The Frederick St protest and reaction

hatrickpatrick · 12-09-2018 8:31am

weldoninhio wrote: »

Ah, we have it. Gadzooks, and here was me thinking the country is being run at a deficit and still borrowing to keep afloat

My local council spent around €44m on a project which nobody asked for and which locals were calling for the demolition of before it was even completed, and that's just one of plenty of examples of money which should be used for housing being wasted on discretionary spending.

Fintan O'Toole summed this up better than I can at this hour of the morning

This is not a lack of funding but a fundamental ideology which says that the free market is a sacred cow and that public housing shouldn't be a thing, that housing is not a right, and that neoliberalism will solve every problem even though it isn't.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/fintan-o-toole-opposition-to-social-housing-is-matter-of-ideology-not-economics-1.2397695

I don't want to just quote a snippet of this article because the whole thing needs to be read in one go (it's quite short) but essentially, he outlines the ludicrosity of suggesting that early post-independence Ireland could afford to build social housing and modern Ireland can't. The issue isn't "can't", but "won't". This is directly tied to the rise of "third way" leftism from the era of Reagan and Thatcher to the present day - Ireland followed its neighbours on both sides into the abyss and has yet to emerge from it.

Sleeper12 · 12-09-2018 8:46am

guylikeme wrote:

Anyways..without debating who is right or wrong on this, id like to hear why Gardai wore Balacalavas. Seems a little overdone.

All I know is that they wear them for protection. Everyone loves videoing these things and Gardai faces end up on social media. During the water meter protests some Gardai families were threatened.

It's a shame that it's come to this. Intimating as it is, I don't have a problem with them protecting their identity from social media.

Because phones & videos can be a deliberate way to intimate someone I wonder will we see laws eventually where it will be illegal to upload videos of Gardai to social media?

DChancer · 12-09-2018 8:50am

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Fintan O'Toole summed this up better than I can at this hour of the morning This is not a lack of funding but a fundamental ideology which says that the free market is a sacred cow and that public housing shouldn't be a thing, that housing is not a right, and that neoliberalism will solve every problem even though it isn't.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/fintan-o-toole-opposition-to-social-housing-is-matter-of-ideology-not-economics-1.2397695

I don't want to just quote a snippet of this article because the whole thing needs to be read in one go (it's quite short) but essentially, he outlines the ludicrosity of suggesting that early post-independence Ireland could afford to build social housing and modern Ireland can't. The issue isn't "can't", but "won't". This is directly tied to the rise of "third way" leftism from the era of Reagan and Thatcher to the present day - Ireland followed its neighbours on both sides into the abyss and has yet to emerge from it.

A free forever home is not a right, nobody has the right to demand that "someone else pay for all my stuff"!

Beechwoodspark · 12-09-2018 9:12am

Probably They wore balaclavas as the social justice warriors would’ve Gone to town on them if they had been able to ID them

Wheeliebin30 · 12-09-2018 9:14am

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

My local council spent around €44m on a project which nobody asked for and which locals were calling for the demolition of before it was even completed, and that's just one of plenty of examples of money which should be used for housing being wasted on discretionary spending.

Fintan O'Toole summed this up better than I can at this hour of the morning This is not a lack of funding but a fundamental ideology which says that the free market is a sacred cow and that public housing shouldn't be a thing, that housing is not a right, and that neoliberalism will solve every problem even though it isn't.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/fintan-o-toole-opposition-to-social-housing-is-matter-of-ideology-not-economics-1.2397695

I don't want to just quote a snippet of this article because the whole thing needs to be read in one go (it's quite short) but essentially, he outlines the ludicrosity of suggesting that early post-independence Ireland could afford to build social housing and modern Ireland can't. The issue isn't "can't", but "won't". This is directly tied to the rise of "third way" leftism from the era of Reagan and Thatcher to the present day - Ireland followed its neighbours on both sides into the abyss and has yet to emerge from it.

Who has the most seats on Dublin City Council?

Sinn Fein.

By the way there is already 4,000 social houses built this year, how is it true the government don’t build social houses anymore?

Have you a costing for building houses for everyone who wants one?

I reckon it’s 100,s of billions of euro.

We don’t have that money it’s as simple as that.

Wheeliebin30 · 12-09-2018 9:18am

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

We already have it. I've explained this numerous times in the other threads on this protest. How do you think we afforded it in the feckin' 1930s when Ireland was broke as f*ck?

Because it was 20 times cheaper to build back then.

mirwillbeback · 12-09-2018 9:18am

riffmongous wrote: »

Look like a bunch of rent-a-thugs, which I guess they probably were

The sames lads that tried to make the Regency Hotel get a make over by getting blood on the carpet.

weldoninhio · 12-09-2018 9:19am

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Who has the most seats on Dublin City Council?

Sinn Fein.

