Margaret Cash steals €300 worth of clothes from Penneys and aftermath/etc!

xi5yvm0owc1s2b · 21-02-2019 03:24PM

holliehobbie wrote: »

Isn't it illegal to get married at 15?

Before this year it was possible for people under 18 to marry if they got permission from the Circuit Family Court or High Court.

As of 1 January 2019, under the Domestic Violence Act 2018, people under 18 can no longer apply to the Irish courts for permission to marry. In practice, teenage Travellers will now go to Northern Ireland or England, where 16-year-olds can marry with their parents' or guardians' permission.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 21-02-2019 03:27PM

She's probably visiting family members over in England.

Deebles McBeebles · 21-02-2019 03:31PM

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

She's probably visiting family members over in England.

Do you reckon they got back from New Zealand by now?

KrustyUCC · 21-02-2019 03:41PM

Deleted User wrote: »

She never said that she’s poor. Just homeless.

Ha true that

Sad thing is that she is 100% dependent on taxpayers but yet can afford a week in England with the seven angles and things like Fiona Todhunter communion dress for her daughter, Jas Fagan €600 on a communion suit for her son

xi5yvm0owc1s2b · 21-02-2019 03:47PM

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I wonder hoe many older users of this forum didn't stay in school until the age of 17 or 18?

Some settled children leave school early too, of course, but the disparity is striking: 86 percent of the settled population complete secondary education, as compared with just 8 percent of Travellers.

The OECD's Education at a Glance report notes that employment prospects for people without a Leaving Cert have plummeted in recent years. Less than half of early school-leavers now get jobs. Unsurprisingly, one in four female early school-leavers and one in five males report suffering from depression.

The message is clear -- someone who leaves school between age 12 and 15, as most Travellers do, has little chance at a future that does not involve social welfare dependency or crime.

Early school-leaving and early marriage, both designed to protect the insularity and thus continuity of Traveller culture, are at the core of Travellers' social problems. These "traditions" ensure that many Travellers end up illiterate and saddled with children even before they are out of their teens. While young settled women are off in university furthering their education and preparing for a career, many of their Traveller peers are stuck in a caravan pregnant and/or raising kids, without even a Junior Cert to their name.

This has to end. But by recognizing Travellers as an ethnic minority, defending their "culture" to the hilt, and characterizing any criticism of Travellers as racist right-wing bigotry, the liberal left is only standing in the way of change.

freshpopcorn · 21-02-2019 03:52PM

Sweet.Science wrote: »

I genuinely dont know where they get the money. Travellers bought a house close to me for 330k.
At the start i thought the council provided bought it privately for them. However it was renovated straight away the council normally leave them idle until they have the money
2 161 vehicles in the driveway aswel

I know in my area the council bought houses for travellers a few years ago.
They did them up fast enough to bring them up to regulations.

dermo888 · 21-02-2019 04:00PM

'This has to end' - correct. The worst of it has to end. But its a matter of persuasion. Look at how the Aboriginal community in Australia are handled, a community far more disadvantaged and loathed compared to the Irish Travellers. The gypsies in continental Europe are despised too, due to their abject criminality and inability to conform to modern societal norms.

Ri_Nollaig · 21-02-2019 04:01PM

Rex Tasteless Gutter wrote: »

Some settled children leave school early too, of course, but the disparity is striking: 86 percent of the settled population complete secondary education, as compared with just 8 percent of Travellers.

The OECD's Education at a Glance report notes that employment prospects for people without a Leaving Cert have plummeted in recent years. Less than half of early school-leavers now get jobs. Unsurprisingly, one in four female early school leavers and one in five males reporting suffering from depression.

The message is clear -- someone who leaves school between age 12 and 15, as most Travellers do, has little chance at a future that does not involve social welfare dependency or crime.

Early school-leaving and early marriage, both designed to protect the insularity and thus continuity of Traveller culture, are at the core of Travellers' social problems. These "traditions" ensure that many Travellers end up illiterate and saddled with children even before they are out of their teens. While young settled women are off in university furthering their education and preparing for a career, many of their Traveller peers are stuck in a caravan pregnant and/or raising kids, without even a Junior Cert to their name.

