NFL Protest Discussion

ELM327 · 05-09-2018 11:29AM

Jolly Red Giant wrote: »

read the article - it says that 35% of Americans believe in evolution - that leaves 65% who don't (if my maths are correct)

"31% of the US public believed that humans had existed in their present form since the beginning, with a further 24% stating that humans had evolved under the guiding hand of a supreme being.....The proportion of the public who believed evolution had happened through natural processes, as described by Charles Darwin more than 150 years ago, was only slightly greater than a third at 35%"

I suppose it's twisting the numbers somewhat to make a determination that a majority do not believe in evolution but those who "believe" in evolution is the sum of 24% and 35%, a remarkably low 59%. With a 24 percentage point subset of that, believing that evolution was influenced/part of god's plan.

What subset do you want, those who are atheist and believe in evolution, or anyone who accepts evolution at all, because the numbers are 35% and 59% respectively. The first supports your claim (remarkably - I was not expecting that) and the second does not.

Jolly Red Giant · 05-09-2018 12:12PM

ELM327 wrote: »

"31% of the US public believed that humans had existed in their present form since the beginning, with a further 24% stating that humans had evolved under the guiding hand of a supreme being.....The proportion of the public who believed evolution had happened through natural processes, as described by Charles Darwin more than 150 years ago, was only slightly greater than a third at 35%"

I suppose it's twisting the numbers somewhat to make a determination that a majority do not believe in evolution but those who "believe" in evolution is the sum of 24% and 35%, a remarkably low 59%. With a 24 percentage point subset of that, believing that evolution was influenced/part of god's plan.

What subset do you want, those who are atheist and believe in evolution, or anyone who accepts evolution at all, because the numbers are 35% and 59% respectively. The first supports your claim (remarkably - I was not expecting that) and the second does not.

Whatever way you cut it - and there are countless studies to show this - the people who are kicking up a stink about the NFL protests are the same people who reject evolution.

If you think about it then it makes sense - they believe that white people are superior (because God says so) and they get uppity when black athletes question their world view.

raze_them_all_ · 05-09-2018 01:00PM

The people that burn all the Nike stuff realise they already gave Nike the money right!?

ELM327 · 05-09-2018 02:00PM

raze_them_all_ wrote: »

The people that burn all the Nike stuff realise they already gave Nike the money right!?

Again, it's symbolic of "no future purchases"

Billy86 · 05-09-2018 02:04PM

I remember similar happening with Fox news watchers destroying their keurig coffee machines but have not heard of any troubles for the company since.

Another was penzeys spices, who lost 3% of their offline customers. Their ovwrall businrss outloom improved dramatically however as online sales went up by 60%.

I think Nike will be just fine.

ELM327 · 05-09-2018 02:07PM

Billy86 wrote: »

I remember similar happening with Fox news watchers destroying their keurig coffee machines but have not heard of any troubles for the company since.

Another was penzeys spices, who lost 3% of their offline customers. Their ovwrall businrss outloom improved dramatically however as online sales went up by 60%.

I think Nike will be just fine.

Never heard of those other companies.
I share your prognosis regarding Nike. Too big a company to be impacted by a small percentage drop which is temporary most likely.

Billy86 · 05-09-2018 02:30PM

ELM327 wrote: »

Never heard of those other companies.
I share your prognosis regarding Nike. Too big a company to be impacted by a small percentage drop which is temporary most likely.

That's pretty much it, small hit in certain US markets in some places, possibly a bigger boost to offset it. Similar happened when Disney's a huge controversy over a Star Wars video game basically extorting money and promoting gambling to kids, and wound up costing Disney points off their stock. Within a few weeks the stocks had recovered, with some savvier stock folk (not me!) calling it one of the easiest, most predictable gains they had ever seen.

Keurig are more North American as best I know (tin of the instant sh*te does me grand) but are fecking massive over there - they got sold for $14bn in 2016, and then again last month for $18.4bn according to their Wiki page.