By the way there is already 4,000 social houses built this year, how is it true the government don’t build social houses anymore?

Have you a costing for building houses for everyone who wants one?

I reckon it’s 100,s of billions of euro.

We don’t have that money it’s as simple as that.

If we call it, say E200,000 per unit to build and there are 10,000 homeless as the number spoofers use. It would only cost E2,000,000,000. Pocket change, sure they spent E44m on something else.

Wheeliebin30 · 12-09-2018 9:20am

_Puma_ wrote: »

According to a picture on twitter the clapped out van had a northern reg before Gardai told them to take them off. New RUC commissioner must have got some of his loyalist mates down.

The extendable batons some of the Gardai are holding aren't liscenced for the Gardai either.

Hilarious people think the new Garda Commissioner personally hired loyalists to come down to throw a few wasters out of a building.

Jesus is that the mentality of these mobs??

Brainwashed.

weldoninhio · 12-09-2018 9:21am

riffmongous wrote: »

Look like a bunch of rent-a-thugs, which I guess they probably were

Rent-a-thug?? I haven't heard any reports of anything thuggish like assaults etc from the crustys. Their main whinge seems to be the attire of the gentlemen asked to secure the building.

Wheeliebin30 · 12-09-2018 9:22am

weldoninhio wrote: »

If we call it, say E200,000 per unit to build and there are 10,000 homeless as the number spoofers use. It would only cost E2,000,000,000. Pocket change, sure they spent E44m on something else.

Yeah and what about the extra 10,000 who will rock up the next day suddenly “homeless” to get a free house.

Can we all just avail of a free house?

Don’t be so naive if you think we build 10,000 houses that’s the last we hear from the want everything for nothing brigade.

weldoninhio · 12-09-2018 9:24am

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Yeah and what about the extra 10,000 who will rock up the next day suddenly “homeless” to get a free house.

Can we all just avail of a free house?

Don’t be so naive if you think we build 10,000 houses that’s the last we hear from the want everything for nothing brigade.

I know, next it will be Sky and flat screen tvs that they need or it will be a breach of their hoooooman rights.

seamus · 12-09-2018 9:25am

weldoninhio wrote: »

Rent-a-thug?? I haven't heard any reports of anything thuggish like assaults etc from the crustys. Their main whinge seems to be the attire of the gentlemen asked to secure the building.

"With masks on, we couldn't photograph them and put their faces all over social media! This is a disgrace!"

The fncking whinging going on about this on social media today. That Gardai doing their duty might be afforded a bit of personal anonymity for their own protection.

seamus · 12-09-2018 9:28am

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

We already have it. I've explained this numerous times in the other threads on this protest. How do you think we afforded it in the feckin' 1930s when Ireland was broke as f*ck?

How much do you think it costs to throw up a box with 3 rooms, brick walls, no insulation, electricity, toilets or running water? **** all.

You would rather live on the street than accept something built to 1930s standards.

Hurrache · 12-09-2018 9:39am

_Puma_ wrote: »

According to a picture on twitter the clapped out van had a northern reg before Gardai told them to take them off. New RUC commissioner must have got some of his loyalist mates down.

The extendable batons some of the Gardai are holding aren't liscenced for the Gardai either.

Sounds like some of the nonsense I was reading from the likes of the Solidarity twitter account last night.

"hey, look over here at these things that may or may not be against the law, we don't really know because we're throwing all sorts of **** hoping some will stick. We're doing this because we don't want you to look over there, yes there, the bit were proper procedures and laws were applied and granted by the court of our land, we don't believe in those laws though because it doesn't suit our narrative."

The ****ing eejits all of a sudden become experts in the law then when they feel they're being 'terrorised'.

suicide_circus · 12-09-2018 9:40am

Paul Murphy's constituency office in Tallaght looked empty when I walked past it last week. Not a single homeless family in there from what I could see

I wonder how the police force would behave in whatever irish communist paradise Paul would rule over if he came to power? Stasi informants in every house and a KGB re education camp in the Phoenix park no doubt

12-09-2018 9:49am

weldoninhio wrote: »

And where does the money come from to do this?? Our magic money tree??

We already have it, according to a Councillor interviewed on the radio a few days ago. It’s very wisely being used to buy or rent properties. Not BUILD. I kid you not.

LuckyLloyd · 12-09-2018 9:52am

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Don't want to answer the question?

I'll answer it for you.

It is none of your business what I do in relation to the ownership of property I would own anymore than it's my business to interfere with your rights of ownership.

That's the market. Suck it up.

Property rights are not unlimited and absolute, there's a clause in the constitution limiting such rights for the public good. The point of argument is that - in the midst of an extreme housing crisis - whether those rights should be limited via vacancy tariffs; limitations on short term letting, etc.

