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The 8th Amendment Part 2 - Mod Warning in OP

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Comments

  • #7532
    Annasopra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,223 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    ELM327 wrote: »
    Back to your "one liners" I see.

    Shes gonna say ths harassment.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • #7533
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    BarleySweets wrote: »
    One who plays the game the way they want them to do and never hesitates to shame hussies who can’t keep their filthy legs shut, just like the man who lives in the church tells everyone to do.

    Not that at all, love both.


  • #7534
    robarmstrong
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭robarmstrong


    pitifulgod wrote: »
    Do you oppose pregnant women with cancer engaging in a drug trial? In the long run, it could save their lives. It does, across the globe. But it requires an abortion.

    He/she is threadbanned dude, they can't respond to your post.


  • #7535
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,862 ✭✭✭✭January


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Not that at all, love both.

    You don't Love Both, if you did you'd support women to make the best choice for them whatever that is. You're a forced birther and that's the extent of it.


  • #7536
    amcalester
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭amcalester


    horseburger wrote: »

    What have I stated that is inaccurate?

    That you are undecided.


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  • #7537
    horseburger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,137 ✭✭✭horseburger


    It wasnt me123 wrote: »
    I wouldn't bother, I just block them now if they go on and on repeating the same lies without backing them up with statistics.

    The 8th will be repealed, the polls have not shown any mearsureable move from the 70 / 30 position.

    If you have a heart and read some of the InHerShoes posts and that piece above about FFA, you have to vote Yes.

    Repeal all the way - trust women

    If you had bothered to read the posts I wrote, you would realise that I said nothing about not trusting women.

    What I called into question was, the practices of abortion clinics, in getting around legislation, by carrying out abortions, on grounds other than the ground originally requested - if that originally requested ground, is not permitted in the particular jurisdiction.

    That issue indicates that the abortion will still occur, because the abortion clinic does it under a different ground - a different ground that was suggested by the staff at the clinic, to the pregnant woman.

    Patricia Lohr of BPAS clearly stated, at the Oireachtas Committee meeting on 22nd November 2017, that an abortion on the grounds of "foetal sex" - whether it's a boy or a girl - could be carried out on another ground, for example mental health.

    That would include a foetus/human foetus/baby, that is perfectly healthy and would otherwise, grow and develop healthily, before and after birth.

    That raises the question, as to whether that abortion, is ethical and justifiable.


  • #7538
    robarmstrong
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭robarmstrong


    amcalester wrote: »
    That you are undecided.

    That would be an obvious one! They won't even address the outrageous comments their fellow campaigners have made (even in this thread!), some pro-choicers have overstepped the line in this thread and I was more than happy to respectfully disagree with them and their opinion whilst commenting on what they initially said that made me disagree with them. The opposition however can't seem to do so, maybe they're just not strong enough?


  • #7539
    horseburger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,137 ✭✭✭horseburger


    amcalester wrote: »
    That you are undecided.

    hilarious.


  • #7540
    pitifulgod
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,282 ✭✭✭pitifulgod


    horseburger wrote: »
    Would you like to answer the question?

    Why is it argued that the father/potential father's opinion is irrelevant?

    Why is it considered that the doctor has more of a say than the father/man/potential father, with regard to the phrase often used, that the decision made is done between the woman/potential mother, and her doctor.

    I rarely hear it suggested that the decision made on whether or not to have an abortion is between the mother, father and the doctor.

    Surely the best scenario is that the decision is made between all three?

    Is the phrase 'between the woman and the doctor' only applicable in cases where the mother and father are no longer a couple?
    I'm a man, I don't think I should dictate over a woman's body for 9 months. If I face such a scenario, I hope I would be in a position to discuss it with my partner. But I would view the ultimate decision as her's.
    robarmstrong wrote: »
    He/she is threadbanned dude, they can't respond to your post.

    Sorry, I skipeed about 15 pages so didn't realise.


  • #7541
    horseburger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,137 ✭✭✭horseburger


    robarmstrong wrote: »
    That would be an obvious one! They won't even address the outrageous comments their fellow campaigners have made (even in this thread!), some pro-choicers have overstepped the line in this thread and I was more than happy to respectfully disagree with them and their opinion whilst commenting on what they initially said that made me disagree with them. The opposition however can't seem to do so, maybe they're just not strong enough?

