Should we protest against the pope's visit?

RustyNut · 21-08-2018 02:39PM

Leroy42 wrote: »

Maybe tell us what you would like them to do. Facetime the rape maybe?

Pray to the lord for forgiveness for having led the poor priest to temptation. The poor priests.

Odhinn · 21-08-2018 02:52PM

Nixonbot wrote: »

Lots of victim-blaming going on here I see.

There's nearly always a caveat added by their apologists and cronies. They were 'leading him on', they were the 'wrong sort' to begin with, heard they came from an 'immoral home'.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 21-08-2018 02:53PM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

Nice bike.

Cheers.. Here's a better photo of it without that awful looking cross and stage in the back ground

I guess if I'm asked nicely I could give the Catholic Grand Wizard a lift on the back when he's finished casting his spells on the sheeple.

batgoat · 21-08-2018 02:53PM

realitykeeper wrote: »

And that`s another thing, if I were a victim of rape or whatever, I would go tell the Gardaí. None of these allegations ring true and the utter prejudice displayed against the clergy by all levels of society reinforce the perception that this is a witch hunt.

realitykeeper wrote: »

The fact that these unproven allegations are described as "credible" is an example of why so much mainstream news is describe as "fake" these days. I can parse the truth from the media reports, which is why I quoted the article. A lot of people just believe everything they read without taking account of the editorial biases, inaccuracies, inconsistencies etc

Are you discounting the decades of abuse that occurred here that rarely ended up near the Gardaí? You're either very oblivious to history or deluded.

4068ac1elhodqr · 21-08-2018 02:58PM

Vinculus wrote: »

Everybody's getting all shouty and angry about this Pope thing. Maybe we need something to distract you all before it all gets out of hand. Maybe something like an epidemic of some type.

Oh wait!!

The express.co.uk haven't made one of their usual photo montage of an epidemic as of yet (just war games and a robot takeover), so can assume were all safe from Ebola for the time being.

A plague of locusts mightn't be far though, off seeing as the devil himself has been walking the earth, stealing young souls, dressed mainly in prada and/or black.

Hotblack Desiato · 21-08-2018 03:10PM

realitykeeper wrote: »

And that`s another thing, if I were a victim of rape or whatever, I would go tell the GardaNone of these allegations ring true and the utter prejudice displayed against the clergy by all levels of society reinforce the perception that this is a witch hunt.

30 or 40 years ago if a victim went to the Gardai they wouldn't have been believed, because the priests were regarded as pillars of the community who literally could do no wrong. How wrong we were, in all too many cases.

But while thankfully Irish society has finally moved on from this mentality of bowing and scraping and unwarranted deference, I see you are still stuck in the defer to clericalism at all costs mindset. "None of these allegations ring true" Really? So they are all lying? There were NO priest abusers? Is that really what you're claiming? Because that is a completely proven false, and utterly bizarre claim.

Why are you so afraid to face up to the truth about your church? Why is your church so afraid to face up to the truth about itself? Do you think it can just go on as it has been?

Skylinehead · 21-08-2018 03:15PM

Calvin Puny Marmoset wrote: »

Cheers.. Here's a better photo of it without that awful looking cross and stage in the back ground

I guess if I'm asked nicely I could give the Catholic High Wizard a lift on the back when he's finished casting his spells on the sheeple.

Luckily there's no doggers in the background there :pac:

tylercheribini · 21-08-2018 03:17PM

The whole "there are paedophiles in every profession" argument is such a non runner, teachers have the same if arguably not more opportunities to abuse children but yet instances of this are nowhere near that of the Catholic church, of which we have no doubt only scratched the surface of their crimes. The reason for this is not another tired old argument "that they can marry", its that teachers never possessed the levels of unfettered power and zero accountability that the clergy did in this country. "Absolute power, corrupts absolutely." If anything existing paedophiles were drawn to this "vocation" for exactly such reasons. Priests didnt become paedophiles, paedophiles became priests. If the church forbids sexual relations with a woman (and man) then where does it state kids are open season? If a priest chooses to break his vows then at least do so with a consenting adult like many also did.