This has to end. But by recognizing Travellers as an ethnic minority, defending their "culture" to the hilt, and characterizing any criticism of Travellers as racist right-wing bigotry, the liberal left is only standing in the way of change.

If I could thank this twice I would.

It sums up the problem perfectly. Education is the key to solving it but in the quest to be seen as progressive as possible the liberal types have only made it worse!

Lollipops23 · 21-02-2019 04:05PM

dermo888 wrote: »

'This has to end' - correct. The worst of it has to end. But its a matter of persuasion. Look at how the Aboriginal community in Australia are handled, a community far more disadvantaged and loathed compared to the Irish Travellers. The gypsies in continental Europe are despised too, due to their abject criminality and inability to conform to modern societal norms.

I mean I'm native Irish (as far back as anyone in either side of the family knows, at least 5-6 generations in the Pale, never mind anywhere else!).

Those DNA kit yokes say we're 96% Irish, although I take that with a grain of salt.

Where does it end?

blanch152 · 21-02-2019 04:13PM

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Those stats are indeed hard to believe, but i am quoting directly from the available research.

Traveller health and life expectancy is the greatest human rights crisis in modern Ireland - we don't recognise it now, but future generations will judge us harshly for our apathy.

The last Census looked at travellers in depth.

https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-cp8iter/p8iter/p8itd/

https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-cp8iter/p8iter/p8itseah/

What these figures show us is that traveller culture results in women being taken out of education at a young age, married off and turned into baby factories.

Some say traveller culture is a good thing, I don't.

Now it doesn't have figures on life expectancy, but the population profiles would support the idea that there is a lower life expectancy.

dermo888 · 21-02-2019 04:56PM

84% Irish myself, the rest being a mix of English (8%), Spanish (5%), Greek/Turkish (2%), Nordic (1%). Plus the results of that bloody type survey keep changing since they are actually reliant and those who supply actual details of their ancestry. Mind thats off topic for here.

Beyond that, I want better for the Travelling community, but first they must want it for themselves.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 21-02-2019 05:04PM

Lollipops23 wrote: »

I mean I'm native Irish (as far back as anyone in either side of the family knows, at least 5-6 generations in the Pale, never mind anywhere else!).

Those DNA kit yokes say we're 96% Irish, although I take that with a grain of salt.

Where does it end?

We're the same, not a planter's surname in sight on the family tree. All ancient Irish. We shouldn't have to pay tax.

Although I did show up in a DNA test with twice the amount of 'Iberian' in me as normal in an Irish person.

We think that one of our womenfolk might have got loose with a Spanish sailor back in 1588.

BattleCorp · 21-02-2019 06:23PM

blanch152 wrote: »

The last Census looked at travellers in depth.

https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-cp8iter/p8iter/p8itd/

https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-cp8iter/p8iter/p8itseah/

What these figures show us is that traveller culture results in women being taken out of education at a young age, married off and turned into baby factories.

Some say traveller culture is a good thing, I don't.

Now it doesn't have figures on life expectancy, but the population profiles would support the idea that there is a lower life expectancy.

This is from a UCD report back in September 2010. It's a bit out of date by now but it does show life expectancy figures. Full link below if you have the time.

https://www.ucd.ie/t4cms/AITHS_SUMMARY.pdf

hurler32 · 21-02-2019 07:05PM

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/mans-whiplash-claim-dismissed-as-judge-says-certain-actions-are-bringing-system-into-disrepute-37839408.html

Yet another traveller involved in some form of a fraudulent - exaggerated personal injury claim

Quazzie · 21-02-2019 07:10PM

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I'm on my phone. It's a nightmare trying to multi quote using the mobile app. I have read all the replies, will reply when I'm back at my desk. Chill, petal.

You still not back at your desk?

Or are you ready to admit you're just trolling?

corks finest · 21-02-2019 07:52PM

nice_guy80 wrote: »

they don't even give the young kids a chance!

most traveller families do not take up the free preschool place that are FREE for their children. ITS FREE!!! you just have to bring them there 5 days a week. maybe thats the issue - no free transport.
where the kids might learn a few basic skills to help them - washing hands, social skills, proper language and vocabulary, counting, letters, how to play etc
any difficulties might be picked up on - speech and language, sight etc that could be treated while the child is young

they land into primary school at 5.
usually with no uniform, books or anything.
Then go running to the local social welfare officer to look for more money for that.

