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Belfast rape trial - all 4 found not guilty Mod Note post one

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Comments

  • #6302
    tretorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,800 ✭✭✭tretorn


    Silentcorner wrote: »
    It is because they are worlds apart, in relevance and context.

    They arent worlds apart, one person using the word slut is male so therefore the word used means he disrespects all women so this means he should be convicted of indecent exposure.

    What do you mean by relevance and context, what do you think of a woman describing other women she doesnt even know as slutty.

    The other women were kind to the woman who alleged rape, they were good friends and they testified that they felt sorry for this woman because she didnt know anyone in the house. They wouldnt have been half as nice if they had known she was texting her pals describing them as sluts.


  • #6303
    Colser
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,572 ✭✭✭Colser


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    He was cleared of rape. He did not do nothing wrong unless your standards are in the gutter. SO was cleared of rape too but he understood a human being got hurt that night and for that he spoke of regret. Man up Paddy and apologise.

    I think it's too late for an apology now tbh.It would also probably be interpreted the wrong way by a certain section and cause more uproar.He's in a no win situation now imo,probably best for himself to try and keep as low a profile as possible.

    It's a terrible situation for all involved (in both sides) imo,I can only imagine what all their immediate families are also going through,the effects of this will last a long time.


  • #6304
    tretorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,800 ✭✭✭tretorn


    Donald Trump engaged in lad chat and probsbly still does.
    The feminists went mental but Don is now President of the USA.


  • #6305
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    tretorn wrote: »
    It would have been so much better for all concerned if she had gone home.
    The other women in the house had a good evening of fun with the men and none ended up in bedrooms.
    Dara Florence even managed to have a goid night while being sober.
    The sad truth is most people probably think her behaviour was completely lacking in self respect, people never think this about young men.

    It's utter bull**** that there are double standards nowadays for young men. Just look at this thread. It's all about shaming them for banter. Women can openly discuss men and what they want to do with them and no one bats an eyelid. Imagine a film in the cinema where some guy gets to have sex with lots of sluts. How long would that last? Then look at 50 shades. The double standards are in the other direction.


  • #6306
    Mrsmum
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,860 ✭✭✭Mrsmum


    tritium wrote: »
    Should his accuser issue an apology too? Or just Jackson for financial reasons? Exactly how sleazy and insincere would you like this apology game to be?

    I don't want a sleazy and insincere apology at all. What would make you think that. A small man finds it difficult or impossible to examine himself and all of his behaviour critically whereas a big man knows there is no shame in apologising for the unintentional hurt you have caused another and in this case also the public.


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  • #6307
    AudreyHepburn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,673 ✭✭✭AudreyHepburn


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    He was cleared of rape. He did not do nothing wrong unless your standards are in the gutter. SO was cleared of rape too but he understood a human being got hurt that night and for that he spoke of regret. Man up Paddy and apologise.

    He was cleared of rape ergo he did nothing wrong.

    What he talks about in his private WhatsApp messages is his own business and not something that he needs to apologize for.

    I’ll ask again, and I’d like an answer this time please, what should he apologize for given he’s done nothing wrong?


  • #6308
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Mr.H wrote: »
    fattymuatty wrote:
    A teenager was left sobbing and bleeding through her clothes, these men thought that was something to brag and joke about. Yeah they deserve repercussions. Like it or not when your career is being a high profile sport person you are a role model, people like these should not be in that position.


    Yet she wasn't raped.....

    Stop the witch hunt
    Innocent until proven guilty applies to her as well as the defendants.

    There has been no evidence to suggest she wasn't raped.

    Stop the lies.


  • #6309
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,822 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    AudreyHepburn wrote: »
    He was cleared of rape ergo he did nothing wrong.

    What he talks about in his private WhatsApp messages is his own business and not something that he needs to apologize for.

    I’ll ask again, and I’d like an answer this time please, what should he apologize for given he’s done nothing wrong?

