Saorview Connect

Snake Plisken · 22-11-2017 12:39PM

Gerry Wicklow wrote: »

You can make your own favourites list(s) with any mixture of Saorview and satellite you fancy, all with full 7 day EPG. AFAIK the box comes with Vix installed but i prefer openATV as it is far better in terms of plugins etc. It's a simple task to upgrade from Vix to Atv.

Thanks for your input I’ve it ordered from Worldof Satellite with the additional T2 tuner I know my way around enigma2 boxes with my Vu+Duo2 and dreamboxes so should be fairly straight forward is the T2 tuner decent enough quality?

keribillen · 22-11-2017 07:08PM

Dave..M wrote: »

keribillen wrote: »

There will be a default listing and ordering provided, and a UI available for manual sorting if the user wishes.

Hi Keri,

who compiles and maintains the default Satellite listing and how will it handle;

1) new channel launches,
2) channel retunes (where a channel switches frequency)
3) multiple/regional variants of the same channel

I didn't see them yet but apologies if these questions were already asked.

Thanks
Dave

HI Dave, apologies for the slow response to your very sensible question. I've been rather busy....BTW I'm not notified of any questions directed at me. I have to trawl through all the pages to find out what is going on.
Powerpoint manage the satellite channel list ordering, and it is updated via software upgrades that EKT deploys together with Powerpoint. Duplicates I believe are made invisible.
Best regards,
Keri

keribillen · 22-11-2017 07:15PM

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Why can't they put a HDD inside the box for Gods sake?

Hi Harry,
HDDs are expensive, noisy and the most fault-prone part of modern electronics, by a country mile. Failure rates of tens of % are not uncommon. From a reliability point of view, an external device is preferable. However I'm well aware that there's a performance hit when using an external USB device. That said, the Saorview Connect functionality (catch-up content from RTE and TG4) lessens the actual need for a PVR capability. That said, as we've discussed before on this forum, we are working on PVR for the SVC box. Best regards, Keri

keribillen · 22-11-2017 07:19PM

George Sunsnow wrote: »

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

So wait... there is no PVR at launch?! Insanity.

Must be the rush to get them in the shops before Xmas
They didn’t have enough time...

Hi, I've covered the strategy with PVR and the time EKT started working on the product development earlier in this forum. There was no 'rush'. The project was well specified and controlled properly from start to finish. At the beginning it was obvious to us there was no time to have PVR ready this year; hence why we are working on it now and will have it available pronto. Best regards, Keri

keribillen · 22-11-2017 07:44PM

STB. wrote: »

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

Looks like this won't be the only box.
Perhaps integrated into tvs too.

Would you buy an EKT TV ?

TV7025.

Yes.

Capt'n Midnight · 22-11-2017 07:50PM

keribillen wrote: »

Hi Harry,
HDDs are expensive, noisy and the most fault-prone part of modern electronics, by a country mile. Failure rates of tens of % are not uncommon. From a reliability point of view, an external device is preferable. However I'm well aware that there's a performance hit when using an external USB device.

I'd argue the opposite.

The HDD's used internally should be multimedia drives. Designed for stamina rather than speed. No super-turbo rpm's , no huge cache, seek time isn't an issue.

Tigerandahalf · 22-11-2017 08:03PM

Kerri

I have the box.
Can you explain the lag switching between saorview and sat and why there isn't one button switching?

Thanks

The Cush · 22-11-2017 08:08PM

keribillen wrote: »

DDs are expensive, noisy and the most fault-prone part of modern electronics, by a country mile. Failure rates of tens of % are not uncommon. From a reliability point of view, an external device is preferable.

I'm afraid I have to put this down as a nonsense excuse for not having an internal HDD. If your drives are having such issues you really have to change manufacturers.

In all the years me and other members of my family have had internal drives in desktops, laptops, DVD/HDD combis and satellite/terrestrial receivers we only ever had 1 failure and that after roughly 5 years in an EchoStar Freesat Slingbox and that was recently. This was my brother's box and as I posted previously he was holding off replacing it until he got the specs of the EKT box, he naturally replaced it with a Humax with internal HDD.

It internal HDDs are such a problem why didn't Freeview and Freesat go down the route of an external drive?

STB. · 22-11-2017 09:30PM

More likely theres not enough space inside for the HDD and sata connector. If HDD's had a significant failure rate it was back in the early days of Amstrad when they were plagued by Seagate/WD badstock. Thats not an issue now or Pace, Thomson, Humax etc would have went out of business a long time ago

Anyhow Keri, heres more questions to ignore.

Is there a method of uploading indivual components of the firmware, ie the userdb.bin file which is the default chan list within most ali compiled software ?

Can an ali editor be used to sort and order the satellite channel list and reflash back to the box ?

Is the dvb-t tuner split within the box to allow recording and viewing off different terrestrial multiplexes. Its not evident from the box chassis.

Former Former · 22-11-2017 09:36PM

The Cush wrote: »

I'm afraid I have to put this down as a nonsense excuse for not having an internal HDD.

STB. wrote: »

Anyhow Keri, heres more questions to ignore.

