The 8th Amendment Part 2 - Mod Warning in OP

Zubeneschamali · 20-04-2018 08:46AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

I respectfully disagree, ending a 12 week babies life is very hard for me personally to vote on

Ending a 12 week old babies life is murder and carries a mandatory life sentence.

Nothing to do with this referendum, though.

ELM327 · 20-04-2018 08:46AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

Where exactly did I say I was on the fence ?
Me and my ilk ? Seriously

Yes, you and your ilk. "pro life".
You have women's blood on your hands. Savita for one.
You are responsible for women's infertility - multiple accounts on the In Her Shoes page where women were forced to have parts of their reproductive system removed un-necessarily because Irish doctors were not allowed to give them a termination due to medical reasons.
You are responsible for introducing risk to the mother's life. The mother should be given priority because she's a real person. A foetus is just that, a foetus. A potential person. What if you save the baby but kill the mother because both are equal, and the mother has 3 other children at home now left without a mother.

That's what gets me. And this is a bit of a rant. You call yourselves pro life. But you're not. You are pro birth. Because someone truly pro life doesn't impose so much hurt and suffering and risk on those who are living.

AnneFrank · 20-04-2018 08:48AM

ELM327 wrote: »

Yes, you and your ilk. "pro life".
You have women's blood on your hands. Savita for one.
You are responsible for women's infertility - multiple accounts on the In Her Shoes page where women were forced to have parts of their reproductive system removed un-necessarily because Irish doctors were not allowed to give them a termination due to medical reasons.

Wow, I'm embarrassed for you.

baylah17 · 20-04-2018 08:50AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

Wow, I'm embarrassed for you.

You should be more embarrassed for yourself, some of the tripe you've posted.
I will raise a special glass and think of you when celebrating the Repeal of the 8th;);)

ELM327 · 20-04-2018 08:52AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

Wow, I'm embarrassed for you.

30% in the polls I'm embarrassed for you!

Actually, since I'm older than you I don't have to listen to your opinion.
Remember that little chestnut you posted.

;):rolleyes:

gmisk · 20-04-2018 09:00AM

That poll looks promising but still a long way to go... I stand by my 55/45 prediction... Fingers crossed

Zubeneschamali · 20-04-2018 09:04AM

RobertKK wrote: »

Googled and found this from RedC research:

https://redcresearch.ie/brexit-polls-lessons-ireland/

It says almost all undecided in the marriage referendum ended up voting no.

Yes, but note that the point of this article is that the undecideds will break for No in the upcoming referendum... and therefore Brexit will not pass.

How did that one work out?

Hooks Golf Handicap · 20-04-2018 09:04AM

Mother of jaysus, here we are, 5 weeks out to the day &the No side still don't get it.

You are not voting for abortion, abortion is happening every day around you but somehow you are blissfully unaware.
Should a majority of you vote No there will still be 5,000 abortions carried out by Irish women next year & each year after that.
You somehow believe voting No protects the sanctity of this god fearing Island.

Voting No only condemns Irish women to travel or order pills online so your vote only inflicts further hardship.

Zubeneschamali · 20-04-2018 09:09AM

Hooks Golf Handicap wrote: »

Voting No only condemns Irish women to travel or order pills online so your vote only inflicts further hardship.

As we saw with the 13th, and we have heard from many "pro-life" posters, they know this very well. This is the whole idea. They don't want to stop women going to England, they don't want to see them going to jail for 14 years, they haven't a notion of stopping a single abortion.

They just want to punish women for having sex by making them do the walk of shame to the Ryanair gate.

Hooks Golf Handicap · 20-04-2018 09:12AM

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

As we saw with the 13th, and we have heard from many "pro-life" posters, they know this very well. This is the whole idea. They don't want to stop women going to England, they don't want to see them going to jail for 14 years, they haven't a notion of stopping a single abortion.

They just want to punish women for having sex by making them do the walk of shame to the Ryanair gate.

Ashbourne hoop · 20-04-2018 09:15AM

Saw the best Yes side poster this morning "Vote Yes. Sometimes a private matter needs public support". Simple and effective. Anything else is pure whataboutery.

....... · 20-04-2018 09:17AM

This post has been deleted.

tigger123 · 20-04-2018 09:25AM

Travelling to England is only an option for those women with the means to do so.

For me it's a class and social equality issue, and for that reason I'll be voting Yes.

ELM327 · 20-04-2018 09:27AM

gmisk wrote: »

That poll looks promising but still a long way to go... I stand by my 55/45 prediction... Fingers crossed

I'd gladly accept 50.3:49.7 in favour of Repeal, similar to the divorce referendum. We can't take any chances and must canvas and get our friends etc out to vote. No complacency, no let up, no surrender.

tigger123 wrote: »

Travelling to England is only an option for those women with the means to do so.

