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The 8th Amendment Part 2 - Mod Warning in OP

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Comments

  • #7022
    RobertKK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,771 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    What about the women who don't agree, and who are voting no.
    I know many by the way.

    Trust (some) women.


  • #7023
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    Hammer Archer wrote: »
    No, not at all. A yes vote does not force any woman to have an abortion she doesn't want. It will have no effect on her or you. A no vote forces a woman who is enduring a pregnancy she doesn't want to either continue with it or travel abroad (if she's lucky enough to be able to). So you are forcing your beliefs on people, despite your desperate (and, quite frankly, laughable) attempts to prove otherwise.

    haha i don't think so buddy, but nice try, again.
    Is this another, the idea of winning an argument theory you have as opposed to actually winning one.
    What lovely perceptions you have.


  • #7024
    seachto7
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,863 ✭✭✭seachto7


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    What about the women who don't agree, and who are voting no.
    I know many by the way.

    Good for them. They have the choice not to get an abortion.


  • #7025
    BarleySweets
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 198 ✭✭BarleySweets


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    What about the women who don't agree, and who are voting no.
    I know many by the way.

    Gender has nothing to do with this issue in all reality. This is about consent.

    What do you think? If a woman does not wish to consent to becoming a mother, should we as a society force her to become one?

    And a related follow-on question: where do you draw the line on consent, if you feel like you can force a woman to become a mother without her consent, what other situations do you feel that her consent is not required?


  • #7026
    v638sg7k1a92bx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭v638sg7k1a92bx


    I'm a bit behind, has this been discussed. I looked at a few pages from yesterday but haven't seen anything.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/anti-abortion-lawyers-issue-statement-against-repeal-1.3467540


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  • #7027
    ELM327
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,109 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    What about the women who don't agree, and who are voting no.
    I know many by the way.
    Those women are almost worse than the elderly men who see fit to enforce their rules on all women.

    Dont like abortions? DONT HAVE ONE.
    If you need to have one, they are already happening unsafely (UK travel or random unsupervised pills).


  • #7028
    bruschi
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 4,149 Mod ✭✭✭✭bruschi


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    haha i don't think so buddy, but nice try, again.
    Is this another, the idea of winning an argument theory you have as opposed to actually winning one.
    What lovely perceptions you have.

    that is the second time you have mentioned Hammer Archer having lovely "perceptions" due to his thinking on how he and his wife viewed a miscarriage they suffered.

    It is extremely condescending and inconsiderate and considering the bleating you are doing about being attacked, the mocking tone you are using to someone about how they viewed their own personal trauma is way worse than the supposed attacks you are receiving on here.


  • #7029
    BarleySweets
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 198 ✭✭BarleySweets


    RobertKK wrote: »
    Trust (some) women.

    What a lovely sentiment. What should be done to women who you decide are untrustworthy?


  • #7030
    ELM327
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,109 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    BarleySweets wrote: »
    Gender has nothing to do with this issue in all reality. This is about consent.

    What do you think? If a woman does not wish to consent to becoming a mother, should we as a society force her to become one?

    And a related follow-on question: where do you draw the line on consent, if you feel like you can force a woman to become a mother without her consent, what other situations do you feel that her consent is not required?
    +1
    What type of upbringing and environment will surround an enforced birthed child?.
    A dead mother? Maybe she wanted the abortion for medical reasons.
    A mother in a psych ward? Maybe she wanted the abortion for mental health reasons.
    No food to eat? Maybe she wanted the abortion for financial reasons.
    Born and abused by violent person? Maybe she wanted the abortion for safety reasons, abusive partner or parent.
    A deformed child with no quality of life? Maybe the woman was on Bipolar medication, or received chemotherapy before she knew she was pregnant and the child is going to be an abomination/defect.

    Above all... why does ANYONE get to tell that mother and family what to do? This really annoys me. It's so incomprehensible.


  • #7031
    Hammer Archer
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 11,552 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hammer Archer


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    haha i don't think so buddy, but nice try, again.
    Is this another, the idea of winning an argument theory you have as opposed to actually winning one.
    What lovely perceptions you have.
    OK enlighten me, how does a yes vote affect you or women who never want to have an abortion?