    Iit's so obvious, even though you couldn't think of it, after me asking you 13 times!:)

    You were asking me, for some reason, to justify statements about statistics of abortion - statements that I didn't make.

    In response, I asked you to answer, by giving evidence of me making inaccurate statements, relating to the statements that you said were inaccurate.

    You did not answer me.


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  • #7542
    kylith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,739 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    The problem with ‘doesn’t the father get a say?’ is what happens if he and the mother disagree. Does he get to force her to continue with a pregnancy against her will?

    Ideally the choice would be made in a discussion between both, but someone has to have the deciding vote and that has to be the person most affected by the pregnancy: the woman.


  • #7543
    Wombatman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,347 ✭✭✭Wombatman


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Not that at all, love both.

    Love both what exactly? All I can see to love is a pregnant woman.


  • #7544
    amcalester
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭amcalester


    horseburger wrote: »
    hilarious.

    Thanks.

    Any voter who was actually and honestly undecided would be able to offer an opinion on the demonstrably false statements being propagated by the no campaign, so as an undecided voter, which you claim to be, what are your opinions on these falsehoods?


  • #7545
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,855 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    kylith wrote: »
    The problem with ‘doesn’t the father get a say?’ is what happens if he and the mother disagree. Does he get to force her to continue with a pregnancy against her will?

    Ideally the choice would be made in a discussion between both, but someone has to have the deciding vote and that has to be the person most affected by the pregnancy: the woman.

    Totally agree

    We also then have situations where the woman has been raped, should a rapist get to have a say?


  • #7546
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    January wrote: »
    You don't Love Both, if you did you'd support women to make the best choice for them whatever that is. You're a forced birther and that's the extent of it.

    I would love both, the irony of your post is unreal, and that's the extent of it.


  • #7547
    amdublin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,653 ✭✭✭✭amdublin


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Not that at all, love both.

    It doesn't feel that way.
    As a woman I feel like number 2 to an unborn baby.

    To be honest i think it's impossible to "love both
    Therefore one has to be more important than the other.

    And I chose the living woman.

    Choice. Let's all have choice.

    Repeal the 8th


  • #7548
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    Wombatman wrote: »
    Love both what exactly? All I can see to love is a pregnant woman.

    Pregnant with what, the idea of a child that has been written previously?


  • #7549
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    amdublin wrote: »
    It doesn't feel that way.
    As a woman I feel like number 2 to an unborn baby.

    To be honest i think it's impossible to "love both
    Therefore one has to be more important than the other.

    And I chose the living woman.

    Choice. Let's all have choice.

    Repeal the 8th

    I understand, but in the majority of cases I believe good decent men would fully support their woman and child, do we really need on demand abortion for 12 weeks ? And while many many women can obviously be trusted, you can't speak for all


  • #7550
    robarmstrong
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭robarmstrong


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Pregnant with what, the idea of a child that has been written previously?

    I'd like your opinion on what I went through, I'd just like to hear your thoughts.

    As previously stated my partner has a heart-shaped uterus and a medically diagnosed weak womb (there's a scientific medical name for it and I am sorry but it just escapes me right now!), basically, all of our miscarriages happened because the baby implanted in the "wrong spot" so to speak. I don't know if I should actually name the hospitals or not but we were told no, she does not qualify to have an abortion as technically there was no FFA nor was there a threat to her health.

    If you're unsure of how it goes it's this - baby implants in an area that does not have enough room to support the growth of it, and it's amniotic sac, so when it reaches a certain size, it will rupture, so each and every single one of our previous pregnancies has been a gamble as to where they'd implant.

    Do you think we should have been denied an abortion in those circumstances, knowing full well that even though that baby was healthy (technically) they would not survive past a certain point due to my partners medical issue?


  • #7551
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,862 ✭✭✭✭January


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    I would love both, the irony of your post is unreal, and that's the extent of it.

    Again, that's not loving both, that's placing the value of the foetus above the value of the person carrying it.

    No irony here, not sure you actually understand what irony means.

