Jamal Khashoggi disappearance

Dohnjoe

Journalist and Saudi critic Jamal Khashoggi has disappeared after walking into the consulate in Turkey

As details are emerging.. it's really looking like this guy was bumped off. He gave 2 mobiles to his fiancee and told her to call one of Erdogan's advisors if he didn't come out - looks like he was aware of danger

It's already highly politically charged

Unreal stuff if the Saudis have offed him in their Turkish consulate

Odhinn

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Journalist and Saudi critic Jamal Khashoggi has disappeared after walking into the consulate in Turkey

As details are emerging.. it's really looking like this guy was bumped off. He gave 2 mobiles to his fiancee and told her to call one of Erdogan's advisors if he didn't come out - looks like he was aware of danger

It's already highly politically charged

Unreal stuff if the Saudis have offed him in their Turkish consulate

At the moment it looks quite likely that he is dead, at the hands of a "hit squad".



https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/saudis-lay-in-wait-for-jamal-khashoggi-and-left-turkey-quickly-sources-say/2018/10/09/0e283e2e-cbc5-11e8-ad0a-0e01efba3cc1_story.html?utm_term=.4ccb2731f82f

McMurphy

Was listening to this in the office yesterday on newstalk, there was also a theory that he might reappear somewhere in the near future,.


Completely bizarre either way.

wexie

was reading an article about this earlier and wondering are the Saudis taking a leaf out of the russian book.

Just flat out denying what a lot of people think they may have done. Although perhaps maybe the saudis are somewhat better organised than the russians.

Having said that there are already videos emerging of the 'alleged' hit team arriving in and out and about in Istanbul. Rumour has it one of them was a forensics expert so I guess they've got that going for them.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-45809470

trellheim

NYT reporting he was dismembered in the embassy. whoa nelly

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/09/world/europe/jamal-khashoggi-turkey-saudi-arabia.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage

ANKARA, Turkey — Top Turkish security officials have concluded that the Saudi dissident Jamal Khashoggi was assassinated in the Saudi Consulate in Istanbul on orders from the highest levels of the royal court, a senior official said Tuesday.

The official described a quick and complex operation in which Mr. Khashoggi was killed within two hours of his arrival at the consulate by a team of Saudi agents, who dismembered his body with a bone saw they brought for the purpose.

“It is like ‘Pulp Fiction,’” the official said.

Dohnjoe

Could be Turkish propaganda about the dismemberment, but equally it could be true

There's a chance he could have been abducted and taken back on that plane, but there is literally no cover story his abducters could use, and next to zero political gain from it.. I would assume hes dead

wexie

Dohnjoe wrote: »

There's a chance he could have been abducted and taken back on that plane, but there is literally no cover story his abducters could use, and next to zero political gain from it.. I would assume hes dead

Even though I would have thought that would be more along the Saudis way of doing things, bring him back, throw him in front of some religious court and then execute him, all official like.

trellheim

what was the film where they did that.... Bad Boys 2 wasnt it , the hard R cut ?

imme

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Could be Turkish propaganda about the dismemberment, but equally it could be true

There's a chance he could have been abducted and taken back on that plane, but there is literally no cover story his abducters could use, and next to zero political gain from it.. I would assume hes dead

Turkey is seeking preeminence in the region and on a word wide basis. The voice of the people of Islam. Their brand of Islam.

It is dubious about Saudi Arabia's louche-ness.

Trump says he's not happy. Nothing will happen there.
MBS in Saudi Arabia looks unstable.

Erdogan is typically petulant.

What will the outcome be, journalist murdered.
Little in terms of repurcussions.

Topgear on Dave

911 hijackers were Saudi and where got invaded?

Its mad stuff but it will all blow over.

Larbre34

Ballsy. Full marks for efficiency too. The Embassy is Saudi soil, they know they can't be touched anymore than they could if it were a government basement in Riyadh. Problem gone, it will be a story for a couple of days then that will go away too.

Khasshoggi won't have supposed in a million years that they would be so blatant. He paid for his naivety with his life. And thats whatll keep the Sauds in control for centuries more, doing whatever is necessary to protect their interests without hesitation.

