New Master Plan for Cherrywood

Chinasea · 21-07-2016 8:35am

If there is space enough, than there should be space for both a cycle lane and separate foot path.

If not, than it is possible for pedestrians to share paths. Once clearly marked i.e thick white dividing line down center of path, AND citizens awareness (personal responsibility etc), it works. Germany as an example uses this design in some areas and both co-exist and get about their business.

All and everything that accommodates cycling and walking should be as important as laying roads for cars.

ted1 · 21-07-2016 9:07am

Chinasea wrote: »

If there is space enough, than there should be space for both a cycle lane and separate foot path.

If not, than it is possible for pedestrians to share paths. Once clearly marked i.e thick white dividing line down center of path, AND citizens awareness (personal responsibility etc), it works. Germany as an example uses this design in some areas and both co-exist and get about their business.

All and everything that accommodates cycling and walking should be as important as laying roads for cars.

There should never be just a white line dividing a cycle path and foot path. They just don't work

See 1.9.3 https://www.nationaltransport.ie/downloads/national_cycle_manual_110728.pdf

Fratton Fred · 21-07-2016 9:27am

Will there be a full junction at the new road, towards the M50?

Making that accessible from all directions would change the flow through the existing business park

Chinasea · 21-07-2016 10:13am

ted1 wrote: »

There should never be just a white line dividing a cycle path and foot path. They just don't work See 1.9.3 https://www.nationaltransport.ie/downloads/national_cycle_manual_110728.pdf

As said, the practice of a thick white line down on a properly designed, signposted and maintained footpath/cycle path is fairly common practice in many European countries and functions perfectly well.

The difference being, the mindset and personal responsibility of the citizens who use all 3, and allow, teach and encourage their children how to use. Cars, cycling and pedestrianisation work perfectly well when each party respect the right.

ted1 · 21-07-2016 10:49am

Chinasea wrote: »

As said, the practice of a thick white line down on a properly designed, signposted and maintained footpath/cycle path is fairly common practice in many European countries and functions perfectly well.

The difference being, the mindset and personal responsibility of the citizens who use all 3, and allow, teach and encourage their children how to use. Cars, cycling and pedestrianisation work perfectly well when each party respect the right.

Did you read 1.9.3?

They simply don't work , I cycle 250km a week and they see them
The whole time, pedasterians crossing over, dogs on leads crossing over, cyclists over taking other cyclist crossing over etc

Fratton Fred · 21-07-2016 11:25am

Personally I find the one in Blackrock park a pain in the hole.

It's a park, you want to let children run free, skate or whatever but you're forever watching over your shoulder for some MAMIL tearing along throwing abuse at you.

The path is too narrow and just smacks of the council ticking a box saying "we built a cycle route".

Chinasea · 21-07-2016 5:46pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Personally I find the one in Blackrock park a pain in the hole.

It's a park, you want to let children run free, skate or whatever but you're forever watching over your shoulder for some MAMIL tearing along throwing abuse at you.

The path is too narrow and just smacks of the council ticking a box saying "we built a cycle route".

Aggressive!

I love to cycle along this route to work and I am very grateful of its existence.

I am not polluting the environment, I am not cramming the road with a one man per car, l am hopefully keeping fitter and lessening my chances of being a burden on the health system, and not dicing with certain death on the shared double decker bus lane on the Rock road.

Fratton Fred · 21-07-2016 6:03pm

Chinasea wrote: »

Aggressive!

I love to cycle along this route to work and I am very grateful of its existence.

I am not polluting the environment, I am not cramming the road with a one man per car, l am hopefully keeping fitter and lessening my chances of being a burden on the health system, and not dicing with certain death on the shared double decker bus lane on the Rock road.

That's grand, but it's a shared path when in reality, the footpath and cycle path should be separate.

I'm sure most cyclists recognise this, but there are those that don't unfortunately.

ted1 · 21-07-2016 6:26pm

Chinasea wrote: »

Aggressive!

I love to cycle along this route to work and I am very grateful of its existence.

I am not polluting the environment, I am not cramming the road with a one man per car, l am hopefully keeping fitter and lessening my chances of being a burden on the health system, and not dicing with certain death on the shared double decker bus lane on the Rock road.

