Irish woman gang raped by 6 men in Czech hotel

irishrebe · 08-04-2018 05:58PM

ceadaoin. wrote: »

irishrebe wrote: »

Right, so basically we ARE to assume that all men are potential rapists. That's what you're saying. You've just reworded it to sound less sinister.

Well if it's a man completely unknown to you then how are you supposed to know if they are a potential rapist or not? Anything is possible so if someone wants to take reasonable precautions then whats the problem. How the hell is it "sinister"?

I stayed in a shared dorm once and woke up to a strange man sitting on my bed staring at me. I wasn't travelling alone but if it was I would have felt totally vulnerable in that situation. Good for you if you don't. I wouldn't say it was "irresponsible" if you feel you can handle yourself in such a situation but why the need to try and guilt others for the way they feel?

Again, you are saying all men are potential rapists, and unless we know them 'well enough' (nobody has defined yet how well you need to know someone to be sure they won't rape you) then we need to be afraid. I'm not disagreeing. Just find the lack of logic here hilarious. If we assume men are dangerous predators by default and watch our back at all times, we're sexist, hysterical snowflakes with a victim complex. If we assume the best of men, we're idiots who deserve to be raped. I'm well aware, having been female my entire life, that this is the general line of thought. That you can never, ever do the 'right' thing and it will always somehow be your fault. It's just funny seeing people go round in circles trying to justify it.

irishrebe · 08-04-2018 06:02PM

eviltwin wrote: »

irishrebe wrote: »

Right, so basically we ARE to assume that all men are potential rapists. That's what you're saying. You've just reworded it to sound less sinister. It's just funny to me, reading through the thread, that the very same men who agree that it's irresponsible for a woman to stay in a hostel dorm where there might be men are those same men who ALSO accuse women of being hysterical liars for recounting experiences of sexual assault and harassment (because according to them, it just doesn't happen) and for treating all men as a threat. Some impressive mental gymnastics there. Really impressive.

Women can't win. If we take precautions we are assuming all men are rapists, if we take men at face value we are being irresponsible.

Personally I cross the street at night if there is a man behind me, it's automatic at this stage because it's been drummed into me to mind myself. Am I guilty of judging all men now?

As I said, the same idiots who start all the 'but not all men...' crap would be the very first to tell you it was your fault for not crossing the street, or even for being out at night at all. They just flip their argument as needed to blame women for a) having a victim complex or b) actually being victims.

irishrebe · 08-04-2018 06:08PM

Ive Been Everywhere Man wrote: »

irishrebe wrote: »

As I said, the same idiots who start all the 'but not all men...' crap would be the very first to tell you it was your fault for not crossing the street, or even for being out at night at all. They just flip their argument as needed to blame women for a) having a victim complex or b) actually being victims.

No one is blaming women. All we are saying is don't go back to a stranger's house when drunk, because let's face it, you wouldn't do that while sober, would you?

Or stay in a hostel where there are men, completely sober. Or get drunk at all when travelling. Etc. Etc. Etc. You know, all the stuff men do that is known as 'having a good time'. Because I was born with a vagina instead of a penis, I'm not allowed to do any of that without being blamed for anything that might happen.

eviltwin · 08-04-2018 06:10PM

irishrebe wrote: »

Or stay in a hostel where there are men, completely sober. Or get drunk at all when travelling. Etc. Etc. Etc. You know, all the stuff men do that is known as 'having a good time'. Because I was born with a vagina instead of a penis, I'm not allowed to do any of that without being blamed for anything that might happen.

To be fair anyone, man or woman, is taking a risk going back to a stranger's house.

pjohnson · 08-04-2018 06:12PM

irishrebe wrote: »

Or stay in a hostel where there are men, completely sober. Or get drunk at all when travelling. Etc. Etc. Etc. You know, all the stuff men do that is known as 'having a good time'. Because I was born with a vagina instead of a penis, I'm not allowed to do any of that without being blamed for anything that might happen.

If a man got drunk and went back to a strangers gaf he could also easily be raped. Having a penis instead of a vagina does not prevent rape.

cantdecide · 08-04-2018 06:14PM

irishrebe wrote: »

I'm not allowed to do any of that without being blamed for anything that might happen.

There are lots of perfectly permissible things in this world which are also perfectly stupid.

I always remember my dad's advice to all of us when we were kids was "don't become a statistic".

