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Freeman Megamerge

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    #6332
    Robbo
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 10,560 Mod ✭✭✭✭Robbo


    Robbo wrote: »
    Here's another case where the debtor tried to roll their own promissory note. Curiously, it was for more €88k than the amount actually due. He left it in an envelope in a meeting with the bank and unilaterally declared the loan settled "in full". Whilst an order for possession was denied here, McGovern pre-empted any kind of "victory" being declared by the debtor...

    I'm reminded me of that old trick where a car sale is agreed and a spurious bank draft is produced for more than the agreed sale price...
    rameire wrote: »
    Think that is the case that Ben of the Family Gimproy was talking about on his facebook page, its his Bro in law.
    The Court of Appeal has had its say on the matter.

    On appeal, they tried to open up a new front which has been promoted a lot by various groups, the Doorstep Selling Directive. Freemen reckon that if you invoke it, you can "cancel" your mortgage". The problem is they never flesh out their thinking as to what might the effects be of such a "cancellation".

    Helpfully, in this case, the appellants thought it might entail a short letter to the bank, inviting them to take the house and politely asking for all of the mortgage payments you've made over the years back. Oh, they also asked to be paid for furniture and fittings also.

    I can see exactly how this scheme would be sold by a fake lawyer:
      You tell the marks that upon cancellation in this manner they'll have a big pot of cash but no house
    1. The bank will have to put the house to auction
    2. You disrupt the auction or intimidate the other prospective bidders
    3. You take your wheelbarrow of cash and put in a lowball offer
    4. They have to accept it because you're now a legal genius
    5. You now have your house back plus a few quid for your trouble
    6. PROFIT!
    It was found that the Directive didn't apply in the slightest to the case in hand.

    The other magic money argument involving the homemade promissory note and the 10% overpayment failed again. It's also noted that the appellants tried to unilaterally make the Land Registry cancel the charge off the back of this note.


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    #6333
    hometruths
    Registered Users, Subscribers Posts: 5,822 ✭✭✭hometruths


    Robbo wrote: »
    The Court of Appeal has had its say on the matter.

    On appeal, they tried to open up a new front which has been promoted a lot by various groups, the Doorstep Selling Directive. Freemen reckon that if you invoke it, you can "cancel" your mortgage". The problem is they never flesh out their thinking as to what might the effects be of such a "cancellation".

    Helpfully, in this case, the appellants thought it might entail a short letter to the bank, inviting them to take the house and politely asking for all of the mortgage payments you've made over the years back. Oh, they also asked to be paid for furniture and fittings also.

    I can see exactly how this scheme would be sold by a fake lawyer:
      You tell the marks that upon cancellation in this manner they'll have a big pot of cash but no house
    1. The bank will have to put the house to auction
    2. You disrupt the auction or intimidate the other prospective bidders
    3. You take your wheelbarrow of cash and put in a lowball offer
    4. They have to accept it because you're now a legal genius
    5. You now have your house back plus a few quid for your trouble
    6. PROFIT!
    It was found that the Directive didn't apply in the slightest to the case in hand.

    The other magic money argument involving the homemade promissory note and the 10% overpayment failed again. It's also noted that the appellants tried to unilaterally make the Land Registry cancel the charge off the back of this note.

    I used to read this thread with a mixture of amusement at how stupid this carry on is, and some sympathy for the gullible in falling for the false hope that the charlatans who peddle this freeman nonsense promise.

    As time has gone on I am coming to the conclusion that I am in the fact mug.

    The above case is a good example. They stopped paying their mortgage sometime in 2010. Bank issued proceedings in 2011. It is now 2017. And they appear to still be in possession of the property. 7 years free housing.

    This is absolutely ridiculous.

    So they have had a free house since 2010. Meanwhile those of us laughing at them and their promissory notes have been paying handsomely for our own accommodation, as well as subsidising the banks losses that these people cause, not to mention chipping in for the costs of the courts time in dealing with this crap.

    It's high time we starting making an example of people who are not paying their mortgages for whatever reason and begin forcing them out of these properties.


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    #6334
    whippet
    Registered Users Posts: 7,674 ✭✭✭whippet


    Hopefully the back lash will come sooner rather than later. Last month a judge asked revenue to have a look at the accounts of one the main protagonists.. probably due to his declaration when looking for free legal aid ... interestingly he was on holidays in Spain just before the proceedings.

    Amusingly our friends in the hub had to be corrected on their headline where they proclaimed the victory of a Ligitant in Person over a vulture fund ... it was all well and good until members of the actual legal team commented and explained that they were registered PIPs and proper legal people representing them and explained how the service didn’t cost the person a penny. More or less showing the hub up for what it really is


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    #6335
    whippet
    Registered Users Posts: 7,674 ✭✭✭whippet


    it seems the Charity regulator has taken an interest in the Hub based on an anonymous tip off !!!!