Penzey's wouldn't be at all as big, but apparently have 67 shops across the US as well as online - so big enough to be able to get a bit of a gauge off of (compared to say, somewhere with a half dozen stores in LA or Alabama - neither of which would give an accurate idea of the US as a whole).

The good PR Nike will get off this globally will more than offset the few lost sales in the short term, but medium/long term consumers are a fickle lot and those lost sales front anti-protest types will likely begin to slowly return.

Jolly Red Giant · 05-09-2018 02:43PM

Statement issued by the NFL on Tuesday

"The National Football League believes in dialogue, understanding and unity. We embrace the role and responsibility of everyone involved with this game to promote meaningful, positive change in our communities," the statement read.

"The social justice issues that Colin and other professional athletes have raised deserve our attention and action."

The NFL head honchos are realising that the attacks on players protesting is doing more damage than anything to their 'brand' - particularly given how unpopular Trump is.

Jolly Red Giant · 05-09-2018 02:55PM

I particularly like the response of the rednecks to the Nike ad - claiming that Nike should have used Pat Tillman instead

And in the process ignoring the fact that once Pat Tillman actually got to Afghanistan he turned against the 'war' and was highly critical of Bush and the hawks in government - including making contact with Noam Chomsky.

Indeed - it has been speculated that he was murdered by elements of the American military because they knew of his intention to make his anti-war views known when he returned to America. Tillman was killed by three bullets from and M16 to the head. Attempts were made to burn Tilllman's body by US troops (to hide evidence) and all of Tillmann's diaries, reputed to contain his criticisms of the war, were destroyed.

Pat Tillman would have been kneeling beside Clin Kaepernick and others protesting if he hadn't been killed by 'friendly fire' in Afghanistan.

nasty_crash · 05-09-2018 03:16PM

does anyone else feel that players sitting in the dressing room is more disrespectful of the anthem than kneeling? Like how does that make sense?

Guaranteed that it will be player watch this weekend - 2 players from this team, 6 players from that team.... I dont care.... I just want football to be back and talking about players that under-performed or excelled!

raze_them_all_ · 05-09-2018 03:29PM

ELM327 wrote: »

Again, it's symbolic of "no future purchases"

These same clowns are the same as LeBron can die when he went to the heat and were slabbering all over his cock when he came back to the land. Yank sports fans are clowns

eagle eye · 05-09-2018 03:43PM

Jolly Red Giant wrote:

Pat Tillman would have been kneeling beside Clin Kaepernick and others protesting if he hadn't been killed by 'friendly fire' in Afghanistan.

Well you don't know that. Pat Tillman might have been unhappy with what was going on but he might have been against kneeling during the national anthem like a lot of Americans.

Anyways I'm out of this thread, it's too much like social media for me.

ELM327 · 05-09-2018 03:45PM

raze_them_all_ wrote: »

These same clowns are the same as LeBron can die when he went to the heat and were slabbering all over his cock when he came back to the land. Yank sports fans are clowns

That's a disgusting comment.

eagle eye wrote: »

Well you don't know that. Pat Tillman might have been unhappy with what was going on but he might have been against kneeling during the national anthem like a lot of Americans.

Anyways I'm out of this thread, it's too much like social media for me.

Yeah it's this usual thing where the liberals feel free to appropriate feelings/stances on those that are dead because they can't respond.

Pat Tillman was in the military and wouldn't have shown disrespect to the military, the flag, or the anthem.

WinnyThePoo · 05-09-2018 03:47PM

eagle eye wrote: »

Jolly Red Giant wrote:

Pat Tillman would have been kneeling beside Clin Kaepernick and others protesting if he hadn't been killed by 'friendly fire' in Afghanistan.

Well you don't know that. Pat Tillman might have been unhappy with what was going on but he might have been against kneeling during the national anthem like a lot of Americans.

Anyways I'm out of this thread, it's too much like social media for me.

