6 Nations 2019 Build Up thread

Burkie1203 · 03-01-2019 5:20pm #1

Injuries taking their toll

Underhill a doubt for England

Halfoenny to see specialist over concussion sustained in AI v Aus

https://twitter.com/BBCSportWales/status/1080842775287992320?s=19

Dog Botherer · 03-01-2019 5:28pm

Not altogether certain that Wales are any weaker with Liam Williams at 15 instead of Halfpenny.

Anthony Watson is still out for England, though they’re stacked in the back three right now.

Clegg · 03-01-2019 5:41pm

Losing Underhill is a blow, but with Tom Curry fit I don't think England lose much at openside. Billy Vunipola is starting for Saracens at the weekend though. That's huge for them. A fit and in form Vunipola transforms that team. Plus if they can keep Tuilagi fit they'll be extremely hard to beat.

Podge_irl · 03-01-2019 6:02pm

Dog Botherer wrote: »

Not altogether certain that Wales are any weaker with Liam Williams at 15 instead of Halfpenny.

Stronger potentially, goal-kicking aside.

irishbucsfan · 03-01-2019 7:14pm

Surely it’d be Halfpenny + Williams + North?

The Rape of Lucretia · 03-01-2019 7:19pm

As with the way the Munster-Leinster game was used, this time, the 6N is really just a short series of sophisticated training sessions, player development, and squad deepening exposure. Wal, Eng, and Fra would like to win it, as a positive and moral boosting development validation step in their WC preparations. But for Ireland, been there, done that. Its all about the world cup. I shall watch their 5 training matches with interest.

penybont exile · 03-01-2019 7:36pm

.... love this time of the year.

stephen_n · 03-01-2019 7:43pm

Don’t see a grand slam for anyone this year, things are too tight. Could be Wales, England or Ireland for the championship and it’s too close to say anyone is a favorite.

Stheno · 03-01-2019 7:44pm

I'll say a novena now for the mods

sydthebeat · 03-01-2019 7:44pm

penybont exile wrote: »

.... love this time of the year.

Worried about gatland leaving??

penybont exile · 03-01-2019 7:52pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

Worried about gatland leaving??

Short answer .... Yes.

But that's 12 months away so looking forward to the 6N first .... then start the WC build-up.

We should be very competitive in both .... nice match order for the 6N & a very favourable WC draw especially if we can beat Australia .... what's not to look forward too.

sydthebeat · 03-01-2019 7:57pm

penybont exile wrote: »

Short answer .... Yes.

But that's 12 months away so looking forward to the 6N first .... then start the WC build-up.

We should be very competitive in both .... nice match order for the 6N & a very favourable WC draw especially if we can beat Australia .... what's not to look forward too.

Things will be tasty if both of us go into the last round undefeated.... Which i can see happening. The scheduling is favourable to us too....scotland in round two could be hard to rise for after the opening game v England, but we are well aware at this stage of their threat at home.

At that point a lot will depend on injuries/ suspensions, but my money would always be on you guys in the millennium.

irishbucsfan · 03-01-2019 8:06pm

penybont exile wrote: »

.... love this time of the year.

March was much better last year

Defaulter1831 · 03-01-2019 8:10pm

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

As with the way the Munster-Leinster game was used, this time, the 6N is really just a short series of sophisticated training sessions, player development, and squad deepening exposure. Wal, Eng, and Fra would like to win it, as a positive and moral boosting development validation step in their WC preparations. But for Ireland, been there, done that. Its all about the world cup. I shall watch their 5 training matches with interest.

Right.. back to back 6N or Grand Slam wins and the confidence it would sustain would be less preferable than a mid table finish..

Countries like Ireland who have never made a WC semi can't afford to be so arrogant. The best teams in most sports just win everything.

Defaulter1831 · 03-01-2019 8:17pm

England 2002-03 is the NH template. Beat the best in the SH summer 2002, win your autumn internationals. Win the GS in 2003. Keep beating teams until they have a hangup about you.

thomond2006 · 03-01-2019 9:10pm

Cardiff is a trap game so I'm happy it's at the end of the tournament when Ireland are less likely to be caught out imo.