A Dub in Glasgo

Yes, this will be swept under the carpet without a peep from some western governments as the Saudis throw their wealth around buying all the new fancy stuff to use against Yemeni civilians

Topgear on Dave

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Yes, this will be swept under the carpet without a peep from some western governments as the Saudis throw their wealth around buying all the new fancy stuff to use against Yemeni civilians

We do all love driving here and its coming into the winter too.

wexie

Hmmm... apparently the Turks are claiming they have both audio and video that proves he was killed in the consulate.

Will be interesting to see how this plays out if it turns out they do indeed have this evidence

Turkey 'has recording proving Saudi murder' - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-45838471

Amirani

Larbre34 wrote: »

Ballsy. Full marks for efficiency too. The Embassy is Saudi soil, they know they can't be touched anymore than they could if it were a government basement in Riyadh. Problem gone, it will be a story for a couple of days then that will go away too.

Not quite true, but effectively so.

The embassy remains the territory of Turkey (so not quite Saudi soil), but under the Vienna Convention, its law enforcement and officials cannot enter the embassy without being invited to by Saudi Arabia.

Cheerful Spring

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

911 hijackers were Saudi and where got invaded?

Its mad stuff but it will all blow over.

They were involved in 9/11 and it was covered up. Someday the truth will come out.

There plenty of American politicians who want people to know the truth.

Cheerful Spring

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Yes, this will be swept under the carpet without a peep from some western governments as the Saudis throw their wealth around buying all the new fancy stuff to use against Yemeni civilians

Trump is already saying he not stop arms shipments to Saudi Arabia over this. He even highlighted the money was more important to the United States. Trump is a fool and shill.

OneEightSeven

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Trump is already saying he not stop arms shipments to Saudi Arabia over this. He even highlighted the money was more important to the United States. Trump is a fool and shill.

Obama and Clinton would do the same thing, they just wouldn't be honest about it.

Harry Palmr

I'm surprised there isn't more talk about this. The body (alive or dead) of Khashoggi is somewhere and it's not going to be long before any stalling by the Saudi's will be seen as refusal to admit the logically bleenin' obvious. If the Turkish have some credible evidence they should release some of it. Indeed it's a pity that it is Turkey at all given their own internal "issues" combined with long standing antagonism with the House of Saud.

Dohnjoe

This is not disappearing from the front pages.. this man is going to do more harm to Saudi dead than alive, how on earth did they think it was a good idea to murder this journalist

wexie

Harry Palmr wrote: »

I'm surprised there isn't more talk about this. The body (alive or dead) of Khashoggi is somewhere

I would imagine that body is long gone never to be found

CrabRevolution

I'm amazed how brazen it is. In all likelihood the Saudis will suffer no consequences, but the fact they've barely tried to hide it or provide any sort of alternative story is shocking.

At least the Russians try the "it could have been anyone who shot /poisoned /hacked etc." excuse and leave it up to the Western States to prove it was Russia (which they'll deny anyway), but this guy verifiably walked into the Saudi consulate and never left, so his fate is 100% up to the Saudis.

Zorya

Dohnjoe wrote: »

This is not disappearing from the front pages.. this man is going to do more harm to Saudi dead than alive, how on earth did they think it was a good idea to murder this journalist

It will though, it'll soon enough disappear from the front pages. So much political skullduggery these days is just a matter of being brazen enough to tough out the public's short attention span and general apathy, and trusting in the quick spin cycle of the news. Rinse and repeat. There will be no reduction of weapon sales to Saudi Arabia from Britain and the US and Europe and so on and so forth, so that the Saudi planes can reign down destruction on starving civilians or schoolchildren in Yemen, or wherever else they please, really. Who cares - it's jobs, profit, business! Trump only does what his slicker forebears have done before him, no more no less. Same dirt, different day. Money above all else, always.

Havockk

CrabRevolution wrote: »

I'm amazed how brazen it is. In all likelihood the Saudis will suffer no consequences, but the fact they've barely tried to hide it or provide any sort of alternative story is shocking.