Vinculus · 21-08-2018 03:27PM

Omar Orange Ignoramus wrote: »

The express.co.uk haven't made one of their usual photo montage of an epidemic as of yet (just war games and a robot takeover), so can assume were all safe from Ebola for the time being.

A plague of locusts mightn't be far though, off seeing as the devil himself has been walking the earth, stealing young souls, dressed mainly in prada and/or black.

Maybe an outbreak of measles might be all the state backed media needs to be able to change the headlines

Seth Brundle · 21-08-2018 03:29PM

tylercheribini wrote: »

If a priest chooses to break his vows then at least do so with a consenting adult like many also did.

Those who went with a consenting adults were treated worse than those who raped children. Compare the church's reaction to Casey and to Brendan Smyth for example.

Vinculus · 21-08-2018 03:30PM

Omar Orange Ignoramus wrote: »

The express.co.uk haven't made one of their usual photo montage of an epidemic as of yet (just war games and a robot takeover), so can assume were all safe from Ebola for the time being.

A plague of locusts mightn't be far though, off seeing as the devil himself has been walking the earth, stealing young souls, dressed mainly in prada and/or black.

Maybe an outbreak of measles might be all the state backed media needs to be able to change the headlines

Muahahaha · 21-08-2018 03:55PM

https://twitter.com/namawinelake/status/1031870543048454144

Water John · 21-08-2018 04:14PM

That list is the REALITY!! Sadly its only the small minority that have been convicted.

Odhinn · 21-08-2018 04:18PM

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Those who went with a consenting adults were treated worse than those who raped children. Compare the church's reaction to Casey and to Brendan Smyth for example.

It gives the lie to the PR line about it being 'different times' and 'we didn't understand'. They had the proverbial mickey fit at the mere suggestion of sex outside marriage between adults being acceptable.

Water John · 21-08-2018 05:16PM

One cleric was worried that women might be getting pleasure from wearing tampons. Told this by the doctor he consulted.

I see Ronan Mullen is out again. Saying we shouldn't be, disrespectful of the Pope's visit. Where does that guy really get off?

ohnonotgmail · 21-08-2018 05:19PM

Water John wrote: »

One cleric was worried that women might be getting pleasure from wearing tampons. Told this by the doctor he consulted.

I see Ronan Mullen is out again. Saying we shouldn't be, disrespectful of the Pope's visit. Where does that guy really get off?

Hopefully nowhere near me.

Muahahaha · 21-08-2018 05:24PM

Water John wrote: »

I see Ronan Mullen is out again. Saying we shouldn't be, disrespectful of the Pope's visit. Where does that guy really get off?

The other day McAleese alluded to people within the Church living double lives

Speaking at the launch of a new study challenging the Catholic Church’s stance on homosexuality, the former president said she was also “terrified” by gay priests and nuns who taught children that homosexuality was wrong.

She said: “A phenomenon that I have found very commonly are what I call the ‘fake hetero homophobes’ within the clergy, who live double lives as gay men and women, but who [wear a veil] that is really stridently homophobic.

The first person I thought of was Ronan Mullen.

Leroy42 · 21-08-2018 05:46PM

This bit is quite extraordinary in the Popes letter (the letter is pretty much self surviving rubbish to be honest).

To do so, prayer and penance will help. I invite the entire holy faithful People of God to a penitential exercise of prayer and fasting, following the Lord’s command.[1] This can awaken our conscience and arouse our solidarity and commitment to a culture of care that says “never again” to every form of abuse.

So he wants each and every catholic to pay a price to try to atone for the sins of the few. Yet we have many on here claiming that such scandals cannot taint the whole church. Suddenly, it seems the secretive and protectionist church needs the help of everyone to sort this out!

Have a read of the letter, it is actually staggering tone deaf. Lots of we failed to live up to standards, its on each of to strive for the lords ways.