Boards is social media.

Jolly Red Giant · 05-09-2018 04:27PM

eagle eye wrote: »

Well you don't know that. Pat Tillman might have been unhappy with what was going on but he might have been against kneeling during the national anthem like a lot of Americans.

Anyways I'm out of this thread, it's too much like social media for me.

A biographer of Tillman has stated 'he would be the first to kneel' - and Pat Tillman's wife went out of her way to have a go at the people invoking Tillman's name (and death) to attack Kaepernick.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/09/04/he-would-be-first-kneel-pat-tillman-exploited-attack-kaepernick-biographer-says/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.93d1bc93a2f7

Manic Moran · 05-09-2018 05:28PM

The other one going around is Glen Coffee. Also a draft pick who played for the 49ers, he, too, joined the military after giving up his NFL career. Unlike Tillman, he did not die, and has been reinstated by the NFL last year as a free agent after finishing his time in the Army, currently coaches for Alabama. If he has stated a position on kneeling, I have not heard it, but he is apparently not first in line.

Jolly Red Giant · 05-09-2018 06:34PM

Manic Moran wrote: »

The other one going around is Glen Coffee. Also a draft pick who played for the 49ers, he, too, joined the military after giving up his NFL career. Unlike Tillman, he did not die, and has been reinstated by the NFL last year as a free agent after finishing his time in the Army, currently coaches for Alabama. If he has stated a position on kneeling, I have not heard it, but he is apparently not first in line.

Coffee found Jesus and Jesus told him to do it.

raze_them_all_ · 05-09-2018 07:23PM

ELM327 wrote: »

That's a disgusting comment.

Yeah it's this usual thing where the liberals feel free to appropriate feelings/stances on those that are dead because they can't respond.

Pat Tillman was in the military and wouldn't have shown disrespect to the military, the flag, or the anthem.

We'll nevber know, the precious military killed him and tried to cover it up

05-09-2018 08:06PM

ELM327 wrote: »

That's a disgusting comment.

Yeah it's this usual thing where the liberals feel free to appropriate feelings/stances on those that are dead because they can't respond.

Pat Tillman was in the military and wouldn't have shown disrespect to the military, the flag, or the anthem.

Conflicts like WW2 were fought about the right to respect the difference of opinion? Yes or no?

http://time.com/4956246/war-veteran-kneel-nfl-players/

helimachoptor · 05-09-2018 08:49PM

Guys, lease keep it civil.

We would prefer not to be banning people in game week 1

Podge_irl · 06-09-2018 12:15AM

eagle eye wrote: »

Anyways I'm out of this thread, it's too much like social media for me.

Not the first time you've claimed this and yet here you are again.

07-09-2018 04:54PM

Something that I had forgotten until it popped up on social media.

When the very white Tim Tebow took a knee for his religion and to protest abortion in 2012, where was the outcry?

j8wk2feszrnpao · 07-09-2018 05:07PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Something that I had forgotten until it popped up on social media.

When the very white Tim Tebow took a knee for his religion and to protest abortion in 2012, where was the outcry?

Wasn't that shown to be false and just a attempt by some to muddy the water for their cause? I thought he came out and denied it himself.

07-09-2018 05:42PM

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Wasn't that shown to be false and just a attempt by some to muddy the water for their cause? I thought he came out and denied it himself.

Could well be, it's a social media thing.

Snopes says he took a knee but not during the anthem. I may have done poor Tim a disservice...

Jolly Red Giant · 07-09-2018 05:58PM

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Wasn't that shown to be false and just a attempt by some to muddy the water for their cause? I thought he came out and denied it himself.

Tebow was constantly kneeling down and praying during games - this was the 3rd qtr in the play-off game against the Steelers

This was a week later before the play-off game against the Pats

636640766870522997-tebow0608.JPG?width=1080&quality=50

Tebow claims he never knelt during the anthem - he probably didn't - but I am sure that people are scouring through every game he ever played trying to find out if he did (and good luck to them - I wouldn't bother).