Scottish Jodi · 07-01-2019 1:33am

I am really looking forward to this year's tournament

.

I am a Scot living in Ireland so Scotland are who I am supporting but my pick this year is Ireland who I tip to win the world cup.

We had a good summer, apart from the USA loss and a good autumn where we ran South Africa very close. The Wales game was our only bad performance but I blame the clubs for not releasing our top players lol.

I expect us to beat Italy and possibly France and am hopeful of regaining the Calcutta Cup by winning at Twickenham for the first time in a very long time. Wales and Ireland away will be tough but we are close to their level.

I predict we will end 3rd,behind Ireland and Wales

.

sydthebeat · 07-01-2019 8:20am

You have Ireland at home this year

razorblunt · 07-01-2019 10:45am

If I were Scottish (I live here so I have to listen to alot of their grumblings and man do they grumble), I'd be looking for a lot more consistency from them, they're playing very like Townsend himself, on their day, class, on others ... eh, not so much.

They have a habit of believing their won hype too and I'm still adamant Laidlaw is weighing them down. If Horne can get the 9 jersey then that opens up a lot of doors.
I'm still incredibly nervous about the opening game in Japan though I have to say.

troyzer · 09-01-2019 8:37am

Here's a weird question:

Does anyone remember/know how the tournament organisers set it up when there are potential winners on the last week in different cities?

The whole point is the winning team raises the trophy on the day but surely there's only one trophy? What if, for example, both Ireland and England were able to win the title this year on the final day?

How do they decide where to have the trophy? Twickenham or Cardiff?

This has definitely happened before but I can't remember what happened.

irishbucsfan · 09-01-2019 8:38am

troyzer wrote: »

Here's a weird question:

Does anyone remember/know how the tournament organisers set it up when there are potential winners on the last week in different cities?

The whole point is the winning team raises the trophy on the day but surely there's only one trophy? What if, for example, both Ireland and England were able to win the title this year on the final day?

How do they decide where to have the trophy? Twickenham or Cardiff?

This has definitely happened before but I can't remember what happened.

Dummy trophies

troyzer · 09-01-2019 8:40am

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Dummy trophies

Really? I thought that might be the case.

thomond2006 · 09-01-2019 5:01pm

Poirot (Bordeaux-Begles)
Priso (La Rochelle)

Guirado (Toulon)
Bourgarit (La Rochelle)

Marchand (Toulouse)
Atonio (La Rochelle)

Bamba (Brive)
Aldegheri (Toulouse)

Lambey (Lyon)
Vahaamahina (Clermont)
Iturria (Clermont)
Willemse (Monpellier)

Leroux (Racing 92)
Lauret (Racing 92)
Y. Camara (Montpellier)
Alldritt (La Rochelle)
Picamoles (Montpellier)

Parra (Clermont)
Dupont (Toulouse)
Serin (Bordeaux-Begles)
Lopez (Clermont)
Belleau (Toulon)

Fofana (Clermont)
Bastareaud (Toulon)
Doumayrou (La Rochelle)
Ntamack (Toulouse)
Fickou (Paris)
Huget (Toulouse)
Penaud (Clermont)
Mrd (Toulouse)
Ramos (Toulouse)

Willemse, Alldritt, Ntamack, Ramos and Aldegheri are the new caps if selected.

errlloyd · 09-01-2019 5:15pm

troyzer wrote: »

Here's a weird question:
This has definitely happened before but I can't remember what happened.

