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Moving on up ...

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,038 ✭✭✭Neady83


    Oh, lucky you! Have yet to even walk the WHW but I sometimes see the Highland Fling on people's facebooks.

    Do you need any crew support? :)

    I'd promise to take some pictures for you but I hardly ever take the phone out of my bag but you never know this time :)

    I don't think I need a crew for this one as there are very few access points to the trail and the FAQs point to the roads being quite congested in past years because of spectators & crews. Thank you though. There will be drop bag along the way so that should do me I think.

    Very much looking forward to seeing a new part of Scotland as I've only ever ben further North.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Neady83 wrote: »
    I'd promise to take some pictures for you but I hardly ever take the phone out of my bag but you never know this time :)

    I don't think I need a crew for this one as there are very few access points to the trail and the FAQs point to the roads being quite congested in past years because of spectators & crews. Thank you though. There will be drop bag along the way so that should do me I think.

    Very much looking forward to seeing a new part of Scotland as I've only ever ben further North.

    Well, I think don't worry about the photos as I plan to walk this in summer anyway (or maybe a walk/run combination). It won't be as spectacular as the highlands but if you get decent weather would be a very nice route to run.

    Hope the training is going well.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Ok, here we go with another update. It's not quite what I'd like to be writing but not a disaster either....

    26th-1st Oct:
    Plan was to cutback the running to about 18miles total, plus a lot of hillwalking over the Easter weekend. Was aiming for 7, 4, 4, 3 miles of running and hoping to frontload it to have two runs done before travelling on Thursday.

    Monday: nothing as planned
    Still having that feeling of the chest having worked after Saturday's parkrun (no not a heart attack or anything ...). It's so long since I raced *anything*.

    Tuesday: 6.6miles @10:36 avg
    Plan had been a hilly 7miles, but the legs were still stiff from Saturday, so I just did a loop of Holyrood and some extra miles and took it easy.

    Wednesday: nothing
    Had planned 4miles for today but busy trying to finish work and pack and pickup winter hiking gear, no time to run.

    Thursday: 9.5miles low-level walking, 4.5miles hillwalk(750m)
    Left Edinburgh at the horrific hour of 8am (three bags with me, and water bottles jumping out from the backback side pockets as I scurried to catch my lift) and drove North. Stopped at Dalrigh near Tyndrum (Neady! your destination) and parked the car and did a flat walk on tracks to the bottom of Ben Lui and back again to the car. There was never a plan to climb the mountain, we were headed to lunch.
    We arrived in Ballachulish at 3:30, way earlier than most of the group. One of the others suggested to hike up Pap of Glencoe before dinner and since there was plenty of time and a bit of sunshine it seemed silly not to do it. I was with two fit people and about halfway up I was struggling to continue on a steepish section and let them go ahead. Everything improved after I stopped trying to chase and I made it up to the top of the mountain just a few minutes behind them for some spectacular views. We came down the hill quite fast and the toes got a bit of abuse from the winter boots - bit annoyed about that as there were only patches of snow high-up and I shouldn't have bothered wearing them. Despite my tough bit going up we beat walkhighlands by quite a bit.
    https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/fortwilliam/papofglencoe.shtml

    Friday: undulating 10miles walking
    Toes were sore from last night's hill, left big toenail showing the sign of abuse. Went for a low-level walk instead of a climb, this one:
    https://www.walkingbritain.co.uk/walk-3506-description
    Bits of up-and-downs and rough patches, but no climb.

    Saturday: undulating 12miles walking, 6.4 miles run@10:15
    Had hopes of using the crampons and ice-axe today but all the higher walks being planned were "interesting" rather than simple munros. Have done the winter skills training but it was two years ago and hardly any practice since, so not confident. Gave the toes an extra rest day with a lower walk, this one (with a wee detour at the start):
    https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/fortwilliam/blackwater.shtml
    When we came back I wasn't a bit tired so I went out and did some running miles on the road :).

    Sunday: 4miles hillwalk (650m)
    Short walk for Easter Sunday doing Beinn A Chrulaiste, an easy Corbett with great views of the surrounding mountains. Gorgeous sunny weather and the views did not disappoint (see photo below, best one of my weekend). There was dry snow for the 100m or so before the summit and we slid down it on the way back down. Towards the front of the group on this walk, running does have its benefits ...

    weekly total: 13miles, 40miles hillwalking
    With the new chilled relaxed approach to running I was ok leaving the run-mileage at 13, no inclination to make up the few miles. Came back to Edinburgh on the Monday and resisted signing up for the Seven Hills!
    That's more or less it for "winter walking" possibilities (not a single one taken up) for the year I think, but I'll plan to do the training again next autumn and actually get some proper experience over next winter.


    2nd-8th April:
    Plan was to cover 26miles as (5, 3, 5 tempo, 4 w strides, 9 hilly), and a bit of cross-training on top of that. Reality was that I had to back off the running a bit because of sore foot/ankle, and no real LSR was done ...

    Monday: nothing as planned

    Tuesday: 4miles easy @10:01 avg
    On the tarmac of the meadows as the the trails were like a swamp. Wet and not so enjoyable. Bits of tendony stuff at the join of the foot and the shin of the right leg (had previously noticed this the week before the hillwalking I think, but worse today)

    Wednesday: nothing
    Not sure why today's run was skipped, no note made, but possibly the foot stuff. Or possibly laziness.

    Thursday: 5.1miles @9:58 avg pace
    No tempo because the foot/ankle was still upset, just did an easy run on my coastal loop. It took a half mile or so to ease it things out this evening, bit worse than when it started.

    Friday: nothing as planned

    Saturday: 8miles @10:05 avg
    Aware of mileage deficit, so planned a longer run today, a mildly hilly route with two laps of Holyrood. Had the ankly feel from the right foot at the start, then it improved, returned a couple of miles into the run, then eased off and behaved the rest of the way. Hmmmmm ....