Do you think the guy is going to keep responding if people keep being as obnoxious as this?

STB. · 22-11-2017 10:46PM

Former Former wrote: »

Do you think the guy is going to keep responding if people keep being as obnoxious as this?

Responding to what. I must have asked a dozen questions in this thread. None of them answered.

Obnoxious. Nah. Tongue in cheek. Definitely.

The guy in question is the project manager for EKT.

Nobody is being obnoxious. People are frustrated and unwilling to spend money on something where there are no answers to questions. Saorview's info is vague and aimed at people who dont have the interest to be posting on a tech forum.

Dont get me wrong the IP playback via methaphor freetime UI is interesting. The rest of the box less so. Especially the lack of a 7 epg data OTA/IP grabbing functionality on SAT is a huge issue unless there will some form of unofficial....

The lack of a Netflix SDK for this box at the end of 2017 is dark ages stuff.

Sam Russell · 22-11-2017 10:58PM

@STB - why not PM him the question or the post number so he does not have to scan through the whole thread?

The Cush · 22-11-2017 11:35PM

Former Former wrote: »

Do you think the guy is going to keep responding if people keep being as obnoxious as this?

You can't be serious, he's trying to tell us internal HDDs are old hat and that we should go out an spend more money on an external drive on an already expensive box. Most likely the real reason is closer to STB's thinking above, they don't have an internal HDD solution in their OEM range

FRIENDO · 23-11-2017 01:32AM

Hi Keri,

Can you watch other satellite's on the box?

Will it operate with a Diseqc switch?
Example
Saorsat on 9E
Astra 19E
Hotbird 13E
Astra 28E

Any word of the satellite tuner on the box being Saorsat approved or fully compatiable?

Is the Satellite tuner Mheg5?

How will the terrestrial tuner manage freeview channels?

Very little details in the manual linked in an earlier post.

Thanks

Former Former · 23-11-2017 08:50AM

The Cush wrote: »

You can't be serious, he's trying to tell us internal HDDs are old hat and that we should go out an spend more money on an external drive on an already expensive box. Most likely the real reason is closer to STB's thinking above, they don't have an internal HDD solution in their OEM range

I don't care about the validity of your technical objections. You don't have to be a dick to the guy.

The Cush · 23-11-2017 09:16AM

Former Former wrote: »

I don't care about the validity of your technical objections.

Obviously, so have you purchased one yet?

Tigerandahalf · 23-11-2017 09:20AM

Population of UK is 65 million
Population of Rep of Ireland is not even 5 million.

Not easy to produce a decent product off that scale.

Schorpio · 23-11-2017 09:22AM

I think it's fairly obvious that EKT are well aware of the technical shortcomings of their box and aren't trying to appeal to us (the enthusiast side of the market).

If they had a technically great product, they'd be on this thread everyday giving us loads of details. It's easier to ignore questions than answer 'no, it can't do that....no it doesn't have that...' etc.

Johnboy1951 · 23-11-2017 09:52AM

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

Population of UK is 65 million
Population of Rep of Ireland is not even 5 million.

Not easy to produce a decent product off that scale.

Products already exist ..... only a matter of adding the 'extra' == catch-up/roll-back function.
Not at all difficult.

Something must have gone wrong with their original supplier, as there is no way it was left to the last minute (as indicated by a post from the Ekt rep) to select a supplier of the hardware.

FRIENDO · 23-11-2017 10:02AM

Former Former wrote:

I don't care about the validity of your technical objections. You don't have to be a dick to the guy.

The Cush is a top guy and has helped and given so much good advice to many posters on these forum's.

No need for the offensive language/name calling, its not welcome here.

(PS. My apologies to the Tech mods if my post is interfering.)

Schorpio · 23-11-2017 11:10AM

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

Products already exist ..... only a matter of adding the 'extra' == catch-up/roll-back function.
Not at all difficult.

Something must have gone wrong with their original supplier, as there is no way it was left to the last minute (as indicated by a post from the Ekt rep) to select a supplier of the hardware.

Exactly. And (as I've said before) Humax already have STB hardware which will work with Saorview AND they have years of experience implementing the freesat UI onto their hardware (which includes Netflix/YouTube apps out of the box). Their latest freeview offering includes an (internal!) 500gB HDD, and has the ability to record up to 3 programmes simultaneously.

A new box doesn't have to be created from scratch from the Irish market. If you already have virtually everything, the capital cost of entry to the Irish market is low.

kooga · 23-11-2017 11:11AM

Schorpio wrote: »

Exactly. And (as I've said before) Humax already have STB hardware which will work with Saorview AND they have years of experience implementing the freesat UI onto their hardware (which includes Netflix/YouTube apps out of the box). Their latest freeview offering includes an (internal!) 500gB HDD, and has the ability to record up to 3 programmes simultaneously.

A new box doesn't have to be created from scratch from the Irish market. If you already have virtually everything, the capital cost of entry to the Irish market is low.

plus Humax Customer Support is based in Belfast!

funnyname · 23-11-2017 11:49AM

I wouldn't be surprised if Humax comes out with their own saorview freesat box, they'd coin it in.