The difference between Tebow and Kaepernick - is that Tebow was constantly invoking religion - it was 'in your face' type stuff. Kaepernick's protest was never of the same character - he was not attempting to be an evangelist - his first protest was sitting in the background during a pre-season game. In fact - he wasn't the only player to sit that day - apparently the Seahawks Jeremy Lane sat beside him. Unlike Kaepernick - Lane (who also engaged in further protests) continued to play for the Seahawks - the Texans even traded for him in 2017 only for the trade to be void because Lane was injured.

It is also worth nothing that many players and coaching staff on the sidelines constantly do things other than stand for the anthem - as seen from this photo. But then again, the issue isn't that you fail to stand and 'respect' - its that you are willing to protest against injustice.

Foxtrol · 07-09-2018 06:51PM

Ford came out supporting the rights of players to protest how the see fit. Look forward to some videos of hillbillies setting their pickup trucks on fire

Billy86 · 07-09-2018 09:28PM

To be fair, the Tebow anthem protest of abortions story is false - https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/tim-tebow-kneel-anthem

Shame he didn't make it in a way, the Jesus-offs between him and Russell Wilson would be absolutely epic.

Billy86 · 11-09-2018 01:09AM

Nike sales up 31% since taking on Kaepernick. Their stock is also right back where it was

https://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/what-boycott-nike-sales-are-31-percent-kaepernick-campaign-n908251

And I absolutely guarantee some of those were from people who tore up or burned their stuff and then almost immediately went out to buy more. :pac:

j8wk2feszrnpao · 11-09-2018 07:18AM

Billy86 wrote: »

Nike sales up 31% since taking on Kaepernick. Their stock is also right back where it was

https://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/what-boycott-nike-sales-are-31-percent-kaepernick-campaign-n908251

And I absolutely guarantee some of those were from people who tore up or burned their stuff and then almost immediately went out to buy more. :pac:

Wasn't there a report that he's been with them since ~2012?
I know it's Labor Day weekend sales, but Nike knew it wasn't going to hurt them.
Just as there are fools who'll burn stuff, there are fools that buy stuff at $175 https://kaepernick7.com/collections/...roducts/jersey

Billy86 · 11-09-2018 09:39AM

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Wasn't there a report that he's been with them since ~2012?
I know it's Labor Day weekend sales, but Nike knew it wasn't going to hurt them.
Just as there are fools who'll burn stuff, there are fools that buy stuff at $175 https://kaepernick7.com/collections/...roducts/jersey

Not that I'm aware of - the NFL has been with Nike since 2012 but no sign of Kaepernick from a Google search. And even if he were, nobody has been aware of it until a week or two back with said ad which is what the article was highlighting: Nike sales jumped by 31 percent after debuting quarterback-turned-activist Colin Kaepernick as a new company spokesman — and market observers say the president’s public displays of anger may have backfired by drawing more attention to Nike.

Labor Day weekend also does not account for a 31% increase in sales, especially for a product that apparently is being boycotted. Adidas stock went down a similar level to Nike's at the same time, but has not recovered. This is similar to when the same crowd smashed up the Keurig coffee machines only to then have the guy they were smashing them on behalf of go and buy them hundreds of new ones. End result: Keurig made a nice little bit of change and had a sales boost directly thanks to the same people who smashed theirs up as an act of (wait for it...) protest.

(wouldn't work as a link, so embedded)
https://twitter.com/seanhannity/status/944051859479777280

I also think the $175 jersey thing is a big missed opportunity on his part and a dumb price point. If he sold them at the same price as regular NFL jerseys (which seems to be about $80-100) he could have really got one over on the NFL by having hundreds of those in the stands every week. So a missed opportunity there, but a huge win for Nike and Kaepernick at the expense of the NFL and in no small part due to Donald Trump's attempts to influence things in the other direction.

NFL Protest Discussion

Comments