    Sunday: 6miles @10:29avg
    Had been planning yesterday's run a second time but the ankle was a bit weak/wobbly from a couple of miles in so I cut the run short and did a playing field lap instead of a second Holyrood loop. Would have been better going straight home I agree.
    Was coming down a grassy descent avoiding some wet spots and I realised that likely upset to the leg had been the hillwalking with some sideways ups and downs, on top of the niggle that was already there .... went looking for the miraculous Gary Crowley do-it-yourself site this evening and worked my way through the trigger release and stretches for ankle pain. Things were very sore at the higher trigger for peroneals, but also sore at the lower trigger point... and a bit of posterior tibialis upset too.

    weekly total: 23.2miles


    9th-15th April:
    Let's not bother with what the plan said for this week. Was feeling a bit of "ankly-ness" even walking early this week, so focus changed to sorting out the foot/ankle. Stretching and trigger-point release my new goals.

    Monday-Wednesday: nothing
    Was doing a bit of trigger-point release on the peroneals (not so much I'd damage them :rolleyes:), some foot-rolling for the posterior tibialis, and some calf stretches. Ankle sometimes niggly while walking, so not trying running yet. Busy days at work so no cross-training either.

    Thursday: 1mile test
    Came back to Dublin this evening and foot/ankle better so decided to try a short run. Ankle in particular was giving trouble early on so cut it short after a mile and walked back to base. More trigger-point stuff that evening, and found some tight spots I hadn't worked before. One was the anterior tibialis and that would explain the tightness between shin and foot which was the earliest sign. Though to be honest it's more a question of which tendon *isn't* upset in this instance :rolleyes:.

    Friday-Saturday: nothing
    The calf stretches and anterior stretches and trigger-point stuff.

    Sunday: 5.2miles easy (10:32)
    Poor Callum Hawkins.
    Some cautious Dublin miles. Foot/ankle discomfort throughout mile 1 but not as bad as Thursday, things started to ease out in mile 2. Took the turn back to Terenure/HX around mile 2 to bring things in at 3.5miles but the ankle and foot continued to improve as I ran and I ended on adding a couple of loops near the house. Was still feeling decent at 5miles but I'm (maybe) not a total idiot so I stopped.

    weekly total: 6.2miles
    Didn't have as much trouble resisting running as usual, goal of 2018 is "keeping the show on the road" so if I have to rest more I will. Didn't have any trouble skipping the cross-training either surprise surprise, but I will do some over the coming week.
    Really seeing the benefit of being signed-up for nothing in terms of niggle management. Will do another parkrun whenever this has been settled for a couple of weeks.


    View from Beinn a Chrulaiste including Buachaille Etive Mor:448394.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,355 ✭✭✭Bungy Girl


    Incredible photo !!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Bungy Girl wrote: »
    Incredible photo !!!

    All the better to divert from other issues, my dear :pac:


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,355 ✭✭✭Bungy Girl


    All the better to divert from other issues, my dear :pac:

    True. But it sounds like you're being sensible (resisting the temptation to sign up for the Seven Hills can't have been easy) and adhering to the 2018 goal !


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,038 ✭✭✭Neady83


    Oh wow, that view and I bet the photo doesn't even do it justice - it's breathtaking, I love it.

    You're doing really well, keep this show on the road because we want to see more pictures like this :) Tyndrum, eeekkkkk it's getting close.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Just coming to the end of 8weeks of on-and-off running to see off the tendon problems (and a bit of bone stress), seems to be settled now so will add in an entry. Have not as lost that much fitness as I might have as there has been sporadic cross-training. Overall a "good experience" as caught the bone stress very early and didn't lose too much time as a result.

    16th-22nd April: 25miles as 4runs (LSR 8.5), 1 cycle (30miles)
    The lighter week had given the ankle and foot a rest so was able to do some proper running this week. Still spent a fair bit of time doing trigger-point release on the peroneals and various other muscles and tendons as things still not right.

    23rd-29th April: 0 miles, 1 cycle (30miles)
    Decided to come off the ankle for a few days and then for the whole week. Just one cycle :(. Let one of my 2018 goals fall by the wayside when I picked up the phone and made a physio appointment.

    30th-6th May: 0 miles, 1 aquajog, 2hikes (16.5miles, 1500m ascent)
    Meeting with physio, she did all the various tests on foot and ankle and gave some band-strengthening exercises. No need for a follow-up unless things worsen. She thought it was just tendons, not bone stuff, but I still had a lurking feeling as it's very easy to miss bone trouble in the early stages (and also I am sure it was this very physio who missed my metatarsal SF 3 years ago ... though admittedly she only saw it very early in the process). I had friends coming for the weekend to climb Ben Nevis and was going to be doing that - they had booked the trip at Christmas and I couldn't bail on the main purpose of the visit, even if I'd lose a few weeks of training. Got permission for that if I stopped running for whole week... then play it by ear the following week. 6miles low-level hike on the Saturday brought just a tiny bit of sensitivity, but did the 10miles up-and-down Ben Nevis on Sunday and there was not a peep out of the ankle or foot :) ... or the day afterwards.

    7th-13th May: 22.5miles (LSR 7), 1hike (8miles), 1 cycle(33miles)
    A good week. Was emboldened by the great behaviour of the ankle on the hillwalking weekend, and brought the mileage up over 20miles. Ankle still not perfect though.

    14th-20th May: 14.6miles (LSR 8.5), 1 hike (8miles, 1000m ascent)
    Was checking the leg after my LSR and noticed a bit of bony tenderness on the fibula about 2-3in above the ankle knobble. Had kind-of known in my gut it must be said. All very familiar from the troubles with the other fibula last year. On the positive side, have 0 trouble walking, and am only getting the soreness by tapping on the bone ... so it's very early on the stress reaction timeline.
    Apart from the running, did some tour guide duties taking a friend-of-a-friend (very slowly!) up Ben Lomond. Hillwalking hasn't seemed to upset the ankle at all during all of this ...