You may laugh,be amazed ,or call me a liar,at Scoil an spioraid naoimh bishoptown, when my son attended, school provided( 3 years) 2 taxis to and from school to campsite off the straight road cork,this changed to a wait for it. LIMO ,excuse that it was cheaper as there were another few traveller kids needed to attend,( at the time I was traveling 13 miles each way,,I was bloody incensed- I questioned the vice head,now principal,( Brian Cuthbert- ex Cork football coach)and was told no comment,it was aired on Red FM who also couldn't get a comment from the school,I went with a video cam stood opposite the entrance to the site, captured every vehicle leaving and entering ,back to the school - still no joy,my point was I was driving a 11 ye old banger yet still made it to school,yet all the travellers vehicles were much newer than mine and they couldn't be bothered to bring their kids on the 10 m drive to school,,,,crazy stuff,this has now stopped AFAIK,100 percent true,pm me anyone who doesent believe me,,,,

BBFAN · 21-02-2019 07:53PM

corks finest wrote: »

You may laugh,be amazed ,or call me a liar,at Scoil an spioraid naoimh bishoptown, when my son attended, school provided( 3 years) 2 taxis to and from school to campsite off the straight road cork,this changed to a wait for it. LIMO ,excuse that it was cheaper as there were another few traveller kids needed to attend,( at the time I was traveling 13 miles each way,,I was bloody incensed- I questioned the vice head,now principal,( Brian Cuthbert- ex Cork football coach)and was told no comment,it was aired on Red FM who also couldn't get a comment from the school,I went with a video cam stood opposite the entrance to the site, captured every vehicle leaving and entering ,back to the school - still no joy,my point was I was driving a 11 ye old banger yet still made it to school,yet all the travellers vehicles were much newer than mine and they couldn't be bothered to bring their kids on the 10 m drive to school,,,,crazy stuff,this has now stopped AFAIK,100 percent true,pm me anyone who doesent believe me,,,,

Can't even read that crap.

tretorn · 21-02-2019 07:56PM

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/woman-accused-of-exaggerating-insurance-claim-absconded-from-court-gardai-37839032.html

Good Christ.

ShaneC93 · 21-02-2019 08:05PM

tretorn wrote: »

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/woman-accused-of-exaggerating-insurance-claim-absconded-from-court-gardai-37839032.html

Good Christ.

That's what a lenient court system results in, they don't care ffor or respect the Gardai or the Justice system because they have no reason to fear - do any crime short of murder, have 100s of convictions and you're still looking at a fully suspended sentence.

Odelay · 21-02-2019 08:08PM

BBFAN wrote: »

Can't even read that crap.

I could read it with ease. Why can’t you read it?

freshpopcorn · 21-02-2019 08:17PM

corks finest wrote: »

You may laugh,be amazed ,or call me a liar,at Scoil an spioraid naoimh bishoptown, when my son attended, school provided( 3 years) 2 taxis to and from school to campsite off the straight road cork,this changed to a wait for it. LIMO ,excuse that it was cheaper as there were another few traveller kids needed to attend,( at the time I was traveling 13 miles each way,,I was bloody incensed- I questioned the vice head,now principal,( Brian Cuthbert- ex Cork football coach)and was told no comment,it was aired on Red FM who also couldn't get a comment from the school,I went with a video cam stood opposite the entrance to the site, captured every vehicle leaving and entering ,back to the school - still no joy,my point was I was driving a 11 ye old banger yet still made it to school,yet all the travellers vehicles were much newer than mine and they couldn't be bothered to bring their kids on the 10 m drive to school,,,,crazy stuff,this has now stopped AFAIK,100 percent true,pm me anyone who doesent believe me,,,,

This is just one of these things that people may not like but it's these things the government has to try and get this minority group to attend school. I'm speaking about the taxi thing not a limo.
It's similar to homework groups that are ran by community groups, uniform allowances, lunches/breakfasts in deis schools, books, etc.
I sort of get why the principal couldn't comment on another families circumstances.

