Should people in emergency accommodation be made pay for their stay?

splashuum · 04-12-2018 2:43pm #1

Niall Boylan poised this question today regarding people in emergency accommodation. Should they be made contribute a reasonable sum towards their stay?

SortingYouOut · 04-12-2018 2:58pm

I think the state can afford to put them up for free, considering the reason they're there in the first place.

A good scheme would be a mandatory saving scheme, with the pot given to the person when other accommodation is found for them, to help them out with paying for home content.

eviltwin · 04-12-2018 3:03pm

I work for an emergency accommodation provider and we take rent from service users even those on welfare. DCC guidelines. Not sure about the others but I'd imagine we all work under the same rules.

zell12 · 04-12-2018 3:06pm

eviltwin wrote: »

I work for an emergency accommodation provider and we take rent from service users even those on welfare. DCC guidelines. Not sure about the others but I'd imagine we all work under the same rules.

Agreed.
People pay a minimum contribution

04-12-2018 3:09pm

SortingYouOut wrote: »

I think the state can afford to put them up for free, considering the reason they're there in the first place............

Some of them are there so as they want a council flat/house and not a rented property from a landlord. ......... why should they be put up for "free"?

Foweva Awone · 04-12-2018 3:11pm

I spent a couple of months in an SVDP house, think it was €50 a week we had to pay. All bills and food included in that.

toxicity234 · 04-12-2018 3:43pm

I thinks so.
So if a person/ or Family is in on-going accommodation and receiving a pay, if it Social Welfare or Working they could pay a % of there income.
So Threshold say that a family shouldn't pay more than 30% of it income for accommodation.
So I think every family should pay 20% for the accommodation.

Then the homeless are encouraged to find HAP and not just sit there waiting for a council house and not paying anything. I.E. which we have seen from the likes of erica fleming.

The Specialist · 04-12-2018 4:02pm

Augeo wrote: »

Some of them are there so as they want a council flat/house and not a rented property from a landlord. ......... why should they be put up for "free"?

Sure don't you know all those homeless people are in that situation "cos of the evil government and de banks and de bailout and de" blah de ****in blah. No such thing as personal responsibility anymore, everyone elses fault except their own.

riclad · 04-12-2018 5:57pm

Did you ever stay in emergency accomodation ?
People in hotels have to back in every night by a certain time,
11pm approx, you have a tv , one kettle to make tea.
no cooking facilty,s .
i don,t think they should pay anything.
Its not very luxurious accomodation .

04-12-2018 6:12pm

riclad wrote: »

Did you ever stay in emergency accomodation ?
People in hotels ............. .

I've stayed in plenty hotels.
Sometimes for months at a time for work.

Bannasidhe · 04-12-2018 6:12pm

Augeo wrote: »

Some of them are there so as they want a council flat/house and not a rented property from a landlord. ......... why should they be put up for "free"?

Or to put it another way some people want a secure tenancy and not be told in 6 months or a year that the LL is selling up/ needs it for a relation/is refurbishing.

Imagine wanting secure accommodation-the cheek of some people.

04-12-2018 6:15pm

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Or to put it another way some people want a secure tenancy and not be told in 6 months or a year that the LL is selling up/ needs it for a relation/is refurbishing.

Imagine wanting secure accommodation-the cheek of some people.

When you are renting there is as they say for and against the situation.
It seems strange that folk who can't pay their way expect more than folk who are, very fooking strange actually. The folk paying their way and renting don't get the secure accommodation you mention but they get on with things as best they can.

Spanish Eyes · 04-12-2018 6:18pm

Do people in hotels not pay anything at all?

I suppose they have to buy their food and get their laundry done etc. Don't know if that is provided. But they have no light, heat, electric, gas, TV license, insurance to pay. Or maybe they do I dunno.

GingerLily · 04-12-2018 6:22pm

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Augeo wrote: »

Some of them are there so as they want a council flat/house and not a rented property from a landlord. ......... why should they be put up for "free"?

Or to put it another way some people want a secure tenancy and not be told in 6 months or a year that the LL is selling up/ needs it for a relation/is refurbishing.

Imagine wanting secure accommodation-the cheek of some people.

I was evicted twice, so I saved and bought a house.

