Were you ever surprised when somebody came out as gay?

Glenster wrote: »

It doesn't say you're straight.

it says you're a real MACHO MAN.

You mean macho man like this?

Gay Byrne

There is an element of if you can tell something about someone just from looking at them because they are constantly broadcasting it, it might well make them annoying, be they religious, gay, vegan or whatever.

It seems a little unfair to put gay in there when the other two are (more or less) choices, but many don't feel the need to make it a central part of their character - like, say, Varadkar. It's a part of them, but they have other things they want to be getting on with.

Being "butch" or "camp" are more choices and they will annoy some, rightly or wrongly. The pitch of a male voice (especially English or American) speaking in the traditional "camp" way grates on my ears a bit. Just the pure pitch it's at. Actually, quite a few female voices grate the same way. I would certainly never say anything about it to the person (or intentionally hurt a friend like that) and I'll get used to it and stop noticing it over time. Unless there's a startled shriek, whereupon my ears go flat.

Edit: Wouldn't necessarily notice a butch lesbian as being "obviously" lesbian.

seamus wrote: »

So when someone is gay but doesn't do all of the above, people are stunned. How can he be gay when he's not a flamboyant, relentless, cock-gobbler?

Seen on reddit the other day -

How can you tell if your room mate is gay?
His cock tastes like shít:D

Leo Varadkar surprised me I have to say.

It was a general shock at the time when Stephen Gately came out. Coming out was still quite a taboo back then.

ThinkProgress wrote: »

How do you figure that they are choices...??

I would say it's more likely just their natural personality coming out. (excuse the pun)

It's one thing to find, say, a very camp gay person irritating to be around. (which in many cases, I personally would/have tbh)

It's another thing entirely to say that they are "choosing" to behave that way! It's a bit of an unfair assumption imo... in most cases, I would say it's just natural to them!

Er, I figure they are choices because I know people who consciously chose to speak in the polari-inspired cant, which remains mostly now as the accent. It's not something that one is born with, unlike being gay. Camp culture was a specific culture around caberet and shows, and adopted in Britain as a similar thing but also to codeword anything related to homosexuality (British version was known as "polari"). Many others don't choose to, which also rather supports the "choice" rather than "nature" idea there. There is no logical biological reason why gay men would have a totally different accent and pitch to anyone else which is...because they naturally don't have anything of the sort.

I have, btw, no issue with people doing as they like about it, nor do I avoid camp people. I just find certain notes make my ears ring and certain women and many English (in particular) camp men hit those notes regularly!

Edit: Actually, I see where you're coming from. I don't know that there are that many other aspects of "camp" left. There's the stereotype of moving the hands a lot, but that's not really that noticeable nowadays. A lot of people gesticulate a lot when talking. Clothing that accentuates or indicates either being "camp" or "butch" is generally a stylistic choice (which is probably because it appeals to the individual, so we can really take that as either "choice" or "natural" Both.) But I was primarily talking about the accent.

Captain Slow IRL wrote: »

2 guys from school, they didn't come across as gay at all. Also, a female colleague. To paraphrase Doug Stanhope, "if you can tell someones sexuality without them disclosing it, they're probably assholes" which I think is fitting in my experiences!

Thats kind of silly. Im guessing its referring to annoying camp lads? I know some camp lads who are some of the nicest guys Ive met. A lot of them dont seem to really have much control over their campness