Gravelly · 08-04-2018 06:15PM

irishrebe wrote: »

Or stay in a hostel where there are men, completely sober. Or get drunk at all when travelling. Etc. Etc. Etc. You know, all the stuff men do that is known as 'having a good time'. Because I was born with a vagina instead of a penis, I'm not allowed to do any of that without being blamed for anything that might happen.

This is the kind of stuff that modern feminism has gotten badly wrong in my humble opinion - you shouldn't do those things, not because you'll get blamed, but because you will be potentially putting yourself at the mercy of bad people - that's not your fault, or men in generals fault, but it is reality. Unfortunately accepting reality is unfashionable of late.

eviltwin · 08-04-2018 06:19PM

Gravelly wrote: »

This is the kind of stuff that modern feminism has gotten badly wrong in my humble opinion - you shouldn't do those things, not because you'll get blamed, but because you will be potentially putting yourself at the mercy of bad people - that's not your fault, or men in generals fault, but it is reality. Unfortunately accepting reality is unfashionable of late.

I don't think it's just women who are at risk in those situations. Anyone by themselves getting drunk is being irresponsible, get drunk but realise if you are alone you are especially vulnerable. Doesn't matter if you are a man or a woman. I'd be equally concerned about my son doing that as my daughter.

cantdecide · 08-04-2018 06:30PM

eviltwin wrote: »

I don't think it's just women who are at risk in those situations. Anyone by themselves getting drunk is being irresponsible, get drunk but realise if you are alone you are especially vulnerable. Doesn't matter if you are a man or a woman. I'd be equally concerned about my son doing that as my daughter.

It's usually when it comes to strangers' sons and daughters is where the ideology and hypocrisy sets in. I don't think the overwhelming majority of people would do anything but support precautionary actions of any kind (bar hysterics). I wouldn't blame any woman for crossing the road if 6'4" me is walking behind them on a dark street. There is a big difference between what the idealogues do and what they would have you do.

irishrebe · 08-04-2018 06:31PM

Gravelly wrote: »

irishrebe wrote: »

Or stay in a hostel where there are men, completely sober. Or get drunk at all when travelling. Etc. Etc. Etc. You know, all the stuff men do that is known as 'having a good time'. Because I was born with a vagina instead of a penis, I'm not allowed to do any of that without being blamed for anything that might happen.

This is the kind of stuff that modern feminism has gotten badly wrong in my humble opinion - you shouldn't do those things, not because you'll get blamed, but because you will be potentially putting yourself at the mercy of bad people - that's not your fault, or men in generals fault, but it is reality. Unfortunately accepting reality is unfashionable of late.

I'm not saying don't be careful. I'm saying that you can't simultaneously deny women's accounts of harassment/assault and deny that women are more likely than men to be assaulted, and then tell women they need to take extra precautions because they're women. You can't have it both ways.

irishrebe · 08-04-2018 06:34PM

Sam Quentin wrote: »

I could never understand the 'people with money psych' of yawww 'Imelda' is taking a year out to go backpacking/ travelling across STRANGE COUNTRIES around the World..
All funded by Daddy/Mammy.
And you think that's cool/ok?????
Most normal parents would be concerned about their daughters heading into the local town for an evening!?

Never met an 'Imelda' who would have a rich mammy and daddy who paid for them to travel the world.

irishrebe · 08-04-2018 06:35PM

cantdecide wrote: »

irishrebe wrote: »

I'm not allowed to do any of that without being blamed for anything that might happen.

There are lots of perfectly permissible things in this world which are also perfectly stupid.

I always remember my dad's advice to all of us when we were kids was "don't become a statistic".

So where do we draw the line between what is stupid and what is just trying to enjoy your life? I don't think many people would call a man stupid for having a few drinks on a night out on holidays or staying in a hostel.

cantdecide · 08-04-2018 06:35PM

irishrebe wrote: »

deny that women are more likely than men to be assaulted,

Do you mean ordinary assault? Because it's the lads are more likely to be assaulted.

dudara · 08-04-2018 06:46PM

Admin note - could posters please stop engaging with the re-reg trollls who come crawling out whenever this type of topic appears? They’re easy to spot, and please report them. It’s honestly tedious to have to clean up their drivel, and the responses to it.

Thanks
dudara

pjohnson · 08-04-2018 06:49PM

irishrebe wrote: »

So where do we draw the line between what is stupid and what is just trying to enjoy your life? I don't think many people would call a man stupid for having a few drinks on a night out on holidays or staying in a hostel.

