Do you think nurses will get their payrise?

wrangler · 29-01-2019 10:17PM

Tell me how wrote: »

I'll take the figures from the department of finance which aren't questioned by the INMO secretary over a single point of reference thanks.

With the threat of Brexit, the performance of the HSE in the past, the attempted rip off that is the childrens hospital, it's hard to support this strike..
Conceding to these demands will cause an avalanche of demands, and quite frankly the tax payers have had enough.....where do we strike

Tell me how · 29-01-2019 10:29PM

wrangler wrote: »

With the threat of Brexit, the performance of the HSE in the past, the attempted rip off that is the childrens hospital, it's hard to support this strike..
Conceding to these demands will cause an avalanche of demands, and quite frankly the tax payers have had enough.....where do we strike

I just think that while some staff nurses are underpaid I think the money that is in the nurses paypot which results in the 57k average is sufficient for the training/demands/benefits.

I hate saying "I don't think they should get a separate deal outside the agreed public sector deal already in place" but the problem is in the structures which we have and the desire of the INMO to look for a 12% rise for all nurses.

wrangler · 29-01-2019 10:42PM

Tell me how wrote: »

I just think that while some staff nurses are underpaid I think the money that is in the nurses paypot which results in the 57k average is sufficient for the training/demands/benefits.

I hate saying "I don't think they should get a separate deal outside the agreed piblic sector deal already in place" but the problem is in the structures which we have and the desire of the INMO to look for a 12% rise for all nurses.

The economy is not over the hump by any means, and brexit is going to have a huge effect on the private sector, HSE costs have doubled in the last ten years with no extra beds and they're going to screw us again with the childrens hospital.
Health care is too important now to be left in the hands the public service

Teddy Daniels · 29-01-2019 10:51PM

The should get a pay rise but it should be absolute! Say 5 grand each because there is no reason in my mind why the nurses on 80 grand should get a 10 grand pay rise and the ones on 30 get less than 4.
It’s the ones on less that should get a bigger rise.

magentis · 29-01-2019 10:56PM

Love these threads.I can just picture some of the posters here left in a situation where they have to clean up someone that has defecated themselves.These nurses are worth their weight in gold.How many nurses is Mr Ross worth?

RHJ · 29-01-2019 11:11PM

magentis wrote: »

Love these threads.I can just picture some of the posters here left in a situation where they have to clean up someone that has defecated themselves.These nurses are worth their weight in gold.How many nurses is Mr Ross worth?

I thought that was mainly the job of health care assistants? Well at least according to what I've read from other posters here.

magentis · 29-01-2019 11:15PM

I suppose when we are grey and old we will find out.Hopefully a nurse will not leave us swimming in our own excrement if no such assistant is available.

Time will tell.

backspin. · 29-01-2019 11:16PM

I would say the Hospitals need more Healthcare Assistants rather than Nurses.

4ensic15 · 29-01-2019 11:17PM

wrangler wrote: »

The economy is not over the hump by any means, and brexit is going to have a huge effect on the private sector, HSE costs have doubled in the last ten years with no extra beds and they're going to screw us again with the childrens hospital.
Health care is too important now to be left in the hands the public service

Why should nurses have to pay for other peoples mismanagement?

doolox · 29-01-2019 11:26PM

Nurses direct health care and deal with medications etc. Unless there is a medical reason to do so they do not clean up patients in their care. They are more like junior management.

I am 10 years dealing with nursing home people on a daily basis in a non medical role and this is what I see. Nurses deal with paperwork and patient care in an indirect way. Health care assistants do the physical lifting carrying and cleaning and catering assistants feed the patients. There are separate staff for laundry and cleaning and separate staff for activities and dealing with payments and financial matters with relatives.

There is not the same level of intimacy with care of people that there used to be. Nurses now only deal with very sick people if they deal with any clients at all. Once they are on routine medical regime the bulk of the work and minding is done by health care assistants.

TheRiverman · 29-01-2019 11:28PM

backspin. wrote: »

I would say the Hospitals need more Healthcare Assistants rather than Nurses.

The existing Healthcare Assistants should have a lot more responsibility.If a Healthcare Assistant makes a mistake the nurse is responsible.That is wrong.

TheRiverman · 29-01-2019 11:33PM

gctest50 wrote: »

Deserve a shotgun blast in the face if someone dies over this

The Moderator should ban you for a comment like that.

KaneToad · 29-01-2019 11:34PM

hawkelady wrote: »

I see that the nurse who posted her payslip online a few weeks ago will be interviewed on prime time tonight. Should set the record straight

Saw that. Looks like she is getting €41,600 (ish) gross a year. Excluding any overtime worked.

Life is too short to be working overtime though!

wrangler · 29-01-2019 11:35PM

4ensic15 wrote: »

Why should nurses have to pay for other peoples mismanagement?

And you know where the mismanagement is and you choose to ignore it, someone will have to take responsibility for calling a halt, this gravy train can't go on

Twenty Grand · 29-01-2019 11:35PM

KaneToad wrote: »

Saw that. Looks like she is getting €41,600 (ish) gross a year. Excluding any overtime worked.

Life is too short to be working overtime though!

Overtime isn't optional unfortunately.
If you're in the trenches with a patient you stay.

doolox · 29-01-2019 11:40PM

They are the eyes and ears on the ground floor of patient care. It does not men that they actually do the work but they need to supervise it in detail.

There is a move towards looking for similar registration of health care assistants in a similar way to the way nurses and doctors are answerable to an outside independent statuary body for their actions. They might need a licence to work if this comes about.

At the present time it is the nurses and doctors who carry the can if bad things happen to vulnerable people in their care.