“If one member suffers, all suffer together with it”, said Saint Paul

Yeah right. The bishop in the US seems to be having an awful time the last 20 years!

Discodog · 21-08-2018 05:48PM

Any child reporting to the Guards would be in even worse trouble. The Guards will always believe the church & wouldn't believe that, so called men of god could do such despicable things.

A woman was on the radio today talking about how, at the age of 11, her teacher (a brother) used to put them over his knee & pulled down their knickers before spanking them.

Discodog · 21-08-2018 05:50PM

Leroy42 wrote: »

This bit is quite extraordinary in the Popes letter (the letter is pretty much self surviving rubbish to be honest).

So he wants each and every catholic to pay a price to try to atone for the sins of the few. Yet we have many on here claiming that such scandals cannot taint the whole church. Suddenly, it seems the secretive and protectionist church needs the help of everyone to sort this out!

Have a read of the letter, it is actually staggering tone deaf. Lots of we failed to live up to standards, its on each of to strive for the lords ways.

Yeah right. The bishop in the US seems to be having an awful time the last 20 years!

Apparently the word "Sorry" isn't used

B0jangles · 21-08-2018 05:51PM

Leroy42 wrote: »

This bit is quite extraordinary in the Popes letter (the letter is pretty much self surviving rubbish to be honest).

So he wants each and every catholic to pay a price to try to atone for the sins of the few. Yet we have many on here claiming that such scandals cannot taint the whole church. Suddenly, it seems the secretive and protectionist church needs the help of everyone to sort this out!

Have a read of the letter, it is actually staggering tone deaf. Lots of we failed to live up to standards, its on each of to strive for the lords ways.

Yeah right. The bishop in the US seems to be having an awful time the last 20 years!

It's the same aul claptrap as ever - remember that 'good cop' Francis was picked to be pope by the Cardinals - he's just a nice smiley front for business as usual.

Part of me suspects that they intentionally put arch-traditionalist, handmade red shoes fan Ratzinger in for a few years to be 'bad cop' so that Francis would seem better by contrast.

Hannibal_Smith · 21-08-2018 06:09PM

realitykeeper wrote: »

Since you love the continuous use of the phrase witch hunt, I will repeat it. This witch hunt against the Catholic Church is dangerous.

No such witch hunt exists.

Why is standing up to the church dangerous?

quintana76 · 21-08-2018 06:13PM

Suggesting we protest against the Pope as our clown of a Taoiseach visits a Muslim Brotherhood mosque for a photo shoot. There is no hope.

batgoat · 21-08-2018 06:16PM

quintana76 wrote: »

Suggesting we protest against the Pope as our clown of a Taoiseach visits a Muslim Brotherhood mosque for a photo shoot. There is no hope.

The Church has done considerably more damage to citizens of Ireland... They also continue to globally do damage.

Discodog · 21-08-2018 06:25PM

quintana76 wrote: »

Suggesting we protest against the Pope as our clown of a Taoiseach visits a Muslim Brotherhood mosque for a photo shoot. There is no hope.

There is no hope for the dinosaurs who support racism & child abuse.

tylercheribini · 21-08-2018 06:26PM

quintana76 wrote: »

Suggesting we protest against the Pope as our clown of a Taoiseach visits a Muslim Brotherhood mosque for a photo shoot. There is no hope.

Would de muslims know leo is fond of the pipe I wonder..

Irish Kings · 21-08-2018 06:28PM

erica74 wrote: »

I don't think that's the case. I have read stories about them fighting court decisions and dragging things out, certainly not easily picking up the tab.

I do think that there is something very strange about the lack of action from our government. I can't explain what.
In high profile abuse ring cases, gardai, senior government officials etc have been implicated, maybe it's a similar story here?
I think I remember when the Brendan Smyth case was going on (it may well have been a different case) there was evidence of police involvement and cover up.

CAB is well able to seize the assets of criminals, and those who cover up crime when they want to, so I'm not buying this excuse either.