No one would call a woman stupid for a few drinks. Take off the gender glasses.

irishrebe · 08-04-2018 06:52PM

pjohnson wrote: »

irishrebe wrote: »

So where do we draw the line between what is stupid and what is just trying to enjoy your life? I don't think many people would call a man stupid for having a few drinks on a night out on holidays or staying in a hostel.

No one would call a woman stupid for a few drinks. Take off the gender glasses.

There are people on this thread saying women shouldn't get drunk or stay in hostel dorms. If you're trying to tell me a man would get the same advice, you're deluded. Men can travel the world, sleep in couchettes on night trains, go drinking with random people, stay in dorms, all grand, all just having a good time. A woman doing the same is seen as taking huge risks and putting herself in danger. And then at the same time criticised for assuming the worst of men.

Riiiight.

givyjoe · 08-04-2018 06:52PM

Appledreams15 wrote: »

Also porn needs to be regulated. Violent and degrading porn of women is a huge factor in women not being respected.

Just like violent video games are a huge factor in mass shootings. Get a grip.

pjohnson · 08-04-2018 06:55PM

irishrebe wrote: »

There are people on this thread saying women shouldn't get drunk or stay in hostel dorms. If you're trying to tell me a man would get the same advice, you're deluded. Men can travel the world, sleep in couchettes on night trains, go drinking with random people, stay in dorms, all grand, all just having a good time. A woman doing the same is seen as taking huge risks and putting herself in danger. And then at the same time criticised for assuming the worst of men.

Riiiight.

Apparently gender glasses are built in.

Well ideally men shouldn't do that either. Its not safe. I sure hope you wouldn't instill such recklessness into a son of yours. These men you keep harping about ARE being reckless and endangering themselves.

ahnowbrowncow · 08-04-2018 07:08PM

irishrebe wrote: »

There are people on this thread saying women shouldn't get drunk or stay in hostel dorms. If you're trying to tell me a man would get the same advice, you're deluded. Men can travel the world, sleep in couchettes on night trains, go drinking with random people, stay in dorms, all grand, all just having a good time. A woman doing the same is seen as taking huge risks and putting herself in danger. And then at the same time criticised for assuming the worst of men.

Riiiight.

You do realise that men are more likely to be the victim of a violent crime?

So of course I would warn both a man or woman about getting drunk while on their own/with strangers in an unknown area.

LLMMLL · 08-04-2018 07:15PM

pjohnson wrote: »

Apparently gender glasses are built in.

Well ideally men shouldn't do that either. Its not safe. I sure hope you wouldn't instill such recklessness into a son of yours. These men you keep harping about ARE being reckless and endangering themselves.

There's a big difference about what parents tell their children not to do and what should be given as sound advice re safety.

I witnessed an assault a few years back from a reasonable distance. I called the police and they came. Once the police arrived I went into my apartment.

So society would probably tell me I did the right thing and also the safe thing. Maybe some people would think the right thing to do would be to intervene but the safest compromise was to not intervene but to do my social duty of reporting it.

I mentioned it to my parents and they started quizzing me on "did the guy see you" "did he see you going back into the apartment" "what if he comes after you" as if he was a mob kingpin who would disappear me so I couldn't testify against him. Really paranoid reactions.

That's what parents are like (generally) and the argument "would you advise your child to go back to a hostel/house party" etc. Doesn't have any bearing on whether it's actually all that risky to do so.

LLMMLL · 08-04-2018 07:17PM

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

You do realise that men are more likely to be the victim of a violent crime?

So of course I would warn both a man or woman about getting drunk while on their own/with strangers in an unknown area.

So why don't we see anything but sympathy for the victims of drunken physical assaults? There's been a few famous cases of assaults in dublin city centre over the years, some with horrific consequences. I don't think I've ever seen anyone say "what was he thinking going out in dublin city centre and drinking". Have you ever gone drinking in a city centre yourself? Got separated from friends?

gw80 · 08-04-2018 07:20PM

givyjoe wrote: »

Just like violent video games are a huge factor in mass shootings. Get a grip.

