All Ireland SHC Final (formerly SHC thread) - READ MOD NOTE POST #1

Mantis Toboggan · 26-06-2017 08:43AM

Limerick could test kk but the others look straight forward

PTH2009 · 26-06-2017 08:55AM

Offaly will put it up too Waterford esp in Tullamore (might move it to Birr). A loss for Waterford would be an absolute disaster

Expect wins for Tipp (massive win infact) over Westmeath and Dublin will get a big challenge of Laois but should come out on top

Horrible draw for Limerick away too Kilkenny but could go either way if Limerick have one of there good days. Still I'd expect Kilkenny too win at home. I imagine that will be the only game televised

dastardly00 · 26-06-2017 09:10AM

PTH2009 wrote: »

Offaly will put it up too Waterford esp in Tullamore (might move it to Birr). A loss for Waterford would be an absolute disaster

You are just being your usual pessimistic self PTH2009.
It'll be a handy win for Waterford.

HurlingRanker · 26-06-2017 09:23AM

The demise of Kilkenny hurling has been somewhat exaggerated. I do feel Galway are in pole position, but if they can avoid each other in round 2, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if we ended up with a Kilkenny v Tipperary final in September.

PTH2009 · 26-06-2017 09:25AM

dastardly00 wrote: »

You are just being your usual pessimistic self PTH2009.
It'll be a handy win for Waterford.

we never do anything easy in Waterford and were the worst favourites ever

a lot of Waterford men in the offaly management team

PTH2009 · 26-06-2017 09:26AM

HurlingRanker wrote: »

The demise of Kilkenny hurling has been somewhat exaggerated. I do feel Galway are in pole position, but if they can avoid each other in round 2, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if we ended up with a Kilkenny v Tipperary final in September.

could easily happen but oh christ we will never hear the end of it if it does

'you cant beat tradition'
'Always the big 2'
'When it matters Tipp and Kilkenny are always there'

all that BS

Badabing · 26-06-2017 09:27AM

Hopefully Dublin v Laois will be played in Parnell Park Saturday afternoon.

dr.kenneth noisewater · 26-06-2017 09:51AM

After the hammering we took against Dublin yesterday in the football I'd fear for our hurlers getting a similar trimming in the hurling. Pity its not in Mullingar, would have got a great crowd

letowski · 26-06-2017 10:58AM

In many respects, it's the best draw for Kilkenny. It's at home and they should win, but will be tested nonetheless. Cody will probably switch things up a bit, and Limerick have the ability to trouble Kilkenny in certain areas where Cody needs to assess.

Other draws are straight forward, I think. Round two is set to be a great weekend. That round is usually a double header in Thurles, but unlikely this year as Tipperary will surely advance.

Tombo2001 · 26-06-2017 11:05AM

PTH2009 wrote: »

could easily happen but oh christ we will never hear the end of it if it does

'you cant beat tradition'
'Always the big 2'
'When it matters Tipp and Kilkenny are always there'

all that BS

What do you expect people to say?

Its a win win for hurling in my view.

If you get a Tipp Kilkenny final, by and large you have a match of very high quality that the neutral will enjoy (same applies to Tipp Galway/ Kilkenny Galway).

If on the other hand you had a Wexford - Galway final - it would be very exciting in terms of a new AI winning team pushing through.

Mantis Toboggan · 26-06-2017 11:21AM

Will round 2 qualifiers be an open draw?

boggerman1 · 26-06-2017 11:36AM

Tyson Fury wrote: »

Will round 2 qualifiers be an open draw?

Yes and neutral venues too

dastardly00 · 26-06-2017 11:37AM

AFAIK Round 2 is an open draw.
But teams who have already met in the Leinster or Munster championships cannot be drawn to meet again.
So that would mean the following can't occur: Laois v Westmeath, and Westmeath v Offaly.

cyrils foxpit · 26-06-2017 11:49AM

dastardly00 wrote: »

AFAIK Round 2 is an open draw.
But teams who have already met in the Leinster or Munster championships cannot be drawn to meet again.
So that would mean the following can't occur: Laois v Westmeath, and Westmeath v Offaly.

so its open draw then

danganabu · 26-06-2017 12:23PM

letowski wrote: »

In many respects, it's the best draw for Kilkenny. It's at home and they should win, but will be tested nonetheless. Cody will probably switch things up a bit, and Limerick have the ability to trouble Kilkenny in certain areas where Cody needs to assess.