At least the Russians try the "it could have been anyone who shot /poisoned /hacked etc." excuse and leave it up to the Western States to prove it was Russia (which they'll deny anyway), but this guy verifiably walked into the Saudi consulate and never left, so his fate is 100% up to the Saudis.

It's the shocking nature of the crime too. Not the cold unfeeling killings the likes we've seen of late but the torture and cutting up is serial killer like. And now to watch their allies try and brush it under the rug, I expect nothing will come of this.

Cheerful Spring

Harry Palmr wrote: »

I'm surprised there isn't more talk about this. The body (alive or dead) of Khashoggi is somewhere and it's not going to be long before any stalling by the Saudi's will be seen as refusal to admit the logically bleenin' obvious. If the Turkish have some credible evidence they should release some of it. Indeed it's a pity that it is Turkey at all given their own internal "issues" combined with long standing antagonism with the House of Saud.

According to the Turkish authorities, he recorded his torture and eventual death using an Apple watch.

I don't think anyone wants to see him being killed and chopped up if that's what is recorded?


Turkish version.
Turkish officials have said they believe the 59-year-old was murdered there by a 15-member Saudi “assassination squad”.

“The moments when Khashoggi was interrogated, tortured and murdered were recorded in the Apple Watch’s memory,” Turkish newspaper Sabah reported.

Brae100

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

According to the Turkish authorities, he recorded his torture and eventual death using an Apple watch.

I don't think anyone wants to see him being killed and chopped up if that's what is recorded?


Turkish version.
Turkish officials have said they believe the 59-year-old was murdered there by a 15-member Saudi “assassination squad”.

“The moments when Khashoggi was interrogated, tortured and murdered were recorded in the Apple Watch’s memory,” Turkish newspaper Sabah reported.

Only the audio was recorded by his Apple watch. The Turks say they also have video evidence, although that will never be released as it would compromise their sources.

This is very easy for the Saudis to prove they had nothing to do with it. All they have to do is produce the CCTV footage of Khasshogi leaving the embassy.

Cheerful Spring

Brae100 wrote: »

Only the audio was recorded by his Apple watch. The Turks say they also have video evidence, although that will never be released as it would compromise their sources.

This is very easy for the Saudis to prove they had nothing to do with it. All they have to do is produce the CCTV footage of Khasshogi leaving the embassy.

US officials claim they have received video and audio of the killing. My best guess is the Turks bugged the embassy and Saudis did not even know. They had secret cameras hid in the building?

TomOnBoard

Brae100 wrote: »

Only the audio was recorded by his Apple watch. The Turks say they also have video evidence, although that will never be released as it would compromise their sources.

This is very easy for the Saudis to prove they had nothing to do with it. All they have to do is produce the CCTV footage of Khasshogi leaving the embassy.

The Turks have both Audio and Video of it all because they have the Consulate bugged. They're using the Apple Watch recording story as a way of getting the recording out without compromising sources and methods. The Apple Watch scenario makes no technological sense.

Cheerful Spring

TomOnBoard wrote: »

The Turks have both Audio and Video of it all because they have the Consulate bugged. They're using the Apple Watch recording story as a way of getting the recording out without compromising sources and methods. The Apple Watch scenario makes no technological sense.

Audio does because allegedly he had connected and synced it up with a mobile phone before entering the consulate? Of course, you could be right and it just a cover story? It's a big deal to be found out you secretly recording a foreign power embassy ongoings. Every embassy in Turkey will now be looking for secret hidden cameras!

TomOnBoard

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Audio does because allegedly he had connected and synced it up with a mobile phone before entering the consulate? Of course, you could be right and it just a cover story? It's a big deal to be found out you secretly recording a foreign power embassy ongoings. Every embassy in Turkey will now be looking for secret hidden cameras!

The tech community have said that there is no technical way for the watch to sync with the phone outside the Consulate due to distance.

Cheerful Spring

TomOnBoard wrote: »

The tech community have said that there is no technical way for the watch to sync with the phone outside the Consulate due to distance.

If the experts said this I have no reason to dispute that.

Saudis recently held the Lebanon prime minister against his will too. Saudis have a long history of been involved in shady stuff including 9/11.