Plumbthedepths · 21-02-2019 08:26PM

BBFAN wrote:

Can't even read that crap.

Why? it's in fairly understandable English.

21-02-2019 08:51PM

BattleCorp wrote: »

Is traveller health and life expectancy not a result of their actions rather than them being denied their human rights?

Wrong question, with respect. Your question is a bit like asking 'are poor people poor because of circumstances, or because they are stupid?'. Neither answer is correct. A better question might be, 'are traveller children achieving optimal educational and life-expectation outcomes in their current living conditions?'. The answer to that is an unambiguous No, and it's all to do with upbringing.

most travellers appear to shun education

Any evidence for this? Or just something you invented on a whim?

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

That must be the same farm they send all the old, sick dogs to. I bet the f*ckin pony regretted it shortly after. How could anyone in their right mind sell an animal to a traveller.

I've always been amused when people expressed shock or disgust at our selling that pony to the travellers. That family had no plumbing, and about five kids in their van - but sell them a pony and, woah - the middle classes are clambering over their own outrage.

There is a certain segment of Irish society which places greater value on a bloody pony than they do on the life of a human child.

21-02-2019 08:56PM

nobody is promised optimal outcomes in this world man.

21-02-2019 08:58PM

Deleted User wrote: »

nobody is promised optimal outcomes in this world man.

Of course.

But there's a big difference in being unable to guarantee an optimal upbringing, and going out of your way (in fact, spending money) to deprive a child of that upbringing.

Just look at the homelessness crisis. We're spending more money to put families in temporary, chaotic accommodation than it would cost to provide them with a home.

freshpopcorn · 21-02-2019 09:14PM

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Of course.

But there's a big difference in being unable to guarantee an optimal upbringing, and going out of your way (in fact, spending money) to deprive a child of that upbringing.

Just look at the homelessness crisis. We're spending more money to put families in temporary, chaotic accommodation than it would cost to provide them with a home.

So, what do you think the government should do?
They've pumped loads of money in education in the last few decades. Kids get access to SNA, resource hours, get laptops/iPads when required, they are homework groups/clubs and in second level these are there to align with LCA and youth reach if the traditional leaving cert wasn't for you.
We've seen houses thrown back in the govemrents face in the last year because they weren't good enough.
They government are doing more than ever to help members of the travelling community yo get an education.
They even provide allounces for books and uniforms.
They only other options would be to pay people attend school or fine people harshly for non attendance.

21-02-2019 09:20PM

freshpopcorn wrote: »

So, what do you think the government should do?

Don't be asking me such easy questions.

1) Provide halting sites which are capable of accommodating families -we have vast amounts of academic research publications describing how well children do, when surrounded by their families.

2) Fund homework clubs and other extra-mural student supports for travellers and other non-traditional CAO applicants.

None of this should cost more than about 30-45 million, it would make a phenomenal difference to our society, and yet most of our politicians show zero interest.

Kivaro · 21-02-2019 09:22PM

Righty-O.
You are going on "mute".

freshpopcorn · 21-02-2019 09:27PM

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Don't be asking me such easy questions.

1) Provide halting sites which are capable of accommodating families -we have vast amounts of academic research publications describing how well children do, when surrounded by their families.

2) Fund homework clubs and other extra-mural student supports for travellers and other non-traditional CAO applicants.

None of this should cost more than about 30-45 million, it would make a phenomenal difference to our society, and yet most of our politicians show zero interest.

1) They often do this but all this turning down houses/sites over horses has to be stopped. It's happened in Cork and Thurles.
2) They are loads of schools with homework clubs and external groups in place at the moment of course they could have more.
No issue with courses being provided. There's a large range of PLC courses at the moment. It's important tough that courses have some hope of getting you into employment.

deaddonkey15 · 21-02-2019 09:33PM

Kivaro wrote: »

Righty-O.
You are going on "mute".

I haven't come across a mod that's so obviously on a wind-up in a thread before. His initial post calling other posters idiots didn't even get carded. Pointless engaging with someone like him.

Margaret Cash steals €300 worth of clothes from Penneys and aftermath/etc!

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