The perks of being a rock star don't exist anymore

is_that_so · 15-02-2019 08:27PM

Sardonicat wrote: »

There is absolutely nothing to compare between the two. And Wyman was considered shocking at the time . You're right he was in his 50s. He got away with by all concerned claicing nothing sexual was taking place and her mother was OK with the relationship. Ms.Smith later went on to say she was groomed.

Why are you comparing older teenagers having sex with each other to 52yo and a child?

I wasn't. I pointed it out as another example of a very young girl. We don't know the age profiles of those who may have become involved with other stars.

Sardonicat · 15-02-2019 08:28PM

Arne_Saknussem wrote: »

is_that_so wrote: »

After the seventies he calmed down and there's little said by anyone about that time. According to one biography, he was indiscriminate in his tastes but never really any suggestion that he was involved with those underage.

Sardonicat wrote: »

Bowie too? Did not know that.

The girl in the picture is Lori Maddox, 15 years old at the time of this picture i believe. She claims she lost her virginity to David Bowie.

Really? I saw an interview with Ms Maddox in which she claimed she was a virgin til she met (was effectively kidnapped by) Page. And she was 13.

Outlaw Pete · 15-02-2019 08:30PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckUKrUqEesc

Arne_Saknussem · 15-02-2019 08:31PM

is_that_so wrote: »

There are questions over that, especially the timing and that there are no pictures but loads of her with Page. She may also have had a relationship with Jagger. As I said, very different view of certain activities back then, especially with rock musicians.

There are no pictures as her and her parents weren't invited on tour with Bowie like they were with Zeppelin.

i'd be inclined to believe her, what are the questions and what are the problems with the timing?

is_that_so · 15-02-2019 08:31PM

Sardonicat wrote: »

Really? I saw an interview with Ms Maddox in which she claimed she was a virgin til she met (was effectively kidnapped by) Page. And she was 13.

Yeah this is what I understood. She was actually involved with Page at the time she supposedly met Bowie.

is_that_so · 15-02-2019 08:33PM

Arne_Saknussem wrote: »

There are no pictures as her and her parents weren't invited on tour with Bowie like they were with Zeppelin.

i'd be inclined to believe her, what are the questions and what are the problems with the timing?

She was apparently involved with Page at that time and in all likelihood would have had relations with him first.

Sardonicat · 15-02-2019 08:36PM

is_that_so wrote: »

Sardonicat wrote: »

There is absolutely nothing to compare between the two. And Wyman was considered shocking at the time . You're right he was in his 50s. He got away with by all concerned claicing nothing sexual was taking place and her mother was OK with the relationship. Ms.Smith later went on to say she was groomed.

Why are you comparing older teenagers having sex with each other to 52yo and a child?

I wasn't. I pointed it out as another example of a very young girl.

But what for? The thread is about rock stars abusing their position of influence to have sex with underage teens.

The Beatles in Hamburg weren't rock stars. On their first trip out they were all teenagers themselves, Harrison was barely 17. Most of the clientele in the clubs they played would have been a few years older (much older than the The Cavern , which didn't have a licence for alcohol ) so any conquest they made would have been with females their age and over. Nothing wrong with that.
Wyman and Smith, Page and Maddo:very wrong indeed.

Sardonicat · 15-02-2019 08:38PM

Arne_Saknussem wrote: »

is_that_so wrote: »

There are questions over that, especially the timing and that there are no pictures but loads of her with Page. She may also have had a relationship with Jagger. As I said, very different view of certain activities back then, especially with rock musicians.

There are no pictures as her and her parents weren't invited on tour with Bowie like they were with Zeppelin.

i'd be inclined to believe her, what are the questions and what are the problems with the timing?

You think her parents took that photo of her and Page?

Arne_Saknussem · 15-02-2019 08:41PM

is_that_so wrote: »

She was apparently involved with Page at that time and in all likelihood would have had relations with him first.

From what i have read independently from what she has said, which matches, she hooked up with Page in 1972 when she was 14. Having been with Bowie a few months earlier.

15-02-2019 08:41PM

Flyingsnowball wrote: »

Mad isn’t it. In the 70s 80s 90s these girls went to these gigs with the dream of being with Bowie or jimmy Paige or whoever.
A very small percentage got to make that happen.
Nobody waits s bothered until this year.

I’m not condoning it or saying it’s terrible. Just mad.
It’s like people were letting the musicians at it once they weren’t fiddling the boys.

It's not that mad in a way, a lot of people turned a blind eye to pedos until recently

is_that_so · 15-02-2019 08:41PM

Sardonicat wrote: »

But what for? The thread is about rock stars abusing their position of influence to have sex with underage teens.