The best example is 2015, where any one of four teams could have won on the final day in either Rome, Edinburgh or Twickenham. It guess it almost certainly has to be dummy trophies.

leakyboots · 09-01-2019 5:20pm

That was one of the maddest days in my years of watching rugby, brilliantly bonkers fun!

leakyboots · 09-01-2019 5:23pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyb7Cn2CF1g

Just to add, one of my favourite bits was current bête-noir Rory Kockott booting the ball out of play and celebrating... after getting absolutely tanked by England by 20 points... but denying them the 6N

errlloyd · 09-01-2019 5:25pm

leakyboots wrote: »

That was one of the maddest days in my years of watching rugby, brilliantly bonkers fun!

Oh that day was special. May never have anything like it again, insanity.

troyzer · 09-01-2019 5:32pm

errlloyd wrote: »

leakyboots wrote: »

That was one of the maddest days in my years of watching rugby, brilliantly bonkers fun!

Oh that day was special. May never have anything like it again, insanity.

Something similar happened in baseball in 2011. There were four teams on the final game of the season able to win one of two playoff spots. None of them were playing each other but each had to win and hope a result went for them. One of the games went into extra innings.

And this was at the end of a 162 game season. Unbelievable.

errlloyd · 09-01-2019 5:39pm

troyzer wrote: »

Something similar happened in baseball in 2011. There were four teams on the final game of the season able to win one of two playoff spots. None of them were playing each other but each had to win and hope a result went for them. One of the games went into extra innings.

And this was at the end of a 162 game season. Unbelievable.

The champions cup group a few years ago where they all finished level was deadly.

SoupyNorman · 09-01-2019 5:45pm

Love 6N so much, gives purpose to the bitterly cold early Spring and by the end of the tournament the clocks soon go forward heralding in the Summers beginnings.

Seriously, began watching 6N around 2001ish when simply scoring a try was viewed as an achievement. Watching every year where we hoped for a triple crown and also hoped for no wooden spoon to the dizzying heights of 2009….will never forget that night. It’s been an amazing journey to watch the team and the game evolve over the years and now I have a little 5 year old mascot that loves to wave the Ireland flag when I jump out of my seat screaming…it’s a good system we have.

Defaulter1831 · 09-01-2019 5:48pm

leakyboots wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyb7Cn2CF1g

Just to add, one of my favourite bits was current bête-noir Rory Kockott booting the ball out of play and celebrating... after getting absolutely tanked by England by 20 points... but denying them the 6N

That day was so tense! I know it's sacrilegious to say but it goes to show that we had a bit of luck to win the championship in 2015, especially, and 2014. Joe got a bit of luck in 2015 that was cruelly absent under O'Sullivan in 2007. Denied the GS by a last minute French try in Croke Park. Denied the championship by a last minute French try against Scotland on Patrick's Day that year.

Of course Joe is a more complete coach but sometimes a bit of luck comes into it.

aloooof · 09-01-2019 6:13pm

leakyboots wrote: »

That was one of the maddest days in my years of watching rugby, brilliantly bonkers fun!

That day was set up brilliantly by Wales hammering Italy. Ireland first, and then England had to go after that points differential if I remember correctly.

aloooof · 09-01-2019 6:15pm

Defaulter1831 wrote: »

Joe got a bit of luck in 2015 that was cruelly absent under O'Sullivan in 2007. Denied the GS by a last minute French try in Croke Park. Denied the championship by a last minute French try against Scotland on Patrick's Day that year.

AND a last minute try we conceded to Italy, when keeping the ball in play and trying to score another ourselves. Little did we know at the time how crucial that would end up being...

Defaulter1831 · 09-01-2019 6:37pm

aloooof wrote: »

AND a last minute try we conceded to Italy, when keeping the ball in play and trying to score another ourselves. Little did we know at the time how crucial that would end up being...