    My take on it is. Certain people wants it to be a crime to use certain words.


  • #6310
    Fann Linn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,085 ✭✭✭Fann Linn


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Innocent until proven guilty applies to her as well as the defendants.

    There has been no evidence to suggest she wasn't raped.

    Stop the lies.

    She wasn't on trial.


  • #6311
    ziggy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,681 ✭✭✭ziggy


    This post has been deleted.


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  • #6312
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    The Talking Bread wrote: »
    Faugheen wrote: »
    Why are you talking about if someone is innocent and if there was consent.

    Olding was found not guilty and says there was consent, and apologised anyway.

    Jackson can despise the woman all he wants, but this is his mess. Notice how very few are talking ill of Olding in comparison to Jackson. He's been an absolute PR disaster since he was acquitted and the sponsors can point to that as well when it comes to Ulster and the IRFUs investigation.

    If I behave like they did, and all the information gets out to clients and customers of where I work, I would be sacked and I wouldn't have a leg to stand on. These boys won't either.

    Clarify what you think he apologised for?

    He apologised for the hurt caused to the complainant and added that it wasn't his intention to upset anyone.

    He admits his actions upset someone. That's not to say he knew he was raping her, either.


  • #6313
    tretorn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,800 ✭✭✭tretorn


    Its just this thread though.
    In real life people agreed with George Hook, parents care a lot about the clothes their daughterrs wear and they dont want them sleeping around.
    They arent too bothered about sons sleeping around, it wont affect the familys reputation the same way, they want the sons to use condomd to protect themselves but after that parents dont care, no one will think badly of young men for getting sex on tap but other women are very judgmental od easy women, eg woman in this case describing the other women as slutty, she didnt describe Jackson or olding as slutty.


  • #6314
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Fann Linn wrote: »
    Faugheen wrote: »
    Innocent until proven guilty applies to her as well as the defendants.

    There has been no evidence to suggest she wasn't raped.

    Stop the lies.

    She wasn't on trial.
    But yet people can still say a rape didn't take place, so therefore she's a liar?

    Nothing in that case or verdict says a rape didn't take place. It's absolutely wrong to suggest otherwise.

    What exactly is the point of your post?


  • #6315
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    whereas a big man knows there is no shame in apologising for the unintentional hurt you have caused another and in this case also the public.

    Yes and that'd be fine if was facing a mature public, he isn't though is he?

    He's facing a narrowminded group of hate filled morons already baying for blood. So if he apologises now, no matter how sincere, the only thing that would happen is that the mature crowd would go : ' yeah dude, we know, carry on'

    and the rest would just go :

    'we f*cking knew it!!!'


  • #6316
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,944 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Faugheen wrote: »
    He apologised for the hurt caused to the complainant and added that it wasn't his intention to upset anyone.

    He admits his actions upset someone. That's not to say he knew he was raping her, either.

    How do you know Jackson hasn't done this too, privately?

    Exactly - you don't.


  • #6317
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Innocent until proven guilty applies to her as well as the defendants.

    There has been no evidence to suggest she wasn't raped.

    Stop the lies.

    More double standards..
    Theres an ixnay on the "she falsified her claim", and rightly so.
    But you seem quite comfortable with the "although acquitted, theres no evidence she wasnt raped"


  • #6318
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Faugheen wrote: »
    He apologised for the hurt caused to the complainant and added that it wasn't his intention to upset anyone.

    He admits his actions upset someone. That's not to say he knew he was raping her, either.

    How do you know Jackson hasn't done this too, privately?

    Exactly - you don't.

    Why would he apologise privately and then turn around and say the PSNI and PPS sought out a malicious case against him because he's an Irish rugby player with the complainant as their main witness?

    If he has apologised privately, then the above makes that apology very insincere, and in fact it looks worse for him that privately he's saying sorry, but publically he's attacking the very people who took the case on her behalf.

    Think about things before you suggest bull**** and you wont look like an idiot.