I think there might be somthing in that statement,
This is just my opinion but with the huge amount of free accessible porn that is on the internet being beemed into sexually repressed third world countries, it giving some people the wrong impression of western women, as there is a lot of ordinary looking western women in porn.
Its must be giving some of these people a very scewed impression, that all western women are easy or promiscuous, and i genuinely believe its is a factor in a lot of these sexual assaults commited by recent migrants.

irishrebe · 08-04-2018 07:26PM

pjohnson wrote: »

irishrebe wrote: »

There are people on this thread saying women shouldn't get drunk or stay in hostel dorms. If you're trying to tell me a man would get the same advice, you're deluded. Men can travel the world, sleep in couchettes on night trains, go drinking with random people, stay in dorms, all grand, all just having a good time. A woman doing the same is seen as taking huge risks and putting herself in danger. And then at the same time criticised for assuming the worst of men.

Riiiight.

Apparently gender glasses are built in.

Well ideally men shouldn't do that either. Its not safe. I sure hope you wouldn't instill such recklessness into a son of yours. These men you keep harping about ARE being reckless and endangering themselves.

I'd say there's quite a bit more danger for a man in going to town in Ireland on a Saturday night than doing any of the above.

irishrebe · 08-04-2018 07:28PM

LLMMLL wrote: »

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

You do realise that men are more likely to be the victim of a violent crime?

So of course I would warn both a man or woman about getting drunk while on their own/with strangers in an unknown area.

So why don't we see anything but sympathy for the victims of drunken physical assaults? There's been a few famous cases of assaults in dublin city centre over the years, some with horrific consequences. I don't think I've ever seen anyone say "what was he thinking going out in dublin city centre and drinking". Have you ever gone drinking in a city centre yourself? Got separated from friends?

Exactly. I remember reading stories of men being randomly attacked in Dublin (killed, in some cases) and I don't remember ONE person asking what they were doing walking alone at night. Not one. They were (rightly) seen as unfortunate victims of bad luck. Attacked while just walking home after enjoying spending time with friends. Nobody was asking why they didn't get a taxi, what were they wearing, why were they out at all.

givyjoe · 08-04-2018 07:35PM

And I suppose they think pizza delivery guys always get sex upon delivery of food too right?

magentis · 08-04-2018 07:35PM

The song "Hook in mouth" by megadeth comes to mind when I look at this thread.

"This song is about censorship,This song Is hook in mouth"

Larbre34 · 08-04-2018 07:35PM

irishrebe wrote: »

There are people on this thread saying women shouldn't get drunk or stay in hostel dorms. If you're trying to tell me a man would get the same advice, you're deluded. Men can travel the world, sleep in couchettes on night trains, go drinking with random people, stay in dorms, all grand, all just having a good time. A woman doing the same is seen as taking huge risks and putting herself in danger. And then at the same time criticised for assuming the worst of men.

Riiiight.

Likewise I would give exactly that advice to men as well as women. Of course not all men are rapists but, in my experience in areas busy with young people travelling there is ALWAYS someone looking to take advantage and being assaulted for your money and gear can be almost as bad. If you got taken advantage of in the wrong part of the world you could genuinely wake up minus a kidney.

It'd be super to be able to breeze around the world solo without danger , but thats totally unrealistic, so why shouldnt everyone limit the risks to themselves whenever possible...?

professore · 08-04-2018 07:38PM

irishrebe wrote: »

Exactly. I remember reading stories of men being randomly attacked in Dublin (killed, in some cases) and I don't remember ONE person asking what they were doing walking alone at night. Not one. They were (rightly) seen as unfortunate victims of bad luck. Attacked while just walking home after enjoying spending time with friends. Nobody was asking why they didn't get a taxi, what were they wearing, why were they out at all.

What has that got to do with anything? In question here is meeting a stranger in a nightclub and going back to their bedroom on your own in a foreign country. Male or female this is a BAD idea. Not walking down a street and getting attacked. Two very different scenarios. The latter is just bad luck.

magentis · 08-04-2018 07:40PM

professore wrote: »

What has that got to do with anything? In question here is meeting a stranger in a nightclub and going back to their bedroom on your own in a foreign country. Male or female this is a BAD idea. Not walking down a street and getting attacked. Two very different scenarios. The latter is just bad luck.

Why is it a bad idea????

This happens all over the world every night of the week.This is how many people came to exist!!!!!

Pero_Bueno · 08-04-2018 07:41PM

The Backwards Man wrote: »

This is a quandry for the resident racist mysoginists that infest this site.

Wow thats the 1st thing that came to your mind ?

I'm curious what's your opinion on the Belfast rape trial ?
Scumbags that were guilty that got away with it yeah ???

Irish woman gang raped by 6 men in Czech hotel

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