Denis Leamy quick tap. He was trying to do the right thing and extend the lead. Fine margins..

mogwai81 · 09-01-2019 6:55pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

Poirot (Bordeaux-Begles)
Priso (La Rochelle)

Guirado (Toulon)
Bourgarit (La Rochelle)

Marchand (Toulouse)
Atonio (La Rochelle)

Bamba (Brive)
Aldegheri (Toulouse)

Lambey (Lyon)
Vahaamahina (Clermont)
Iturria (Clermont)
Willemse (Monpellier)

Leroux (Racing 92)
Lauret (Racing 92)
Y. Camara (Montpellier)
Alldritt (La Rochelle)
Picamoles (Montpellier)

Parra (Clermont)
Dupont (Toulouse)
Serin (Bordeaux-Begles)
Lopez (Clermont)
Belleau (Toulon)

Fofana (Clermont)
Bastareaud (Toulon)
Doumayrou (La Rochelle)
Ntamack (Toulouse)
Fickou (Paris)
Huget (Toulouse)
Penaud (Clermont)
Mrd (Toulouse)
Ramos (Toulouse)

Willemse, Alldritt, Ntamack, Ramos and Aldegheri are the new caps if selected.

That squad seems to be light on natural wingers.

stephen_n · 09-01-2019 7:08pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

Poirot (Bordeaux-Begles)
Priso (La Rochelle)

Guirado (Toulon)
Bourgarit (La Rochelle)

Marchand (Toulouse)
Atonio (La Rochelle)

Bamba (Brive)
Aldegheri (Toulouse)

Lambey (Lyon)
Vahaamahina (Clermont)
Iturria (Clermont)
Willemse (Monpellier)

Leroux (Racing 92)
Lauret (Racing 92)
Y. Camara (Montpellier)
Alldritt (La Rochelle)
Picamoles (Montpellier)

Parra (Clermont)
Dupont (Toulouse)
Serin (Bordeaux-Begles)
Lopez (Clermont)
Belleau (Toulon)

Fofana (Clermont)
Bastareaud (Toulon)
Doumayrou (La Rochelle)
Ntamack (Toulouse)
Fickou (Paris)
Huget (Toulouse)
Penaud (Clermont)
Mrd (Toulouse)
Ramos (Toulouse)

Willemse, Alldritt, Ntamack, Ramos and Aldegheri are the new caps if selected.

So much talent on paper, that will ultimately come to nothing.

The Rape of Lucretia · 09-01-2019 7:35pm

SoupyNorman wrote: »

Love 6N so much, gives purpose to the bitterly cold early Spring and by the end of the tournament the clocks soon go forward heralding in the Summers beginnings.

Its usually what gets me through the dark months, and it does have a great hit rate to provide some super games.

But a bit of a different vibe this year from an Ireland perspective at least. Wales and England especially will be gung ho to win it. But for us, not so much. Its just not so much of a biggie, in a World Cup year, where the most positive outcome is squad development and no long term injuries.
So very interested to see what combinations Joe experiments with and how the team is developing. But in the sense that they are important warm up games, similar, and even to a lesser extent given their greater distance from the WC , to the warm up games in the summer.
So it lacks the magic anticipation of daring to dream we could win the thing or do a grand slam. Those dreams are already focused on the Autumn.

troyzer · 09-01-2019 7:57pm

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

SoupyNorman wrote: »

Love 6N so much, gives purpose to the bitterly cold early Spring and by the end of the tournament the clocks soon go forward heralding in the Summers beginnings.

Its usually what gets me through the dark months, and it does have a great hit rate to provide some super games.

But a bit of a different vibe this year from an Ireland perspective at least. Wales and England especially will be gung ho to win it. But for us, not so much. Its just not so much of a biggie, in a World Cup year, where the most positive outcome is squad development and no long term injuries.
So very interested to see what combinations Joe experiments with and how the team is developing. But in the sense that they are important warm up games, similar, and even to a lesser extent given their greater distance from the WC , to the warm up games in the summer.
So it lacks the magic anticipation of daring to dream we could win the thing or do a grand slam. Those dreams are already focused on the Autumn.

Ireland to win the Six Nations but Wales to win the Triple Crown.

It'll finish like this:

Ireland.
Wales.
England.
Scotland.
France.
Italy.

sydthebeat · 09-01-2019 9:32pm

I see the bookies have the opening game between the French and the Welsh as impossible to predict.... No spread.

