child is only 9 years old. Right now she is an innocent child with the world at her feet but what future should she have and who gets to decide it? Should she be married off in her teens or should she get educated and decide for herself in her 20's?

Please answer those questions. You have very strong views on how Travellers have it so hard but show little to no insight into how Travellers themselves can overcome these issues. Tell us what we can/should do to change the trajectory of Margaret's daughter's life, or do you think we should just leave her be and let Traveller culture takes it's course? I honestly want to know what you think. Should that 9 year old finish education or become a product of Traveller upbringing?

Some v good points there boy

BattleCorp · 23-02-2019 10:32AM

normanoffside wrote: »

I met him about 5 years later, he was having his wedding party at the local hotel on his 16th birthday.

Were they handing these out on the way in.

babi-hrse · 23-02-2019 10:55AM

I had a traveller lad in my primary school he was a quiet enough lad in 6 class principals from different schools came round to talk about their school and why we should go there and handed out flyers.
This was every other day a different principal a different school.
The class had pretty much been split on 2 schools so these were pretty much pointless one principal came in from a school I can't remember and asked for a show of hands who is thinking about coming. No one put their hand up the traveller lad in front of me looked around slowly then raised his hand slowly.
It only dawned on me later in life that he was having a tough time dealing with the question of which school you going to as his parents had no intention of sending him to any.
This was his way to escape the questions when he saw that noone was going he could lie and say he was going there and noone would notice him not showing up.
I saw him in years later on swimming in a river while I was in it during the summer everyone I was with shied away and walked i had literally just gotten in so I just decided to stay put and we had a conversation he was actually genuinely a nice lad.

Wanderer78 · 23-02-2019 11:20AM

babi-hrse wrote:

I had a traveller lad in my primary school he was a quiet enough lad in 6 class principals from different schools came round to talk about their school and why we should go there and handed out flyers. This was every other day a different principal a different school. The class had pretty much been split on 2 schools so these were pretty much pointless one principal came in from a school I can't remember and asked for a show of hands who is thinking about coming. No one put their hand up the traveller lad in front of me looked around slowly then raised his hand slowly. It only dawned on me later in life that he was having a tough time dealing with the question of which school you going to as his parents had no intention of sending him to any. This was his way to escape the questions when he saw that noone was going he could lie and say he was going there and noone would notice him not showing up. I saw him in years later on swimming in a river while I was in it during the summer everyone I was with shied away and walked i had literally just gotten in so I just decided to stay put and we had a conversation he was actually genuinely a nice lad.

A lot of shame in the travelling community over continuing education, it's hard to know how to approach it, you will find the odd approachable one as well

Icsics · 23-02-2019 11:28AM

NIMAN wrote: »

Is there pressure within traveller families to keep their kids away from education?

This is one of the major things which could change their lot in life. Surely some parents out there really want their kids to get an education and better themselves? There must be some.

It depends on how strong the mother is. You get the odd one with a bit of cop on & they fight to keep their children in school. But more often than not the father calls the shots & 'heritage' wins out.

23-02-2019 11:44AM

So far Travellers have been compared to African Americans, The Amish, Maori and Aboriginal people. Just waiting for Hasidic Jews, Inuit Eskimos and Buddhist Monks now...

punisher5112 · 23-02-2019 12:27PM

Omackeral wrote: »

So far Travellers have been compared to African Americans, The Amish, Maori and Aboriginal people. Just waiting for Hasidic Jews, Inuit Eskimos and Buddhist Monks now...

Don't forget saints and angles too.... Yes angles any degree you can think of.

Dante7 · 23-02-2019 09:23PM

Andy Lee is not typical Irish Traveller. He is more from the English gypsy culture which is a bit different. They haven't been given the handouts to the same extent as Irish Travellers. Good lad Andy. I've plenty of time for him.

tuxy · 24-02-2019 06:47PM

I see Bernard is writing a book called......Travision!
Lets hope he can raise the €500 he needs.

So he has had two go fund me's that have failed for the podcast/TV show
And now he is trying again but in book format.

24-02-2019 06:56PM

Who is this Bernard that you're taking such a keen interest in?

freshpopcorn · 24-02-2019 07:00PM

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Who is this Bernard that you're taking such a keen interest in?

He's a traveller.
He's ran in the general election.
He has very liberal views regarding gay rights and abortion
He campaigns for traveller rights and has a YouTube channel discussing thing with people.(I think it's mainly aimed at traveller.

https://m.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100007227857780&ref=content_filter

Spanish Eyes · 24-02-2019 07:09PM

There was a segment on RTE1 at one o'clock about Travellers.

I just refused to listen. No one seems to realise that this small element of our society has caused mayhem to those who actually pay for their lifestyles.

