Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread VIII - MOD NOTE POST #4781

irishbucsfan · 06-11-2017 02:19PM

Ireland squad update says nothing about a Sexton injury and says players will train fully today. Except Treadwell who is en route from SA

https://twitter.com/irishrugby/status/927524049332338688

06-11-2017 02:19PM

No injuries according to the Times just now:

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/international/ireland-report-a-clean-bill-of-health-1.3281646

molloyjh · 06-11-2017 02:24PM

Call me a cynic, but how many times have injury reports been less than accurate in the past?

Clegg · 06-11-2017 02:30PM

I didn't realise Treadwell was only 22.

We've a lot of young, talented locks coming through now. It seems like we've a lot of promisiing players coming through in every area bar hooker. Bodes well for the future.

Buer · 06-11-2017 02:41PM

You have to laugh at Harry Byrne getting to train with the Irish squad whilst his big brother is sitting at home.

b.gud · 06-11-2017 02:56PM

Buer wrote: »

You have to laugh at Harry Byrne getting to train with the Irish squad whilst his big brother is sitting at home.

Is his brother Ross? Ye have too many Byrnes at Leinster

bilston · 06-11-2017 03:23PM

Buer wrote: »

You have to laugh at Harry Byrne getting to train with the Irish squad whilst his big brother is sitting at home.

Do the other provincial academies get the chance to train with the senior squad throughout the season?

durthacht · 06-11-2017 03:35PM

b.gud wrote: »

Is his brother Ross? Ye have too many Byrnes at Leinster

Yes

irishfan9 · 06-11-2017 03:37PM

bilston wrote: »

Do the other provincial academies get the chance to train with the senior squad throughout the season?

usually yes.

Buer · 06-11-2017 03:38PM

bilston wrote: »

Do the other provincial academies get the chance to train with the senior squad throughout the season?

Not when they're training in Carton House, as far as I know. It's generally sub-academy players who are brought in too although there are a few 1st year academy players in the list training with them.

And I would imagine the training aspect is a very loose interpretation. Holding bags and providing bodies in non-contact drills etc. would be the extent of their involvement, I'm guessing.

06-11-2017 03:40PM

Buer wrote: »

Not when they're training in Carton House, as far as I know. It's generally sub-academy players who are brought in too although there are a few 1st year academy players in the list training with them.

And I would imagine the training aspect is a very loose interpretation. Holding bags and providing bodies in non-contact drills etc. would be the extent of their involvement, I'm guessing.

Yeah I doubt they do much but being in that environment must help them so much

Bazzo · 06-11-2017 04:22PM

It's unusual simply because it opens them up to accusations of bias if nothing else. I doubt the other academy/sub academy lads would have an issue traveling the extra hour or two to be there and if they're just bodies then what's the harm?

Wegians89 · 06-11-2017 04:28PM

Bazzo wrote: »

It's unusual simply because it opens them up to accusations of bias if nothing else. I doubt the other academy/sub academy lads would have an issue traveling the extra hour or two to be there and if they're just bodies then what's the harm?

I can remember Cian romaine was involved a few years back and Ryan feehily was maybe last year just from a Connacht point of view. Leinster academy players might be the Ines to appear most but other provinces get represented too

Bazzo · 06-11-2017 04:34PM

Wegians89 wrote: »

I can remember Cian romaine was involved a few years back and Ryan feehily was maybe last year just from a Connacht point of view. Leinster academy players might be the Ines to appear most but other provinces get represented too

At Carton house??

irishfan9 · 06-11-2017 04:37PM

i'm sure a few future munster, ulster and connacht players are in that list of leinster academy players.

Wegians89 · 06-11-2017 04:37PM

Bazzo wrote: »

At Carton house??

Both were in aviva at open sessions actually could have just been with the under 20s

molloyjh · 06-11-2017 04:37PM

Bazzo wrote: »

It's unusual simply because it opens them up to accusations of bias if nothing else. I doubt the other academy/sub academy lads would have an issue traveling the extra hour or two to be there and if they're just bodies then what's the harm?

It can only open itself up to accusations of bias in as much as people want to ignore the pretty obvious logistical factors and just default straight to provincial outrage. Anyone willing to take a breath and look at the bigger picture will see it's a simple matter of convenience. Nothing more.

Although it is the internet, where the default setting is outrage anyway so......

Bazzo · 06-11-2017 04:40PM

molloyjh wrote: »

It can only open itself up to accusations of bias in as much as people want to ignore the pretty obvious logistical factors and just default straight to provincial outrage. Anyone willing to take a breath and look at the bigger picture will see it's a simple matter of convenience. Nothing more.

Although it is the internet, where the default setting is outrage anyway so......

Rule 1 of PR, never expect people to be reasonable.

