Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Jamal Khashoggi disappearance

Options
1235789

Comments

  • Options
    #122
    What Username Guidelines
    Registered Users Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭What Username Guidelines


    wexie wrote: »
    Few articles on this already, according to them there are currently no networks in Turkey that this is possible with. Good few tech journalists have said it simply can't have been done with an Apple watch

    While the watch story is unlikely, one thing I haven’t seen mentioned is that if both watch and phone are connected to the same WiFi network, they can still communicate when out of bluetooth range from each other. But again unlikely that both were able to access a network within the embassy.


  • Options
    #123
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    What Username Guidelines wrote: »
    While the watch story is unlikely, one thing I haven’t seen mentioned is that if both watch and phone are connected to the same WiFi network, they can still communicate when out of bluetooth range from each other. But again unlikely that both were able to access a network within the embassy.

    The other thing I've been wondering about is whether or not it would have been possible to do with an Android smartwatch.

    Either way it's probably more likely that it's a cover story. I think it's considered bad form to admit to bugging the consulate of a friendly nation.

    Aside from that, if a Washington Post journalist had made a recording like that and arranged for it to be sent somewhere I'd be unlikely that only the Turkish authorities had it no?


  • Options
    #124
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    I was infracted for just laughing at this nonsense. So let’s go deeper.

    You’d think that with clear evidence that Saudi is controlling the West’s foreign policy (to the extent that they have organised this killing expecting no repercussions and in fact won’t get any when the dust settles and people go back to strictly) people might move on from the deep state produced nonsense about Russia.

    aah, ok. So Russia isn't responsible for interfering with elections, referendums of using a nerve agent to kill one of its former spies in the UK.

    If you believe that, then there is no point going further with this.

    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    One of your “proofs” here is that some Russian companies are still appearing at an event that some western companies have pulled out from. The other is an article about arms deals from a year ago which is tiny relative to the deals the U.K., US and other western powers engage in. The second article even admitted Russia and Saudi they were on opposite sides in the Syrian war.

    yet ties between Russia and Saudi are getting closer and closer, with MBS and Putin enjoy hugs and lols during the world cup.

    Then of course, there is the whole "Regulating oil prices" thing......
    Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »
    You’d think that with clearer evidence (it was always clear to anybody who looked) of Saudi influence on the west that the Syrian war would be re-examined. Saudi after all supported radical jihadists in the Syrian war, but it’s considered conspiratorial to say the west supported anybody but the non existent moderate rebels.

    you don't seem to be looking very hard.

    Russia is constantly looking to increase its arms sales and influence. The $110bn deal that Trump talked about when he visited still hasn't actually been actioned and now, apparently, the Saudis are looking at Russian arms instead.

    There is more to this story, I am convinced of it.


  • Options
    #125
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    What Username Guidelines wrote: »
    While the watch story is unlikely, one thing I haven’t seen mentioned is that if both watch and phone are connected to the same WiFi network, they can still communicate when out of bluetooth range from each other. But again unlikely that both were able to access a network within the embassy.

    This apple watch can only connect to WiFi by connecting to the network through the phone first. Which he didn't have. That's why you haven't seen that. The apple watch keeps reappearing every day on the thread here when it has been discounted by tech experts about an hour after the mention of it came out. Red herring.

    And as you said there was probably no "Mr bone saw WiFi 2" open network on offer at the Saudi consulate.


  • Options
    #126
    CrabRevolution
    Registered Users Posts: 2,805 ✭✭✭CrabRevolution


    It wouldn't surprise me if the USA are deeply unhappy with the situation, but that themselves and Saudi Arabia are currently in discussions saying "listen, what happened happened. Now what's the easiest way for the 2 of us to gloss over this and forget about it?"


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #127
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    CrabRevolution wrote: »
    It wouldn't surprise me if the USA are deeply unhappy with the situation, but that themselves and Saudi Arabia are currently in discussions saying "listen, what happened happened. Now what's the easiest way for the 2 of us to gloss over this and forget about it?"

    of course, even if it isn't literally being said that is the sentiment.

    the word seems to be that the Saudis will / are being encouraged to get a senior intelligence general close to Mister Bone Saw to fall on his sword and end of.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/oct/19/jamal-khashoggi-saudi-prince-under-pressure-to-blame-general-for-presumed-death

    if that works, then swiftly moving on as an ally in the region against Iran, buy some more tanks and rockets and don't get cosy with the Russians.