  • #6319
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    More double standards..
    Theres an ixnay on the "she falsified her claim", and rightly so.
    But you seem quite comfortable with the "although acquitted, theres no evidence she wasnt raped"

    I seem to recall there is an ixnay on the 'they are still rapists' as well?


  • #6320
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    Faugheen wrote: »
    Innocent until proven guilty applies to her as well as the defendants.

    There has been no evidence to suggest she wasn't raped.

    Stop the lies.

    More double standards..
    Theres an ixnay on the "she falsified her claim", and rightly so.
    But you seem quite comfortable with the "although acquitted, theres no evidence she wasnt raped"

    The lads weren't found guilty of anything, so they are presumed innocent.

    She hasn't been found guilty of anything, yet she's a presumed liar?

    You're right, it is double standards. Thanks for pointing that out to me.


  • #6321
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,944 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Why would he apologise privately and then turn around and say the PSNI and PPS sought out a malicious case against him because he's an Irish rugby player with the complainant as their main witness?

    If he has apologised privately, then the above makes that apology very insincere, and in fact it looks worse for him that privately he's saying sorry, but publically he's attacking the very people who took the case on her behalf.

    Think about things before you suggest bull**** and you wont look like an idiot.

    He isn't the only one critical of the case coming to court.

    And I fail to see why he couldn't make an apology in private. Olding made one with reservations which you are lauding him for. Why couldn't Jackson?


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  • #6322
    Captain Obvious
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,165 ✭✭✭Captain Obvious


    professore wrote: »
    It's utter bull**** that there are double standards nowadays for young men. Just look at this thread. It's all about shaming them for banter. Women can openly discuss men and what they want to do with them and no one bats an eyelid. Imagine a film in the cinema where some guy gets to have sex with lots of sluts. How long would that last? Then look at 50 shades. The double standards are in the other direction.

    You've never seen a Bond movie?
    AudreyHepburn wrote: »
    He was cleared of rape ergo he did nothing wrong.

    What he talks about in his private WhatsApp messages is his own business and not something that he needs to apologize for.

    I’ll ask again, and I’d like an answer this time please, what should he apologize for given he’s done nothing wrong?

    He was cleared of rape means he did nothing illegal. Wether he did something wrong or not is a matter of opinion and there's clearly a large body of people who believe he did something wrong. I'd agree with you in that he shouldn't apologise if he feels he did nothing wrong though.


  • #6323
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Faugheen wrote: »
    Why would he apologise privately and then turn around and say the PSNI and PPS sought out a malicious case against him because he's an Irish rugby player with the complainant as their main witness?

    If he has apologised privately, then the above makes that apology very insincere, and in fact it looks worse for him that privately he's saying sorry, but publically he's attacking the very people who took the case on her behalf.

    Think about things before you suggest bull**** and you wont look like an idiot.

    He isn't the only one critical of the case coming to court.

    And I fail to see why he couldn't make an apology in private. Olding made one with reservations which you are lauding him for. Why couldn't Jackson?

    Because Jackson publically is slamming the authorities and insinuating that they only brought the case to court because he's an international rugby player.

    What part of that are you failing to grasp?

    How could he say this publically and then turn around and say 'I'm sorry for hurting you, but the authorities are wee pricks'?

    How? Tell me that.

    That's right, you can't, because the idea of common sense goes right over your head.

    Olding apologised publically and didn't attack anyone. All Jackson is doing is pointing the finger of him being an absolute animal at other people.

    Would would apologising privately do for him? **** all, he's supposed to be in damage limitation mode and you're saying it's better for him to repair the damage by apologising privately?

    Go away, you are so out of your depth it's unreal.


  • #6324
    Tsipras
    Closed Accounts Posts: 493 ✭✭Tsipras


    Looking forward to HER apology to PJ
    Live on TV would be great


  • #6325
    Fann Linn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,085 ✭✭✭Fann Linn


    Captain Obvious wrote: »
    You've never seen a Bond movie?