Schorpio wrote: »

Exactly. And (as I've said before) Humax already have STB hardware which will work with Saorview AND they have years of experience implementing the freesat UI onto their hardware (which includes Netflix/YouTube apps out of the box). Their latest freeview offering includes an (internal!) 500gB HDD, and has the ability to record up to 3 programmes simultaneously.

A new box doesn't have to be created from scratch from the Irish market. If you already have virtually everything, the capital cost of entry to the Irish market is low.

Schorpio · 23-11-2017 11:54AM

funnyname wrote: »

I wouldn't be surprised if Humax comes out with their own saorview freesat box, they'd coin it in.

I'm not so sure about that. If the freesat EPG could be licensed on Irish soil, I'm certain EKT would already have it.

The problem with Humax is that they don't do a satellite/terrestrial combi box, because there is no need to have such a product in the UK market.

Entering the Irish market with their terrestrial hardware (which is very good), would only give the Saorview channels, which pales in quantity compared to freeview. No need for 3 tuners when you only have 2 muxes!

The Cush · 23-11-2017 12:36PM

Schorpio wrote: »

I'm not so sure about that. If the freesat EPG could be licensed on Irish soil, I'm certain EKT would already have it.

Yes. I'd agree, their agreement with Freesat would most likely prohibit such a combination.

PabloAndRoy · 23-11-2017 02:38PM

Schorpio wrote: »

I'm not so sure about that. If the freesat EPG could be licensed on Irish soil, I'm certain EKT would already have it.

...

This appears to be the main issue surrounding the box. As is often the case, it's the legal/licensing issues that are more difficult to overcome than the technical ones.

If this box had a combined 7 day EPG, there would be a lot less negative response. More likely, people would be relieved that at last such a simple plug-and-play box exists and would be (relatively) happy to wait for the PVR functionality (with internal or external HD).

I think when the initial announcement was made there was an implication (from our side it must be said) that this would be a Saorview/Freesat powered combi box with IP capabilities. At no time did Saorview say that that was what we would be getting. As time went on it became clear that it was not the case. Now it is 100% confirmed.

It's our own fault for expecting too much, when we all knew in our hearts that delivering an official box with a combined Saorview/Freesat EPG was going to be nigh on impossible.

Johnboy1951 · 23-11-2017 03:37PM

PabloAndRoy wrote: »

This appears to be the main issue surrounding the box. As is often the case, it's the legal/licensing issues that are more difficult to overcome than the technical ones.

If this box had a combined 7 day EPG, there would be a lot less negative response. More likely, people would be relieved that at last such a simple plug-and-play box exists and would be (relatively) happy to wait for the PVR functionality (with internal or external HD).

I think when the initial announcement was made there was an implication (from our side it must be said) that this would be a Saorview/Freesat powered combi box with IP capabilities. At no time did Saorview say that that was what we would be getting. As time went on it became clear that it was not the case. Now it is 100% confirmed.

It's our own fault for expecting too much, when we all knew in our hearts that delivering an official box with a combined Saorview/Freesat EPG was going to be nigh on impossible.

That is only true if the 7 day EPG must be Freesat.
There were, and are, non-Freesat options to achieve the same functionality, which are not licence encumbered.

dubrov · 23-11-2017 03:42PM

The switching process between satellite and Saorview is hardly due to licencing issues..

It is just bad design or more likely because that is how it has been implemented for other markets where users rarely switch between the two.

Tigerandahalf · 23-11-2017 04:44PM

dubrov wrote: »

The switching process between satellite and Saorview is hardly due to licencing issues..

It is just bad design or more likely because that is how it has been implemented for other markets where users rarely switch between the two.

If there is no solution to the one button switching I think I will just get a freesat box.

The satellite side of the box still lacks even the basic 'back to previous channel' function. So you are on bbc1 - you go to channel 4 - now you want to return to bbc1 again. A very common and basic function yet at the moment it is not there. Instead you have to press the enter button and possibly scroll through 2 or 3 pages to get back to the channel you were on.

Perhaps Powerpoint/EKT will solve that with a software update.

However solving the one button switching is more difficult as there is no button on the remote for it (I also don't understand why they didn't put the saorview and sat links one under the other on the Home menu and thus you would need to scroll less to change).

The older combi boxes could do it but everything was contained in the one software system. On these connect boxes the satellite section (Powerpoint's own software) is completely different to saorview (with the Freesat Metaphor software). So solving this issue may not be a runner.

The very fact that the EKT rep mentioned Saorview had no desire for a 2nd sat input in their tender shows up how underdeveloped the satellite side of things is.

With the lack of a common 7 day epg and fast switching people may just invest in the sky q type system (with the no subscription linux boxes). But will all of the Connect features (roll back and rte player) be available on that type of system?

Tony · 23-11-2017 06:54PM

Didn't think he was being a dick , just calling a guy on what was (to my mind) a ridiculous statement.

Former Former wrote: »

You don't have to be a dick to the guy.

Saorview Connect

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