Don't agree at all, KK are now in a position that they have a tough game this weekend that they cannot in anyway take lightly and are then out 7 days later with a 67% chance of playing Tipp or Waterford, that cannot in any way be described as ideal, the only way it is any way positive is the fact they are at home.

dastardly00 · 26-06-2017 12:27PM

cyrils foxpit wrote: »

so its open draw then

Ha, yeah :pac:

Kristopherus · 26-06-2017 12:48PM

paulie21 wrote: »

4 straight forward games there

I get a strong whiff of a fix in that draw:rolleyes:.

danganabu · 26-06-2017 01:07PM

Kristopherus wrote: »

I get a strong whiff of a fix in that draw:rolleyes:.

I actually can't think of any draw that this accusation wouldn't have been made, people love a conspiracy theory! The draw was televised live for what its worth.

Bonniedog · 26-06-2017 01:09PM

Dublin in Parnell against Laois was probably only chance they have of advancing. They've shown a fair bit of balls in fairness despite all the negative stuff and a win will boost confidence.

letowski · 26-06-2017 01:15PM

danganabu wrote: »

Don't agree at all, KK are now in a position that they have a tough game this weekend that they cannot in anyway take lightly and are then out 7 days later with a 67% chance of playing Tipp or Waterford, that cannot in any way be described as ideal, the only way it is any way positive is the fact they are at home.

I can see where you are coming from, don't get me wrong.

So I guess by your reckoning Laois was the favourable draw for them. They would have had a 2:1 chance of getting Waterford/Tipp anyway. But my point of view was say they did get Laois and Cody does make some notable changes, and they end up winning by 30 points and get Tipp in the next round. They won't have learned anything from the game and could end up be exposed again. But I accept this would be based on that Cody does make some changes to both his selection and tactics, both of which are needed imo.

I do take your point though, and a hard test this early in the qualifiers could take its toll on a KK side that hasn't huge strength in depth. I guess time will tell. It will be interesting to follow them anyway.

grbear · 26-06-2017 01:47PM

As daft as this may sound I think the Tipperary and Waterford management might be a bit disappointed with not getting Kilkenny in the draw.
I'm not saying that to knock Kilkenny in any way but you could practically see the rust on them, especially players like Aylward, in their match against Wexford. The more games they get, the better they'll get so I reckon they'd have been much more vulnerable this weekend than they will be if they get past Limerick.

Right now they are like that bloke in Highlander who nearly had his head chopped all the way off, the longer the neck gets to heal up the harder it will be for the opposition to remove the head eventually.

I'm not sure if this makes McGrath, Kiely or Michael Ryan the Sean Connery of the piece though. Can any of them grow a beard? And who on the Tipperary, Limerick or Waterford team can be Christopher Lambert?

letowski · 26-06-2017 02:48PM

Didn't realize it but Laois are missing a rake of players this weekend:

https://twitter.com/ShaneSaint/status/879248643433299968

Dyr · 26-06-2017 03:06PM

danganabu wrote: »

Don't agree at all, KK are now in a position that they have a tough game this weekend that they cannot in anyway take lightly and are then out 7 days later with a 67% chance of playing Tipp or Waterford, that cannot in any way be described as ideal, the only way it is any way positive is the fact they are at home.

I think a lot of Codys success was based on using their dominance in Leinster to ensure they make the semi's well rested and raring to go

A few qualifier dog fights in quick succession won't suit Kilkenny.

Tombo2001 · 26-06-2017 03:15PM

Bambi wrote: »

I think a lot of Codys success was based on using their dominance in Leinster to ensure they make the semi's well rested and raring to go

A few qualifier dog fights in quick succession won't suit Kilkenny.

Let the revisionism begin.

You could be right - against that, it was a factor that held back Galway for decades supposedly; they never had a decent match before the semi.

KevIRL · 26-06-2017 03:19PM

All-Ireland SHC qualifiers round 1 draw - all games Saturday July 1
Offaly v Waterford, O'Connor Park, 3pm
Tipperary v Westmeath, Semple Stadium, 5pm
Dublin v Laois, Parnell Park, 7pm
Kilkenny v Limerick, Nowlan Park, 7pm

HurlingRanker · 26-06-2017 04:29PM

Bambi wrote: »

I think a lot of Codys success was based on using their dominance in Leinster to ensure they make the semi's well rested and raring to go

A few qualifier dog fights in quick succession won't suit Kilkenny.