Beggars shouldn't be choosers and all that

Bannasidhe · 04-12-2018 6:47pm

GingerLily wrote: »

I was evicted twice, so I saved and bought a house.

Beggars shouldn't be choosers and all that

Shouldn't have to be beggers at all.
People should have access to secure long-term accommodation.

I'm glad you were able to buy a house, Not everyone is in that position.

Bannasidhe · 04-12-2018 6:52pm

Augeo wrote: »

When you are renting there is as they say for and against the situation.
It seems strange that folk who can't pay their way expect more than folk who are, very fooking strange actually. The folk paying their way and renting don't get the secure accommodation you mention but they get on with things as best they can.

Has it occurred to you that some of those people in "emergency" accommodation were paying their way but were evicted because LL selling/relation moving in/refurbishment and found it impossible to find accommodation due to spiraling rent costs?

Sure, charge a fee but then end the practice of requiring people (incl children) to vacate the rooms during the day.

Gatling · 04-12-2018 7:09pm

Emergency accommodation or not ,
People should be paying their fair share to stay in hotels or b&bs ,i believe it's added to the growing thend of homelessness and people in hotels turning down multiple offers of housing,
A token fee isn't good enough especially if people are in full and part time employment

04-12-2018 7:31pm

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Has it occurred to you that some of those people in "emergency" accommodation were paying their way but were evicted because LL selling/relation moving in/refurbishment and found it impossible to find accommodation due to spiraling rent costs?

...

No doubt there's a few.... amongst the wasters

For every case you describe there's at least one turning down alternative accommodation so as to maintain their "endeavour" in securing a council property

jimmycrackcorm · 04-12-2018 7:38pm

riclad wrote:

Did you ever stay in emergency accomodation ? People in hotels have to back in every night by a certain time, 11pm approx, you have a tv , one kettle to make tea. no cooking facilty,s . i don,t think they should pay anything. Its not very luxurious accomodation .

You mean like people who actually use hotel rooms in general?

Spanish Eyes · 04-12-2018 7:41pm

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

You mean like people who actually use hotel rooms in general?

Well apart from a curfew, and maybe a fridge you are correct.

Bannasidhe · 04-12-2018 7:42pm

Augeo wrote: »

No doubt there's a few.... amongst the wasters

For every case you describe there's at least one turning down alternative accommodation so as to maintain their "endeavour" in securing a council property

And why do they want council property?
Because it's secure.

I don't think wanting a secure tenancy is being a waster - I think that's the mini standard.

noodler · 04-12-2018 7:43pm

Renters really are the ones getting screwed.

Just paying to survive with little. Hope og long term accommodation whereas those being looked after by the state and usually not working get some. Sort of. Permanentl and incredibly cheap accommodation.

Foweva Awone · 04-12-2018 8:06pm

Foweva Awone wrote: »

I spent a couple of months in an SVDP house, think it was €50 a week we had to pay. All bills and food included in that.

By the way that was a house with several other women, with lots of rules and very basic facilities. I'm now paying half that on HAP for a two-bed apartment. So I guess financially the incentive was there to move out.

Generally though being homeless is really crap. Those who've never been can't really understand the "ungrounded" feeling, the anxiety, the feeling that you're a burden to everyone kind enough to accommodate you. I rarely slept on the streets, but I've spent a fair amount of time in hostels, recovery houses, treatment centres and was still counted as "homeless" all that time. You can be kicked out at a moment's notice, you lose so much free will and independence. There's no stability.

Knowing that where I am now I can come and go as I please, do what I want with my time, and most of all knowing I'd be given a month to organise myself if the landlord decided to end the tenancy ... it's just amazing. I'd almost forgotten what it was like to have stability like this. It's like I can breathe again.

I just can't imagine anyone would stay in emergency accommodation if they had any other option. It's just so difficult to find HAP properties. I was extremely lucky.

Wheeliebin30 · 04-12-2018 8:11pm

Foweva Awone wrote: »

By the way that was a house with several other women, with lots of rules and very basic facilities. I'm now paying half that on HAP for a two-bed apartment. So I guess financially the incentive was there to move out.