Leroy42 wrote: »

Add to that that historic cases of abuse are very difficult to convict on. First off the victim needs to want to go through all that again.
2nd the priest may not still be alive
Records not available
Many of the victims were in homes/care and as such the records reside in the church, who can easily block access.

I'm not buying this excuse either. The state are well able to issue search warrants. Nazi's were hunted down and put on trial by the Israelis 60-70 years later when some of them were in their 90's.

Leroy42 wrote: »

I do think that religion continues to carry quite a significant weight in many countries. Taking on the CC is going to cost quite a lot of votes. They are expecting 500k at this event, that is quite a lot of potential voters who seem ok with the CC as it stands. This things are political.

The fact that Leo is welcoming an organisation that treats him as a sinner and going to spend eternity in hell, shows that the CC is still a powerful political force.

I'm not buying the excuse that those currently in power in the state are pro church, and therefore won't investigate or prosecute. Media and politicians galore have presented us with reams of evidence. The state needs to start administering some justice for the victims and dishing out some convictions.

batgoat wrote: »

Maybe this situation would never have arisen if the church had actually reported the crimes? But instead you're making this about the poor church and they're really the victims... Everything goes back to, the church intentionally made it impossible to investigate.

Why are they " impossible to investigate ? " This is utter rubbish and Church propaganda. Search warrants could easily be issued for bishops files, and bishops easily taken in for questioning under caution on suspicion of concealing criminal activities from the state . . yet not a single one has.

Leroy42 wrote: »

One simple question. If one was to start a religious organisation, do you think we should start off with an organisation with systemic child abuse and an inbuilt sexism code.

Well given that the Irish state seems unwilling to prosecute you for covering up crimes, i'd say you will pretty much still get away with whatever you want.

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

30 or 40 years ago if a victim went to the Gardai they wouldn't have been believed, because the priests were regarded as pillars of the community who literally could do no wrong. How wrong we were, in all too many cases.

But while thankfully Irish society has finally moved on from this mentality of bowing and scraping and unwarranted deference,

Those who are now in authority in the state are not pro Catholic Church, so why not a single arrest for questioning, or warrant issued for searching their files in recent years, never mind a trial or conviction for the bishops that covered up these crimes in Ireland ? Most of these Bishops are still alive and well. The state is on the only body in Ireland that can obtain and administer justice for the victims of these crimes and cover ups, so why are the state authorities still refusing to do so and getting away with it, along with the bishops responsible ?

Discodog · 21-08-2018 06:32PM

Irish Kings wrote: »

Those who are now in authority in the state are not pro Catholic Church, so why not a single arrest for questioning, or warrant issued for searching their files in recent years, never mind a trial or conviction for the bishops that covered up these crimes in Ireland ? Most of these Bishops are still alive and well. The state is on the only body in Ireland that can obtain and administer justice for the victims of these crimes and cover ups, so why are the state authorities still refusing to do so and getting away with it, along with the bishops responsible ?

Maybe they are afraid that they will face compensation claims as it's obvious the state knew about abuse.

Irish Kings · 21-08-2018 06:36PM

Discodog wrote: »

Maybe they are afraid that they will face compensation claims as it's obvious the state knew about abuse.

Even if that were the case and the Church turn out not to be whole responsibly (which I believe they are), Why the hell should that be accepted as an excuse not to prosecute or put on trial anyone that deliberately aided and abetted the cover up of of these horrific crimes, inside or outside the Church, and let them away scott free ? Why should these people be allowed to walk around our streets today by the state ?

I'm not buying any of these bull shyte excuses from Church and State apologists anymore.

Hitman3000 · 21-08-2018 06:37PM

realitykeeper wrote:

And that`s another thing, if I were a victim of rape or whatever, I would go tell the GardaÃ. None of these allegations ring true and the utter prejudice displayed against the clergy by all levels of society reinforce the perception that this is a witch hunt.

The above is proof that your user name is 'tongue in cheek'.

Should we protest against the pope's visit?

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