06-11-2017 04:46PM

I really don't see why he'd give a toss about accusations of bias from a few internet loons. Leave them to it.

06-11-2017 04:49PM

molloyjh wrote: »

It can only open itself up to accusations of bias in as much as people want to ignore the pretty obvious logistical factors and just default straight to provincial outrage. Anyone willing to take a breath and look at the bigger picture will see it's a simple matter of convenience. Nothing more.

Although it is the internet, where the default setting is outrage anyway so......

You are dead right in that it's convenience. But that geographic convenience gives those players access to an environment in which they can learn from different coaches and players. Which in turn aids their development which aids Leinster before it aids Ireland. It's the way it is for good reason but if you called any sub/academy player form around the country they would be there in a heartbeat.
This isn't outrage at them being there but if they were a mix from the 4 provinces it'd be more beneficial for those academies

molloyjh · 06-11-2017 04:55PM

connemara man wrote: »

You are dead right in that it's convenience. But that geographic convenience gives those players access to an environment in which they can learn from different coaches and players. Which in turn aids their development which aids Leinster before it aids Ireland. It's the way it is for good reason but if you called any sub/academy player form around the country they would be there in a heartbeat.
This isn't outrage at them being there but if they were a mix from the 4 provinces it'd be more beneficial for those academies

Probably. It's hard to know or quantify that though. I can't imagine they learn all that much more compared to what they'd be learning at the Academies. They are only spending a couple of days holding tackle bags and probably aren't running through the plays properly. At this stage the Academies should be professional enough for them to be learning almost as much and then actually repping the stuff so it sticks. If watching others was enough to make us better players then most of us here would be pretty damn good.

irishbucsfan · 06-11-2017 05:02PM

I've no idea what sort of HR minefield they have to trip over when bringing amateur lads in to train with professional athletes, but I'd imagine most of these decisions are just down to whatever causes the least hassle and cost

06-11-2017 05:06PM

molloyjh wrote: »

Probably. It's hard to know or quantify that though. I can't imagine they learn all that much more compared to what they'd be learning at the Academies. They are only spending a couple of days holding tackle bags and probably aren't running through the plays properly. At this stage the Academies should be professional enough for them to be learning almost as much and then actually repping the stuff so it sticks. If watching others was enough to make us better players then most of us here would be pretty damn good.

I know in my professional career that when I'm around someone better than me it's improved me long term even if that's spending a day in an office with them.

So when you have a group of young lads watching and soaking in the senior international experience they are getting at least two things that will benefit them long term
firstly: and this might seem stupid but that want to be there increases they have seen behind the curtain seen what the pinnacle of their sport is like and will want to be back there again. (Not saying any player at home doesn't have that drive but being there will surely amplify that)
Secondly: you can learn a lot in terms of attitude, how the seniors conduct themselves how they interact with coaches etc... You'll learn that over years of playing but seeing the likes of Stander, O Brien, Earls, Kearney, & Sexton, honing what they do while you hold a tackle bag can only be better than being among lads your own age

prawnsambo · 06-11-2017 05:27PM

b.gud wrote: »

Is his brother Ross? Ye have too many Byrnes at Leinster

It's the Wicklow mafia piling in. You can't spit in any direction in Wicklow without hitting a Byrne.

06-11-2017 05:29PM

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I've no idea what sort of HR minefield they have to trip over when bringing amateur lads in to train with professional athletes, but I'd imagine most of these decisions are just down to whatever causes the least hassle and cost

Probably doesn't hurt that the academy lads are already familiar with the bulk of the senior Ireland squad coming from Leinster.

The Rape of Lucretia · 06-11-2017 11:18PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Probably doesn't hurt that the academy lads are already familiar with the bulk of the senior Ireland squad coming from Leinster.

And the Leinster academy lads will form the bulk of the Ireland squad going forward anyway. Having academy players (do the other provinces even have genuine academies?) from from other provinces is starting to look like it would be unfair to any Leinster ones excluded.

06-11-2017 11:21PM

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

(do the other provinces even have genuine academies?)

Yeah - you can sign up for Ulsters one here:

Burkie1203 · 06-11-2017 11:39PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yeah - you can sign up for Ulsters one here:

Thats low.

Utah_Saint · 06-11-2017 11:45PM

Deleted User wrote: »

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

(do the other provinces even have genuine academies?)

Yeah - you can sign up for Ulsters one here:

Funny and devastatingly true. Talk about kicking a man while he's down!

prawnsambo · 06-11-2017 11:47PM

Burkie1203 wrote: »

Thats low.

Tells us a lot about Venjur's online activities though. And offline ones of course.

Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread VIII - ** MOD NOTE POST #4781 **

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Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread VIII - MOD NOTE POST #4781