Generally though being homeless is really crap. Those who've never been can't really understand the "ungrounded" feeling, the anxiety, the feeling that you're a burden to everyone kind enough to accommodate you. I rarely slept on the streets, but I've spent a fair amount of time in hostels, recovery houses, treatment centres and was still counted as "homeless" all that time. You can be kicked out at a moment's notice, you lose so much free will and independence. There's no stability.

Knowing that where I am now I can come and go as I please, do what I want with my time, and most of all knowing I'd be given a month to organise myself if the landlord decided to end the tenancy ... it's just amazing. I'd almost forgotten what it was like to have stability like this. It's like I can breathe again.

I just can't imagine anyone would stay in emergency accommodation if they had any other option. It's just so difficult to find HAP properties. I was extremely lucky.

Hmmm I wonder why landlords don’t like taking HAP.

One of life’s great mysteries that.

Foweva Awone · 04-12-2018 8:18pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Hmmm I wonder why landlords don’t like taking HAP.

One of life’s great mysteries that.

I'm not sure what you're implying there, but I'm pretty much an ideal tenant, good work and previous landlord references etc, I get on great with the landlord. I'd been renting privately for years and years without any issues before I went through a very rough couple of years in addiction, which can happen to anyone, believe it or not. I was lucky enough to come out the other side. People can end up on HAP for a variety of reasons, doesn't mean they're automatically going to be bad tenants.

davindub · 04-12-2018 8:25pm

Bannasidhe wrote: »

And why do they want council property?
Because it's secure.

I don't wanting a secure tenancy is being a waster - I think that's the mini standard.

Could probably half the emergency list by forcing offspring to move back into their parents, of course then they move down the housing list. A charge for hotels will hopefully reduce those doing it to get moved up the list.

Wheeliebin30 · 04-12-2018 8:27pm

Foweva Awone wrote: »

I'm not sure what you're implying there, but I'm pretty much an ideal tenant, good work and previous landlord references etc, I get on great with the landlord. I'd been renting privately for years and years without any issues before I went through a very rough couple of years in addiction, which can happen to anyone, believe it or not. I was lucky enough to come out the other side. People can end up on HAP for a variety of reasons, doesn't mean they're automatically going to be bad tenants.

Nope it doesn’t.

But I think you know my point so I’m not going to bore you with the details.

GingerLily · 04-12-2018 8:35pm

Bannasidhe wrote: »

GingerLily wrote: »

I was evicted twice, so I saved and bought a house.

Beggars shouldn't be choosers and all that

Shouldn't have to be beggers at all.
People should have access to secure long-term accommodation.

I'm glad you were able to buy a house, Not everyone is in that position.

Secure long term accommodation is a luxury that so many renters in Dublin are not entitled to.

I just don't think it's fair that the middle seem to get the raw end of the stick.

I've no problem with council housing, but manipulating the system to get a forever home faster, I think, is ridiculous.

Sleeper12 · 04-12-2018 8:49pm

splashuum wrote:

Niall Boylan poised this question today regarding people in emergency accommodation. Should they be made contribute a reasonable sum towards their stay?

It's akin to expecting prisoners to pay for their jail sells when they earn 15 euro per week.

People in Hubs already pay. The people who don't pay stay in hostels & hotels where they get kicked out onto the street at 8am, have no cooking facilities so they have pay to eat out or they have to change accommodation several times per week.

What exactly would they be paying for?

Sleeper12 · 04-12-2018 8:53pm

Augeo wrote:

I've stayed in plenty hotels. Sometimes for months at a time for work.

With children? Getting them ready for school, travelling on two buses to get them to school and then after school stook in a room with nowhere to play?

Being a guest in a hotel & actually living in one are two totally different things

Gatling · 04-12-2018 8:58pm

Sleeper12 wrote: »

People in Hubs already pay.

The people who don't pay stay in hostels & hotels where they get kicked out onto the street at 8am, have no cooking facilities so they have pay to eat out or they have to change accommodation several times per week.

The vast majority don't live in hubs and the vast majority don't have to leave.their accommodation at 8pm ( emergency hostels yes) but not hotels b&bs (business model has always operated on out after breakfast and come back in the evening ).
And those who have to be out of hotels at 8 either have school runs or have jobs to go to ,still don't pay

Should people in emergency accommodation be made pay for their stay?

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