The 'but it's my property what business of yours god bless the unquestioned market' shtick is quite juvenile, though I understand that it sounds good to people. There's a very complex issue developing that has multiple causes. The issue may impact on our continued economic and social development as a nation - and certainly that of our urban areas. We might have to limit the profit potential of asset speculators as one of the potential fixes. That's the constitution. Suck it up.

I don't condone the methods of these protesters, but they are shining a direct light on an issue that we have to ask questions around.

Hurrache · 12-09-2018 9:57am

Take Frederick House for example. If that was renovated to current standards and rented out, how many people do you think would afford to rent or buy such a place? It's not going to do anything for those on housing lists.

suicide_circus · 12-09-2018 9:59am

I do agree that there is an issue around the hoarding of empty property and land during a housomg crisis but i also agree that if people ignore court orders they should get a boot up the hole.

weldoninhio · 12-09-2018 10:02am

Deleted User wrote: »

We already have it, according to a Councillor interviewed on the radio a few days ago. It’s very wisely being used to buy or rent properties. Not BUILD. I kid you not.

We have E2,000,000,000 sitting around??? Someone tell the Dept of Finance.

Colonel Claptrap · 12-09-2018 10:04am

weldoninhio wrote: »

Their main whinge seems to be the attire of the gentlemen asked to secure the building.

Snobs!

Thatnastyboy · 12-09-2018 10:06am

Hurrache wrote: »

Take Frederick House for example. If that was renovated to current standards and rented out, how many people do you think would afford to rent or buy such a place? It's not going to do anything for those on housing lists.

'Normal' folk on 'normal' wages can't afford to buy or rent a central property in any major city in the world though, the way people are going on you'd swear it was an Irish only problem. It's not, not even close. it is very much the way of the western world - not saying it's 'right' or 'wrong' but it's definitely how it is in many many other places.

Those on housing lists shouldn't really be housed in a 2k/month apartment etc. in the city centre though. Those are for people of large means who can afford it. Equality can't be extended to bank accounts, or else it's just heading towards communism. I am not entirely sure what this squatting exercise wants to achieve beyond the raising of awareness and division of people.

LuckyLloyd · 12-09-2018 10:07am

Hurrache wrote: »

Take Frederick House for example. If that was renovated to current standards and rented out, how many people do you think would afford to rent or buy such a place? It's not going to do anything for those on housing lists.

Supply is squeezed at all ends of the market. Two very different properties at different levels of the market have been occupied over the last couple of months, highlighting the fact that vacancy is being pursued as an asset speculation strategy by owners of different property types. A vacancy tariff would be applied across the market, easing supply issues at all levels.

Boom_Bap · 12-09-2018 10:09am

They are not balaclava's, they are special masks that have nasal filters in them so that they don't have to deal with the reek of unwashed squatting hippy during the removal.

:pac::pac:

Wheeliebin30 · 12-09-2018 10:12am

This moron eoin in 98fm giving out about the security staff breaking the law as they had no id totally ignoring the fact he was breaking the law himself.

Moron.

Hurrache · 12-09-2018 10:13am

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Supply is squeezed at all ends of the market. Two very different properties at different levels of the market have been occupied over the last couple of months, highlighting the fact that vacancy is being pursued as an asset speculation strategy by owners of different property types. A vacancy tariff would be applied across the market, easing supply issues at all levels.

I understand the logic, but that particular premises will have no affect. It's more likely to become a commercial premises, or a high end short term let for corporations.
They need to get to the suburbs and do it with council houses.

But you know what the problem then will be? Ah here, I'm not moving out there, sure that's miles away from where I grew up and where my parents are now.

suicide_circus · 12-09-2018 10:14am

I wonder what the correlation is between those who have a problem with gardai wearing balaclavas and those who support people who wear the burqa......

12-09-2018 10:16am

weldoninhio wrote: »

We have E2,000,000,000 sitting around??? Someone tell the Dept of Finance.

I’m not sure what figure was mentioned, nor can I remember who was being interviewed. Possibly on Sean O’Rourke Monday. I think he was a from Dun Laoghaire Rathdown.

It was Friday.

“Councils and Housing
Don't blame us say councillors as Government threatens to take over housing powers. Ossian Smyth, Green Party councillor for Dun Laoghaire/Rathdown, Solidarity councillor for Dublin Fingal Matt Waine, and Damien English, Minister of State in the Department of Housing, Planning and Local Government discussed this with Sean O'Rourke this morning” https://www.rte.ie/radio1/today-with-sean-o-rourke/programmes/2018/0907/992217-today-with-sean-orourke-friday-7-september-2018/?clipid=102920373#102920373

Cabaal · 12-09-2018 10:18am

In all honesty I don't blame the gardai for covering their faces, With media attention if these people could easily track down where these gardai live and start protesting outside of their homes.

would you want your family harrassed because you were upholding the law?

The Frederick St protest and reaction

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