Discovery 2x05 - "Saints of Imperfection" [** SPOILERS WITHIN **]

Not a bad episode. I'm actually enjoying the non-main story line approach. I felt Season 1 was far too focused on the overwhelming arch, rather than the more Star Trek-y stuff.

Pike is really growing on me.

Cons though

• Burnhams bloody monologues at the start and end are getting tedious
• What's the point in killing a character off, only to have them return? Same can be said about Saru last episode.
• Why oh why is their tech so much more advanced? Holograms everywhere, even for communication just seems like showing off their CG.
• Seriously, why the hell does -everyone- know about Section 31?

More discovery style of Trek this week.

S31 will probably get retcon'ed, probably after doing somethings so bad, it becomes taboo to discuss it, and the organization goes underground. Like in DS9!

So, if Burnham was restored to rank Commander, how come she still has to share quarters with Tilly?
And does this mean the definitive end to the Spore drive?

That was decent. Could have been tightened up a fair bit but overall a good episode. They seem to have found a good format and a good mix between story-arc and weekly Trek adventure (whether or not you think it's a good Trek adventure), I hope they stick with it.

Definitely need less Burham, or at least less of those monologues. What is her actual position on the ship anyway? Would be nice just to have an episode or two focused on someone else.

Section 31 / Starfleet black-ops isn't my favourite idea by a long shot but they were fine in this episode I suppose. Although the black leather uniforms and "I'M BLACK-OPS!!" badges are a bit dumb.

Was getting annoyed by all the lengthy heart-felt conversations going on while the 3-minutes-to-death timer was ticking away.

Looking forward to seeing Culber again. Also want to get back to Saru and see how he's getting on without his ganglia.

And find Spock I guess.

Deleted User wrote: »

In terms of the monologue, they are far too speech like but nothing different to Captain's/First Officer's/Science Officer's log Stardate: XXX which is all over Trek. They just need to make them less "profound" and more matter of fact.

This is what stands out to me too. Most episodes of Trek opened up with monologue, but it was a Captains Log. Brief, to the point of the ongoing situation. If anything it was quite often a quick bit of exposition, an intro to what's going on and what alien race the crew is meeting.

With Discovery, it's more of a direct monologue, designed and said purely to trigger emotion and made to make you think 'deep thoughts'.

I wasn't actually a fan of Tilly in the first season, just way too clumsy and 'dopey' for a Starfleet officer, but she seems to be the one character who's actually been developed.

Enjoyed that. Looking forward to next week's!

Ash had the perfect farewell when he waljed off into the sunset with Klingon lady. He's not adding anything.

And even though I had no issue with Stamets/Hugh, bringing him back feels very contrived.

And I couldn't care less about Section 31. Maybe its because I never saw any DS9 after they apoeared but the feel like an ipcoming spinoff just now, and I hate spinoffs messing with my shows.

That said, as soon as they get back into the red angel story I feel it'll get stronger.

FutureGuy wrote: »

I really enjoyed the episode. I thought Culber was done for when they finally managed to get him to the point of return only for his arm to dissolve. Nice turn.

I thought Stamets would stay behind in Mushroom World, and human and fungus would just agree to stop fighting each other

I think I enjoyed this episode. As mentioned before, the sinking ship stuff was cooool. The rescue mission element was great but I actually guessed the Doctor was the monster as soon as May mentioned it. And also the lack of urgency to get out was badly edited in comparison to the bridge crew being inches from death.

Another Burnham thing that is really wrecking my head now is the way she has to add on her thoughts onto everyone else’s sentences especially when they speak to the captain. If anyone is talking to Pike she has to jump in at the end to give a sound bite or an endorsement before Pike reacts. It’s doing my head in.

Example:

Saru: Captain, we must go to warp now before we are all destroyed.
Burnham: I agree with Saru captain, he has my complete confidence.
Pike: (Looks at Burnham) Ok that’s good enough for me.

Example:

Tilly: Captain, the anomaly’s structure is manifesting some kind of field that is changing it’s internal form.
Burnham: Like a caterpillar in a cocoon.
Pike: (Looks at Burnham) Well let’s hope it’s turning into a butterfly.

filters wrote: »

Its getting worse, it'd writing is atrocious.
There is no one at the wheel, its only following twitter hash tags for story lines.
Last season they killed of the gay black doctor, they got backlash from online SJW's, so they bring him back with a stupid story.
If im honest the best thing for that show would have been for Tilly, Michale, and Stamets to have died in the mushroom network, then we could have got a real Star Trek with Pike as the main character , but alas the SJW backlash on Twitter would have been too much for the spineless producers to take, so STD continues to die a slow death.