Brunel seems to have the French bucking their stereotypical trends.... Ie slow starters, loose flair play with abandon, running out of puff after 70 etc.

Last year, while statistically being beating all ends up by us, they were still able to pull ahead after 70 mins and we were blessed to win that game.

The Welsh might just find this a step too far for them.

Dave_The_Sheep · 09-01-2019 9:46pm

aloooof wrote: »

That day was set up brilliantly by Wales hammering Italy. Ireland first, and then England had to go after that points differential if I remember correctly.

I was so angry with Italy for that second half. I had to get up and go for a walk for the last ten minutes or so, pure capitulation.

Dubinusa · 10-01-2019 3:16am

I think England will be tough. They looked better during Nov.
The young players coming in are very good.
Should be a great competition.

SoupyNorman · 10-01-2019 12:19pm

Dubinusa wrote: »

I think England will be tough. They looked better during Nov.
The young players coming in are very good.
Should be a great competition.

Opening games are always the tetchy and very hard to call.

Home advantage and tails up after an epic 2018 should see us through but I think it’s going to be a tough day at the office.

jr86 · 10-01-2019 2:43pm

SoupyNorman wrote: »

Opening games are always the tetchy and very hard to call.

Yeah in our last 3 opening matches we've drawn one, lost one and scraped over the line against France. Haven't been the fastest of starters in recent times

I suspect we may well have ourselves England and Wales tied on 4 wins each this year. Gonna be an interesting campaign

shootermacg · 11-01-2019 12:55pm

troyzer wrote: »

Ireland to win the Six Nations but Wales to win the Triple Crown.

It'll finish like this:

Ireland.
Wales.
England.
Scotland.
France.
Italy.

I think Ireland will have to beat Wales because I don't really see them losing to anyone else this year...maybe England..

troyzer · 11-01-2019 1:22pm

shootermacg wrote: »

troyzer wrote: »

Ireland to win the Six Nations but Wales to win the Triple Crown.

It'll finish like this:

Ireland.
Wales.
England.
Scotland.
France.
Italy.

I think Ireland will have to beat Wales because I don't really see them losing to anyone else this year...maybe England..

I think they'll trip up somewhere.

SoupyNorman · 11-01-2019 2:06pm

troyzer wrote: »

I think they'll trip up somewhere.

I think it’s a necessity.

We need teams to exploit vulnerabilities as after a pretty epic 2018 there is a rather large target on our backs. Teams that do show up any weakness in our squad will be doing us a great service for our WC preparations.

I can see us taking the Championship this year but I don’t see the Slam but I wouldn’t mind too much.

aloooof · 11-01-2019 2:38pm

SoupyNorman wrote: »

I can see us taking the Championship this year but I don’t see the Slam but I wouldn’t mind too much.

I think this illustrates as much as anything how spoiled we are as Irish rugby fans at the moment. And is definitely overstating it.

Jump_In_Jack · 11-01-2019 2:52pm

Sam Underhill officially ruled out of 6 Nations, out for 3 months after surgery.
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/jan/11/sam-underhill-miss-six-nations-england-ankle-surgery

stephen_n · 11-01-2019 2:52pm

Jump_In_Jack wrote: »

Sam Underhill officially ruled out of 6 Nations, out for 3 months after surgery.
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/jan/11/sam-underhill-miss-six-nations-england-ankle-surgery

Big blow for Engerland after finally finding a proper openside.

Jump_In_Jack · 11-01-2019 3:02pm

stephen_n wrote: »

Big blow for Engerland after finally finding a proper openside.

Tom Curry for Sale, another precocious talent at 20yrs old, will get a chance to come in and make a statement before the World Cup.

stephen_n · 11-01-2019 3:02pm

Jump_In_Jack wrote: »

Tom Curry for Sale, another precocious talent at 20yrs old, will get a chance to come in and make a statement before the World Cup.

Wonder will Eddie trust him though.

6 Nations 2019 Build Up thread

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