Ulster Team Talk Thread III: Les Miserables SEE MOD WARNING POST #1924 + #2755

Clegg · 24-03-2018 05:30PM

Gibbes is a great coach as shown by his time at Leinster and Clermont. He hasn't become a bad coach overnight despite the troubles at Ulster. Ulster are a poor side but it's not just down to coaching. They don't have a strong enough side to compete with the best and I've serious doubts about the attitude of the squad as a whole. There have been times when they just don't look bothered.

ScissorPaperRock · 24-03-2018 05:34PM

Some kicks in behind that Cardiff defensive line is what's needed.

Dubinusa · 24-03-2018 05:35PM

Ulster are absolute crap. He's done nada to change that.
I suppose he had a lot more to work with at Leinster. Ulster are regressing and he bears some of the burden.

irishbucsfan · 24-03-2018 05:36PM

Dubinusa wrote: »

I suppose he had a lot more to work with at Leinster

He absolutely did not have a lot more to work with when he arrived.

Clegg · 24-03-2018 05:36PM

That's all on McCloskey and Stockdale not making that tackle.

razorblunt · 24-03-2018 06:01PM

Is it Reidy at 8? Complete fluff.

It’s Timoney, point still stands, he was just sat down by Matthew Morgan.

molloyjh · 24-03-2018 06:02PM

Whatever about tries, Ulster can’t even buy forward momentum!

prawnsambo · 24-03-2018 06:06PM

It all just breaks down after a few phases. It's the backs putting in the work at the breakdown to shore up possession rather than the forwards.

And just to prove my point, Shanahan scores after a couple of phases where only the backs were rucking. At least they took the conversion quickly.

razorblunt · 24-03-2018 06:07PM

Goodness sake just take a DK for the conversion and go again. 2 points means nothing if there’s another try.

Clegg · 24-03-2018 06:09PM

That was far too easy for Cardiff.

Ulster are a disgrace.

ScissorPaperRock · 24-03-2018 06:10PM

Sickening.

vienne86 · 24-03-2018 06:12PM

Are Ulster bothered? Defence seems to be optional for them.

awec · 24-03-2018 06:13PM

I hate rugby.

Half of this squad could walk out the door tomorrow and we'd be better off for it.

24-03-2018 06:17PM

awec wrote: »

I hate rugby.

Half of this squad could walk out the door tomorrow and we'd be better off for it.

I can't get my head around how bad Ulster are. I know the quality of player isn't really there but there's no excuse for being THAT poor.

awec · 24-03-2018 06:22PM

Hadassah CoolS Backside wrote: »

I can't get my head around how bad Ulster are. I know the quality of player isn't really there but there's no excuse for being THAT poor.

Too many crap players and coaches. The current (or recently relieved) regime at Ulster was a huge mistake by however made that appointment and the chickens are coming home to roost on that one.

2012 was the peak and then downhill from there, but the fall has been accelerated in recent seasons.

It can still get worse. Don't see where our next match is coming from and I don't see how we fix this problem given the constraints on players from the IRFU. In reality Ulster need numerous high quality signings, but that isn't going to happen. You can't make a silk purse from a sows ear. The best coach in the world cannot turn crap players into good ones.

prawnsambo · 24-03-2018 06:25PM

Hadassah CoolS Backside wrote: »

I can't get my head around how bad Ulster are. I know the quality of player isn't really there but there's no excuse for being THAT poor.

It's pretty clear that the forwards aren't all up to the job. Everything breaks down after a few phases and the clear out work is being done by a few lads who can't be everywhere. Opposition just have to pick their moment and the ball is snaffled.

A few of the backs couldn't be arsed/aren't able either, so half the team are doing all the work and the rest are semi-effective. But you can't over emphasise how disheartening it must be when you take the field knowing only a miracle will prevent a defeat.

24-03-2018 06:29PM

awec wrote: »

Too many crap players and coaches. The current (or recently relieved) regime at Ulster was a huge mistake by however made that appointment and the chickens are coming home to roost on that one.

2012 was the peak and then downhill from there, but the fall has been accelerated in recent seasons.

It can still get worse. Don't see where our next match is coming from and I don't see how we fix this problem given the constraints on players from the IRFU. In reality Ulster need numerous high quality signings, but that isn't going to happen. You can't make a silk purse from a sows ear. The best coach in the world cannot turn crap players into good ones.

You can take a not overly talented squad and coach them into some sort of shape though. There's no cohesion and no attitude in the team at all, they just roll over and die in games like that, same against Scarlets away the other week. It's really poor.

molloyjh · 24-03-2018 06:30PM

awec wrote: »

Hadassah CoolS Backside wrote: »

I can't get my head around how bad Ulster are. I know the quality of player isn't really there but there's no excuse for being THAT poor.

Too many crap players and coaches. The current (or recently relieved) regime at Ulster was a huge mistake by however made that appointment and the chickens are coming home to roost on that one.

2012 was the peak and then downhill from there, but the fall has been accelerated in recent seasons.

It can still get worse. Don't see where our next match is coming from and I don't see how we fix this problem given the constraints on players from the IRFU. In reality Ulster need numerous high quality signings, but that isn't going to happen.