    He was cleared of rape means he did nothing illegal. Wether he did something wrong or not is a matter of opinion and there's clearly a large body of people who believe he did something wrong. I'd agree with you in that he shouldn't apologise if he feels he did nothing wrong though.

    Equally there's a large body of people who believe he did nothing wrong.
    Haven't looked at this threads poll lately, but what does that say?

    Doesn't really matter however as the only verdict that counts is the one that came from the courts.


  • #6326
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Tsipras wrote: »
    Looking forward to HER apology to PJ
    Live on TV would be great

    She has nothing to apologise for there, horse.


  • #6327
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,944 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Because Jackson publically is slamming the authorities and insinuating that they only brought the case to court because he's an international rugby player.

    What part of that are you failing to grasp?

    How could he say this publically and then turn around and say 'I'm sorry for hurting you, but the authorities are wee pricks'?

    How? Tell me that.

    That's right, you can't, because the idea of common sense goes right over your head.

    Olding apologised publically and didn't attack anyone. All Jackson is doing is pointing the finger of him being an absolute animal at other people.

    Would would apologising privately do for him? **** all, he's supposed to be in damage limitation mode and you're saying it's better for him to repair the damage by apologising privately?

    Go away, you are so out of your depth it's unreal.

    Olding said the complainant was wrong, in his apology but that he wanted to say he regretted what happened that night.

    Why is it not possible that Jackson could say that ''while the police were wrong I want...etc etc etc.

    You need to calm down a wee bit and think about this tbh.


  • #6328
    Andrew Beef
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 754 ✭✭✭Andrew Beef


    Paddy Jackson has done NOTHING wrong. He was found not guilty unanimously by a jury which took just over 2 hours to reach that conclusion. The salient evidence, provided by the only sober person at the party, spoke of a non-menacing two guys/one girl threesome; Paddy Jackson sent one Whatsapp which referred to “spit-roasting” which is a colloquial and conventional term for such a threesome.

    The guy’s down €500,000 and his career hangs in Ireland hangs in the balance; Paddy Jackson is the victim here.


  • #6329
    NIMAN
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,944 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    A defending lawyer has received death threats.

    So some numpty on the Internet thinks it fine to kill a man because there was a court decision they didn't agree with.

    I'll kill you, even if it's due to a case which has f all to do with me, involved people I have never met or will ever know, but I care so much about it I'm prepared to do life in prison for it.

    Kinda sums up a lot of the people who are so up in arms on the net these days.


  • #6330
    Here we go
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 286 ✭✭Here we go


    Faugheen wrote: »
    I'm blaming him for his actions.

    He performed sex acts on a woman who was left bleeding (which he knew) and in hysterics.

    He boasted about spitroasting said woman (who was left bleeding and in hysterics) on whatsapp.

    He used his standing as an international rugby player to suggest this was a malicious case that was brought against him.

    He hasn't apologised to the woman despite the fact Olding has.

    That's all on him. Stop telling me to not blame him for his actions. He behaved in a way that made a woman feel like she was raped (note I said 'feel like' and am not saying he raped her. Big difference). That is inexcusable.

    He is an international rugby player (he may have said that once or twice) and he behaved despicably. That is enough for him to lose his job if the IRFU and Ulster sees fit.

    The IRFU won't be pandering to any politician. If the sponsors don't want those two wearing their logos, then there's plenty the IRFU have on Jackson and Olding if they so need.

    Also, show me the evidence that she filed a false allegation please. Innocent until proven guilty works both ways.

    Just in the bleeding I’ve seen it mentioned a few times can you or anyone else clarify I heard somewhere it may have been period blood and if sowoukd be bleeding if sat at home or in the party just that time is this false ?


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  • #6331
    Katgurl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,145 ✭✭✭Katgurl


    Why are people still arguing that the issue is Jackson thought the sex was consensual even if she didn't?

    Jackson has claimed not to have had sex with her at all.


This discussion has been closed.
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