For me it's a class and social equality issue, and for that reason I'll be voting Yes.

+1 it's now an "abortions for the rich/middle classes" and enforced incubation or debt for the rest. That's not right either.

Hammer Archer · 20-04-2018 09:35AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

I know many women who would be deeply offended by this post, having miscarried around that mark

Just so we're clear, you feel that a woman miscarrying at 12 weeks would be the same experience as losing a 12 week old baby?

horseburger · 20-04-2018 09:40AM

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Ben Shapiro, far right extremist? Forgive me if I dont listen to what he has to say given his extreme views race, islam, lgbt issues and his links with extreme Far right media like Breitbart.

Nah. I wont be listening to far right fascists like Shapiro or Justin Barrett on this.

I asked the particular poster, what he/she thought of the points Ben Shapiro was making, in response to arguments that are often made to advocate for a wider availability of abortion services.

I did not ask what the poster thought of Ben Shapiro, with regard to Shapiro's outlook, and perspective with regard to a range of issues.

I asked what the particular very courteous poster - who made such nice comments about me, comments that weren't at all off topic in speculating what writing style might be employed in the development of a dissertation - thought of the responding points made, by Ben Shapiro, to arguments that endorse an increase of abortion services.

Mr. CooL ICE · 20-04-2018 09:41AM

horseburger wrote: »

<same youtube videos as before and before>

Mod: horseburger, stop posting the same videos over and over. It's becoming borderline spam at this stage.

Bringing other people's views/opinions to the thread is welcome, but repeating the same thing over and over is bringing nothing new.

AnneFrank · 20-04-2018 09:44AM

Hammer Archer wrote: »

Just so we're clear, you feel that a woman miscarrying at 12 weeks would be the same experience as losing a 12 week old baby?

Just to be clear, i feel no need to explain the meaning of a post to you.

AnneFrank · 20-04-2018 09:45AM

Dole Scrounging Vegan Crossfitter wrote: »

Mod: horseburger, stop posting the same videos over and over. It's becoming borderline spam at this stage.

Bringing other people's views/opinions to the thread is welcome, but repeating the same thing over and over is bringing nothing new.

but it's fine to attack people and misquote them on numerous occasions as long as you're on the yes side.
That's fair.

amdublin · 20-04-2018 09:49AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

but it's fine to attack people and misquote them on numerous occasions as long as you're on the yes side.
That's fair.

Have you reported any of what you think are attack posts to alert the mod to them?

Hammer Archer · 20-04-2018 09:50AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

Just to be clear, i feel no need to explain the meaning of a post to you.

Good thing you're not on a discussion forum then. Oh wait.

I think you've realized the stupidity of your post and are now furiously trying to backtrack.
My OH had a miscarriage around that time (couple of weeks earlier). We now have a 3 month old daughter. While the miscarriage was definitely tough, we don't feel like we lost a baby, more the idea of a baby. I cannot even begin to comprehend how I'd feel if we lost our daughter now.

robarmstrong · 20-04-2018 09:53AM

horseburger wrote: »

I asked the particular poster what he/she thought of the points Ben Shapiro was making, in response to arguments that are often made to advocate for a wider availability of abortion services.

I did not ask what the poster thought of Ben Shapiro, with regard to Shapiro's outlook, and perspective with regard to a range of issues.

I asked what the particular very courteous poster - who made such nice comments about me, comments that weren't at all off topic in speculating what writing style might be employed in the development of a dissertation - thought of the responding points made, by Ben Shapiro, to arguments that endorse an increase of abortion services.

Would you care to engage with and enlighten those courteous posters who are very keen to hear what comments you have to make about the pro-life campaign, including the statements and inaccuracies the campaign has made.

As someone who is "on the fence" surely you would have some observations or questions to bring up, no? You're asking all these questions about the pro-choice campaign and the opinions of the pro choice individuals on posts you put up but you never address those who question you, in fact you just keep on regurgitating pretty much the same over and over again.

Are you unable to engage with posters who query you about your standpoint on the pro-life campaign? Has someone forbidden you from engaging with people who want your views and observations on that aspect?

If I was on the fence I'd be readily available to give my thoughts and observations on both sides of the matter, so why can't you?

nozzferrahhtoo · 20-04-2018 09:53AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

Just to be clear, i feel no need to explain the meaning of a post to you.

Great. But then do not presume to admonish OTHER people for failing to keep the debate civilized. Because the lack of decorum and civility is almost solely and entirely coming from you. No one else.

Since you entered this thread you have:

shouted one liner slogans.
Disparaged the opinions of people solely on the age of the speaker.
Ignored questions and posts seeking to engage with you on a mature level.
Thrown out dismissive schoolyard one liners like "Wow, I'm embarrassed for you"
Refused to explain yourself when your posts were not clear.
Played the imaginary victim card by trying to portray any level of disagreement with you as some kind of harassment

At no point have you engaged with the actual topic or people in it. Which is of course your right, and is very representative of the "no" side of this debate as it happens. But it absolutely does NOT give you the pedestal or the high horse that you are acting like you have to admonish others on the topic.