    And why are you attacking my views on my own personal experience of a miscarriage my partner suffered and the birth of my daughter? Bizarre how you are the one claiming to be harassed when you come out with that. Why does my personal experience elicit such a hostile response from you?


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  • #7032
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    haha i don't think so buddy, but nice try, again.
    Is this another, the idea of winning an argument theory you have as opposed to actually winning one.
    What lovely perceptions you have.

    That reply didn't really answer any questions that were put to you, it was just passive aggressive and condescending, as well as dismissive of his experiences.

    Is that how you win arguments? Put down the other person until they relent and agree with you?


  • #7033
    Zubeneschamali
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,686 ✭✭✭✭Zubeneschamali


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/anti-abortion-lawyers-issue-statement-against-repeal-1.3467540

    I look forward to the response from Dog Groomers for Repeal.


  • #7034
    Frank Bullitt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,921 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    gmisk wrote: »
    It is kind of hilarious but hey no surprise.
    The fact the no vote dropped by 1% is a really bad sign for them, it would need to be increasing at this stage (Even Keith Mills...gay man who wasnt for gay marriage...) think it is looking like a yes vote.
    The poll is though a massive indicator of lots of undecided people, so still lots of work to do.

    As much as the NO side need the YES side to fall back, they also need to make improvements themselves, which they aren't. With 5 weeks or so to go, thats grim reading to a degree for them.

    Still though, McGuirks attempts at a positive look are great to behold. He has me blocked on twitter though, so I have to use other means to see them. He was also saying that the numbers in the polls dont add up to what they are hearing at the doors, which one would you trust more? Hmmmmmm


  • #7035
    seamus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,190 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Gintonious wrote: »
    Canvassing is a brutal indicator of how a vote will go.
    Could also be a deliberate misinformation tactic - make things seem closer on the ground to encourage "Yes" campaigners to stick at it.


  • #7036
    ELM327
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,109 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    That reply didn't really answer any questions that were put to you, it was just passive aggressive and condescending, as well as dismissive of his experiences.

    Is that how you win arguments? Put down the other person until they relent and agree with you?
    +1. Thankfully that won't work in the ballot box.
    I trust our citizens, and trust that they won't continue to inflict this pain and suffering on our women. I use the hashtag #trustourwomen when canvassing/commenting online but it's not an empty slogan. Trust begins with trusting Irish people to make the right decision

    And if they don't, well we'll have another referendum in a couple of years a la the Nice Treaty and Divorce Referendum when the old voters die out and are replaced with non-brainwashed people who instead of clinging to their rosary can see the pain and suffering and death and infertility and delayed treatment that the 8th has caused.


  • #7037
    Ave Sodalis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭Ave Sodalis


    bruschi wrote:
    It is extremely condescending and inconsiderate and considering the bleating you are doing about being attacked, the mocking tone you are using to someone about how they viewed their own personal trauma is way worse than the supposed attacks you are receiving on here.

    The poster has been crying about being attacked ever since she was asked if she had any more to add to the discussion other than repeatedly saying "Save the 8th" and nothing else. A victim complex is her argument, the rest seems to be just fluff so she can go back to painting herself as being bullied.


  • #7038
    baylah17
    Closed Accounts Posts: 790 ✭✭✭baylah17


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    What about the women who don't agree, and who are voting no.
    I know many by the way.

    They wont be forced to have abortions ok
    But when the evil 8th is repealed no woman will be forced to die.


  • #7039
    baylah17
    Closed Accounts Posts: 790 ✭✭✭baylah17


    BarleySweets wrote: »
    What a lovely sentiment. What should be done to women who you decide are untrustworthy?

    That was the motto in place above the Magdelene laundries and Mother and Baby homes that Robert still reveres and defends
    Kind of like the oul Arbeit Macht Frei that another gang in black used.


  • #7040
    v638sg7k1a92bx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭v638sg7k1a92bx


    Seems like alot of people are talking past one another on this thread.

    Once the right to the unborn has been removed from the constitution, how can that be dealt with to allay concerns that Pro Life people would have?


  • #7041
    Ave Sodalis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭Ave Sodalis


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote:
    Once the right to the unborn has been removed from the constitution, how can that be dealt with to allay concerns that Pro Life people would have?