I really don’t understand this post. Today you had a top class forwards coach in the dug out and a piss poor pack performance. Gibbs has several years behind him proving he is a top class forwards coach. This following on from a top class defence coach overseeing poor defensive performances. The common thread in these situations is the team, not the various different coaches.

As for signing high quality players, that approach would just be kicking the can even further down the road than it’s already been kicked. It would mask serious organisational issues that need to be addressed.

There is no short term solution to a mess that’s been so many years in the making. And few, if any, coaches can really make a difference. Hence why Gibbs has made the move away already.

awec · 24-03-2018 06:34PM

molloyjh wrote: »

I really don’t understand this post. Today you had a top class forwards coach in the dug out and a piss poor pack performance. Gibbs has several years behind him proving he is a top class forwards coach. This following on from a top class defence coach overseeing poor defensive performances. The common thread in these situations is the team, not the various different coaches.

As for signing high quality players, that approach would just be kicking the can even further down the road than it’s already been kicked. It would mask serious organisational issues that need to be addressed.

There is no short term solution to a mess that’s been so many years in the making. And few, if any, coaches can really make a difference. Hence why Gibbs has made the move away already.

Yes, and this proves my point.

Johnno Gibbes could not make these players any good. Ulster will never improve so long as we persist with these players. We need new ones.

Now, in a perfect utopian idealistic world Ulster would just pick a few academy lads and they'd get a lot better but of course this is the real world and that is not how it works. People can say "don't just take the short term fix", but again this is the real world and there is only so long Ulster will be able to languish in this mediocrity before long term damage is done.

I wonder how happy the IRFU are that there'll only be two teams in the Champions Cup next year. That's a hit on IRFU income.

awec · 24-03-2018 06:36PM

Hadassah CoolS Backside wrote: »

You can take a not overly talented squad and coach them into some sort of shape though. There's no cohesion and no attitude in the team at all, they just roll over and die in games like that, same against Scarlets away the other week. It's really poor.

And how do we fix that? We can't change the players. And you can guarantee our next forwards coach will be of lower pedigree than Gibbes.

Bridge93 · 24-03-2018 06:37PM

As it stands isn't the playoff for the last spot Ulster v Connacht?

awec · 24-03-2018 06:38PM

Bridge93 wrote: »

As it stands isn't the playoff for the last spot Ulster v Connacht?

As it stands but I'd fancy Treviso to overtake us.

Bridge93 · 24-03-2018 06:41PM

awec wrote: »

As it stands but I'd fancy Treviso to overtake us.

Wow had a look there, didn't realise how close it was. Treviso with an easier run in too albeit with a game less.

Doesn't seem that long ago Ulster were comfortably ahead of Edinburgh with Treviso in midtable purgatory.

stephen_n · 24-03-2018 06:44PM

awec wrote: »

I wonder how happy the IRFU are that there'll only be two teams in the Champions Cup next year. That's a hit on IRFU income.

Doubt the IRFU are happy about anything to with Ulster. But sweeping the **** under the carpet by importing foreign talent didn’t work before and won’t work now. So if this leads to Ulster actually getting their house in order and contributing to Irish rugby on par with the other provinces. The short term loss of revenue would make far more sense.

awec · 24-03-2018 06:46PM

Bridge93 wrote: »

Wow had a look there, didn't realise how close it was. Treviso with an easier run in too albeit with a game less.

Doesn't seem that long ago Ulster were comfortably ahead of Edinburgh with Treviso in midtable purgatory.

Our run in is difficult.

We have Munster away last game. Would be interesting to see what sort of team Munster select if Ulster need a win for 4th place and Munster's place is already secure.

awec · 24-03-2018 06:46PM

stephen_n wrote: »

Doubt the IRFU are happy about anything to with Ulster. But sweeping the **** under the carpet by importing foreign talent didn’t work before and won’t work now. So if this leads to Ulster actually getting their house in order and contributing to Irish rugby on par with the other provinces. The short term loss of revenue would make far more sense.

What makes you think it's short term?

stephen_n · 24-03-2018 06:50PM

awec wrote: »

What makes you think it's short term?

Because I think if and it’s a big if, Ulster get their sh*t together next season. They will be able to attract players from within Ireland a lot better. Short term is 1-3 seasons.

awec · 24-03-2018 06:53PM

stephen_n wrote: »

Because I think if and it’s a big if, Ulster get their sh*t together next season. They will be able to attract players from within Ireland a lot better. Short term is 1-3 seasons.

3 seasons of this garbage, yea I don't think so.

And signing players from other provinces is hardly solving the problem. That's just another short term fix that everyone seems so worried about.

prawnsambo · 24-03-2018 06:59PM

awec wrote: »

3 seasons of this garbage, yea I don't think so.

And signing players from other provinces is hardly solving the problem. That's just another short term fix that everyone seems so worried about.

It's not half as expensive as signing players from abroad. And at the least it benefits Irish rugby as a whole. The other alternative is carry on as you are and hope the academy can churn out players in enough numbers. But that will take a lot longer than three years.

thomond2006 · 24-03-2018 06:59PM

Ulster are signing crap IE and NIE players. Hardly the fault of IRFU constraints.

Ulster Team Talk Thread III: Les Miserables SEE MOD WARNING POST #1924 + #2755

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