I don't buy that one bit. Just look at the pretty woeful record the Munster champion has had since the qualifiers were introduced to all teams in 2002, only twice (2005 and 2016) has the Munster champion gone on to win the final, the team that has won the Munster final has gone on to lose their next game and has not contested the All-Ireland final in 2002, 2004, 2007, 2008, 2010, 2012, 2013, 2014 and 2015. That 5/6 week wait between the provincial final and All-Ireland semi final can be killer, whereas teams coming through the backdoor and quarter finals can bring a bit of momentum into a semi final against a team with no competitive games in 5/6 weeks.

Cody and Kilkenny were primed, and ready to go EVERY time they had to endure that 5/6 week wait. Pretty impressive when you consider how the Munster champions have been caught cold so often. Since 2002 they have never lost their first knock out game be that in the All-Ireland series or their only seasons in the qualifiers to date (2004 & 2013).

Doggedness has been one of the predominant traits of Cody and his teams, so they'll be well up for a few dog fights in the qualifiers. Don't quite have the same level of quality and depth that they have had for most of Cody's tenure, but it's kind of scary that the "worst" Kilkenny team of the Cody era is still better than most of the opposition, and still has the beating of all opposition on their day.

Tombo2001 · 26-06-2017 04:35PM

HurlingRanker wrote: »

I don't buy that one bit. Just look at the pretty woeful record the Munster champion has had since the qualifiers were introduced to all teams in 2002, only twice (2005 and 2016) has the Munster champion gone on to win the final, the team that has won the Munster final has gone on to lose their next game and has not contested the All-Ireland final in 2002, 2004, 2007, 2008, 2010, 2012, 2013, 2014 and 2015. That 5/6 week wait between the provincial final and All-Ireland semi final can be killer, whereas teams coming through the backdoor and quarter finals can bring a bit of momentum into a semi final against a team with no competitive games in 5/6 weeks.

Cody and Kilkenny were primed, and ready to go EVERY time they had to endure that 5/6 week wait. Pretty impressive when you consider how the Munster champions have been caught cold so often. Since 2002 they have never lost their first knock out game be that in the All-Ireland series or their only seasons in the qualifiers to date (2004 & 2013).

Doggedness has been one of the predominant traits of Cody and his teams, so they'll be well up for a few dog fights in the qualifiers. Don't quite have the same level of quality and depth that they have had for most of Cody's tenure, but it's kind of scary that the "worst" Kilkenny team of the Cody era is still better than most of the opposition, and still has the beating of all opposition on their day.

I think that supports his point....

IE the munster teams have to peak in June/ early July and then peak again in mid-August/ September.

Cody's teams by and large had easy in July and only had to peak once. Its very difficult for amateurs to sustain a high level of performance for 4 months.

nice_guy80 · 26-06-2017 04:49PM

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Let the revisionism begin.

You could be right - against that, it was a factor that held back Galway for decades supposedly; they never had a decent match before the semi.

galway never had a match, full stop

HurlingRanker · 26-06-2017 04:51PM

Tombo2001 wrote: »

I think that supports his point....

IE the munster teams have to peak in June/ early July and then peak again in mid-August/ September.

Cody's teams by and large had easy in July and only had to peak once. Its very difficult for amateurs to sustain a high level of performance for 4 months.

Munster teams don't have to peak June/early July. July onwards is all that matters, teams only need to start peaking once defeat means your year is over. Losing a provincial game simply doesn't matter anymore. I hate to say it but the provincial championships are almost glorified challenge matches at this stage. Sure, it's always nice to win games. But no ambitious team sets up to peak before the All-Ireland games.

thomond2006 · 26-06-2017 04:58PM

https://gaa.tickets.ie/Listing/EventInformation/35650/gaa-all-ireland-shc-qualifiers-round-1-kilkenny-v-limerick-nowlan-park-1-July-2017

Tickets aren't being released for KK vs LIM until 10am Friday?!

All Ireland SHC Final (formerly SHC thread) - READ MOD NOTE POST #1

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