  • Options
    #128
    StringerBell
    Registered Users Posts: 14,029 ✭✭✭✭StringerBell


    That's all that's happening. A way out that's mutually acceptable and that causes the least amount of damage politically.

    A scapegoat will likely be put forward in the near future to accept responsibility, acting without permission of MBS or the King and will be dealt with by the said authorities as it took place in a Saudi embassy.

    "People say ‘go with the flow’ but do you know what goes with the flow? Dead fish."



  • Options
    #129
    What Username Guidelines
    Registered Users Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭What Username Guidelines


    glasso wrote: »
    This apple watch can only connect to WiFi by connecting to the network through the phone first. Which he didn't have. That's why you haven't seen that. The apple watch keeps reappearing every day on the thread here when it has been discounted by tech experts about an hour after the mention of it came out. Red herring.

    And as you said there was probably no "Mr bone saw WiFi 2" open network on offer at the Saudi consulate.

    I still know it's highly unlikely, but it is possible using their own portable wifi network, depending on how deep into the embassy it happened. Agree it's almost definitely a bug inside the embassy, however.


  • Options
    #130
    loyatemu
    Registered Users Posts: 14,766 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    How secure is MBS? I know he's been consolidating his power etc but this could be seen as a serious miscalculation by him. Any danger it could have repercussions for him in the kingdom? I'm sure he has plenty of enemies.


  • Options
    #131
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    loyatemu wrote: »
    How secure is MBS? I know he's been consolidating his power etc but this could be seen as a serious miscalculation by him. Any danger it could have repercussions for him in the kingdom? I'm sure he has plenty of enemies.

    he has made sure that he has control of the bodies of power by means of fear and intimidation.
    the king has been demented for years and apparently has only fleeting moments of lucidity so unlikely to replace him with a different crown prince.

    so although he definitely should go as the most credible solution he probably won't. It's Gaddafi, Assad, Saddam all over again, with varying degrees of tyranny. The whole royal family thing even solidifies it.
    That's the way they roll in the middle east for the most part.

    apparently mister bone saw is very headstrong and doesn't want to back down - wants a solution on his terms - according to that guardian article.

    I guess that the Saudis will have to conclude their "investigation" sometime over the next week and see what they come up with.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #132
    loyatemu
    Registered Users Posts: 14,766 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    glasso wrote: »
    he has made sure that he has control of the bodies of power by means of fear and intimidation.
    the king has been demented for years and apparently has only fleeting moments of lucidity so unlikely to replace him with a different crown prince.

    so although he definitely should go as the most credible solution he probably won't. It's Gaddafi, Assad, Saddam all over again, with varying degrees of tyranny. The whole royal family thing even solidifies it.
    That's the way they roll in the middle east for the most part.

    apparently mister bone saw is very headstrong and doesn't want to back down - wants a solution on his terms - according to that guardian article.

    I guess that the Saudis will have to conclude their "investigation" sometime over the next week and see what they come up with.

    the Saudis promising to get to the bottom of this reminds me of OJ Simpson saying he would find the real killer :rolleyes:


  • Options
    #133
    TomOnBoard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,109 ✭✭✭TomOnBoard


    glasso wrote: »
    apparently mister bone saw is very headstrong and doesn't want to back down - wants a solution on his terms - according to that guardian article.

    I guess that the Saudis will have to conclude their "investigation" sometime over the next week and see what they come up with.

    Side by side with the Saudi attempts at 'clean up' are a range of tactics to 'dirty down' the victim by labelling him in such a way as to say, "well, he was a bad 'un anyway and probably deserved what he got! " Prior 'associations' with the Muslim Brotherhood and Bin Laden are being touted by FoxNews and others.


  • Options
    #134
    Rhineshark
    Registered Users Posts: 632 ✭✭✭Rhineshark


    TomOnBoard wrote: »
    Side by side with the Saudi attempts at 'clean up' are a range of tactics to 'dirty down' the victim by labelling him in such a way as to say, "well, he was a bad 'un anyway and probably deserved what he got! " Prior 'associations' with the Muslim Brotherhood and Bin Laden are being touted by FoxNews and others.

    Gosh, it's almost like the propaganda network understand that Trump really doesn't eantbto investigate anything that might require him to stand up to Saudi Arabia.

    Of course his craven cowardliness (and greed) has absolutely has no effect on what MBS reckons he can get away with. I'm told on high authority that that would be silly.