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    #6336
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    whippet wrote: »
    it seems the Charity regulator has taken an interest in the Hub based on an anonymous tip off !!!!

    https://www.businesspost.ie/news/hub-ireland-probed-fundraising-activities-402033
    The charities regulator said that it has “received a concern that The Hub - Ireland appears to be operating as a charitable organisation while not registered"

    Wonder what BS response the Hub will come up with, no doubt a visit to the HC will be involved.


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    #6337
    Grassey
    Registered Users Posts: 2,393 ✭✭✭Grassey


    They also seem to be having a raffle of a tv for Christmas...

    Don't worry folks, they now aren't a charity!

    The TV pictured: we are raffling this TV for Christmas: one very fine Hubbers has promised to deliver it to the lucky winners home; It was donated to us by a company called uvaluespreyfoam.ie, it will pay the rent for three and a bit months:
    Someone will win this state of the art TV for €20.00. Good luck everyone.

    The full details and Gardai licence are being worked out over this weekend: we will post all of the details early next week: charity ‘we are not’.

    The Hub-Ireland


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    #6338
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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    #6339
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    Grassey wrote: »
    They also seem to be having a raffle of a tv for Christmas...

    Don't worry folks, they now aren't a charity!

    The TV pictured: we are raffling this TV for Christmas: one very fine Hubbers has promised to deliver it to the lucky winners home; It was donated to us by a company called uvaluespreyfoam.ie, it will pay the rent for three and a bit months:
    Someone will win this state of the art TV for €20.00. Good luck everyone.

    The full details and Gardai licence are being worked out over this weekend: we will post all of the details early next week: charity ‘we are not’.

    The Hub-Ireland

    That post on their FB page mysteriously just got deleted about two minutes ago.

    Probably deleting any notions of charitable work on their FB pages at the moment.


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    #6340
    Grassey
    Registered Users Posts: 2,393 ✭✭✭Grassey


    Also taken down the post about how they were advised by text on sat that there would be an article on them as a charity. And how it was bad journalism to post a one sided story without their response.


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    #6341
    whippet
    Registered Users Posts: 7,674 ✭✭✭whippet


    Wasn’t the hub registered as a company a little while back ?


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    #6342
    capefear
    Registered Users Posts: 772 ✭✭✭capefear


    Nope only registered as a business name by lord Byron


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    #6343
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    https://facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=895310237292425&id=186111024879020
    The Sunday Business post and The Hub – Ireland; 5th Nov 2017.

    So we made page two of the Sunday Business Post this morning: the first thing we need to do is correct the SBP article: The Hub-Ireland has never offered a ‘pro bono’ service: pro bono is a no win, no fee basis and we are not solicitors. We do not give advice on any level; we are not legally trained.

    We are not affiliated to any political party: DDI or any other political group. We do fund those that cannot afford to lodge Circuit or High Court paperwork.

    We were given the opportunity to comment. Well now, sending a Text message to the Hub phone on a Saturday morning at 8:41am, inviting us to comment, is not exactly a fair and open invitation in our eyes.

    Where did this article stem from? There is one particular page that is disparaging and purposely intimidating a few members of The Hub – Ireland and on a very personal level: for this reason we are unable to comment on this matter in any depth, this is because a file is now with the Police and Gardai: next week we are having another meeting with our legal team; we will be bringing the letter we received from the Charity Regulator: and because this is going ‘legal’ against FaceBook and certain individuals we will under The Freedom of Information Act 1997 (FOI) as amended by the Freedom of Information (Amendment) Act 2003 and Freedom of Information Act 2014; be requesting the full details of those that complained against The Hub – Ireland or its members and will be requesting copies of any correspondence they may have received.

    The Hub – Ireland has also extended an invitation to the journalist Jack Horgan-Jones to spend a day in The Hub – Ireland.

    Pretty sure the post they earlier deleted stated they were not given any chance to comment.


    From the above:-
    We do not give advice on any level

    And yet their mission statement states:-
    We are a group of individuals who have come together in a bid to help and advise people who are in mortgage difficulties.

    :confused:


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    #6344
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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    #6345
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    What are their chances of getting Garda permission to hold a raffle?

    Probably zero, I believe you can only gain a licence for a raffle if there is no profit to the licensee, their post is now deleted stated the TV was donated - so what would the €20 be? A profit.

    A raffle must be for a charitable purpose, but, remember they are not a charity - and now we no why that post has also vanished.


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    #6346
    relax carry on
    Registered Users Posts: 4,074 ✭✭✭relax carry on


    Sounds serious, "a file is now with the Police and Gardai".
    Can't get the Donegal Catch add out my head now.


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    #6347
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,642 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    GM228 wrote: »
    Probably zero, I believe you can only gain a licence for a raffle if there is no profit to the licensee, their post is now deleted stated the TV was donated - so what would the €20 be? A profit.

    A raffle must be for a charitable purpose, but, remember they are not a charity - and now we no why that post has also vanished.

    An earlier post stated the proceeds of the raffle would be use to pay the rent for the Hub office.