You've taking an agreesive defence. He never said anything wrong about cyclists , he was talking about the infrastructure.

A white line gives an illusion that a the council have actually designed, planned and provided a safe cycling track when in fact they haven't.

I used it today, 3 kids ran across by the playground , 2 dogs on leads blocking the path, 3 cyclists on the wrong side of the path. A compete blind corner by the Martello tower is an accident waiting to happen

Chinasea · 22-07-2016 1:57pm

ted1 wrote: »

.
A white line gives an illusion that a the council have actually designed, planned and provided a safe cycling track when in fact they haven't.

I used it today, 3 kids ran across by the playground , 2 dogs on leads blocking the path, 3 cyclists on the wrong side of the path. A compete blind corner by the Martello tower is an accident waiting to happen

I get the impression you are a last word merchant. You are just short of adding the lines about cyclists crashing lights, paths, stereo stereo stereo.

ted1 · 22-07-2016 2:10pm

Chinasea wrote: »

I get the impression you are a last word merchant. You are just short of adding the lines about cyclists crashing lights, paths, stereo stereo stereo.

No, you pointed a rubbish statement, which I pointed out to you was incorrect by referencing the relevant part of the national cycle manual, but you seem to think that you are better qualified than the people who put it together and at then you had a crazy rant and now have a eve worse rant about crashing lights , paths , stereos ???

P.s when I said I used it, I was talking about on a bike

patrickbrophy18 · 19-08-2016 9:54pm

A huge step forward as per the following two links:

Permission has been granted for the road network according to this link.
Coverage of the same can be seen at The Journal.

According to the coverage in The Journal, construction work should begin in the next few weeks. It should be interesting to see how traffic fares from the M50 when the new signal controlled junction is completed.

The construction of the road network is earmarked for completion in 2017 which is somewhat optimistic for (circa) 5 kilometers. Either-way I look forward to trying it out in its entirety. One of the roads (to be used by buses) is going to be laced with chicanes which I am very reserved about. But alas, such is life.

patrickbrophy18 · 19-01-2017 1:25am

I’m surprised that this hasn’t been in the Weekly Traffic News from the Dun Laoghaire-Rathdown County Council website. However, for the past few weeks, it looks like construction on the new road system is already underway. Apparently, major road works are to begin from the 30th of January according to the road information systems in the vicinity.

Along Valley Drive, there appears to be a lot of flattening of the once uneven mud patches which I imagine is for the purpose of the road widening that is to take place there. Next, towards the M50 on the right, you have an enclosed construction site where they seem to be restructuring the land at the junction where the mobile speed camera check points are occasionally stationed.

Finally, there has been a lot more information added to the official Cherrywood Dublin Website where you can even find blue prints of the town center that will be built on the R118. In any case, I am really looking forward to when the whole thing is complete.

Fratton Fred · 19-01-2017 11:29am

The plans look impressive.

Larbre34 · 20-01-2017 9:19pm

patrickbrophy18 wrote: »

I’m surprised that this hasn’t been in the Weekly Traffic News from the Dun Laoghaire-Rathdown County Council website.

Why would it be in the Traffic News? These works are taking place entirely on site and offline from the existing roads, negligible effect on traffic until occupation.

Supercell · 20-01-2017 9:33pm

Larbre34 wrote: »

Why would it be in the Traffic News? These works are taking place entirely on site and offline from the existing roads, negligible effect on traffic until occupation.

Actually there is a big sign on the road leading to the roundabout saying major roadworks from January 31st or words to that effect. I noted yesterday that the roundabout has wooden stakes on it presumably marking out where to dig?

ted1 · 20-01-2017 9:34pm

Larbre34 wrote: »

Why would it be in the Traffic News? These works are taking place entirely on site and offline from the existing roads, negligible effect on traffic until occupation.

I believe that they are removing the roundabout towards the start of the development rather waiting till it's occupied

dunner515 · 25-01-2017 7:30pm

"2,850 multi family rental units"
Are the apartments only going to be available for rental?

Fratton Fred · 25-01-2017 9:01pm

dunner515 wrote: »

"2,850 multi family rental units"
Are the apartments only going to be available for rental?

I would imagine some blocks will be bought by pension companies and the like from the outset, to help fund the project.

ted1 · 25-01-2017 10:18pm

dunner515 wrote: »

"2,850 multi family rental units"
Are the apartments only going to be available for rental?