  • Options
    #135
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    so the Saudis have come out and said that Khashoggi 'died after fight'

    what horsesh1t! a fight of 15 killers to 1 60 year old man. that's not a fight.

    they are deluded that anyone would go with this bs.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-45923217


  • Options
    #136
    StringerBell
    Registered Users Posts: 14,029 ✭✭✭✭StringerBell


    We have our scapegoat anyway.

    Saudis have announced he is dead and that it was an accident.

    18 Saudis arrested and under investigation, not named. He got into a fist fight which led to his death is their new story.

    Top general Ahmed al-Assiri and senior advisor to the royal court Saoud al-Qahtan has been fired.

    "People say ‘go with the flow’ but do you know what goes with the flow? Dead fish."



  • Options
    #137
    MayoForSam
    Registered Users Posts: 2,265 ✭✭✭MayoForSam


    StringerBell wrote: »
    We have our scapegoat anyway.

    Saudis have announced he is dead and that it was an accident.

    18 Saudis arrested and under investigation, not named. He got into a fist fight which led to his death is their new story.

    Top general Ahmed al-Assiri and senior advisor to the royal court Saoud al-Qahtan has been fired.

    Bit hard to have a fist fight when you've no fingers left to make a fist.


  • Options
    #138
    StringerBell
    Registered Users Posts: 14,029 ✭✭✭✭StringerBell


    MayoForSam wrote: »
    Bit hard to have a fist fight when you've no fingers left to make a fist.

    It's just a ridiculous story, same as the other one where he left he embassy alive and they don't have cameras that store footage out the back door, which he left through, for some reason.

    The old botched interrogation weather balloon didn't seem to do them any favors either so its back to the old reliable scapegoat and insulate the top man as much as possible from any blowback

    I can't wait to read the wonderful bit of fiction they come up with to explain the Saudis jetting jn, the pathologist, the 15 to 1 fist fight, hell the actual reason behind the fist fight.

    Trump will be sickening too in his praise for how they have handled the situation and the speed with which it was resolved.....

    It's a ****ed up world.

    "People say ‘go with the flow’ but do you know what goes with the flow? Dead fish."



  • Options
    #139
    Headshot
    Registered Users Posts: 53,879 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    They finally own up to it but pity their excuse is bs.

    It's a pity they will just get a slap on the wrist. It's such a nasty regime. The west is always up in arms about Iran but the Saudi's are just as bad.


  • Options
    #140
    TomOnBoard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,109 ✭✭✭TomOnBoard


    Corey Stewart was shown up as a total idiot just now on AC360 on CNN, while trotting out the BS 'lots of mystery about Khasoggi's past' deflection. The spinning from Trump's camp is going into overdrive...


  • Options
    #141
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,409 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Turkey: He died in a fight, ok...show us his body do we can fo an autopsy

    SA: errrrremmmmmm, yeahhhh about that...


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #142
    Rhineshark
    Registered Users Posts: 632 ✭✭✭Rhineshark


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    Turkey: He died in a fight, ok...show us his body do we can fo an autopsy

    SA: errrrremmmmmm, yeahhhh about that...

    SA: Well, once he died in the fist fight with 18 men closely linked to MBS as he definitely did, there was nothing for it but to cut him up and dump the remains somewhere. Are you saying that this is not the normal way to treat accidental deaths?


  • Options
    #143
    Harry Palmr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 40,061 ✭✭✭✭Harry Palmr


    The Turks have played a blinder it has to be said. Clearly they knew far more than the Saudi's thought they did and having extracted a confession of sorts now it's all about the body - is that forest search just for the media to keep the pressure on? Do they actually know where it is? Or from here are the Turks as in the dark as the rest of us? Obviously have acknowledged his death on their patch the Saudi's are now going to be pressurised to produce a corpse and the state that is in will then lead to the next phase of pressure. Forensic science means there are no secrets.


  • Options
    #144
    Rhineshark
    Registered Users Posts: 632 ✭✭✭Rhineshark


    It is going to be difficult to wiggle around an "accidental" death in a fist fight resulting in dismemberment unless they can actually produce Freddy Krueger as his assailant.

    Trump is ofc all over the Saudi explanation but tbh, MBS could have actually accused Freddy Krueger and Trump would have reckoned it was a legit explanation. This is the guy that thought/pretended a "rogue gang" roaming around the Saudi embassy seemed totally likely and not at all weird.