    21st-27th May: 10.5miles (LSR 7), 1 cycle (50miles), 1 swim (1100m freestyle)
    Backing off with the running. An extra-long cycle - we cycled 36miles to Dunbar and then found out that the Sunday trains from Dunbar don't allow bikes. So the leisurely cycle out was followed by a frantic 13miles to North Berwick to catch a train from there (making it with 2mins to spare).

    28th-3rd June: 9.2miles
    A lazy week of no cross-training. Two short runs and a lot of time spent tapping the fibula above the ankle :pac:. I did walk 12miles on the Saturday too, not hillwalking, just round town...

    4th-10th June: 15.5miles (LSR 6), 1aquajog (60mins), 1 swim (1200m freestyle), 1spin (60min)
    A good week running every second day, and by the end of it, getting virtually no response from tapping the fibula :) even after the 6 miles. Hurray! Back in Dublin for a few days, and did swim/spin in Swan leisure. Also a light bit of spectating at the Wicklow Way race where Neady was 3rd female.

    Will continue the every second day running next week, but feeling very optimistic now. Hope to get in a decent cycle too.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,038 ✭✭✭Neady83


    I really enjoy reading about your adventures, especially the hillwalking :) You're incredibly patient and intuitive and doing a really good job at rehabbing, an example to us all.

    p.s. thanks so much for coming out to cheer on Saturday, I really appreciated seeing you and it was lovely to put a name to the face. Sorry for not hanging around too long in the CPs.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Neady83 wrote: »
    I really enjoy reading about your adventures, especially the hillwalking :) You're incredibly patient and intuitive and doing a really good job at rehabbing, an example to us all.

    p.s. thanks so much for coming out to cheer on Saturday, I really appreciated seeing you and it was lovely to put a name to the face. Sorry for not hanging around too long in the CPs.

    That is very kind of you to call those adventures :pac:, not quite what I would hope for but doing what I can for now.

    It's your job to *not* hang round at CPs! Nice seeing you and Well Done.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Have had a cold since the start of the week and only did 3runs instead of 4 as a consequence. But not too bad at week at all in fact, two longish runs, and a long hike yesterday which significantly contributed to "time on feet" :pac:

    Monday: 5.5 miles @10:17 avg pace
    Late night run. Had travelled back to Edinburgh with a cold, not yet in the chest, and decided I'd do the run while I could.

    Tuesday, Wednesday: nothing
    Watching the cold ...

    Thursday: 7.5miles @10:32 avg pace
    Was a bit better today (though cold not fully gone), so did the run after work. Knew I had a big hike at the weekend, so was aiming to get the "long" run out of the way now, or so I thought. First Hillyish run in ages and fibula behaved fine.

    Friday: nothing

    Saturday: 7.85miles @10:00+ pace
    Hike had got pushed to Sunday because of the weather, so I was running today. Went out in the evening after weather was clearing, planning to do something between 5 and 8.5 miles, thinking of the lost miles. Mad stuff with the Garmin, but the run was done, and no trouble except I noticed a bit of fibula sensitivity that evening.

    Sunday: 18mile hike (900m ascent over 4 small hills)
    Needed to recce the "Dun Rig horseshoe" as I will lead a group on this route next weekend, so headed out with a friend in the morning to take the bus to Peebles. The route is 15miles anyway, but with the extra distance to bus stop, 17miles, and then a couple of tos-and-fros fixing routing errors on top of that. Nice scenery but all "rolling hills" and the various hills looking a bit similar which did not help. Also a stiff breeze when we were higher up. With all the route-finding and chatting it took us 8.5hours :eek: which was not expected (and a ridiculous early start this morning to finish bit of work I was too tired to do last night). Fibula fine when I got home, somehow the hillwalking is not challenging it at all, just the running. Cold is back a bit though ...
    https://www.walkhighlands.co.uk/borders/dun-rig.shtml
    Excellent time-on-feet I suppose, which cannot harm with the base building. And will be doing it again next weekend.


    weekly total: 20.5miles as 3runs, 1 hike (18miles, 900m)

    Next week, more of the same.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,810 ✭✭✭Huzzah!


    18 miles! Fair play. I definitely think hiking helps base building.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Huzzah! wrote: »
    18 miles! Fair play. I definitely think hiking helps base building.

    That's what I like to hear :)

    To be honest it felt like it would have been easier to run it, but that's probably wishful thinking.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Not quite a copy of the previous week but close enough! The cold is not 100% gone but better than a week ago, so fingers crossed I will shift the dregs of it this week.

    Monday: 5.15miles @10:35 avg pace
    Knackered after the Sunday hike and an 6:30am wake-up to finish some work before start-of-day, did this run on a flattish coastal loop in the evening. Quads very tight, and the legs were heavy after the efforts of the weekend. But good to have it done and no fibula issues.

    Tuesday: nothing as planned

    Wednesday: 8.5miles @10:03 avg
    Did this after work on the meadows trails. It was going to just be 6 miles but the sun came out after a few miles so I decided I'd turn it into this weeks long run and keep it well away from Saturday's hike. The legs were feeling quite light this evening.

    Thursday: nothing
    Had planned I might run today, but was coughing extra today and decided to leave it.

    Friday: 4.8miles @10:20 avg
    A shorter one than yesterday's planned 6+ because of the hike tomorrow, again on flat trails. Was coughing a fair bit along the way but felt better afterwards.

    Saturday: 17mile hike (900m ascent over 4 small hills)
    Exact same hike as last week, except done with 4 others (me leading) and since I knew the route properly this time, there was no backtracking. Bit faster than last Sunday. Bit knackered afterwards again :rolleyes:.