Yes that's the plan.

ted1 · 25-01-2017 10:20pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

I would imagine some blocks will be bought by pension companies and the like from the outset, to help fund the project.

Hines are pretty well funded,about 95bn dollars of assests under control

Fratton Fred · 25-01-2017 11:51pm

ted1 wrote: »

Hines are pretty well funded,about 95bn dollars of assests under control

They are indeed, but cash is a different matter.

Thestones · 26-01-2017 11:22pm

I live in the area, has anyone noticed they seem to have changed the lights sequence turning right from flyover bridge from wyattville road towards Cabinteely onto N11, I do this turn everyday and it use to flow better, I've noticed in general the traffic seems to be more congested on the wyattville road, dreading when the actual major roadworks will start if this is anything to go by.

errlloyd · 27-01-2017 9:52am

Thestones wrote: »

I live in the area, has anyone noticed they seem to have changed the lights sequence turning right from flyover bridge from wyattville road towards Cabinteely onto N11, I do this turn everyday and it use to flow better, I've noticed in general the traffic seems to be more congested on the wyattville road, dreading when the actual major roadworks will start if this is anything to go by.

Yeah I noticed it, but it suits me. I have to uturn at the bridge, so take N11 south, go over the bridge and then take N11 north. The old sequence was a real pain in the ass. The right turn off the Southbound slip road would go green at the same time as the right turn on to the Northbound slip road. If you were lucky, and if you gunned it, you would make it. But usually you wouldn't. Uturning the N11 could take me as much as 8 minutes. I despise it.

ted1 · 27-01-2017 9:57am

errlloyd wrote: »

Yeah I noticed it, but it suits me. I have to uturn at the bridge, so take N11 south, go over the bridge and then take N11 north. The old sequence was a real pain in the ass. The right turn off the Southbound slip road would go green at the same time as the right turn on to the Northbound slip road. If you were lucky, and if you gunned it, you would make it. But usually you wouldn't. Uturning the N11 could take me as much as 8 minutes. I despise it.

Why do you have to U turn? Why not just use loughlinstown roundabout up further, should be faster than 8 minutes.

errlloyd · 27-01-2017 10:18am

ted1 wrote: »

Why do you have to U turn? Why not just use loughlinstown roundabout up further, should be faster than 8 minutes.

Ah yes, the great kitchen table debate over which is quicker, for some reason the whole family favour the bridge, but various others have suggested the roundabout. The roundabout is probably quicker (on average), but involves driving a fair bit further. Google maps reckons Loughlinstown is 6 minutes and the bridge is 7 (from where I live to get back to the point on the n11 opposite my estate). Although interestingly google maps advises going around the roundabout at Cherrywood instead of going right on the far side of the bridge, which I choose to do.

At this stage probably habit. It is possible to get over the bridge quite quickly. Once or twice since it opened I even managed to get around with all three greens. Maybe I do it in vain hope it won't be a disaster.

ted1 · 27-01-2017 10:38am

errlloyd wrote: »

Ah yes, the great kitchen table debate over which is quicker, for some reason the whole family favour the bridge, but various others have suggested the roundabout. The roundabout is probably quicker (on average), but involves driving a fair bit further. Google maps reckons Loughlinstown is 6 minutes and the bridge is 7 (from where I live to get back to the point on the n11 opposite my estate). Although interestingly google maps advises going around the roundabout at Cherrywood instead of going right on the far side of the bridge, which I choose to do.

At this stage probably habit. It is possible to get over the bridge quite quickly. Once or twice since it opened I even managed to get around with all three greens. Maybe I do it in vain hope it won't be a disaster.

We're in Seafield and our debate is weather to go up to the roundabout or go through Ballybrack village.
I guess we all have our debates.

If we are coming from Whelan's the debate is the flyover or a u turn by the garage in the N11

dunner515 · 31-01-2017 9:24pm

Found this on facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ChrisCurranIRE/videos/1284667764905651/

DMcL1971 · 09-02-2017 2:47pm

The open days where you can view the plans and talk to people from Hines, started today in the marketing suite, which is located above the spar.