An onerous load to carry in a job that is not well paid for the responsibilities it carries.

KaneToad · 29-01-2019 11:42PM

Twenty Grand wrote: »

Overtime isn't optional unfortunately.
If you're in the trenches with a patient you stay.

Well maybe that's what needs to be tackled.

Wheeliebin30 · 29-01-2019 11:45PM

One question.

The government know they are unpopular not giving into the demands and will get hammered in the polls.

So why are they still not giving in?

Is it the case they know the money isn’t there?

wrangler · 29-01-2019 11:45PM

Twenty Grand wrote: »

Overtime isn't optional unfortunately.
If you're in the trenches with a patient you stay.

A nurse said during the week that you get time in lieu,

Wheeliebin30 · 29-01-2019 11:47PM

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/review-states-no-exodus-of-nurses-while-pay-competitive-1.3570521%3fmode=amp

Review states no exodus of nurses, while pay competitive

Goldengirl · 29-01-2019 11:58PM

Teddy Daniels wrote: »

The should get a pay rise but it should be absolute! Say 5 grand each because there is no reason in my mind why the nurses on 80 grand should get a 10 grand pay rise and the ones on 30 get less than 4.
It’s the ones on less that should get a bigger rise.

While I don't agree with splitting into factions, nurse managers, assistant directors of nursing and Directors, are all paid on a different payscale to the regular staff nurse scale anyhow...so yes, a rise in pay for nurses does not mean a rise for these promotional grades, as the extra for experience and qualifications is meant to be built into their pay grade.
However you can't expect nurses to take on a role where they have a major increase in responsibility , and have to have certain extra qualifications, if they are not going to earn more than the senior staff nurses working on their unit, can you? That is like the civil service trying o entice senior consultants from the private sector, but with less pay .

30-01-2019 12:21AM

Going to be controversial here. I work in the HSE as a pharmacist and I don't think nurses should be paid the same as me. On a pure financial level, I make savings multiple times of my salary, I switch regards to medicines management. I also make clinical decisions with regards to patients medications. I also have two masters which I had to do part time alongside work to get to my level. Nurses don't make the impact I do on a clinical level to be paid the same as me. I think a useful job development for nurses would be an advanced nurse practitioner role which possibly could enable to earn similar to me.

Twenty Grand · 30-01-2019 12:44AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Going to be controversial here. I work in the HSE as a pharmacist and I don't think nurses should be paid the same as me.

Not a criticism of your post but everyone believes their job is more difficult than other peoples.
Everyone thinks they've got it harder, or they work longer or better. You'd be hard pressed to find anyone who thinks they should be paid less for their work.

Damien360 · 30-01-2019 12:58AM

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

One question.

The government know they are unpopular not giving into the demands and will get hammered in the polls.

So why are they still not giving in?

Is it the case they know the money isn’t there?

Brexit will suck up all money. If it goes tits up, prices will rise and people will need help. If the nurses get their money, it is just the tip of the iceberg, as a queue will already be forming for their slice of pie. The new hospital will be knocked on the head and you can imagine the **** storm if staff got paid and the capital plan gets shelved.

30-01-2019 12:59AM

Twenty Grand wrote: »

Not a criticism of your post but everyone believes their job is more difficult than other peoples.
Everyone thinks they've got it harder, or they work longer or better. You'd be hard pressed to find anyone who thinks they should be paid less for their work.

I don't think I've got it harder. Just that I make more of an impact clinically on my patients than nurses do (albeit less patient facing)

Wheeliebin30 · 30-01-2019 01:02AM

Damien360 wrote: »

Brexit will suck up all money. If it goes tits up, prices will rise and people will need help. If the nurses get their money, it is just the tip of the iceberg, as a queue will already be forming for their slice of pie. The new hospital will be knocked on the head and you can imagine the **** storm if staff got paid and the capital plan gets shelved.

So the government are doing it for the good of the country???

But don’t tell the INMO or Sinn Fein or any anti establishment numpty that.

Damien360 · 30-01-2019 01:05AM

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

So the government are doing it for the good of the country???

But don’t tell the INMO or Sinn Fein or any anti establishment numpty that.

Not sure how you read that. There just isn't the money. And with the great unknown of Brexit, they would be reckless to have a giveaway budget for nurses.

30-01-2019 01:12AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I don't think I've got it harder. Just that I make more of an impact clinically on my patients than nurses do (albeit less patient facing)

So you work 24/7 , 365 days a year?
You probably get bonuses every year?

Wheeliebin30 · 30-01-2019 01:12AM

Damien360 wrote: »

Not sure how you read that. There just isn't the money. And with the great unknown of Brexit, they would be reckless to have a giveaway budget for nurses.

Exactly the money isn’t there so to give it now would be wreckless.

Ergo the government are doing the right thing in not giving money we don’t have, therefore not giving into populism.

Tell me how · 30-01-2019 01:14AM

Goldengirl wrote: »

While I don't agree with splitting into factions, nurse managers, assistant directors of nursing and Directors, are all paid on a different payscale to the regular staff nurse scale anyhow...so yes, a rise in pay for nurses does not mean a rise for these promotional grades, as the extra for experience and qualifications is meant to be built into their pay grade.
However you can't expect nurses to take on a role where they have a major increase in responsibility , and have to have certain extra qualifications, if they are not going to earn more than the senior staff nurses working on their unit, can you? That is like the civil service trying o entice senior consultants from the private sector, but with less pay .

Yes it does mean that if they are successful then all nurses in management roles will also get the payrise.

That is why the figure of 57k is relevant.

If it was just at an active on ward level, I would be in favour of their request, but it isn't.

Do you think nurses will get their payrise?

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