    Sunday: 6.6miles @10:49 avg pace
    Managed to avoid the heat by going out for an early dinner, and leaving the run till after at 9pm. Flattish coastal loop with extra distance added and there was plenty of daylight around for the whole run. The legs were feeling heavy after yesterday's efforts and and the pace was correspondingly slow.

    weekly total: 25.1miles as 4runs, 1 hike (17miles, 900m)


    Today a day off running, hurray! (in the sunshine :) ), and similar week of running ahead, plus one hike.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    The base building continues ...

    Monday: nothing as planned

    Tuesday: 5.5miles with 5 100m strides in final mile
    Well, 4 strides at least. Did the last one on a hill and Garmin track showed no evidence of any pace at that stage :pac:. Run was mostly on trail.

    Wednesday: 9.5miles @10:24 avg pace
    Hike planned for Friday so doing the long run early. About half trails/grass and half hard surfaces, done in lunchtime sunshine. A bit hilly but nothing major, pace was comfortable.

    Thursday: 3.2miles @10:38 avg pace
    Three neighborhood laps at easy pace without the Garmin.

    Friday: cross-training! 8mile hike with 900m+ ascent
    A friend from the US was in Edinburgh and keen to try a munro so I took a half-day and we headed west to do Ben Lomond. Gorgeous weather so a bit too hot on the ascent but the views were spectacular this evening. A much steeper climb than the route of past two weeks, but also much shorter, wasn't tired after this hike which was a novelty after the long-distance of previous weeks.

    Saturday: 3.8 miles @10:20 avg pace
    Had been at a horrible stressful event all day so couldn't run, eventually got myself out for a Cinderella run round the neighbourhood loop.

    Sunday: 15m w/u, 10m fartlek, 10m easy, 10m fartlek, 15m c/d (overall 6.2miles @9:42 avg)
    Current plan of running is "miles in the legs" but am planning a parkrun trial in two weeks so want to add a tiny bit of speed this week and next. Did this one on the meadows trails in evening sunshine, though most of the 2nd fartlek was on tarmac. Was feeling quite reluctant going out, all recent running has been easy-pace and it feels very nice, was thinking I might bail on this one and turn it into yet another easy run but when it came to it I was able to do it and not as horrible as I thought it might be. Was hitting the lap button on the Garmin for each section and both fartlek sections came in very close to 8:30 pace. Was a lovely run in the sunshine except for pollen issues and also smoke from the various barbecues in the park.

    weekly total: 28.2miles as 5runs, 1 hike (8miles, 900m+)

    Most of the runs done in sunshine, except the Cinderella one obviously, but it's not quite as hot here as in Ireland and have mostly been running in about 20C which is ok.

    Running plans will be more or less the same next week. Am looking forward to the weekend forecast and thinking there may be hiking after all (had planned to skip next week) ... either way I'll keep the long run midweek for a number of weeks ahead.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    "miles in the legs" again .... base building.

    Monday: 3.8miles @10:34 avg pace
    The plan to was get my Long Run in midweek to keep it away from the effort of the weekend's hike, so was moving all my running early. Did this on a local tarmac route in early evening and got attacked by a Seagull sweeping down about a km from home, felt it brush my head as it dived. Would have written it off as an accident but it turned round on its ascent and came back for another dive, ahem, definitely deliberate. Have been told it likely had a youngster on the ground that it was worried about, so I will not carry a grudge.

    Tuesday: 5.3miles easy (10:16 pace)
    Done on the meadows in the evening sunshine, mostly trail. Went fine but later that evening I noticed a bit of ankle wobbly-ness a few times and when I went tapping the fibula it was a bit sensitive again. It had improved a couple hours later but decided to change my plans for the week anyway, and take tomorrow off. Looking up details over past weeks saw that I had run nearly 8 days in a row ("nearly" because one of those was a hike), had not realised that and wouldn't have aimed for that ...

    Wednesday: nothing
    No long run. Did the trick in resting the fibula and there's been no sensitivity since (even though it's had quite a bit of action since).

    Thursday: 10.8miles @10:28 avg pace
    Ankle was grand so set off in the evening to do two loops of Holyrood Park plus one Innocent-path loop, had a lovely run on a mixture of grass/trail (4miles) and the rest tarmac. Bit hilly. Met a pheasant along the side of the trail just before the 2mile point, he was calm and unruffled, picking his way alongside tall grass. Around 6miles I was coming out of the Park and heading down towards Duddingston and there was a quiet young bunny rabbit eating calmly on the grass verge beside the path, he didn't move an inch and could easily have snapped him if I'd had my phone. Another 4 bouncy rabbits in a wooded copse before coming back into the park.
    Only negative for the run was suffering from pollen issues in the greener patches, especially near those tall weeds with smelly cream flowers ("Cows parsley" I think) ... also the stretch up the Innocent path is massively verdant right now with new weed growth, blackberry bushes, trees bursting with leaves crossing overhead, like a green tunnel ... *yeuuch*. I tried to breathe through my nose for some of these tricky patches and it seemed to help.
    Ankle was ok after fortunately :)

    Friday: 4.2miles @10:45 avg pace
    Mostly grass/trail. Was doing this after work and even though it was evening it was still warm, around 21C, and I was slow.

    Saturday: cross-training: 9mile hike with 1150m+ ascent, lake "swim"
    Went up to the Loch Earn area with a group to climb Ben Vorlich and Stuc A'Chroin, two munros with overall ascent of 1150m. Tough enough hike with hot sunshine for the first 1/2 of ascent, also 200m or so of scrambling to get to the 2nd summit, and some tricky downhill sections on the way back. We went into the lake for 15-20 mins to loosen out our legs before heading back to Edinburgh. Enjoyable day but tiring, and I slept a bit in the car on the way home.
    As usual, as far as I can tell, the hiking does not seem to be stressing the fibula or anything else, the only effect I'm noticing is stiffness in the couple days after. It is definitely great "time on feet" training.