Thursday 9th Feb: 1pm – 8pm
Friday 10th Feb: 8am – 8pm
Saturday 11th Feb: 10am – 5pm

The have already started removing the roundabout.

errlloyd · 09-02-2017 2:50pm

I am going to pop up tonight so.

Gareth Keenan · 10-02-2017 10:44am

big piece on this in the Irish Times today

http://www.irishtimes.com/business/construction/cherrywood-the-rocky-road-to-a-key-dublin-development-1.2969670

shawnxxiong · 12-02-2017 9:40pm

Anyone's been to the open day? Wondering whether there's a concrete timeline of the project?

patrickbrophy18 · 24-08-2017 12:19am

Having passed the Roundabout (or Oval-about) over the past few weeks, it appears as though the new junction is rapidly taking shape. From seeing it up close at numerous angles, there doesn't seem to be that many layers of tarmac to go before they start connecting it up with the existing roads. Having said that, there is still a long way to go from the Valley Drive perspective. I say this because I've driven up there every few weeks and the foundations for the roadway running parallel to the tracks immediately north of Cherrywood Luas Stop are being layered and haven't been joined to West Courtyard yet. Nevertheless, steady progress is being made.

Thestones · 28-09-2017 9:42am

What an absolute joke the traffic is lately with the roadworks on wyattville road, I saw tailbacks as far back as carrickmines on m50 trying to exit into cherrywood, there doesn't appear to be any traffic management plan, people just left to deal with usual traffic lights which is not working with one lane, something needs to be done.

errlloyd · 28-09-2017 10:18am

Thestones wrote: »

What an absolute joke the traffic is lately with the roadworks on wyattville road, I saw tailbacks as far back as carrickmines on m50 trying to exit into cherrywood, there doesn't appear to be any traffic management plan, people just left to deal with usual traffic lights which is not working with one lane, something needs to be done.

Yeah it's killing me right now - and I am not even coming from the M50. I am coming from the N11 Southbound lane. Only 3 cars are making the left turn off the ramp at each cycle. I can only imagine how bad it is from cars coming the whole way down.

Supercell · 14-11-2017 4:11pm

Roundabout going this weekend, should be interesting to see how the new junction copes with the rush hour traffic next week - http://www.dlrcoco.ie/sites/default/files/atoms/files/171111.pdf

As part of these works it is intended to remove the Cherrywood Roundabout and replaced
with a signalised Traffic Junction.
This switchover to a signalised Traffic Junction is scheduled to take place after 10.00am on
Monday, 20th November ’17.

14-11-2017 8:24pm

Supercell wrote: »

Roundabout going this weekend, should be interesting to see how the new junction copes with the rush hour traffic next week - http://www.dlrcoco.ie/sites/default/files/atoms/files/171111.pdf

for the weekend, traffic coming from the M50 will not be able to turn right in to Cherrywood, meaning a diversion over the N11 and a u-turn.

Monday morning is going to be chaos until the junction goes live Monday lunch time.

patrickbrophy18 · 21-11-2017 1:37am

Thanks for the update Supercell and Aegir. Yeah, it doesn't appear to be all that bad now from a motorised traffic perspective. However, add the mooted 30000 population to that and it will be a different story. Hopefully, by then, there will be a few new bus routes anyway to serve the area to mitigate the increase in traffic somewhat.

It's still going to be a daunting cross for pedestrians and very hostile for the additional cyclists who will be using it once everything is completed.

I can see this junction undergoing a good few revisions when more members from each of the main road user groups start passing through it.

I guess we'll have to see how it all pans out when Cherrywood is maxed out population-wise and entirely operational.

ted1 · 21-11-2017 4:42am

Aegir wrote: »

Supercell wrote: »

Roundabout going this weekend, should be interesting to see how the new junction copes with the rush hour traffic next week - http://www.dlrcoco.ie/sites/default/files/atoms/files/171111.pdf

for the weekend, traffic coming from the M50 will not be able to turn right in to Cherrywood, meaning a diversion over the N11 and a u-turn.

Monday morning is going to be chaos until the junction goes live Monday lunch time.

What about a left towards tullyvale then a u turn?

McGrath5 · 21-11-2017 10:43am

Well who else got stuck coming into Cherrywood this morning? The traffic was back past the exit for Carrickmines on the M50, they have to do something with the new junction.