The Beatles in Hamburg weren't rock stars. On their first trip out they were all teenagers themselves, Harrison was barely 17. Most of the clientele in the clubs they played would have been a few years older (much older than the The Cavern , which didn't have a licence for alcohol ) so any conquest they made would have been with females their age and over. Nothing wrong with that.
Wyman and Smith, Page and Maddo:very wrong indeed.

I don't disagree on the older guys but even the young lads couldn't say for sure how old some of them were. My point is that there was a very different perception around pop stars and how they behaved, especially activities we now see as completely unacceptable.

Arne_Saknussem · 15-02-2019 08:41PM

Sardonicat wrote: »

You think her parents took that photo of her and Page?

No, i don't think that. Didn't say that either.

Maybe Bowie took it.

Sardonicat · 15-02-2019 08:53PM

is_that_so wrote: »

Sardonicat wrote: »

But what for? The thread is about rock stars abusing their position of influence to have sex with underage teens.

The Beatles in Hamburg weren't rock stars. On their first trip out they were all teenagers themselves, Harrison was barely 17. Most of the clientele in the clubs they played would have been a few years older (much older than the The Cavern , which didn't have a licence for alcohol ) so any conquest they made would have been with females their age and over. Nothing wrong with that.
Wyman and Smith, Page and Maddo:very wrong indeed.

I don't disagree on the older guys but even the young lads couldn't say for sure how old some of them were. My point is that there was a very different perception around pop stars and how they behaved, especially activities we now see as completely unacceptable.

Oh for sure. Taking into account that the Beatles were playing on the Reeperbahn when one of them was only 17 (and looked about 12!) is pretty shocking in itself. WTF were his parents thinking.?
I think an attitude to 'groupies' developed in certain quarters similar to the attitude held by the UK grooming gangs to the girls they abused . They were somehow different to other girls and up for it and ok to use. Also, many of them got passed around too. In reality they were very vulnerable ( their parents, I mean come on Mrs Maddox and Mrs Smith!) But the fact that attitudes in those circles were different then doesn't mean it was ever ok.

Gimme A Pound · 15-02-2019 09:01PM

professore wrote: »

A lot of these rock stars weren't much older than teenagers themselves - in a situation that is highly unusual for most young men, ie women tearing each others hair out to have sex with them. I think most normal young men in that situation would have lots of sex.

I'd go so far as to say there would be something wrong with them if they didn't. Having sex with underage girls is a whole other can of worms though.

But isn't the point that they WERE having sex with under-age girls?

Good title anyway OP, "It's not acceptable for musicians to have sex with teens anymore, boo!"

Still though, while it may not be a palatable viewpoint, if those teenage girls were doing all they could to have sex with those musicians (because they were silly teens)... obviously the musicians should not have gone there, but in a booze and drugs fuelled surreal bubble of reckless abandon and ego and the whole free love counter culture, I can see why they did. I don't think it's the same as, say, the abuse by Jimmy Savile.

Ideally it shouldn't have happened of course, and those girls were legally too young to consent but they did. They did queue up for it. I read the biography of so called super groupie Pamela Des Barres and was absolutely shocked at the stuff she did so casually at 14. And no regrets either.

But of course it was disgustingly seedy, and the rose tinted specs are being removed in relation to the summer of love etc - an absolute predators paradise.

The Rape of Lucretia · 15-02-2019 09:12PM

The rock music phenomenon was always about the teenage girls. It was never 'about the music' - most if not all of it was rubbish anyway. But was catnip to teenagers with simplistic musical tastes open to being manipulated by it, and to throw themselves at the predominantly 20 year old men churning it out.
Some lapped it up, others justified it on the basis that it must be OK because were the ones throwing themselves at them, and society said something along the lines of - fair play to them, wish it were me. And still does.

Gimme A Pound · 15-02-2019 09:21PM

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

The rock music phenomenon was always about the teenage girls. It was never 'about the music' - most if not all of it was rubbish anyway.

You gotta be more subtle, TROL.

silverharp · 15-02-2019 09:31PM

are soccer players not LOI obviously getting more of the action these days?

facehugger99 · 15-02-2019 09:34PM

A lot of rock stars became famous in their late teens or early 20's.

It seems common that many of them stopped maturing at around the time that fame hit. Almost as if they got locked in a state of permanent adolescence. Even their sexual preference was still for younger girls as they got older.

closifer · 16-02-2019 09:47AM

suicide_circus wrote:

these bands didnt go out grooming random girls, these groupies threw themselves at them left right and centre. very few men would remain saintly under those conditions.