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    #6348
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    Graham wrote: »
    An earlier post stated the proceeds of the raffle would be use to pay the rent for the Hub office.

    Meaning they would be making a profit.


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    #6349
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    Gotta love the Hubs "nota bean's" which are obviously directed at the Sunday Business Post.
    Many, many Moon’s ago we had the trolls on our page and on a constant basis: we just threw them to the wolves: the Hubbers, they sorted them out: the trolls have pretty much given up: “you can try but at the end of the day: you can’t beat honesty”.

    Next we had the infiltrators lol: they are sorted but on a light note: the Sunday Business Post; from me to you Jack Horgan-Jones: the exposé was a little fizzed out, maybe like Champaign and head the next day: I see you were on the next page showing off your award for exposing corruption: the invitation to spend a day in The Hub – Ireland is still open.
    Notabene; We have had just about every newspaper down The Hub – Ireland over the last three plus years, we have had quite a few politicians too, a couple of ‘top’ politicians; very few have ever made print or recognised the elephant in the room; positive or even negative: one reporter spent two days with us, going between the courts and The Hub – Ireland office: upon leaving we said our goodbyes, my throwaway comment was: “your piece will never see print”.

    Indignation followed; but low and behold: his piece never saw the light of day; if my memory serves me right he was a journalist from the SBP.

    And the one which made me laugh....
    A word of warning: and don't forget::: we do our homework. It is called = prison.

    The above is followed by a link to the Prohibition of Incitement To Hatred Act 1989. No doubt a complait under the Act has been made about the SBP.


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    #6350
    fxotoole
    Registered Users Posts: 1,661 ✭✭✭fxotoole


    whippet wrote: »
    it seems the Charity regulator has taken an interest in the Hub based on an anonymous tip off !!!!

    Am I right in saying that one has to register with Revenue as a charity as well? I'd say The Hub would be facing a Revenue audit if they're not properly registered for tax purposes. If they're making profits (as opposed to donations) they'd be liable for tax, no?


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    #6351
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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    #6352
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    fxotoole wrote: »
    Am I right in saying that one has to register with Revenue as a charity as well? I'd say The Hub would be facing a Revenue audit if they're not properly registered for tax purposes. If they're making profits (as opposed to donations) they'd be liable for tax, no?
    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    Absolutely.

    No, a charity may (it's optional) register with Revenue if they want to avail of the Charitable Tax Exemption - but in order to do that they must be a registered charity with the Charities Regulator.


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    #6353
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    What is the Hub though? Is it a business name of someone or a limited company?

    "The HUB-Ireland" is a registered business name.


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    #6354
    relax carry on
    Registered Users Posts: 4,074 ✭✭✭relax carry on


    No sign of them on this list unless they are called anything other than the hub.

    https://www.revenue.ie/en/corporate/information-about-revenue/statistics/registrations-assessments-transactions/charities/bodies-charitable-tax-exemption.aspx


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    #6355
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    relax carry on wrote: »
    No sign of them on this list unless they are called anything other than the hub.

    https://www.revenue.ie/en/corporate/information-about-revenue/statistics/registrations-assessments-transactions/charities/bodies-charitable-tax-exemption.aspx

    To be on that list they would have to be a registered charity first which they are not.

    They just have a registered business name.

    https://search.cro.ie/company/CompanyDetails.aspx?id=599600&type=B

    Edit: not sure why the above link does not show them, their number is 599600.


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    #6356
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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    #6357
    capefear
    Registered Users Posts: 772 ✭✭✭capefear


    This is what they do according to what's on the cro site


    Nature 8299: A HELP AND GUIDANCE SERVICE FOR THE PURPOSE OF BRINGING PEOPLE TOGETHER INCLUDING SHARING INFORMATION MAINLY TO ENABLE THEM TO STAY IN THEIR HOMES AND AVOID EVICTION.


    It's register business name belonging to Byron Jenkins


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    #6358
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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    #6359
    expectationlost
    Registered Users Posts: 11,778 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.
    here he is on nearfm http://nearfm.ie/podcast/?p=24185


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    #6360
    Losty Dublin
    Registered Users Posts: 13,062 ✭✭✭✭Losty Dublin


    https://www.psychicmediumsisters.com/helping-hand

    A fundraiser for Freeman chum, Ken Smollen. It's going to be jam packed with woo, smoke and mirrors, spoofology, bluff, truth economics, hash smoking, scamartistry and all round conning of the gullible

    And they will have two Psychics on hand as well.


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    #6361
    glic71rods46t0
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,074 ✭✭✭glic71rods46t0


    Losty Dublin wrote: »
    https://www.psychicmediumsisters.com/helping-hand

    A fundraiser for Freeman chum, Ken Smollen. It's going to be jam packed with woo, smoke and mirrors, spoofology, bluff, truth economics, hash smoking, scamartistry and all round conning of the gullible

    And they will have two Psychics on hand as well.

    The two psychics pictured on the website are good looking though, to be fair


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