For example of the stuff you have been dodging, you commented on abortion in cases of rape. And you were asked the very simply question about how you imagine that exception could be accessed and implemented. What did you do? IGNORE. The same thing you always do.

You want a civilized debate to be happening? Then act like it rather than moan about it, because actions speak louder than words.

dudara · 20-04-2018 09:59AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

No matter what side your on, it's such a hard thing to have to think about deeply and vote upon

Not really IMO. I think it’s an easy decision to vote No and create the environment where women can choose. The tough choices will be made by the women, and their partners. The tough choices willmade by the people who are really impacted directly.

AnneFrank · 20-04-2018 10:03AM

Hammer Archer wrote: »

Good thing you're not on a discussion forum then. Oh wait.

I think you've realized the stupidity of your post and are now furiously trying to backtrack.
My OH had a miscarriage around that time (couple of weeks earlier). We now have a 3 month old daughter. While the miscarriage was definitely tough, we don't feel like we lost a baby, more the idea of a baby. I cannot even begin to comprehend how I'd feel if we lost our daughter now.

No Backtracking here buddy, and i know many women in situations were they could not have another baby, they were not lucky like you,
a miscarried baby is a baby to alot of women.
Perhaps in your world it was only the idea of a baby.
Nice perception to have

Bannasidhe · 20-04-2018 10:05AM

horseburger wrote: »

<shnip - youtube videos again>

Oh dear. Now we have dropped down into the 30 percentile for continued regurgitation and failure to personally engage with the topic. Plus what we in the dissertation correcting game calling 'padding' - a device used to get the word count up.

Is it that you find it difficult to interpret the information and then present it in your own words believing that by quoting other people that covers that deficit or is it a case that you feel appealing to authorities of various kinds on all side of the debate lends gravitas to a position you do not feel able to argue yourself?

Mr. CooL ICE · 20-04-2018 10:05AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

but it's fine to attack people and misquote them on numerous occasions as long as you're on the yes side.
That's fair.

Mod: Do not discuss moderator decisions on thread. It adds clutter and derails the thread. PM the mod if you have any questions.

If you see any post that needs attention, use the report function. If you have already reported posts and don't see that any action is taken, then either the post is still under review, or mods have decided that no action is necessary. Again, PM a mod for clarification.

Hammer Archer · 20-04-2018 10:05AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

No Backtracking here buddy, and i know many women in situations were they could not have another baby, they were not lucky like you,
a miscarried baby is a baby to alot of women.
Perhaps in your world it was only the idea of a baby.
Nice perception to have

Yes I'm sure it is. And that's their decision and I 100% respect that. But to a lot of women (my partner included), it wasn't. And to a lot of women who wish to have an abortion, a 12 week or earlier pregnancy isn't a baby either. And nothing gives you the right to force your beliefs on them like you're trying to do.

Triceratops Ballet · 20-04-2018 10:06AM

AnneFrank wrote: »

No Backtracking here buddy, and i know many women in situations were they could not have another baby, they were not lucky like you,
a miscarried baby is a baby to alot of women.
Perhaps in your world it was only the idea of a baby.
Nice perception to have

I get that, but how does voting no help them, or anyone?

Timberrrrrrrr · 20-04-2018 10:07AM

nozzferrahhtoo wrote: »

Great. But then do not presume to admonish OTHER people for failing to keep the debate civilized. Because the lack of decorum and civility is almost solely and entirely coming from you. No one else.

Since you entered this thread you have:
shouted one liner slogans.

Disparaged the opinions of people solely on the age of the speaker.

Ignored questions and posts seeking to engage with you on a mature level.

Thrown out dismissive schoolyard one liners like "Wow, I'm embarrassed for you"

Refused to explain yourself when your posts were not clear.

Played the imaginary victim card by trying to portray any level of disagreement with you as some kind of harassment

At no point have you engaged with the actual topic or people in it. Which is of course your right, and is very representative of the "no" side of this debate as it happens. But it absolutely does NOT give you the pedestal or the high horse that you are acting like you have to admonish others on the topic.

For example of the stuff you have been dodging, you commented on abortion in cases of rape. And you were asked the very simply question about how you imagine that exception could be accessed and implemented. What did you do? IGNORE. The same thing you always do.

You want a civilized debate to be happening? Then act like it rather than moan about it, because actions speak louder than words.

And now you can expect a reply somewhere along the lines accusing you of attacking/intimidating/bullying or some other spurious accusation that will in no way actually be relevant to the truths that you have pointed out.

The 8th Amendment Part 2 - Mod Warning in OP

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