    Sunday: 5.15miles not-so-easy (10:04 avg pace)
    Had been aiming to do a little bit of fartlek on this, but was a bit tired after yesterday's hike, so decided to drop the bit of speed. Went out early afternoon when it was 24C, and it was *hot*, was keeping an eye on the watch for the first couple of miles and then decided to ignore, but not take it too easy. Result of that is that it came in faster than any of the other runs this week and with the heat, it was probably "steady" effort. Legs didn't seem as heavy as they'd usually be the day after a hike which is also good.
    Came past the same stretch of Monday's incident towards the end of this run, fortunately no aggro today.

    weekly total: 29.3miles as 5runs, 1 hike (9miles, 1150m+)


    Ok, next week it will *not* be "more of the same". Am taking a cutback week, aim is 21miles (5,5,5,6) and Saturday's run will incorporate a parkrun trial. The forecast for the weekend is looking very nice (*stamps foot*), but if I do a hike I'll try to make sure it's an easier one.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    A doss week ...

    Monday: nothing as planned

    Tuesday: 5.05miles with 3@MP (9:37, 9:26, 9:20)
    Did this on the meadows in evening with w/u and c/d around 10:20-10:30. I stuck my parkrun time from March into the McMillan calculator and it gave 9:28 for MP so was aiming for that. Hard to gauge the effort as it's not a pace I recognise, so was keeping an eye on the watch ... managed to get it fairly close, with the 1st mile too slow, and 3rd one a bit fast. Had 5 hill sprints to do with this run but there was no good hill near this route, so postponed those to Thursday's run.

    Wednesday, Thursday: nothing
    Had a rest-day planned for Wednesday, then laziness took over and I was unable to budge from my sofa on Thursday. I didn't even have anything else on ... :o

    Friday: 5.35miles very easy (10:52 avg pace), including 5 hill sprints
    Did this as a lunchtime run round Holyrood Park but took the pace very easy as I was doing the parkrun in the morning. Stopped at a sharp hill at 3.5 miles and did 5 hill sprints with decent effort and questionable technique.

    Saturday: parkrun in 25:48 (8:07, 8:05, 8:33), 2miles easy, 21miles over 3bike rides
    The last time I did a parkrun was back in March and it came in at 25:28. Since then I had 7-8 weeks of mixed mileage watching the fibula, and recently another 4-5 consistent weeks of mileage. There had also been a fair bit of cross-training so despite the lack of any speed training I was "hopexpecting"(TM) this would come in under 25mins. Was not to be ... On the race day itself it was sunny and warm even standing in the pack as they they made the announcements, was 20C already at 9:30am ... went out the aim of getting mile 1 a bit below 8mins but could feel I was at 5k effort before that, did my best and it came in at 8:07. Then 2nd mile at 8:05 and the 3rd mile is where things got hard - I was having a light stitch in my side for the first half of this mile which is very rare for me, and apart from that the effort was too much, in fact I pulled up after 2.5 miles and walked 4 steps before getting going again :o. Anyway mile 3 ended up at 8:33, the "bit" at 8:05, and a disappointing result with no chance to improve my easy/steady/MP paces. Not even sure the warm weather was the problem to be honest, might just be lost fitness. Wish I was back in the 23:xx zone.
    Did 2miles at easy pace to cool-down, one of those should have been warm-up but I didn't arrive in time for that.
    Three bike rides today - 6miles to parkrun, then 7 miles getting lost and taking a scenic route from the parkrun site to go fruit-picking (poor hedgehog dead on the road on this one). Of course was not able to transport all my berries on the bike so had to come back later that evening and do 8miles cycling the bike home.

    Sunday: 5.6miles easy (10:56 avg pace)
    Maybe slightly quicker than that as the Garmin did something weird near the start, but close enough, a true easy pace. Evening run and I was not really in the mood for this, but I kicked myself out. Noticed a mild stitch in the third mile again, so clearly yesterday's pace was not the problem then!

    weekly total: 21.1miles as 4runs, 21miles cycling


    Will use the MylesS/Testosterscone rules to estimate training paces:

    pace | min-per-mile
    5k: | 8:13
    Easy: | 10:43-11:13
    Steady: | 9:28-9:58
    MP: | 8:58-9:28
    HMP: | 8:38-8:53
    10k: | 8:28- 8:43


    Though also noticing that McMillan calculator gives MP as 9:36 (for a marathon of 4:11:24) ... so need to keep on eye on both.
    Have definitely been doing my easy runs a bit too fast.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    plans going forward ...

    Love making plans, this one has been polished and re-considered various times, itching to put it down in .txt even though likely it's an immediate jinx. Anyway ... I was foolish enough to invest in a DCM place, bought in May for E80 as the tickets were selling out and when I thought the fibula niggle would sort itself out quicker than it did.

    The main priority for now is (careful) base building, so not too different from novice marathon training. I am going to train alongside the DCM group for the time being, and see how it goes, but right now I am expecting I'll pull back mileage before the end of the training, and skip the race itself. Have drawn up a plan which is essentially the Boards plan except that I'll increase the LSR more gradually, and with the short runs a bit longer ... I don't put on my runners for less than 4-5 miles. I also have a couple of cutback weeks in there for caution.