After a brief flash of hope with the displaced WWIII survivors a few episodes ago, it's gone further and further down the rabbit hole.

Tilly is a godawful character on so many levels it's beyond nonsensical at this stage. The idea that this idiot graduated from the academy and is being tapped as command potential is just ridiculous.

At one point Pike asks Burnham to make sense of what's going on - I completely sympathise with the guy. This is all over the place. Section 31 are now a super advanced openly known intelligence arm, holograms everywhere, TNG comm badges, more magic mushroom nonsense.. and as already noted by others, Burnham's pontificating at the start/end of the episode is extremely grating.

Midnight's Edge did a video though recently that explains all this. Supposedly, the licensing/merchandising stuff between CBS and Paramount means that everything since the 2009 movie has been made under an alternate license requiring significant changes to what's been previously established (aka Star Trek Canon). What is now referred to as Prime is in fact a third time line.. NOT what we saw in the previous series, but the lines are being deliberately blurred so as not to affect potential sales.

Time will tell whether this speculation has any basis, but it would explain why this stuff is more in line with the JJ-verse than the TOS era.

But leaving all that aside - this entire episode was a convoluted mess that has far too much going on, but has no notion where it wants to go, and keeps getting lost among it's own subplots to the detriment of any sort of structure or continuity. Allegedly the result of the production chaos as well.

Wasn't gone on that episode. While I know some people saw Burnham as a bit of a Mary Sue, I didn't agree with it totally at the time but it is certainly becoming more so. Their leaps in logic in determining that Tilly was alive was just absurd and the whole episode was just a bit too much and too silly.

Liked

• Good to see the doctor back because I like the actor.
• Good that, hopefully, the incredibility annoying Mei will be gone for a couple of episodes. God she is annoying!

Didn't like/Meh

• "We will be half in their universe and half in ours"..... Like PHYSICALLY???!!!! C'monnnn folks.
• The lengths the went to to stay in position was stupid. They risked killing everyone in the ship horrifically.
• Physically where did they all go? Sit on the right nacelle?
• That was the longest 3 mins I've ever seen: Oh, let's have a conversation about the conservation of mass/energy and have an auld chinwag about stuff......
• While it was good to see the doc back, the method of bringing him back was just silly. A real cop-out. It really came across as "Dammit, we got a lot of slack for "killing off your gays" and people liked the character.... How do we get him back? Ah, make him out of spores"
• Does EVERYONE know about Section 31 at this stage?
• The slow motion bit at the end as Burnham enters the bridge and they all look up in awe of her and follow her movements.
• How much damage was done to the ship? They have the healing powers of Voyager..... Or Tom and Jerry!!!

Silly, OTT episode. I'm sure there is a big plan for each of the episodes so far but I can't see it unless you find out that the angels are actually manifestations of the Spore people and they have been working with Section 31 to enslave Saru's people. Spock knows this because the wikipedia alien told him and he will work with Spore-Doc and Mei to save Saru's people before he hulks out and goes rogue. And Mei will die.

......... Or something

fritzelly wrote: »

I thought it was a great episode and enjoying the season for what it is - Star Trek escapism
If you have to nitpick every second of an episode then why bother watching it.

I enjoy a show my way and you do your way. Each to their own. Feel free to ignore my thoughts. I've said time and time again that my opinions here are simply opinions. I have enjoyed the series greatly up until this episode and do not agree with others who have disliked it from the start. But I respect their opinion.

I just did not enjoy this episode. One in over 20 so far is pretty damn good.

filters wrote: »

dont forget responsible for starting the war with the Klingons in season 1

I'm definitely in the minority as not seeing it that way, that war was coming whether Burnham was there or not. She's guilty of mutiny, but not starting the war imo.

Sad Professor wrote: »

It's a shame because they have some good actors and potentially good characters but the writers are hacks.

Couldn't agree more, the show has huge potential. The writing is shocking though, like a bunch of interns are at the helm.