    I've noticed that you can't actually argue a point with anyone, you just use their words back at them, akin to a child mocking someone repeatedly and your overuse of the words 'buddy' and 'pal' is very aggressive in nature, again a trait of someone who can't actually argue a point made by someone else.


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  • #7552
    pitifulgod
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,282 ✭✭✭pitifulgod


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    I understand, but in the majority of cases I believe good decent men would fully support their woman and child, do we really need on demand abortion for 12 weeks ? And while many many women can obviously be trusted, you can't speak for all

    So do you not trust women if they choose to have an abortion? Yes, we do. Thousands of women travel abroad every year, our abortion rate is actually higher than prior to the 8th. There are many reasons that a woman chooses to have an abortion, I think allowing it in general before 12 weeks is good. We're not forcing women abroad and respecting their choice.


  • #7553
    backspin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,091 ✭✭✭backspin.


    Putinbot wrote: »
    What do people think of a poll for the thread.
    Simple question 'How will you vote in the referendum?'
    2 possible answers
    I'll vote in favour of repealing the 8th
    I'll vote against repealing the 8th.

    Undecided is important too as that is where i currently stand.

    I think the world is overpopulated and people will always have unwanted pregnancy and i do not want a world where there are lots of terrible parents raising kids they never wanted.

    But i can't get past the belief that abortion is the killing of a life.


  • #7554
    Hammer Archer
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 11,552 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hammer Archer


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Pregnant with what, the idea of a child that has been written previously?
    Oh look, you're back. Any response?
    Hammer Archer wrote: »
    OK enlighten me, how does a yes vote affect you or women who never want to have an abortion?

    And why are you attacking my views on my own personal experience of a miscarriage my partner suffered and the birth of my daughter? Bizarre how you are the one claiming to be harassed when you come out with that. Why does my personal experience elicit such a hostile response from you?
    I'd especially love to know why you had such a hostile response to me and my partner's personal experience of a miscarriage.


  • #7555
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    Rob, with respect I will not comment on personal cases, January I am well aware thank you, I think you misunderstand what I have said.


  • #7556
    robarmstrong
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭robarmstrong


    backspin. wrote: »
    Undecided is important too as that is where i currently stand.

    I think the world is overpopulated and people will always have unwanted pregnancy and i do not want a world where there are lots of terrible parents raising kids they never wanted.

    But i can't get past the belief that abortion is the killing of a life.

    Fully respect your beliefs and that you're currently undecided, I don't want to "convert you" or anything of the sort but what I would ask of you is to please take no heed of the false posters the pro-life campaign has put up, our biggest fear is that undecided voters will believe the lies they've told and vote no.

    I refer you to my situation above and as an undecided voter, I would ask you the same question I asked AnneFrank.


  • #7557
    Hammer Archer
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 11,552 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hammer Archer


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Rob, with respect I will not comment on personal cases, January I am well aware thank you, I think you misunderstand what I have said.
    Hilarious. Why did you feel the need to attack our experience then?


  • #7558
    lazygal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,644 ✭✭✭✭lazygal


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Rob, with respect I will not comment on personal cases, January I am well aware thank you, I think you misunderstand what I have said.

    Every pregnancy and abortion is personal.


  • #7559
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    backspin. wrote: »
    Undecided is important too as that is where i currently stand.

    I think the world is overpopulated and people will always have unwanted pregnancy and i do not want a world where there are lots of terrible parents raising kids they never wanted.

    But i can't get past the belief that abortion is the killing of a life.

    That's exactly my struggle too


  • #7560
    robarmstrong
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭robarmstrong


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Rob, with respect I will not comment on personal cases, January I am well aware thank you, I think you misunderstand what I have said.

    Why won't you comment on personal cases? It's a discussion board and you're refusing to discuss. I'm not trying to have a "gotcha!" moment, I just want to hear what you would have to say regarding that particular case.


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  • #7561
    pitifulgod
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,282 ✭✭✭pitifulgod


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Rob, with respect I will not comment on personal cases, January I am well aware thank you, I think you misunderstand what I have said.

    You responded to Hammer's experience with judgement.... So you're perfectly willing to respond to personal cases when it suits.


This discussion has been closed.
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