Larbre34 · 21-11-2017 11:16am

According to 'Live Drive' this morning they are monitoring and calibrating it during this week. Either way it will be a lot slower than the roundabout because of the addition of pedestrian phases where all motor traffic is stopped, as wouldnt have happened before.

Im planning to avoid for the next fortnight at least.

Supercell · 21-11-2017 6:54pm

Loads of people were late into work today because of the M50 tailbacks in both directions. Lots of people planning on using the N11 and exiting at different junctions instead tomorrow, N11 likely to be busier than normal I'd guess as a result. God only knows what the traffic will be like when the town centre is built in a few years.

markpb · 21-11-2017 8:09pm

Supercell wrote: »

Loads of people were late into work today because of the M50 tailbacks in both directions. Lots of people planning on using the N11 and exiting at different junctions instead tomorrow, N11 likely to be busier than normal I'd guess as a result. God only knows what the traffic will be like when the town centre is built in a few years.

To be fair, this week was always going to be bad as people adjust to the new road layout and as the timing of the traffic lights are changed. It's too early to judge what the long term effect will be.

Thestones · 21-11-2017 8:58pm

Supercell wrote: »

Loads of people were late into work today because of the M50 tailbacks in both directions. Lots of people planning on using the N11 and exiting at different junctions instead tomorrow, N11 likely to be busier than normal I'd guess as a result. God only knows what the traffic will be like when the town centre is built in a few years.

The traffic was awful in the whole cabinteely area this morning, I think people are avoiding the cherrywood area/wyattville road where possible which in turn is causing traffic congestion elsewhere.

DMcL1971 · 22-11-2017 12:28am

Larbre34 wrote: »

According to 'Live Drive' this morning they are monitoring and calibrating it during this week. Either way it will be a lot slower than the roundabout because of the addition of pedestrian phases where all motor traffic is stopped, as wouldnt have happened before.

Im planning to avoid for the next fortnight at least.

The footpaths are not finished yet so the pedestrian phase hasn’t even been added yet.

ted1 · 22-11-2017 4:52am

Supercell wrote: »

Loads of people were late into work today because of the M50 tailbacks in both directions. Lots of people planning on using the N11 and exiting at different junctions instead tomorrow, N11 likely to be busier than normal I'd guess as a result. God only knows what the traffic will be like when the town centre is built in a few years.

Could be a good thing, lots of them should consider cycling or using busses or the LUAS

Green Party: Ossian Smyth · 24-11-2017 11:37am

The main developer says that Cherywood will be so easy to walk or cycle around and so full of amenities that it will be like Ranelagh. To me, it looks like the planned roads and junctions for Cherrywood are built for high car capacity. I expect that Cherrywood will be a town with the atmosphere of Sandyford Business District or Tallaght- high density with heavy traffic on wide noisy roads, driving short distances from one car park to another.

Cian Ginty has a good summary of the cycling aspects of Cherrywood's plans here:
http://irishcycle.com/2017/11/19/cherrywood-is-yet-another-missed-opportunity-to-get-cycling-right-in-ireland/

ted1 · 24-11-2017 11:52am

Where’s the sandyford business district? If that a fancy name for sandyford industrial estate?

Green Party: Ossian Smyth · 24-11-2017 12:00pm

It's what they want be called now and includes the neighbouring office parks in Stillorgan, Leopardstown, Central Park etc

http://www.sandyford.ie/

Supercell · 24-11-2017 1:34pm

Green Party: Ossian Smyth wrote: »

The main developer says that Cherywood will be so easy to walk or cycle around and so full of amenities that it will be like Ranelagh. To me, it looks like the planned roads and junctions for Cherrywood are built for high car capacity. I expect that Cherrywood will be a town with the atmosphere of Sandyford Business District or Tallaght- high density with heavy traffic on wide noisy roads, driving short distances from one car park to another.

Cian Ginty has a good summary of the cycling aspects of Cherrywood's plans here:
http://irishcycle.com/2017/11/19/cherrywood-is-yet-another-missed-opportunity-to-get-cycling-right-in-ireland/

I sincerely hope not, talk about soulless, depressing places, surely lessons have been learned this time?
The public parks sound quite nice, which Tallaght and Sandyford don't have to my knowledge?

New Master Plan for Cherrywood

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