    I am aiming to do a HM early in September, possibly the RosGoRun on 9th, and will use that as a deadline to decide whether to finish the marathon training. Apart from that I might do a parkrun in 5 weeks time on my next cutback week, but it'll depend on overall picture, including cross-training load. Planning to do one cross-training session each week, and for the next month+ some of those will be hillwalking, so I am keeping the LSR midweek until I do the half-marathon.
    Have been sleeping quite a bit extra lately, will need to be going to bed at 9pm on Wednesdays!

    week | Mon | Tues | Wed | Thur | Fri | Sat | Sun | total
    16-22 Jul |-|5|12 LSR|4|-|5|6 w 4MP| 32
    23-29 Jul |-|5|13 LSR|4|-|5|6 w 4MP| 33
    30-5 Aug |-|5|14 LSR|4|-|7 w 5MP|5| 35
    6-12 Aug |-|5|16 LSR|4|-|7 w 5MP|5| 37
    13-19 Aug |-|5|-|6|-|5 w parkrun|6| 22(CB)
    20-26 Aug |-|5|16 LSR|4|-|5|8 w 6MP| 38
    27-2 Sep |-|5|17 LSR|5|-|5|8 w 6MP| 40
    3-9 Sep |-|5|5|-|4|-|HM + 2miles| 29
    10-16 Sep|-|5|8 w 6MP|5|-|4|19 LSR| 41
    17-23 Sep |-|4|-|7 w 5MP|-|5|10 LSR| 26(CB)
    24-30 Sep|-|5|9 w 7MP|4|-|4|20 LSR| 42
    1-7 Oct|-|5|9 w 7MP|4|-|4|20 LSR| 43
    8-14 Oct|-|4|6 w 4MP|4|-|4|16 LSR| 34
    15-21 Oct|-|4|5 w 3MP|4|-|3|9 LSR| 25
    22-28Oct|-|5|-|5 w 3MP|-|3|DCM| 39



    Will see how it goes, but will not be reluctant to pass-up on DCM training if I get niggles, or the load feels too much. Am shocked how slow I am lately, so if the pace doesn't improve a bit, I'll be wanting an excuse to bail anyhow :o.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,810 ✭✭✭Huzzah!



    Friday: 5.35miles very easy (10:52 avg pace), including 5 hill sprints
    Did this as a lunchtime run round Holyrood Park but took the pace very easy as I was doing the parkrun in the morning. Stopped at a sharp hill at 3.5 miles and did 5 hill sprints with decent effort and questionable technique.

    This done the day before a 5k would scupper any PB attempt for me, personally, so I'd imagine your hopexpectations weren't too far off.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Huzzah! wrote: »
    This done the day before a 5k would scupper any PB attempt for me, personally, so I'd imagine your hopexpectations weren't too far off.

    Really? That's interesting, it was only 5 short hill sprints, I wouldn't have thought it'd make any difference, esp as the run itself was quite easy. Was not a PB attempt i was going for, more a "post years of injury" PB I guess. I'm used to thinking of sub-25 as being "in all right shape".

    Maybe I sabotaged myself with my lazy Thursday :(.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,810 ✭✭✭Huzzah!


    Really? That's interesting, it was only 5 short hill sprints, I wouldn't have thought it'd make any difference, esp as the run itself was quite easy. Was not a PB attempt i was going for, more a "post years of injury" PB I guess. I'm used to thinking of sub-25 as being "in all right shape".

    Maybe I sabotaged myself with my lazy Thursday :(.

    Yep, for me, anyway. I wouldn't really do anything over three miles and might just do a couple of strides. I'm still learning the art of the taper, though. Maybe it's different when it's not a PB attempt though.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Next exciting episode of Operation "miles in the legs". First bit of injury trouble this week, but fibulas, metatarsals, disc all fine ... had some trouble from the left shoulder, but much improved now.

    Monday: nothing as planned

    Tuesday: 5.2miles with 5x100m strides (10:50 avg)
    As my plan. A meadows run on grass/trail with genuinely slow paces around 11min, threw in 5 strides into mile 5 which dropped the avg pace a bit. Pollen giving some trouble.

    Wednesday: 12miles @10:56 avg pace
    Did this one in the evening after work, one and half (round back) clockwise laps of Holyrood Park, 1 Innocent path loop, then up and round the back of Holyrood Park and down to St Margaret's Loch, then home. A bit hilly and paces varied depending on up/downhills. It was a bit harder than I expected to get the final miles done though the pace improved if anything, more a mental time-on-feet thing I think.
    Had some pollen-issues in the first half of this but the coughing lessened after that. Pollen count seems to have dropped off in the last week or two.
    Was feeling rumblings from 5miles or so and as I came into the 6th mile it started feeling more urgent and had to take a detour to take care of some "gastric" issues. Will draw a veil on any details ...

    Thursday: nothing
    Was supposed to do 4miles today but had various things to sort out in the evening and didn't get done.

    Friday: 3.2miles easy @10:58 avg pace
    Yesterday's run - some morning (!) neighbourhood loops as I was doing to be travelling later in the day. Was pushed for time and didn't get all four miles done.

    Back in Dublin Friday night and having some trouble from my left shoulder which is affecting sleep position and range of motion in lifting the arm. The shoulder is not as good as the other one, over the past year or two has occasionally been a bit tight when swimming and in sleep position which is lower arm folded under the pillow, probably not ideal... Bit tighter/sorer today and no idea what set it off. Only possible aggravator would be the dynamic planks and side planks of my bodyweight strengthening as sometimes notice it doing those, but the last time I'd done the strengthening had been Monday ... so I guess aggravated it in sleep or lounging on the sofa or something.

    Saturday: 1mile w/u, 4miles @MP, 1.8miles c/d
    Shoulder worse today but I walked a few miles in the afternoon and the arm swing didn't really bother it, so I was going to try the run, would decide whether to try the MP depending on the w/u mile. Aiming for 9:15 MP pace as that's the middle of the range from Testosterscone's conversion.
    Shoulder didn't give trouble so picked up the pace on mile 2 and brought the MP miles in at 9:21, 9:12, 9:17, 9:10, more consistent than I expected, but it turned out that the individual miles with uphill also had some downhill too so the overall profile was consistent. All the same this felt harder than what I'd imagine for MP, close enough to HMP which is a pace I do recognise.
    Had known setting out that this route was over 7miles, but wanted to make up the lost mileage from yesterday. Just did the missing .8 and then walked the last bit home. Had to drop into the Dropping Well for a pit stop during the 6th mile, discovered that if you enter by the Bar the toilets are right beside the entrance, no need to parade in front of loads of customers, useful to know for the future.