    Information and legislation


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  • #7042
    Zubeneschamali
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,686 ✭✭✭✭Zubeneschamali


    Gintonious wrote: »
    Still though, McGuirks attempts at a positive look are great to behold. He has me blocked on twitter though, so I have to use other means to see them. He was also saying that the numbers in the polls dont add up to what they are hearing at the doors, which one would you trust more?

    This is a standard line from politicians who are losing: "not what we are hearing on the doorsteps", used to try to stop their voters thinking they've lost already and not bothering to vote. More loser phrases to watch for:

    "The only poll that counts is the one on the day".
    "A week is a long time in politics".
    "Just a snapshot in time".
    "A lot can happen before polling day".
    "The momentum is with us".
    "Let's not second guess the people, the choice is up to them"


  • #7043
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    Seems like alot of people are talking past one another on this thread.

    Once the right to the unborn has been removed from the constitution, how can that be dealt with to allay concerns that Pro Life people would have?

    It will have no effect on those who are pro-life because abortion won't be forced on anyone.
    They can continue to live their lives as normal with the added benefit of being able to consent/withhold consent while receiving maternity care.

    If you're asking how to allay the concerns they have over OTHER PEOPLE'S pregnancies, I would advise them to stop worrying about the uterus's and sex lives of strangers and mind their own business.


  • #7044
    BarleySweets
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 198 ✭✭BarleySweets


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    Seems like alot of people are talking past one another on this thread.

    Once the right to the unborn has been removed from the constitution, how can that be dealt with to allay concerns that Pro Life people would have?

    It’ll be dealt with the exact same way as in every other country that offers abortion. Or do you think that Italy, Spain, the UK, Greece, and every other such country has rescinded all considerations for their unborn children?


  • #7045
    BarleySweets
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 198 ✭✭BarleySweets


    Zubeneschamali wrote: »
    This is a standard line from politicians who are losing: "not what we are hearing on the doorsteps", used to try to stop their voters thinking they've lost already and not bothering to vote. More loser phrases to watch for:

    "The only poll that counts is the one on the day".
    "A week is a long time in politics".
    "Just a snapshot in time".
    "A lot can happen before polling day".
    "The momentum is with us".
    "Let's not second guess the people, the choice is up to them"

    Don’t forget my favorite catchphrase coined in this thread: “Trust (some) women.”


  • #7046
    BarleySweets
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 198 ✭✭BarleySweets


    baylah17 wrote: »
    That was the motto in place above the Magdelene laundries and Mother and Baby homes that Robert still reveres and defends
    Kind of like the oul Arbeit Macht Frei that another gang in black used.

    Barbaric!


  • #7047
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,862 ✭✭✭✭January


    Looking forward to canvassing tonight, weather is lovely and we'll have a presence from a lot of political parties with us tonight!


  • #7048
    ELM327
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,109 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    Seems like alot of people are talking past one another on this thread.

    Once the right to the unborn has been removed from the constitution, how can that be dealt with to allay concerns that Pro Life people would have?
    Nothing.
    Their life will not change, they will not have an abortion as they don't now, and that's it.

    Their " concerns " are in an area that they do not have jurisdiction over, which is trying to enforce their " morals " on someone else who may not share their views


  • #7049
    gmisk
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,385 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    January wrote: »
    Looking forward to canvassing tonight, weather is lovely and we'll have a presence from a lot of political parties with us tonight!
    If its in Inchicore and you knock on my door you will get a warm welcome.
    Its terrific of you to volunteer your time and effort thanks so much.


  • #7050
    Zubeneschamali
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,686 ✭✭✭✭Zubeneschamali


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    Once the right to the unborn has been removed from the constitution, how can that be dealt with to allay concerns that Pro Life people would have?

    Once the 8th is removed, the prolife people will mostly vanish along with their concerns, the same as the anti-divorce people, anti-contraception people, anti-civil partnership people and anti-same sex marriage people.

    The Citizens Assembly and referendum result will be enough cover for the Government to push through their proposed legislation, and then:

    ... we will never speak of it again. The whole topic will go quiet apart from Iona's home page and the odd speech form Ronan Mullen.


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  • #7051
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,862 ✭✭✭✭January


    gmisk wrote: »
    If its in Inchicore and you knock on my door you will get a warm welcome.
    Its terrific of you to volunteer your time and effort thanks so much.

    Dublin West constituency here but someone will be over your way organising canvases!


This discussion has been closed.
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