There are stories of bands staff going out and plucking pretty young girls from the crowd and bringing them backstage. Girls as young as 13. Do you believe they were throwing themselves at the rock stars? Do you believe a 13 year old girl can legitimately consent?

padd b1975 · 16-02-2019 09:57AM

Sardonicat wrote: »

When are they coming for Jimmy Page?

He's already been punished by having to live next door to Robbie Williams.

anewme · 16-02-2019 10:07AM

padd b1975 wrote: »

He's already been punished by having to live next door to Robbie Williams.

Now, he s loving Angels instead.

The Crowman · 16-02-2019 11:42AM

Then there was Jerry Lee Lewis marrying his 13 year old cousin when he was 22, though that was probably as much down to his redneck background as a rock star thing.

Your Face · 16-02-2019 11:43AM

This is why I never became a rock star.

orourkeda1977 · 16-02-2019 12:01PM

Mother and Daughter threesomes.

I bet health and safety have spoilt their fun as well.

Ubbquittious · 16-02-2019 01:07PM

orourkeda1977 wrote: »

Mother and Daughter threesomes.

I bet health and safety have spoilt their fun as well.

Everyones fun is being spoilt to some extent by modern political correctness and health and safety. Its like we are entering a new victorian age except religion isnt the justification this time

sabat · 16-02-2019 01:31PM

silverharp wrote: »

are soccer players not LOI obviously getting more of the action these days?

Ismahil Akinade, convicted gang rapist of an underage girl, is currently playing for Waterford in the LoI.

whiskeyman · 16-02-2019 01:40PM

Epic Eir Epic wrote: »

Seems like everyday stuff to me!

You must have missed the bit in the article about the explicit texts to a 14 year old girl which is now being investigated by the FBI.

This is the real clincher for many of his fans and general public.
The other accusations are definitely more prominent in the #MeToo climate, but I'm sure there's loads more in the music biz who are guilty of the same arseholery, preying on naive people.

Calibos · 16-02-2019 02:50PM

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I think you're being unfair to most men here. I don't think I'm alone in not understanding the attraction towards teenagers - even those who are over 18. If you don't understand that, maybe you're the one with the problem, and not the rest of us.

You're going to have to define what you mean by attraction.

Is it creepy to want to have a relationship with a teenager around the age of consent and above?

Hell Yes!!

For all the obvious reasons that don't need repeating.

However, are you saying that you can't understand physical attraction to fully developed teenagers?

I'm reminded of a boards thread a few years ago were some lad was shocked that his group of mixed gender friends genuinely thought he had Paedophile tendencies because one time when walking through the streets of Dublin an attractive young female caught his eye and turned his head before he copped she was a schoolgirl. His friends noticed the girl turning his head, noted she was a schoolgirl and confronted him about Paedophile tendencies. First off, its obvious the guys friends nor most people seem to know about the fact that Paedophilia is the persistent attraction to prepubescent children and a persistent attraction to 15-19yo teens is called Ephebophilia. The point was, that even if the guy did have a philia for 15-19 year old schoolgirls, that did not make him a Paedophile...but he didn't have a persistent attraction to schoolgirls anyway. His young red blooded males eye was simply caught by a very attractive fully developed female form for a split second before he realised she was a schoolgirl. The guy was distraught that there was nothing he could say or do to convince his female and whiteknighting male friends that he didn't have 'paedophile' tendencies. The consensus of that thread was that they agreed with his friends which boggled my mind. (To clarify. IIRC he described the uniform as not as obvious as many where it could have passed for the uniform of the likes of a Powercity reception/till staff with a small school crest instead of a Powercity Name badge in the same place)

Is it creepy to want to have a sexual relationship with a 15-19 year old female as an older male?? I'll say it again. HELL YES! Is it creepy to have your eye/head momentarily turned by the physically attractive fully developed female form of many 15-19 year old female teenagers? No. Its simple biology/instinct. Am I defending the rockstars? No All I'm saying is that its understandable and biologically/evolutionarily expected that males of any age will find the fully developed adult female form be she 15 or 45...physically attractive. The creepiness or wrongness only comes into it if that male pursues a non platonic relationship sexual or otherwise with the teen. Societal/cultural development in the last few hundred years cant overwrite 2 million years of evolution, that'll cause a guy to turn his head when a physically attractive female walks past.

16-02-2019 07:51PM

Calibos wrote: »

All I'm saying is that its understandable and biologically/evolutionarily expected that males of any age will find the fully developed adult female form be she 15 or 45...physically attractive.

What about 46 year olds?

chopperbyrne · 16-02-2019 08:24PM

The perks of being a rock star don't exist anymore

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