    Sunday: 5.1miles easy (10:37 avg)
    Difficult night of sleep with the shoulder giving real trouble, unable to get any sleep for hours. Was Googling the various likely causes (top culprit the rotator cuff muscles) for the 3rd time at 4:30 in the morning and noticed "take painkillers" on a how-to-treat list .... I never even have a headache, so had not crossed my mind :rolleyes:. Got up and found some paracetamol and was able to sleep after taking that.
    Nice easy 5miler in the early evening, very consistent and comfortable pace, no trouble from the arm at all (of course was still taking painkillers).

    Searched on the Novices thread to see which conversion rules they are using for paces, in fact they are working with McMillan directly. So I will aim my further MP miles a bit closer to that 9:36 pace in future, at least until I have another race result. In the past the predictions from McMillan have been very close for me anyway.

    weekly total: 32.3miles as 5runs

    Apart from a little bit of shuffling, exactly as my plan. Overall this felt like an easy week, suspect that's because of the properly-easy paces and because there was no hike or cycle.

    Shoulder is better (though not perfect) by now, painkiller free as I type this.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,307 ✭✭✭ariana`


    Great week hillsiderunner.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,338 ✭✭✭eyrie


    Glad to hear the shoulder is feeling better this morning! Hope it continues to improve.

    Seriously impressed that you managed your 12 miles in the evening after work!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    ariana` wrote: »
    Great week hillsiderunner.

    Thanks, ariana, I think/hope getting the paces right is making a difference.

    Good luck with your own dilemma, sounds as though you might be on your way to switching goals (I would think you've a good chance of making sub-4 if you do continue though, your base is very good, that makes a big difference ...)
    eyrie wrote: »
    Glad to hear the shoulder is feeling better this morning! Hope it continues to improve.

    Seriously impressed that you managed your 12 miles in the evening after work!!

    Thanks eyrie, I wasn't tired on the Thursday either which was good, so planning to keep the LSR midweek till the HM. You are doing brilliant training yourself!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    The plodding continues in the next episode of Operation "miles in the legs". Had to shuffle the runs around because of very warm weather Thursday and Friday, so the Long Run was pushed to the weekend.

    Monday: nothing as planned

    Tuesday: 5.1miles with 5x100m strides (10:27 avg pace)
    Still in Dublin, needed to go up to Walkinstown to collect a tag we'd ordered for my brother's cat while he is staying with my parents, so ran up to get it, and did 5 strides in the final mile. It was quite humid and though I didn't notice anything on the run, when I got back into the house noticed blobs of sweat dripping onto my Tshirt. Shoulder now good :). Cat now allowed to go out into the garden, yippee, since he is now wearing his digits.

    Wednesday: nothing
    Not as planned, had hoped to do the Long run today. Was coming back a day later than planned because of the Ryanair industrial dispute, had work to do, I was tired and lazy and it was warm....

    Thursday: 6.2miles easy (10:47 avg pace)
    Very hot today, stretching right into the evening, but I was still planning to do the long run after work. Left it till after 7pm to try to avoid the heat but it was still very warm when I headed out. I was doing a cautious pace and feeling comfortable but got to worrying about the effect on tiredness and getting up the next day etc etc ... so I cut it short. When I got back to the house and Googled the local weather it was still reading 25C. Had a stitch a mile and half into this run, on the flat not a downhill, and later on another sharper stitch at the downhill stretch that was triggering the stitch last year. This has only been going on the past couple of weeks, don't normally get them, possibly increased mileage I guess.

    Friday: 6.1miles with 4@MP
    Another hot day, humid 24C in the evening when I did this. On the meadows, mostly grass and trail. Was going to be aiming for around 9:25 pace for the MP miles, just a shade quicker than McMillan's prescribed 9:36. They came out as 9:26, 9:27, 9:20, 9:20 which was about right and felt harder than what I'd expect for MP but in today's case I bet it was the weather. Felt as though I was crawling on the c/d mile (with uphill) but the pace was slightly faster than easy, just over 10min.

    Saturday: 2.6miles easy (10:28 avg pace)
    Just a few miles stuck in to make up for missing mileage midweek.

    Sunday: 13.2miles LSR (10:33 avg pace)
    Had to delay this one till late evening because of torrential rain most of the day (how lovely!), went out after 7pm to do this on my usual LSR turf of Holyrood Park and surroundings. Had drizzle for the first few miles but it cleared after that and was lovely cool weather. I changed the route when I was halfway round to reduce the hilliness of the second half a bit ... I was finding the effort a bit difficult despite the nice cool conditions. Not sure the reason, for once I hadn't eaten a lot during the day and that might have influenced things .. or else just lost endurance. Had meant to go just a sliver over the exact 13miles and had enough of it at 13.2 and walked the last few hundred metres home!
    Another stitch today, what is going on.
    This was all on hard surfaces, no grass/trail today as I was wearing road shoes and the ground was wet.

    weekly total: 33.2miles as 5runs

    Apart from shuffling the Long run to the weekend, matched the plan.

    Niggles: only small ones, but the left achilles is slightly tight, am doing some stretching for it. Also I've had the bum-pinch that accompanies my disc troubles a little bit, so need to keep an eye on that (*sigh*)

    Hoping for a mini-expedition this coming weekend if weather and everything else goes well, so will need to get the Long Run done before the weekend.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    The log is for accountability, alas.