For the record I am talking about the majority of them. There are some who are possibly ok. But they do not seem to berate their tribe either. Fear of reprisals maybe?

normanoffside · 24-02-2019 07:41PM

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Who is this Bernard that you're taking such a keen interest in?

1. He's a victim mentality Traveller who thinks the world is against him. he seems to hate all settled people.

2. He stands up for traveller rights but most travellers hate him because of his liberal views on abortion and gay marriage.

3. He talks Sh1te all the time and says that Maggie Cash is the Irish equivalent to Rosa Parks. He seems infatuated with her and is possibly riding her.

4. Despite his self professed incredible intelligence, he is on the scratcher and constantly begging for money for his media projects/books. He doesn't get any money because of point 2.

punisher5112 · 24-02-2019 08:28PM

normanoffside wrote: »

1. He's a victim mentality Traveller who thinks the world is against him. he seems to hate all settled people.

2. He stands up for traveller rights but most travellers hate him because of his liberal views on abortion and gay marriage.

3. He talks Sh1te all the time and says that Maggie Cash is the Irish equivalent to Rosa Parks. He seems infatuated with her and is possibly riding her.

4. Despite his self professed incredible intelligence, he is on the scratcher and constantly begging for money for his media projects/books. He doesn't get any money because of point 2.

I would pay him to go fcuk off.

normanoffside · 24-02-2019 08:37PM

punisher5112 wrote: »

I would pay him to go fcuk off.

Yeah when he said that the settled people in Ireland nowadays are no different to the English in Ireland during the penal law/famine days he kinda lost any respect I had for him.

tayto lover · 24-02-2019 09:50PM

freshpopcorn wrote: »

He's a traveller.
He's ran in the general election.
He has very liberal views regarding gay rights and abortion
He campaigns for traveller rights and has a YouTube channel discussing thing with people.(I think it's mainly aimed at traveller.

https://m.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100007227857780&ref=content_filter

I’ll listen to him when he talks about Travellers crime and it’s affect on victims.

Dante7 · 24-02-2019 09:56PM

tayto lover wrote: »

I’ll listen to him when he talks about Travellers crime and it’s affect on victims.

Just ask him about Traveller education. Education is key. He has benefited from education and is one of the travellers who is not involved in criminality or feuding. If all Travellers achieved at least leaving cert education most problems disappear.

BattleCorp · 24-02-2019 09:59PM

normanoffside wrote: »

1. He's a victim mentality Traveller who thinks the world is against him. he seems to hate all settled people.

2. He stands up for traveller rights but most travellers hate him because of his liberal views on abortion and gay marriage.

3. He talks Sh1te all the time and says that Maggie Cash is the Irish equivalent to Rosa Parks. He seems infatuated with her and is possibly riding her.

4. Despite his self professed incredible intelligence, he is on the scratcher and constantly begging for money for his media projects/books. He doesn't get any money because of point 2.

If he's so busy with media projects/books etc. does that mean that he's not available for work, one of the requirements of being on the scratcher. :eek::eek::eek:

BattleCorp · 24-02-2019 10:00PM

Dante7 wrote: »

Just ask him about Traveller education. Education is key. He has benefited from education and is one of the travellers who is not involved in criminality or feuding. If all Travellers achieved at least leaving cert education most problems disappear.

I'm not fcukin sure about that? Have you seen some of his posts. :eek::eek::eek::eek:

tayto lover · 24-02-2019 10:04PM

Dante7 wrote: »

Just ask him about Traveller education. Education is key. He has benefited from education and is one of the travellers who is not involved in criminality or feuding. If all Travellers achieved at least leaving cert education most problems disappear.

I’ve heard it said that Travellers don’t want their children receiving a full education because an educated Travellers might turn their back on their culture.
Their daughters are usually married by 16 too. Hardly going to do a Leaving Cert exam then. They still insist on arranged marriages in many instances too. Women are held back and forbidden to mix with settled girls. I’ve seen a lot of this myself.

Backward culture.

normanoffside · 24-02-2019 10:20PM

Dante7 wrote: »

Just ask him about Traveller education. Education is key. He has benefited from education and is one of the travellers who is not involved in criminality or feuding. If all Travellers achieved at least leaving cert education most problems disappear.

Not sure about that, while I am not 100% certain, this very much sounds like him.

Can anyone see behind the paywall?

https://www.longfordleader.ie/news/home/338303/longford-district-court-cashed-cheque-but-it-bounced.html

normanoffside · 24-02-2019 10:29PM

This is almost certainly him.
It says on his Facebook Bio that he repairs PCs

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/sligochampion/news/computer-repair-man-had-a-stolen-laptop-27585323.html

Effects · 24-02-2019 10:43PM

He might be trying to move on from past criminality. Can't blame him for that.

Deebles McBeebles · 25-02-2019 10:59AM

What age was the child who wrote the bio?

Margaret Cash steals €300 worth of clothes from Penneys and aftermath/etc!

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