    I did think Turkey was going to back down on this, given their trade ties with SA but apparently this was way too much to swallow. It does seem to have been done with contemptuous lack of interest in secrecy or diplomatic relations. As well as all the other reasons it was horrendous.


  • Options
    #145
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    StringerBell wrote: »
    ....He got into a fist fight which led to his death is their new story. .....

    That's just typical behaviour for overweight journalists, they're always getting into fistfights with elite soldiers and intelligence officers, most especially if they're looking for paperwork that will enable them to happily go on with the rest of their lives.

    Bloody journalists

    :rolleyes:


  • Options
    #146
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    Harry Palmr wrote: »
    The Turks have played a blinder it has to be said. Clearly they knew far more than the Saudi's thought they did and having extracted a confession of sorts now it's all about the body - is that forest search just for the media to keep the pressure on? Do they actually know where it is? Or from here are the Turks as in the dark as the rest of us? Obviously have acknowledged his death on their patch the Saudi's are now going to be pressurised to produce a corpse and the state that is in will then lead to the next phase of pressure. Forensic science means there are no secrets.

    I don't know, personally I'd be shocked if so much as a toe was ever found of that body.

    It's one thing having an 'explanation' for what happened to him, it's entirely different having that 'explanation' match up with what can be corroborated with forensic science like you said.

    Having said that, if a body is produced I'm sure a friendly 'trained' pathologist could be found somewhere.


  • Options
    #147
    goat2
    Registered Users Posts: 4,939 ✭✭✭goat2


    The fifteen that arrived brought suitcases, were travelling private jet,
    and it is being broadcast that he was cut up into bits
    is it too far fetched to think that,
    the suitcases came in handy,


  • Options
    #148
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    goat2 wrote: »
    The fifteen that arrived brought suitcases, were travelling private jet,
    and it is being broadcast that he was cut up into bits
    is it too far fetched to think that,
    the suitcases came in handy,

    If that was supposed to be a Haiku you're doing it wrong :pac:

    (good effort though)


  • Options
    #149
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    goat2 wrote: »
    The fifteen that arrived brought suitcases, were travelling private jet,
    and it is being broadcast that he was cut up into bits
    is it too far fetched to think that,
    the suitcases came in handy,

    For a more serious answer this time. I can't see how they're thinking this whole fight thing is going to hold water.

    IF it was indeed an accident (:rolleyes:) there is absolutely no sensible reason they didn't come out with it straightaway. As a matter of fact if they had just broken the mans neck and produced the body within hours this whole thing would be mostly out of the news by now.

    But if it was a fight and an accident then where is the body? (regardless of whatever condition it is in wherever it is).

    So if they produce a body it will more than likely prove they are lying, if they don't produce a body they have no logical reason as to why not.

    Either way they are lying, and poorly at that.


  • Options
    #150
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    wexie wrote: »
    For a more serious answer this time. I can't see how they're thinking this whole fight thing is going to hold water.

    IF it was indeed an accident (:rolleyes:) there is absolutely no sensible reason they didn't come out with it straightaway. As a matter of fact if they had just broken the mans neck and produced the body within hours this whole thing would be mostly out of the news by now.


    But if it was a fight and an accident then where is the body? (regardless of whatever condition it is in wherever it is).

    So if they produce a body it will more than likely prove they are lying, if they don't produce a body they have no logical reason as to why not.

    Either way they are lying, and poorly at that.

    They are not expecting it to hold water really
    Everyone knows it's complete horsesh1t but it's unfortunately in all of the West's interest to keep Saudi onside for oil price stability, Iran and buying stuff so so it goes.
    People will complain but nothing will be done besides boycotting the odd conference or two and less invites for Mr bone saw to come in foreign visits.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #151
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,783 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    Turkey: He died in a fight, ok...show us his body do we can fo an autopsy

    SA: errrrremmmmmm, yeahhhh about that...

    "During the fight he fell on this angle-grinder that was running, then he tripped and collapsed on this active chainsaw.. then he careered over here where he toppled over a forensic pathologist with a bone saw who accidentally and neatly took all his limbs off.."

    In all likeliness, with the body, they will claim it was taken back to Saudi but was "dumped in the sea" (or similar) in a panic by the men who abducted him, the 15 "scapegoats"

    Taking bets on it


Advertisement