    Tues 31st: 1mile w/u, 4miles MP ..... cut short
    Plan was to do 1mile w/u, 5miles MP, 1mile c/d, but the left calf started giving trouble in the third MP mile (it had been slightly tight at the very start but had eased out). As you'd expect I continued for a while and the inclination was of course (as usual) to at least get the full run done today and see how it was tomorrow, but it was a bit was tighter again after the 4th MP mile, so I had the sense to stop and walk back.

    It might be the end of the marathon plans, but on the other hand that might be a blessing in disguise. Don't really have the proper base for marathon training, and might do no harm to revert to a more gradual base-building for the rest of the year.

    Few days off and some calf stretching for a start, for definite.

    Wondering whether I need to postpone my weekend hike too ...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    The achilles/calf took about a week to settle, and then I needed to re-introduce gradually, so given I'm not working from a large base ... DCM off the plan. Given my history it's very good to have got away with a single week off :rolleyes:.

    Back to the base building, and the plodding continues.

    30th-5th August:

    Monday: nothing
    Had felt the left achilles/lower-calf being a bit tight.

    Tuesday: 1miles w/u, 4miles MP ...
    Had done bits of calf stretching during the day. Went out to do the MP session after work on the meadows, the plan was 1mile w/u, 4@MP, and 1mile c/d. There was a bit of tightness at the start of the run which eased off, but it came back worse a few miles into the MP section and eventually I gave up. Apart from the calf troubles, MP miles worked out ok at 9:26.

    Wednesday - Saturday: nothing
    Reverting to the solution of just-leave-it-alone-and-do-nothing from years ago before I cared that much about training .... rather than testing the leg every hour and trying to maintain fitness with aquajogging/cycling/whatever. Did some festival stuff and went to the pub.

    Sunday: 45miles cycling
    Had gone to the bike shop on Saturday to get the bike sorted out, chain was de-grotted and oiled, types pumped properly and was advised to buy a foot-pedal bike pump. Got a bit of lecture too, as the bike has been very much neglected and I should be taking care of oil and re-pumping etc every 2 weeks and the tyre pressure should be maintained at around 70 whatevers.
    Took advantage of the resurrection of the bicycle to do an out-and-back along the coast today, pace much better than it has been lately, surprise surprise.

    weekly total: 5miles as 1run, 45mile cycle


    6th-12th August:

    Monday-Tuesday: nothing
    Calf/achilles still tight, stayed off the leg a bit more.

    Wednesday: 3.3miles @11min pace
    Grass/trail, on the meadows to test the calf. Seemed to pass.

    Thursday: nothing
    Calf bit niggly again so decided not to run today, waiting another day.

    Friday: 5.1miles @10:50 avg pace
    Back again on the meadows taking things gently for another test, passing again. Rain.

    Saturday: 35miles cycle
    Out and back along the coast in late afternoon/evening.

    Sunday: 8.6miles @10:27 avg pace
    First proper test of the leg with this bit-hilly run in Holyrood Park and surroundings. Started the run in light enough rain but it was torrential for the final few miles and by the end my shorts were plastered to my legs. But the calf passed.

    The strap of my Garmin was partially broken by end of this week, went onto the Outdoors Gear exchange group on facebook searching for a Forerunner 110 (only really needing the strap bit to be working) and in a couple of hours had a brilliant deal on a 2nd hand one in fully working condition :).

    weekly total: 17miles as 3 runs, 35miles cycle
    Little stretching and no strengthening, and that's still true one week later. Think I can feel that my hip/bum muscles etc are weaker. Have to get back doing this.


    13th-19th August:

    Monday: 5.2miles easy @10:37 avg
    On the grass/trails after work.

    Tuesday, Wednesday: nothing
    Tuesday as planned, Wednesday too lazy.

    Thursday: 12.1miles @10:34 avg pace
    Run done straight after work from the office so I wouldn't get too comfortable at home and skip it. First test of my replacement Garmin. Usual Long Run setting, ran to Holyrood Park for a couple of laps, and some extra running round about there. Calf/achilles pretty good with just a bit of light niggling. The run was pretty comfortable, at least it was without the "when will this end" feeling I had at the end of the 12 and 13 miles runs I did back in July :) ...

    Friday: nothing

    Saturday: 5miles easy @10:43 pace
    Had to ease out calf/achilles at start, after that it was perfect. Slowwwww.

    Sunday: 8miles easy @10:39 avg pace
    Holyrood park and surroundings again. Had to ease calf/achilles at start, slight niggling midway. Drizzly.

    weekly total: 30.3miles as 4 runs


    Plan going ahead is to continue building. Am planning a HM at the end of September, and might do another one earlier in September just for the sake of it. Will introduce a few HM pace miles for the weeks ahead. Not going to take it too seriously pace-wise at this point though as have been casting an eye over my average paces since spring-time and though recent mileage is mostly up, average pace is down a bit from a few months back ....

    Have some weather-dependent plans for hiking for September, fingers crossed.

    Thinking I may possibly aim for Run The Line in November too but will wait a little while to decide about distance.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,038 ✭✭✭Neady83


    Glad the Achilles flare up didn't take too much time out of your plan M.

    Thinking I may possibly aim for Run The Line in November too but will wait a little while to decide about distance.

    this ..... boardsies reunion in Wicklow :D:D I need to give you a proper hug unlike the smelly one I forced on you the last time I saw you in Wicklow.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Neady83 wrote: »
    Glad the Achilles flare up didn't take too much time out of your plan M.

    Yep, to be honest it was quite a positive experience! The marathon will wait for another year.
    this ..... boardsies reunion in Wicklow :D:D I need to give you a proper hug unlike the smelly one I forced on you the last time I saw you in Wicklow.

    Well, we'll both be smelly in November ;)


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